Collarspace Discussion Forums


Home  Login  Search 

RE: Congratulations it looks as if america just might get it's first black president and it's about time


View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
 
All Forums >> [Casual Banter] >> Off the Grid >> RE: Congratulations it looks as if america just might get it's first black president and it's about time Page: <<   < prev  1 2 [3] 4   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
RE: Congratulations it looks as if america just might g... - 1/9/2008 8:35:18 PM   
defiantbadgirl


Posts: 2988
Joined: 11/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

The problem is that regardless of the president, the US as a whole is deeply involved all over the world in many ways, so it cant be avoided without total isolationism - including, and most relevantly in the commercial sphere.



If it takes isolationism to stop outsourcing, so be it. Every day, more and more jobs that once paid a living wage are outsourced. Americans are being forced to take low paying service jobs. At the same time, rent and utility rates are going up. If prices were lowered to accomodate the decrease in wages, it wouldn't be a problem, but I don't see that happening. I want a president that will find a way to stop outsourcing and bring jobs that pay a living wage back to the United States. I want to see law enforcement agencies that don't enforce laws against employing illegal immigrants penalized. I want a president that will bring the troops home and direct US tax dollars toward universal health care. Our tax dollars have to be spent somewhere. Better to spend on health care than on fighting useless wars in foreign countries.

_____________________________


Only in the United States is the health of the people secondary to making money. If this is what "capitalism" is about, I'll take socialism any day of the week.


Collared by MartinSpankalot May 13 2008

(in reply to LadyEllen)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: Congratulations it looks as if america just might g... - 1/9/2008 8:42:10 PM   
junecleaver


Posts: 1145
Joined: 4/6/2005
Status: offline
quote:

He wrote the book- "The audasscity  to Dream".


It's the Audacity of Hope.

< Message edited by junecleaver -- 1/9/2008 8:44:09 PM >


_____________________________


"No one will ever win the battle of the sexes; there's too much fraternizing with the enemy. "
--Henry A. Kissinger

(in reply to pahunkboy)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: Congratulations it looks as if america just might g... - 1/9/2008 8:43:11 PM   
barefootprincess


Posts: 66
Joined: 3/20/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SubbieOnWheels

quote:

ORIGINAL: barefootprincess

I believe Obama was raised Muslim. I also have seen pictures of him being sworn into a public office with a koran instead of a bible.

That wasn't Obama. That's someone from Minnesota, if I recall correctly. Obama's father was African, and he was raised Christian.



And you are a Republican or a Liberal? Of course not.
Just because someone says they belong to the church of christ or whatever cult they slide into on Sundays doesn not make them christian.
They had Obamas school teachers on tv last week, during a documentary these childern were doing the trance thing over the koran in the back ground. For some reason, that Minnesotan was named Obama also.
Its all good, we are in the USA and can believe and vote which ever way we choose.(btw, thank a soldier for that)
I just wish we had some better people running, I follow these threads with interest. Tell me more, please.
Good night
bfp

(in reply to SubbieOnWheels)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Congratulations it looks as if america just might g... - 1/9/2008 8:55:17 PM   
Alumbrado


Posts: 5560
Status: offline
quote:

I believe Obama was raised Muslim. I also have seen pictures of him being sworn into a public office with a koran instead of a bible.


No, you did not see pictures of Barrack Obama, the current Presidential candidate, swearing the oath of office on a Koran.

http://www.snopes.com/politics/religion/ellison.asp

(in reply to barefootprincess)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: Congratulations it looks as if america just might g... - 1/9/2008 9:08:12 PM   
barefootprincess


Posts: 66
Joined: 3/20/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Alumbrado

quote:

I believe Obama was raised Muslim. I also have seen pictures of him being sworn into a public office with a koran instead of a bible.


No, you did not see pictures of Barrack Obama, the current Presidential candidate, swearing the oath of office on a Koran.

http://www.snopes.com/politics/religion/ellison.asp



This is what has been posted,,many many times.
But hey, if its on the internet and it also has snopes.com saying it not true.
Makes me just want to do more home work and make my own opinions, and not that of a international news network, but an internet based snopes web site... decisions decisions.


I don’t know if all of this is true, but its worth a look… 






 
 Who is Barack Obama?
 
Probable U. S. Presidential candidate, Barack Hussein Obama was born in
Honolulu, Hawaii, to Barack Hussein Obama, Sr., a black MUSLIM from
Nyangoma-Kogel, Kenya and Ann Dunham, a white ATHIEST from
Wichita, Kansas.
 
Obama's parents met at the University of Hawaii . When Obama was two years
Old, his parents divorced. H is father returned to Kenya . His mother then
Married Lolo Soetoro, a RADICAL Muslim from Indonesia ?
 
When Obama was 6 years old, the family relocate to Indonesia . Obama
Attended a MUSLIM school in Jakarta . He also spent two years in a
Catholic school.
 
Obama takes great care to conceal the fact that he is a Muslim. He is
Quick to point out that, "He was once a Muslim, but that he also attended
Catholic school."
 
Obama's political handlers are attempting to make it appear that that he
Is not a radical.
 
Obama's introduction to Islam came via his father, and that this influence
Was temporary at best. In reality, the senior Obama returned to Kenya soon
After the divorce, and never again had any direct influence over his son's
Education.
 
Lolo Soetoro, the second husband of Obama's mother, Ann Dunham, introduced
His stepson to Islam. Obama was enrolled in a Wahabi school in Jakarta .
 
Wahabism is the RADI CAL teaching that is followed by the Muslim
Terrorists who are now waging Jihad a gainst the western world.
 
Since it is politically expedient to be a CHRISTIAN when seeking major
Public office in the United States , Barack Hussein Obama has joined the
United Church of Chris t in an attempt to downplay his Muslim background.
ALSO, keep in mind that when he was sworn into office he DID NOT use the
Holy Bible, but instead the Koran.
 
Barack Hussein Obama will NOT recite the Pledge of Allegiance nor will he
Show any reverence for our flag. While others place their hands over their
Hearts, Obama turns his back to the flag and slouches.
 
Let us all remain alert concerning Obama's expected presidential candidacy.
 
The Muslims have said they plan on destroying the US from the inside out,
What better way to start than at the highest level - through the President
Of the United States , one of their own!!!!
 
Please forward to everyone you know. Would you want this man leading our
Country?......

(in reply to Alumbrado)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Congratulations it looks as if america just might g... - 1/9/2008 9:13:48 PM   
Alumbrado


Posts: 5560
Status: offline
You don't 'know' if the crap above is true, so you will just keep repeating it, while dismissing evidence to the contrary...

(in reply to barefootprincess)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Congratulations it looks as if america just might g... - 1/9/2008 9:19:44 PM   
SubbieOnWheels


Posts: 590
Joined: 12/14/2007
Status: offline
Snopes.com has a beautiful dissertation on all the "Obama is a Muslim" stuff out there.http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/muslim.asp

And, for the record, the Muslim who used the Koran to be sworn into office was Keith Ellison of Minnesota.


(in reply to Alumbrado)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: Congratulations it looks as if america just might g... - 1/9/2008 9:52:10 PM   
Dom4Ebonyfemsub


Posts: 2
Joined: 9/15/2007
Status: offline
Dear folks,

I realize that I, and my thinking, constitute a minority on this forum.  But may we have little historical context and basic understanding of economics please?

All wars are a series of mistakes from the Peloponesian wars to our current struggle against Islamic fascists.  Preemption and preventive war have been a part of warfare dating to the wars of the ancients....check out Rome's 3rd Punic War.  More recently, it took Lincoln four years to find his Grant and Sherman and it took FDR almost as long to find his Eisenhower.  War is not pleasant, but is many times necessary.  And, as practiced by Western civilization, it can embody the best of the human spirit and wind up liberating billions over time.  And what constitutes liberation?  At this place in history, all I can point to as an answer, is that representative government and free-market economics constitutes liberation. 

After 12 years of broken peace treaties, Arab lies and aggression, UN scandals, and threats of further aggression several things were clear; Saddam was a threat, was in bed with Islamic extremism and deserved to be removed.  Unlike Bill Clinton, who awoke one day and decided to bomb Bosnia without congressional or UN approval, the US under George Bush followed accepted protocol before levying war.  Besides WMD, 22 other articles of war were ratified by the US congress.  Each one of these articles remains valid to this day.  As far as WMDs are concerned, it was not up to the West to verify whether or not he possessed stockpiles, it was up to Iraq to verify that they did not.  And such verificatiion was impossible since the inspectors whose job this was were denied entry and access.  Listen to the tapes of Saddam, in his own voice, promising that as soon as sanctions died down, he was going to ramp up production.  Listen to Saddam as he revels in descriptions of the mass slaughter he will soon be capable of.  Listen to Saddam as he relives his past gassings of Kurdish and Iranian villages and hamlets.  Listen, and then tell me you want a return to the day of an impotent US, unable and unwilling to confront the central evil of our time.  I firmly believe the American soldier is the best friend this world has ever known, and ever will know.  Events, and reality, have yet to prove this wrong.

Gone are the days when Abu Nidal takes refuge in Iraq.  Gone are the days when Ramsi Yussef flees to Iraq after the first WTC attack in 1993.  Gone are the days of training compounds housing aircraft fuselage.  Gone are the days of shooting at planes in no-fly zones in accordance with a peace treaty sign by Iraqi representatives.  Gone are the days of attempted murder of a former sitting US president.  Gone are the days of Iraqi bonuses paid to the families of Palestinian suicide bombers.  Gone are the days of invasions of neighboring peaceful countries and brutal wars with Iran that kill millions.  

Yes, each of our war dead is a tragedy for their families, but not for the nation.  We have lost less men in 4 years of war against a savage enemy, and not just of us, but of all men and women, than we lost in a matter of hours at Normandy.  But should not we have attacked Saudi Arabia in the wake of 911 and not Iraq?  Such thinking would have precluded the US from making war on Germany in WWII for, after all, Germany never attacked us.  We are at war with an ideology and Iraq is one front in that war.  We are not at war with countries, we are at war with extremists; and extremism does not recognize borders, treaties or boundaries.  And, lest we forget, war was declared on the West generations ago by Prince Wahibbi and after him, the Muslim Brotherhood.  We were just to self-absorbed and "busy" to notice.  We have been at war with elements of Islam since the days of Jefferson; this did not begin under George Bush's watch.  What is different is that he is the first leader, in my lifetime at least, to stand up to the murderers and thugs; the first leader to deliver something to Islamic extremists besides legal briefs (Mr. Clinton) and harsh language (the United Nations).  And now, for the first time in recorded history, the people of the Middle East have a chance to effect the necessary and needed reformation and re-reformation that the development of Islam has lacked, and which has doomed Islam to the pitiful state it occupies today. 

In their place are the seeds of true change.  You want change?  How about women going to school and elections being held in places that, just a few short years ago, such thoughts would be laughable.  More change?  How about the foundations of a free press and functioning Arab economy based on something other than oil and a hatred for the West.  Still want change?  How about Sunni and Shia working together and with Americans to rid their country of Muslim thugs and killers.  Sanitation plants, water plants, power plants, political progress and reconciliation at the grassroots level, hospitals, schools and roads built where before there was nothing; that is change.  Opportunity for people that, until now, stood just as good a chance of winding up in a mass grave with a blindfold still tied around their decaying skulls; that is change.

But, alas, we have also changed.  As we have lost our spiritual way, so have we lost the simple ability to discern right from wrong.  As we have become wealthier, more leisured and "smarter" we have lost the ruggedness and ability to innovate and respond that separates Western civilization from the dysfunctional mobs of today.  We wallow in moral relativisim and bemoan our plight, as if our forefathers experienced nothing of this magnitude.  We have replaced acquiring knowledge with staring at an box that influences our thinking, heedless of the fact that the people doing the influencing have a decrepit ideology of their own acquired, unfortunately these days, from the American university system.  We seem to have lost the ability to think or act and we mire ourselves in the supposed guilt acquired over the ages.  We listen to the insipid and banal posturing of talking heads and think we are informed.  And we should be ashamed.

Just in my short lifetime, I have experienced the hysterical voices prophesizing a mini Ice Age descending on the planet.  Those same voices now predict doomsday scenarios because we are creating a planetary oven.  In my youth, I remember the media telling us that Communism was inevitable and we needed to learn to live with our enemies.  These same useful idiots also proclaimed that there were too many people in the world and surely we were running out of food before the new millenium.  I listenened and, for a time, I believed.  But it did not come to pass. 

For the greatest resource we possess is the mind of man.  And with the mind of man comes the concept of the individual.  And with the individual comes the infusion of commerce and the rule of law.  And with these things all, comes relative peace and prosperity. 

Fear not the future, for it is glorious!  As Sir Winston would say, This is not the end.  It is not even the beginning of the end.  But it is, perhaps, the end of the beginning.

As far as economics, I will address in a later post if I am still allowed to post.  But suffice to say, like everything else, economics is cyclical.  Sub prime crisis?  96% of mortgages are paid on time.  The ones that are in default are the result of bad decisons by both lenders and borrowers.  Corporate greed?  In any functioning economy, there exists both wage-payers and wage-earners.  One can not exist without the other.  Outsourcing?  Global prosperity creates markets which in turn creates more opportunity and prosperity.  Trade deficit?  Given a choice, I will run a deficit rather than a surplus; it implies that my citizens have enough income and savings to buy imports.  Rising energy prices?  Higher prices lead to more conservation and a quicker turn to alternative methods due to innovation, research and the entrepreneurial spirit.

Have we become so used, through the vapid toilet that is pop culture, to entitlement and self-pitying whining?

Remember this; you are a citizen of the most noble land and you have more opportunity than any people in the history of civilization.


Best regards,

(in reply to SubbieOnWheels)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Congratulations it looks as if america just might g... - 1/9/2008 10:25:27 PM   
Alumbrado


Posts: 5560
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SubbieOnWheels

Snopes.com has a beautiful dissertation on all the "Obama is a Muslim" stuff out there.http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/muslim.asp

And, for the record, the Muslim who used the Koran to be sworn into office was Keith Ellison of Minnesota.




And it is so easy to confuse the two...

http://www.keithellison.org/photos/EllisonObama.jpg

(in reply to SubbieOnWheels)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: Congratulations it looks as if america just might g... - 1/9/2008 10:25:59 PM   
defiantbadgirl


Posts: 2988
Joined: 11/14/2005
Status: offline
US citizens are getting poorer because of living wage jobs being shipped oversees. Many working Americans are homeless because their service jobs pay so little they can't afford rent, utilities, and food. The poor get screwed either way. They can't afford high priced apartments that are well insulated so they go for the cheaper apartments that are drafty and end up with extremely high utility bills. High priced utilities don't hurt the big companies that pollute the atmosphere the most. They only hurt the poor.

_____________________________


Only in the United States is the health of the people secondary to making money. If this is what "capitalism" is about, I'll take socialism any day of the week.


Collared by MartinSpankalot May 13 2008

(in reply to Dom4Ebonyfemsub)
Profile   Post #: 50
RE: Congratulations it looks as if america just might g... - 1/9/2008 10:43:33 PM   
ArizonaSunSwitch


Posts: 205
Joined: 11/14/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

In his speech tonight Obama was mentioning problems that this country's facing and he used the word "genocide."
Does that mean that he intends to get us involved in foreign countries' problems I wonder?
That's definately NOT what I'm looking for in a candidate.


Yes, because it's perfectly ok for us to throw our military around, just as long as it's in a country that poses no
national interest to us. *rolls eyes*

He's also said he'd invade Pakistan, which will further destablize a (sort-of) pro-US country, potentially handing it
(and it's nuclear weapons) to extremist muslims.

But, nevermind, Hillary is the establishment candidate and the establishment candidate is the only one that is allowed to
win the democrat nomination. The good news is she isn't as naive, the bad news is they are both totalitarian marxists at
heart (and if the country elects one of those i'd rather get the naive inexperienced one).

(in reply to popeye1250)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: Congratulations it looks as if america just might g... - 1/9/2008 11:05:45 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

The problem is that regardless of the president, the US as a whole is deeply involved all over the world in many ways, so it cant be avoided without total isolationism - including, and most relevantly in the commercial sphere.



If it takes isolationism to stop outsourcing, so be it. Every day, more and more jobs that once paid a living wage are outsourced. Americans are being forced to take low paying service jobs. At the same time, rent and utility rates are going up. If prices were lowered to accomodate the decrease in wages, it wouldn't be a problem, but I don't see that happening. I want a president that will find a way to stop outsourcing and bring jobs that pay a living wage back to the United States. I want to see law enforcement agencies that don't enforce laws against employing illegal immigrants penalized. I want a president that will bring the troops home and direct US tax dollars toward universal health care. Our tax dollars have to be spent somewhere. Better to spend on health care than on fighting useless wars in foreign countries.


Defiant, if *you* were running for president you'd get my vote!
I have no problem voting for a woman, just not the global socialist Hillary.
On the Democratic side Edwards agrees with the above.
And he's talking about those things and people are starting to listen.
BOTH Hillary and Obama voted for that amnesty crap so I can't ever vote for them.

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to defiantbadgirl)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: Congratulations it looks as if america just might g... - 1/9/2008 11:12:27 PM   
ArizonaSunSwitch


Posts: 205
Joined: 11/14/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl

US citizens are getting poorer because of living wage jobs being shipped oversees. Many working Americans are homeless because their service jobs pay so little they can't afford rent, utilities, and food. The poor get screwed either way. They can't afford high priced apartments that are well insulated so they go for the cheaper apartments that are drafty and end up with extremely high utility bills. High priced utilities don't hurt the big companies that pollute the atmosphere the most. They only hurt the poor.


Overseas there is no OSHA, no EPA, (frequently) lower business taxes and no predatory legal system that pays out milltions
to dumbasses that spill hot coffee on their crotches. The fact that the workers in these newly emerging economies are willing
to work for pennies on the dollar is just the last nail in the coffin.

Screw the poor, they are in the wagon while the middle class and the rich pull it for them. If they don't like their situation they
happen to be blessed to be living in the country that provides them the most opportunity to change that situation. I wish more
would take advantage of that, rather than just voting for people who's entire philosphy is to take money (at the point of a
gun) from people that know how to make and invest it (to the benefit of us all) and give it to people that don't deserve it.

Robin Hood is a fairy tale, not the basis of a sound economic system.


(in reply to defiantbadgirl)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Congratulations it looks as if america just might g... - 1/9/2008 11:36:24 PM   
defiantbadgirl


Posts: 2988
Joined: 11/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ArizonaSunSwitch


quote:

ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl

outsourcing:

the workers in these newly emerging economies are willing
to work for pennies on the dollar

which is why Americans are not:

living in the country that provides them the most opportunity to change that situation.



So there are enough CEO positions open for every poor American to change that situation? How are people to change their situation when the once decent paying jobs have been outsourced? It takes money to make money. Few decent paying jobs = few opportunities.

_____________________________


Only in the United States is the health of the people secondary to making money. If this is what "capitalism" is about, I'll take socialism any day of the week.


Collared by MartinSpankalot May 13 2008

(in reply to ArizonaSunSwitch)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: Congratulations it looks as if america just might g... - 1/9/2008 11:38:30 PM   
CuriousLord


Posts: 3911
Joined: 4/3/2007
Status: offline
..about time we got our first black president?

Dear Karana, man! Don't get me wrong, I think I'm going to vote for the man at this point, but you're happy about his race?

I don't care what way you spin it, ignore the damn race. It's racism either way.

(in reply to wankerforuse)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: Congratulations it looks as if america just might g... - 1/10/2008 12:15:28 AM   
ArizonaSunSwitch


Posts: 205
Joined: 11/14/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl

quote:

ORIGINAL: ArizonaSunSwitch


quote:

ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl

outsourcing:

the workers in these newly emerging economies are willing
to work for pennies on the dollar

which is why Americans are not:

living in the country that provides them the most opportunity to change that situation.



So there are enough CEO positions open for every poor American to change that situation? How are people to change their situation when the once decent paying jobs have been outsourced? It takes money to make money. Few decent paying jobs = few opportunities.


Please, if you know better than the companies themselves. Start your own. Treat your employees as you wish. As long as there's still people like me to oppose the socialists, you will still have the freedom to start your own business.

The American people have gotten the economy they've asked and voted for. There's no environmental program too expensive
despite the ever dimishing returns, there's no regulation too expensive for a company to comply with as long as the regulation is to benefit "workers" and the people that get millions for spilling coffee on their crotch deserve it, because well, hot coffee shouldn't be hot because it burns and the company should of known better (of course, no one actually wants to *buy* cold coffee, with the exception of a few that buy the weird shit at starbucks).

If you're not willing to put your life savings, possibly your house up to start the business, well, stop whining about it. No one owes *anyone* a "living wage" or anything else. If you don't like the terms of the job don't take it, it's a free country.

(in reply to defiantbadgirl)
Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Congratulations it looks as if america just might g... - 1/10/2008 12:27:54 AM   
defiantbadgirl


Posts: 2988
Joined: 11/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ArizonaSunSwitch

The American people have gotten the economy they've asked and voted for.


So middle class Americans voted for big corporations to outsource their jobs just so they could become poor. I would be interested in reading about this vote I've never heard of. Link please?

_____________________________


Only in the United States is the health of the people secondary to making money. If this is what "capitalism" is about, I'll take socialism any day of the week.


Collared by MartinSpankalot May 13 2008

(in reply to ArizonaSunSwitch)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: Congratulations it looks as if america just might g... - 1/10/2008 12:58:32 AM   
ArizonaSunSwitch


Posts: 205
Joined: 11/14/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl

quote:

ORIGINAL: ArizonaSunSwitch

The American people have gotten the economy they've asked and voted for.


So middle class Americans voted for big corporations to outsource their jobs just so they could become poor. I would be interested in reading about this vote I've never heard of. Link please?


Yes you did. When you voted for higher taxes for the "rich". When you vote for every environmental program without understanding the economic impact. When you vote to allow government to regulate every aspect of every business relationship. When you vote for "alternative fuels" in the form of ethanol that at best return 30% more energy than the fossil fuel required to create it (and as a side effect doubling corn and beef costs). Ie. when you think with your heart (or dick or pussy) instead of your head.

You seem to think companies are obligated to conduct their business here no matter what the costs are. That's no different than someone putting shackles on you and forcing you to pick lettuce or cotton or tobacco for 12 hours a day without pay. If you don't like outsourcing you better damn well start supporting political candidates that want to improve the business climate here instead of candidates that think corporations only exist to have every cent of profit possible squeezed out of them in the form of taxes.

There are no links for common sense. If you want to see where the current political sentiment will invariably lead us (if it isn't reversed) read "Atlas Shrugged". The corporations are already starting down this road, as they are *morally* obligated to defend their shareholders (ie owner's) interest in any way they can. In this political climate, it's safer for them to hedge and spread their operations out beyond this government's reach. There isn't a damn thing that can be done to stop if if you care to continue to live in a free country. Of course you can choose to empower people like Hillary at the expense of your own liberty if it makes you feel better because she'll stick it to the "rich" (while accelerating the decline of your own earnings potential).

(in reply to defiantbadgirl)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: Congratulations it looks as if america just might g... - 1/10/2008 12:37:23 PM   
ChainsandFreedom


Posts: 222
Joined: 6/20/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ArizonaSunSwitch


quote:

ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl

US citizens are getting poorer because of living wage jobs being shipped oversees. Many working Americans are homeless because their service jobs pay so little they can't afford rent, utilities, and food. The poor get screwed either way. They can't afford high priced apartments that are well insulated so they go for the cheaper apartments that are drafty and end up with extremely high utility bills. High priced utilities don't hurt the big companies that pollute the atmosphere the most. They only hurt the poor.


Overseas there is no OSHA, no EPA, (frequently) lower business taxes and no predatory legal system that pays out milltions
to dumbasses that spill hot coffee on their crotches. The fact that the workers in these newly emerging economies are willing
to work for pennies on the dollar is just the last nail in the coffin.

Screw the poor, they are in the wagon while the middle class and the rich pull it for them. If they don't like their situation they
happen to be blessed to be living in the country that provides them the most opportunity to change that situation. I wish more
would take advantage of that, rather than just voting for people who's entire philosphy is to take money (at the point of a
gun) from people that know how to make and invest it (to the benefit of us all) and give it to people that don't deserve it.

Robin Hood is a fairy tale, not the basis of a sound economic system.




You know what else is a fairy tale? Horatio Alger stories. You can't go from rags to riches just because you want to and work hard-otherwise all those 16-hr a day janitorial workers and nurses would be the richest Americans.

Fourtunatly for America, your 'screw the poor' attitude isn't what our republic was founded on. If it were, we would still have colonial charters and indentured servants rather than a constitution and private citizen-consumers.  

"If they don't like their situation they
happen to be blessed to be living in the country that provides them the most opportunity to change that situation."

-actually, the standard of living for the poor / middle class is higher in a great many other countries. So is mobility up the economic ladder. Unless you're a multimillionare, your chances for success at becoming richer are greater in Canada, Austrailia, or Germany than they are here in the States.

"I wish more
would take advantage of that, rather than just voting for people who's entire philosphy is to take money (at the point of a
gun) from people that know how to make and invest it (to the benefit of us all) and give it to people that don't deserve it. "

-Wait. So you're saying the POOR at the one's taking money at gunpoint? How about the people being taxed even though they can't afford healthy food or a new pair of glasses for their kid? than why are the poor still poor while the rich political class controls all the guns? And you really think Britney Spears, the guy who makes girls gone wild tapes, or the jackass charging a dollar a peice for a condom are investing their money for the benift of us all, well, I assume you're on this site because your a sadist. 

"The fact that the workers in these newly emerging economies are willing to work for pennies on the dollar is just the last nail in the coffin. "

This fact is also an important aspect of HUMAN NATURE which economist's and Ann Randist's either ignore or don't understand.

People will ALWAYS be working to make a profit. If suddenly the economy changed and investors/bussinesses all could only make 30 cents on the dollar in profit instead of 40, they'd STILL WORK HARD FOR THAT PROFIT. They wouldn't just quit making billions-if history is any guide, they might even put in more hours, calories and brain power and work harder.

SO you might as well have enviromental and labor law, and egalitarian tax codes, so that they can go on pursuing their profits instead of pissing in the labor pool and consumer markets where they eat, which is what happens when you're allowed to take short cuts, and have to, in order to outpreform the competition today.

(in reply to ArizonaSunSwitch)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: Congratulations it looks as if america just might g... - 1/10/2008 12:55:21 PM   
ChainsandFreedom


Posts: 222
Joined: 6/20/2007
Status: offline
Arizona said
"Yes you did. When you voted for higher taxes for the "rich". When you vote for every environmental program without understanding the economic impact. When you vote to allow government to regulate every aspect of every business relationship. When you vote for "alternative fuels" in the form of ethanol that at best return 30% more energy than the fossil fuel required to create it (and as a side effect doubling corn and beef costs). Ie. when you think with your heart (or dick or pussy) instead of your head."

-The average voter didn't vote for tax breaks for the rich. This isn't pleblisite government. The budget isn't a Proposition to be voted on by all, its an act of congress.The average voter voted for a POLITICIAN who voted for those tax breaks. The politicians have this nice, comferting blanket of nepotism, law, and class which help make sure there will never BE enough politicians who ARNT going to vote with their 'dicks/hearts/pussys' as a part of the rich white guy club.

-And about enviromental law: It isn't about money. Its about self-preservation as a culture and a species. Not all laws are to keep the rich rich from one day to the next. Some laws are simply meant to preserve the market and resources from greed so that the rich GO ON being rich. By the lsame logic that enviromental law is bad because it keeps corporations from making quite as much money, Wal-Mart security gaurds should be allowed to just murder shoplifters on sight so they don't have to pay lawyers. I guess I should stop writing this and just go rob my neighbor-because laws regulating this would prevent my god-given right to get rich.

"You seem to think companies are obligated to conduct their business here no matter what the costs are. That's no different than someone putting shackles on you and forcing you to pick lettuce or cotton or tobacco for 12 hours a day without pay."

-No, the difference is that you have a CHOICE to run a company and sell products/services GIVEN the avalible profit margins. Not enough profit to be made? Someone else will either fill the niche instead or invest in innovations which make more profit. The shakled are the one's who DO pick lettuce or tobacco for twelve hours a day, doing honest, leagle, non-exploitative work, and not STILL not making enough to make ends meet.

(in reply to ArizonaSunSwitch)
Profile   Post #: 60
Page:   <<   < prev  1 2 [3] 4   next >   >>
All Forums >> [Casual Banter] >> Off the Grid >> RE: Congratulations it looks as if america just might get it's first black president and it's about time Page: <<   < prev  1 2 [3] 4   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy

0.110