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help with untraining a new Dom? - 1/7/2008 11:20:52 PM

chellekitty

Posts: 3923
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ok...with hopes of not jinxing a new relationship...i know this has definately been discussed before...but i have this issue...i have never wanted to "train" a new Dominant...and i am definately not training him per se...i am, however, faced with untraining, for lack of a better word, some of his social and past relationship conditioning...he is fucking awesome, Dominant, sadistic, caring, a gentleman, sarcastic, yea...just awesome...but, when i talk about the things i am doing in the lifestyle he says negative things, like many unfamiliar with the lifestyle do...all of his exposure to the lifestyle this far has been movies - not like the secretary, but like strangeland...and i am not even sure the secretary would help, because of his educational background, anyway...i am not even sure where to start...because throwing a book at him just isn't going to work and there are so many facets of the lifestyle that have taken me over 6 years to learn on my own, that...yea, i just am not sure where to start...because i don't want it to be just about kinky sex, or pain, or service...i really do want to explain about authority exchange, but i am not sure how to with someone who doesn't understand the concept...so...help?
someone? anyone? did i make any sense?

thanks in advance...
chelle

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One thing I know: the only ones among you who will be really happy are those who will have sought and found how to serve. ~Albert Schweitzer

Post #: 1

RE: help with untraining a new Dom? - 1/8/2008 12:11:17 AM

MasterFireMaam

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From: Charleston, WV
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Well, first, has he agreed to this "untraining"? You can't change someone who doesn't want to change and going into a relationship with that goal often leads to disaster.

Master Fire

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Post #: 2

RE: help with untraining a new Dom? - 1/8/2008 2:07:04 AM

Leatherist

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Joined: 12/11/2007
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Are you trying to teach him to be "pc"?

We tend to have to come to that on our own-and for our own reasons. It seldom happens from others trying to force it down our throats.. At least not with anyone you would really want to call "Dominant". Seems to work better on subs.

Sometimes.

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Post #: 3

RE: help with untraining a new Dom? - 1/8/2008 2:25:22 AM

Maya2001

Posts: 1656
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From: Woodstock ONT,CANADA
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lol goodluck .....basically amounts to what the ones above have said

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Post #: 4

RE: help with untraining a new Dom? - 1/8/2008 3:02:23 AM

julietsierra

Posts: 1841
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I'm reminded of the show of Rosanne, where she's sitting in the break room with her co-workers, eating a doughnut while talking about the "training" of husbands. She talks of changing this and that, and with every change, she chomps down on another part of the doughnut. When she finally reaches the part where the husband has become the "perfect husband," she wolfs down the last piece of the doughnut. It was funny. It was also very creepy.

When she'd changed the husband into the "perfect husband," there was nothing left of him. Substitute the word Master or Dominant for the word husband and it winds up being the same thing.

Don't look to make him fit. Look to see if the two of you fit - the way you each are. If you don't, then no matter how wonderful he is...it's not right.

juliet

< Message edited by julietsierra -- 1/8/2008 3:05:33 AM >

(in reply to Maya2001)

Post #: 5

RE: help with untraining a new Dom? - 1/8/2008 3:45:37 AM

TysGalilah

Posts: 589
Joined: 11/21/2007
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hi Chellekitty

You say in your description of him that he is Dominant.
You explain that you want him to understand authority exchange>>   what makes you feel he doesn't already know?
perhaps the answer is as simple as > hand him the authority and see what he does with it.......you describe him as dominant, perhaps it will all just naturally evolve.

the more control you do not keep/take/have> the more he will step up to ???

for me the question of which comes first? the submission or the dominance?   has always been alittle like the chicken or the egg question.
   depends on who you ask and their perspective, most likely.

I also agree with the others> trying to change or manipulate the situation or him is counterproductive to the "authority exchange" you are wanting to feel from him and with him.
and
whether it be a ds relationship or not> trying to change another to fit your needs rarely nurtures a healthy relationship.

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galilah

.."There are two ways of spreading light: to be the candle or the mirror that reflects it. " Edith Wharton

(in reply to chellekitty)

Post #: 6

RE: help with untraining a new Dom? - 1/8/2008 3:58:41 AM

ExSteelAgain

Posts: 1803
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From: Georgia
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You said you like his Dominant features, but you want him to understand the authority dynamic. Oh, I suspect he is going to have authority over you before you know it. There are many different types of Doms and not everyone works from a script. Give things time to work and you might be very happy.

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Post #: 7

RE: help with untraining a new Dom? - 1/8/2008 4:00:14 AM

SailingBum

Posts: 3225
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From: Sailin the stormy sea
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This sounds like my partener is perfect except for x... I have to agree with Fire lady untrain =change. Flirting with diaster.

BadOne

(in reply to TysGalilah)

Post #: 8

RE: help with untraining a new Dom? - 1/8/2008 4:03:18 AM

Evility

Posts: 915
Joined: 12/19/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: chellekitty
but, when i talk about the things i am doing in the lifestyle he says negative things, like many unfamiliar with the lifestyle do...all of his exposure to the lifestyle this far has been movies... throwing a book at him just isn't going to work and there are so many facets of the lifestyle that have taken me over 6 years to learn on my own... but i am not sure how to with someone who doesn't understand the concept...

So because he doesn't see the lifestyle the same way that you see the lifestyle he must be the one in error and he has to change? Why do you assume that he is so unfamiliar with the lifestyle? Perhaps he's been around the block a few times himself - you had many favorable comments to make about his regarding bdsm - perhaps he not been sucked into "the lifestyle" side of things and doesn't need to be part of the lifestyle to do what he does. You found someone who is original and you want to mold him into another lifestyle dominant. Do you have plans to dress him up like Glenn from the Village People?

Maybe that's not what he is and maybe that's not what he wants.

Edited for spelling. Yes, it matters.

< Message edited by Evility -- 1/8/2008 4:05:54 AM >

(in reply to chellekitty)

Post #: 9

RE: help with untraining a new Dom? - 1/8/2008 4:20:27 AM

slavegirljoy

Posts: 1207
Joined: 11/6/2006
From: North Carolina, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: chellekitty
...i really do want to explain about authority exchange, but i am not sure how to with someone who doesn't understand the concept...so...help?

Why don't you just have a conversation with him about 'the concept' of authority exchange and explain your understanding of it and find out how he feels about the way you see it?

Like others have said, seeking to 'untrain' someone who is not interested in or wanting to be 'untrained' is not likely to be a positive experience.

But, a good 'ol fashioned' conversation can do a lot. At the very least, you can find out if he is even open to being 'untrained' or if he is steadfast in his beliefs and no amount of effort, on your part, is going to change that. You might find out that it would be better to just be good friends and not expect more.

slave joy
Owned property of Master David

(in reply to chellekitty)

Post #: 10

RE: help with untraining a new Dom? - 1/8/2008 4:26:35 AM

Dnomyar

Posts: 7933
Joined: 6/27/2005
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You state that he says negative things. If that turns you on then stay with him. If not then it is someting to think about.

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Post #: 11

RE: help with untraining a new Dom? - 1/8/2008 7:14:22 AM

Jeffff

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Most people are not waiting to be changed. We aren't recipes that need a few different ingredients, we are who we are. Some people will go along for a while but I think the end result will be resentment

Jeff

(in reply to chellekitty)

Post #: 12

RE: help with untraining a new Dom? - 1/8/2008 7:26:12 AM

Leatherist

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If a woman came across to me like that-I'd ask her why she wasn't dating allan alda instead.

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Post #: 13

RE: help with untraining a new Dom? - 1/8/2008 7:29:14 AM

LadyHibiscus

Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline

He is sadistic, but not into the lifestyle? So he is at least somewhat clear on the difference between consent and non-consent?

I have always said that you can change your behavior, but you can't change your essential self. Same works with others. How would you feel if some dude came along and said, Chelle, you rock, but if you were like X, whoa!

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Post #: 14

RE: help with untraining a new Dom? - 1/8/2008 7:32:29 AM

RCdc

Posts: 8674
Status: offline

Chelle
My suggesting is get off the idea of training - or rather 'untraining' and teach him by example instead. Be the book yourself, let him learn what you and why you are via yourself. There is no better tool. You cannot tell him he is outright wrong, but you can show him that the fantasy doesn;t always match the reality.

the.dark.

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RC&dc

love isnt gazing into each others eyes - it's looking forward in the same direction

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Post #: 15

RE: help with untraining a new Dom? - 1/8/2008 7:50:32 AM

Aylee

Posts: 24103
Joined: 10/14/2007
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Chelle,

First off, I think that you should slow down the relationship, but you know I think that.

Second, have a talk with him about what power exchange means to you. Take it slowly. Make sure that you explain that you do not see it as a diminishment of yourself, but rather an enhancement of who you feel you are. Start with small exchanges. One example would be for him to order for you at a coffee shop or while you are out for desert. I am not saying that he has to chose for you, merely that he places the order for you. Another way is for him to make a choice on what you wear. Tiny steps again. "Would you prefer the blue or green blouse?" Things like this can give over small bits of control with out jumping into fast. And then as he grows more comfortable you can make them larger bits of control. At some point (hopefully) he will say, "Wear the red blouse."

Remember to tell him when you enjoy these power exchanges. "I felt warm and fuzzy wearing the red blouse because you picked it and told me to."

It is nearly taboo in our current society for men to do this with women because of societal training and decree. So it is important that he know that this pleases you to please him. I think that is what you mean by "untraining." To cast him loose from the certainity that telling a woman to do X will result in a very teed off woman and having his head bit off. Instead you want to show and "train" him that telling you to do X makes things more enjoyable for both parties.

Just my 10 cents. Inflation, you know.

Take care and be well.

Best,

Aylee

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Post #: 16

RE: help with untraining a new Dom? - 1/8/2008 7:58:07 AM

Mercnbeth

Posts: 11766
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~ Fast Reply ~

Chelle,
Take him to as many places where he can meet and get to know people socially. Not just at club functions where he can see 'lifestyle' activities that may be intimidating, but outside that environment where he can get to know people outside of their 'play' persona. He may need to reconcile that a person may be labeled Dom/Master, sub/slave; but is also still a person.

Books and talk between you two is fine, but he needs some real time example to get to, as you say, "understand the concept". It isn't important if they are 'good' or 'bad' examples or if they are people he likes. He just has to see that they are people and that there is no set model to follow.

Don't give any 'disclaimers', such as "you'll love this guy!" or "wait until you get to know her - she'll tell you exactly what I mean." You'll run into a problem if he ends up hating that guy, or thinking that person who 'knew' was a moron. The only thing he should have confidence in is that you're his 'safety net' for the process. You aren't "in charge" but if need be you can be his exit strategy if the experience isn't going so well. It's the process that's important and the process should lead to his "un-training".

Good luck!

(in reply to RCdc)

Post #: 17

RE: help with untraining a new Dom? - 1/8/2008 8:04:03 AM

Phin

Posts: 1802
Joined: 2/26/2007
Status: offline

he cant have you, you're mine

Seriously take him to munches and the sort. If you take him to a group function, dont realy visit the dongeon much the first time. In the social settings you will see more of the D/s aspect than play. For now I think that you need to have him looking at that to see what his reaction will be.

Best of luck, I wish you happiness, you deserve it.

Phin

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Post #: 18

RE: help with untraining a new Dom? - 1/8/2008 8:09:51 AM

beargonewild

Posts: 22716
Joined: 5/7/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: chellekitty

...but, when i talk about the things i am doing in the lifestyle he says negative things, like many unfamiliar with the lifestyle do...all of his exposure to the lifestyle this far has been movies - not like the secretary, but like strangeland...and i am not even sure the secretary would help, because of his educational background, anyway...
thanks in advance...
chelle

Hi chelle, I had focused on this section as I think this is the crux of your issue. It sounds like his negative comments are to cover up his lack of knowledge in many facets of WIITWD. Ads you stated, you took over 6 years to learn yourself and maybe you could start by teaching this guy what you have learned. Granted he'll make disparaging remarks but with patience, you can show him that there is more to BDSM and this lifestyle then what's shown on television and movies.....Don't think of this as untraining a dominant , it's more of being a teacher. We all has something to teach our s/o and we all have something to learn from our s/o. The best you can do is to share your knowledge with him, what he does with that knowledge is his choice and it's out of your hands.

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Post #: 19

RE: help with untraining a new Dom? - 1/8/2008 8:23:50 AM

ArgoGeorgia

Posts: 256
Joined: 2/9/2007
From: Atlanta, Georgia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: chellekitty
because throwing a book at him just isn't going to work and there are so many facets of the lifestyle that have taken me over 6 years to learn on my own, that...yea, i just am not sure where to start...

It took you 6 years to learn all of the facets, why shouldn't he have the same consideration? Allow him to learn at his own pace - you can't force it. Be there to offer your wisdom and support, if he is interested in reading books, get them for him, etc. Think back to when you first started and everything you did to learn about the lifestyle.

If you are looking to change him instantly into your idea of a perfect Dom, you will be doomed to failure I fear.

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Post #: 20

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