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RE: Does anyone know the difference between Vietnam and... - 1/10/2008 2:12:07 PM

BOUNTYHUNTER

Posts: 9259
Joined: 2/5/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: KnOcala

wow, I didn't mean to step into a debate.
Honestly, I think we did the right think initially. But we are spending billions to rebuild a country that will not be able to hold it together if we leave, and we should be seeing the benefits of our aid at the gas pumps. Why are we spending over $3 a gallon? Why is our money in aid not supplying us the oil at greatly reduced rates?

I agree the oil should be pouring in from Iraq to pay for the previous war damages however we can't protect the refineries nor the oil fields and out "friends' ie Saudi Arabia and Kuwait with whom we save their ass won't drop the prices, they love to see us squirm,Wait until the hydrogen car find a mass market then they will be begging us to buy their liquid gold...

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US going to hell in a hand basket/

(in reply to KnOcala)

Post #: 81

RE: Does anyone know the difference between Vietnam and... - 1/10/2008 2:12:44 PM

Aylee

Posts: 24103
Joined: 10/14/2007
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Ooooooooo! I like it when you beg!

_____________________________

Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam

I don’t always wgah’nagl fhtagn. But when I do, I ph’nglui mglw’nafh R’lyeh.

(in reply to trappedinamuseum)

Post #: 82

RE: Does anyone know the difference between Vietnam and... - 1/10/2008 2:14:57 PM

trappedinamuseum

Posts: 5066
Joined: 8/24/2006
Status: offline

For you Aylee....anything.

Just say when and where...and I'll show you all the begging I can do.

_____________________________

"You're gonna catch a cold, from the ice inside you soul.
Don't come back for me.
Don't come back at all" - Jar of Hearts

(in reply to Aylee)

Post #: 83

RE: Does anyone know the difference between Vietnam and... - 1/10/2008 2:19:21 PM

BOUNTYHUNTER

Posts: 9259
Joined: 2/5/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: trappedinamuseum

Bounty, I see your point, but we can't be the land of the free and the home of the brave if we turn people away int their time of need. What about the statement on the Statue of Liberty that says, "Give me your poor, your tired, your huddled masses"? Should we change it to "No Vacancy"? If we start kicking people out now, we lose what this country was created for.

I don't agree with illegal immigration; I think people should do it the legal way it was first created as. I also agree with you that we should not be in Iraq. I think we should concentrate on our own country's issues before going out and trying to solve other people's issues.

And, for the record, I'm damn proud to be a humanitarian, and to stand for the rights of all people, not just the ones who are like me.
[/q

Turning people away that is going to harm us? hell yes..tighten up the immigration policy's.While we are a country of immigrants, this is today..WE must rebuild our own country first and if this means closing the borders to all for a while then so be it... WE DID NOT CAUSE 9/11...

_____________________________

US going to hell in a hand basket/

(in reply to trappedinamuseum)

Post #: 84

RE: Does anyone know the difference between Vietnam and... - 1/10/2008 2:20:33 PM

BOUNTYHUNTER

Posts: 9259
Joined: 2/5/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

Ooooooooo! I like it when you beg!

Beg for me girl say pleaseeeee bounty

_____________________________

US going to hell in a hand basket/

(in reply to Aylee)

Post #: 85

RE: Does anyone know the difference between Vietnam and... - 1/10/2008 2:22:37 PM

trappedinamuseum

Posts: 5066
Joined: 8/24/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: BOUNTYHUNTER

quote:

ORIGINAL: trappedinamuseum

Bounty, I see your point, but we can't be the land of the free and the home of the brave if we turn people away int their time of need. What about the statement on the Statue of Liberty that says, "Give me your poor, your tired, your huddled masses"? Should we change it to "No Vacancy"? If we start kicking people out now, we lose what this country was created for.

I don't agree with illegal immigration; I think people should do it the legal way it was first created as. I also agree with you that we should not be in Iraq. I think we should concentrate on our own country's issues before going out and trying to solve other people's issues.

And, for the record, I'm damn proud to be a humanitarian, and to stand for the rights of all people, not just the ones who are like me.
[/q

Turning people away that is going to harm us? hell yes..tighten up the immigration policy's.While we are a country of immigrants, this is today..WE must rebuild our own country first and if this means closing the borders to all for a while then so be it... WE DID NOT CAUSE 9/11...

Then, our entire being - all the blood spilled with have been for nought...because then we have forgotten why that blood was shed.

Obviously, our opinions differ. I respect that you have yours, but will continue to believe in my own opinion.

_____________________________

"You're gonna catch a cold, from the ice inside you soul.
Don't come back for me.
Don't come back at all" - Jar of Hearts

(in reply to BOUNTYHUNTER)

Post #: 86

RE: Does anyone know the difference between Vietnam and... - 1/10/2008 2:26:14 PM

Suleiman

Posts: 1127
Joined: 9/9/2004
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Kitten, for the sake of the gods, the poor thing is flopping around helplessly bleeding. Just kill it for crying out loud. You can save the bestest parts to leave on Aylee's pillow.

_____________________________

Think of my verbosity as a sort of litmus test for our relationship. I write in a manner identical to how I speak and how I think. If you can not cope with what I have written here, it is probably for the best if we go our separate ways.

(in reply to trappedinamuseum)

Post #: 87

RE: Does anyone know the difference between Vietnam and... - 1/10/2008 2:26:36 PM

Aylee

Posts: 24103
Joined: 10/14/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BOUNTYHUNTER

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

Ooooooooo! I like it when you beg!

Beg for me girl say pleaseeeee bounty

pleaseeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee bounty, share the drugs!

_____________________________

Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam

I don’t always wgah’nagl fhtagn. But when I do, I ph’nglui mglw’nafh R’lyeh.

(in reply to BOUNTYHUNTER)

Post #: 88

RE: Does anyone know the difference between Vietnam and... - 1/10/2008 2:27:20 PM

bestbabync

Posts: 1061
Joined: 7/25/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: trappedinamuseum

quote:

ORIGINAL: bestbabync

i guess noone but me read the diary entries and letters written by terrorist.

in these writings it was found that Al Qaida operatives were trained and stationed in the middle east in the following countries Iran, Iraq, Pakistan and Afganistan.

What's your point?

i mean that terrorism is alive and well in Iraq, Iran, Pakistan & Afganistan.

_____________________________

"A woman is the only thing I am afraid of that I know will not hurt me" Abraham Lincoln
"Choose Life, your mother did!"
www.howobamagotelected.com
http://www.lp.org/platform
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2CaBR3z85c

(in reply to trappedinamuseum)

Post #: 89

RE: Does anyone know the difference between Vietnam and... - 1/10/2008 2:29:20 PM

Aylee

Posts: 24103
Joined: 10/14/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: bestbabync

quote:

ORIGINAL: trappedinamuseum

quote:

ORIGINAL: bestbabync

i guess noone but me read the diary entries and letters written by terrorist.

in these writings it was found that Al Qaida operatives were trained and stationed in the middle east in the following countries Iran, Iraq, Pakistan and Afganistan.

What's your point?

i mean that terrorism is alive and well in Iraq, Iran, Pakistan & Afganistan.

_____________________________

Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam

I don’t always wgah’nagl fhtagn. But when I do, I ph’nglui mglw’nafh R’lyeh.

(in reply to bestbabync)

Post #: 90

RE: Does anyone know the difference between Vietnam and... - 1/10/2008 2:29:40 PM

trappedinamuseum

Posts: 5066
Joined: 8/24/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Suleiman

Kitten, for the sake of the gods, the poor thing is flopping around helplessly bleeding. Just kill it for crying out loud. You can save the bestest parts to leave on Aylee's pillow.

But....I wanna play wif it....its soooo easy.

bestbabync...I understood why you were mentioning terrorism in the other countries, but am confused as to why it had a valid point in this debate. No one here has said that terrorism does not exist in these countries.

_____________________________

"You're gonna catch a cold, from the ice inside you soul.
Don't come back for me.
Don't come back at all" - Jar of Hearts

(in reply to Suleiman)

Post #: 91

RE: Does anyone know the difference between Vietnam and... - 1/10/2008 2:35:46 PM

bestbabync

Posts: 1061
Joined: 7/25/2007
Status: offline

oh god!

what i was getting at was the statements that the 9/11 terrorist had nothing to do with the war in Iraq. which i took as meaning that there are no terrorist in Iraq.

_____________________________

"A woman is the only thing I am afraid of that I know will not hurt me" Abraham Lincoln
"Choose Life, your mother did!"
www.howobamagotelected.com
http://www.lp.org/platform
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2CaBR3z85c

(in reply to trappedinamuseum)

Post #: 92

RE: Does anyone know the difference between Vietnam and... - 1/10/2008 4:03:20 PM

MrRodgers

Posts: 10542
Joined: 7/30/2005
Status: offline

Are you ready ? Get a cup of coffee.

The French invaded Viet Nam to 'give' them a good deal on (take) 'their' rubber. Viet Nam is and has been the world's largest supplier of rubber for over 50 years. Rubber is also #4 in the hit parade of commodities in demand right behind air, water and oil. Yes, pres. Eisenhower did tell Kennedy that Vietnamese oil and rubber were too important to fall into communist hands.

The French got their butts kicked at Dien Bien Phu and left. In the North having declared their independnce once the 'brilliant' US govt. gave the finger over Hồ Chí Minh's (a US ally and on OSS payroll during WWII) desire to be a consitutional republic, in a UNITED Viet Nam...turned to the communists invaded the south with Chinese funding and military assist.

Pres. Kennedy (in maybe his worst move) challenged by Kruschev (Soviet Union) and because of our power manipulation in Viet Nam not being successful...11/63 sent over 16,000 'advisors' as a means to demonstrate his diplomatic 'manhood' and so Viet Nam could shore up the south and beat back the communist invaders. He was then assassinated.

Pres. Johnson then took over and really upped the anti. (500,000 troops at it's zenith) There was an alleged incident against a US Navy ship in the Golf of Tonkin prompting the 'Gulf of Tonkin' resolution passed by our congress justifying $funding$ for the war...YES war. There is NO war without funding. Congress did NOT declare war on Korea, Viet Nam or Iraq. The War Powers Act is as unconsititutional as any and gives presidents...imperial powers.

NOTE: We got into WWII to stop both Japanese imperialist fascism (Pacific) and Nazi imperialist fascism (Europe) and in no way shape or form...for money.

We suffer again now. Iraq has the 2nd (second) largest reserves of crude oil known in the world. We can't imagine that being controlled by a megalomaniac (Hussien) or muslim radicals (al-Qeada). BUT, this crowd...THIS admin. without anywhere sufficient enough forethought, diplomacy or basic brains or for that matter, accurate intelligence lied right straight through their teeth about any threat from Iraq and has demonstrated themselves to be the arrogant, pompous, incompetant clowns that many thought they were and in fact...turned out to be.

They did almost EVERYTHING wrong. Iraq as opposed to geopolitical concerns, has been crazy, costly and tragic adventursism and exactly what our founding fathers warned us against. IF IRAQ had no oil we'd being sending them checks so we could bomb any al-Qaeda. (Pakistan) and he we go...yet again...and they have nukes.

< Message edited by MrRodgers -- 1/10/2008 4:10:15 PM >

(in reply to bestbabync)

Post #: 93

RE: Does anyone know the difference between Vietnam and... - 1/10/2008 4:47:44 PM

trappedinamuseum

Posts: 5066
Joined: 8/24/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

.

NOTE: We got into WWII to stop both Japanese imperialist fascism (Pacific) and Nazi imperialist fascism (Europe) and in no way shape or form...for money.

I disagree with you on that statement, but agree with you on the rest.

_____________________________

"You're gonna catch a cold, from the ice inside you soul.
Don't come back for me.
Don't come back at all" - Jar of Hearts

(in reply to MrRodgers)

Post #: 94

RE: Does anyone know the difference between Vietnam and... - 1/10/2008 5:04:22 PM

MrRodgers

Posts: 10542
Joined: 7/30/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: trappedinamuseum

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

.

NOTE: We got into WWII to stop both Japanese imperialist fascism (Pacific) and Nazi imperialist fascism (Europe) and in no way shape or form...for money.

I disagree with you on that statement, but agree with you on the rest.

Ok, but now you are going to have to explain yourself. Just what 'money' are you talking about ? If you are talking profits...ALL wars are profitable for somebody. US Steel made over $2 Billion in PROFITS in 1917 !! (WWI)

There is a provision for a windfall profits tax during war or national emergencies (used only once I think) You surprised ?

Also: After the bombing of Pearl Harbor, the Germans declared war on the US before we declared war on Germany. What would you have had the us do...say no ?

(in reply to trappedinamuseum)

Post #: 95

RE: Does anyone know the difference between Vietnam and... - 1/10/2008 5:40:12 PM

Suleiman

Posts: 1127
Joined: 9/9/2004
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The phrase "To stop imperialist fascism" seems a bit specious, especially when contrasted to your other well-thought out statements. It reads a bit like a propagandist sound-byte in comparison to the rest of the post.

By the way, thank you for taking the time to use more than the modern newspeak abridged dictionary in stating your arguments. It's always nice to see rhetoric properly applied, especially when the lowbrow set insist on using it like a dirty word.

_____________________________

Think of my verbosity as a sort of litmus test for our relationship. I write in a manner identical to how I speak and how I think. If you can not cope with what I have written here, it is probably for the best if we go our separate ways.

(in reply to MrRodgers)

Post #: 96

RE: Does anyone know the difference between Vietnam and... - 1/10/2008 6:14:55 PM

BOUNTYHUNTER

Posts: 9259
Joined: 2/5/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

quote:

ORIGINAL: BOUNTYHUNTER

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

Ooooooooo! I like it when you beg!

Beg for me girl say pleaseeeee bounty

pleaser bounty, share the drugs!

I can't I love them to much and yippee I get a new batch tommorrow....

_____________________________

US going to hell in a hand basket/

(in reply to Aylee)

Post #: 97

RE: Does anyone know the difference between Vietnam and... - 1/10/2008 8:06:52 PM

dcnovice

Posts: 37282
Joined: 8/2/2006
Status: offline

quote:

We did put Japanese in big internment camps but they weren't citizens, because the US was not allowing them to become citizens yet.

From a Smithsonian Institution website:

During the opening months of World War II, almost 120,000 Japanese Americans, two-thirds of them citizens of the United States, were forced out of their homes and into detention camps established by the U.S. government.

(Emphasis added.)

_____________________________

No matter how cynical you become,
it's never enough to keep up.

JANE WAGNER, THE SEARCH FOR SIGNS OF
INTELLIGENT LIFE IN THE UNIVERSE

(in reply to Aylee)

Post #: 98

RE: Does anyone know the difference between Vietnam and... - 1/10/2008 8:14:49 PM

trappedinamuseum

Posts: 5066
Joined: 8/24/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

Ok, but now you are going to have to explain yourself. Just what 'money' are you talking about ? If you are talking profits...ALL wars are profitable for somebody. US Steel made over $2 Billion in PROFITS in 1917 !! (WWI)

There is a provision for a windfall profits tax during war or national emergencies (used only once I think) You surprised ?

Also: After the bombing of Pearl Harbor, the Germans declared war on the US before we declared war on Germany. What would you have had the us do...say no ?

I'm not going to respond to this tonight, because I'm brain-dead after 10, but will formulate my response tomorrow evening. I'm not disagreeing with the fact that the US did get into the war because the worry about fascism, but I will argue that it was not the only reason, and a driving force behind the war was an economical one. The US had alot to gain from a war.

"There is a provision for a windfall profits tax during war or national emergencies (used only once I think) You surprised ?" - Could you explain this statement a bit more clearly? I think there is an error in there that is keeping me from understanding the validity of this statement in your argument.

Would I have had the US say no? Certainly not. You can't say no when someone declares war on you. Germany had to declare war on the US for two reasons: 1. Economic 2. If they didn't, the US was going to declare on them. But, more on this tomorrow.

_____________________________

"You're gonna catch a cold, from the ice inside you soul.
Don't come back for me.
Don't come back at all" - Jar of Hearts

(in reply to MrRodgers)

Post #: 99

RE: Does anyone know the difference between Vietnam and... - 1/10/2008 8:17:53 PM

BOUNTYHUNTER

Posts: 9259
Joined: 2/5/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Suleiman

Kitten, for the sake of the gods, the poor thing is flopping around helplessly bleeding. Just kill it for crying out loud. You can save the bestest parts to leave on Aylee's pillow.

KILL the beast,thats what many say and yet can't quiet do it...

_____________________________

US going to hell in a hand basket/

(in reply to Suleiman)

Post #: 100

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