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RE: Cheating, Lying Kinksters - 1/10/2008 7:09:28 PM   
beargonewild


Posts: 22716
Joined: 5/7/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: weneedyourhelp

BDSM, D/s, vanilla, dressing up as little bo peep and her sheep, does the type of relationship really matter? Should it? NO! Open,un-open, these do not matter either, nor should they. Cheating is cheating, thats it in a nutshell.

Cougar


Yes the type of relationship does matter and it should matter. One should look at each situation and see the circumstances that surround the types of relationships before making any nutshell interpretation, IMHO


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RE: Cheating, Lying Kinksters - 1/10/2008 7:16:49 PM   
weneedyourhelp


Posts: 118
Joined: 12/16/2007
Status: offline 		I don't know where you got the idea that I said anything about cheating having to be sexual in nature. It doesn't. It is doing anything originally agreed upon to not do. If you told your wife not to buy a dress and she did it behind your back, you wouldn't think of that as cheating? The only relationship that would not pertain to is a nudist one, so how can you say a type of relationship matters?

_____________________________

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Man is still man, and even frozen in a block of ice, our singular purpose is still to get a nut.

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RE: Cheating, Lying Kinksters - 1/10/2008 7:17:55 PM   
xxblushesxx


Posts: 9318
Joined: 11/3/2005
From: Kentucky
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: beargonewild

*sigh* for sure Suleiman. Yet it appears the general concensus on a cheater is one who plays around on their S/O without full knowledge. Yet it seems that a recurring theme is the fact that the circumstances surrounding the reason for cheating isn't being taken into consideration.  Hopefully I am wrong on this.


Circumstances for cheating are; 'he/she doesn't understand me, they can't satisfy me, he/she would be devastated...etc...' of course sometimes it's because, 'the person I'm with has much more $$ and I still want that, but, I also want to do what I want...'

Why not just be honest with yourself and with others? I still think a level playing field where everyone knows everything is the most fair way to live.

~Christina

(in reply to beargonewild)
Profile   Post #: 83
RE: Cheating, Lying Kinksters - 1/10/2008 7:23:34 PM   
beargonewild


Posts: 22716
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline 		Meaning the type of relationship the people have with each other. Meaning, the circumstances regarding and defining an open relationship is the fact that both partners do seek out other outside the relationship. This is what I was referring to.

If my S/O bought something against my wishes, that is plain and simple defiance. For the most part cheating has to do with a sexual nature. Or that would be the same as saying that your S/O cheated because he went and had a coffee or beer with his friend and didn't tell you.


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Profile   Post #: 84
RE: Cheating, Lying Kinksters - 1/10/2008 7:30:18 PM   
GreedyTop


Posts: 52100
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Savannah, GA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: beargonewild

Meaning the type of relationship the people have with each other. Meaning, the circumstances regarding and defining an open relationship is the fact that both partners do seek out other outside the relationship. This is what I was referring to.

If my S/O bought something against my wishes, that is plain and simple defiance. For the most part cheating has to do with a sexual nature. Or that would be the same as saying that your S/O cheated because he went and had a coffee or beer with his friend and didn't tell you.



Heh. I had an ex that considered going out for a drink with a friend to be cheating..if *I* did it..it was ok for him to do,though.

But I agree, Bear..when someone talks about cheating, MOST people would immediately think of it in a sexual context.

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RE: Cheating, Lying Kinksters - 1/10/2008 7:30:46 PM   
weneedyourhelp


Posts: 118
Joined: 12/16/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: beargonewild

Meaning the type of relationship the people have with each other. Meaning, the circumstances regarding and defining an open relationship is the fact that both partners do seek out other outside the relationship. This is what I was referring to.

If my S/O bought something against my wishes, that is plain and simple defiance. For the most part cheating has to do with a sexual nature. Or that would be the same as saying that your S/O cheated because he went and had a coffee or beer with his friend and didn't tell you.


Exactly what I am talking about, "and didn't tell you." A lie of omission is still a lie, and that , to me, constitutes cheating.

_____________________________

" You become responsible forever for what you have tamed." ~ Antoine de Saint-Exupery

Man is still man, and even frozen in a block of ice, our singular purpose is still to get a nut.

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Profile   Post #: 86
RE: Cheating, Lying Kinksters - 1/10/2008 7:34:39 PM   
beargonewild


Posts: 22716
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline 		So this all boils down to a matter of semantics?

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Profile   Post #: 87
RE: Cheating, Lying Kinksters - 1/10/2008 7:38:40 PM   
weneedyourhelp


Posts: 118
Joined: 12/16/2007
Status: offline 		Aside from the fact that I am always up for semantics,(sorry had to be said) I would have to say apparently so. I just believe that there can be cheating in any type of relationship, it all depends on the terms and agreements to the said relationship.

_____________________________

" You become responsible forever for what you have tamed." ~ Antoine de Saint-Exupery

Man is still man, and even frozen in a block of ice, our singular purpose is still to get a nut.

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Profile   Post #: 88
RE: Cheating, Lying Kinksters - 1/10/2008 7:44:32 PM   
beargonewild


Posts: 22716
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline 		I am also but I am also finding that in this case, my temper is getting a bit short. So being a public forum, I propose we agree to disagree and walk away from any further dicussion on this matter between you and I. Deal?

edited to add: my appologies to xxblushesxx for getting too carried away.


< Message edited by beargonewild -- 1/10/2008 7:48:00 PM >

_____________________________

Do Not Rile da Chosen Bear

Promiscuous boy you already know
That I’m all yours what you waiting for?

Resident MANWHORE ~1000 Bear pts~

10 NZ points
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Profile   Post #: 89
RE: Cheating, Lying Kinksters - 1/10/2008 7:48:00 PM   
weneedyourhelp


Posts: 118
Joined: 12/16/2007
Status: offline 		Agreed, have a great evening sir.

Cougar

_____________________________

" You become responsible forever for what you have tamed." ~ Antoine de Saint-Exupery

Man is still man, and even frozen in a block of ice, our singular purpose is still to get a nut.

(in reply to beargonewild)
Profile   Post #: 90
RE: Cheating, Lying Kinksters - 1/10/2008 7:48:29 PM   
beargonewild


Posts: 22716
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline 		And you also.

_____________________________

Do Not Rile da Chosen Bear

Promiscuous boy you already know
That I’m all yours what you waiting for?

Resident MANWHORE ~1000 Bear pts~

10 NZ points
Whips~n~Cuffs

(in reply to weneedyourhelp)
Profile   Post #: 91
RE: Cheating, Lying Kinksters - 1/10/2008 7:58:59 PM   
weneedyourhelp


Posts: 118
Joined: 12/16/2007
Status: offline 		Well, I think we sucessfully hi-jacked this thread, shall we see what other semantics we can get into this evening?  ;)

Cougar


_____________________________

" You become responsible forever for what you have tamed." ~ Antoine de Saint-Exupery

Man is still man, and even frozen in a block of ice, our singular purpose is still to get a nut.

(in reply to beargonewild)
Profile   Post #: 92
RE: Cheating, Lying Kinksters - 1/10/2008 8:00:27 PM   
BOUNTYHUNTER


Posts: 9259
Joined: 2/5/2004
Status: offline 		Hell lets face the truth here, people have been cheating since the beginning of time..Things haven't changed its just that a few modern conveniences have made it easier to do so..I don't condone cheating but lets first define cheating.ITS having a relationship without your partners knowledge,plain and simple,it doesn't have to be physical just the intend to do so is cheating...I happen to be a very lucky man myself..My spouse is true blue to me playing only with the girls while I am allow to have as much strange as I can handle...Even during the bible days man was allow more then one woman..Just my two cents on the matter..

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RE: Cheating, Lying Kinksters - 1/10/2008 8:40:28 PM   
LotusSong


Posts: 6334
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Domme Emeritus
Status: offline 		Some people can compartmentalize their lives.  The part of their heart they give to their master or submissive is the part that the spouse has no interest in.  One does what they have to , to keep sane. 
 
Divorce is not always an option nor is it the solution.. While D/s.is fun, it's not worth destroying a marriage over.  When it becomes so compelling that you can't walk away, then you need to re-evaluate your situation.
 
"Kissin' don't last, cookin' do"- Pennsylvania Dutch saying
 
PS- let me guess- you just got a sad surprise with a recent master?
.



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Profile   Post #: 94
RE: Cheating, Lying Kinksters - 1/10/2008 9:20:52 PM   
Lucius


Posts: 80
Joined: 6/13/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Suleiman

Therein lies the rub, Bear. There seems to be as many definitions around here of what constitutes cheating as there are definitions of what constitutes a sub.


Actually, I think I've only seen three basic definitions.

One is, "Cheating is having a relationship and/or intimate contact with more than one person." Granted, there is some variation on what constitutes a "relationship"  or "intimate contact" in this sense; perhaps that is what you meant.

Then there is "Cheating is having a relationship with more than one person, unless it's me doing it. Then it's just me having X seperate relationships with X different people. But if anyone else has more than one relationship at a time they're cheating and it's wrong."

And then there is the valid definition: "Cheating is breaking the rules of a game, when you have agreed to play that game by those rules." That IS what the word "cheat" means at root isn't it? To mark the cards, to load the dice, to spike the other team's gatorade, to hide a ten dollar punch in your boxing glove. Rather fundamentally, it is to lie, because you either explicitly or implicitly agreed to play by the rules and play fair.

But to get back to the original topic:

A woman who was submitting to Me online revealed eventually that she had a vanilla paramour already. she had some really extreme fantasies and a lot of shame and guilt about having them. But I encouraged her to share that part of her with the Man in her life. "If you love Him, if you trust Him, you should let Him see who you really are." I figured one of two things would happen: either He would accept this new level of intimacy, or at least not completely freak out, and she could continue the relationship on a more open basis, happy ending for her; or he would react with rejection, ending the relationship and freeing her to give herself to Me totally and in truth, happy ending for her AND for Me. Either way would be a resolution; I did not consider the situation acceptable, or tenable, for the long term. So how did He react? she picked a time they'd have a lot of time together alone, let all her filthy degrading fantasies pour out - and He proposed. Vanilla paramour turned out not to be so vanilla after all. He is now her Master and her Husband. Happy ending for both of them anyway - and as for Me, I have the satisfaction of knowing I did the right thing.

And, every once in a while, I get to hear from her still about the awful, terrible, wonderful things He does or makes her do.

Lucius Alexander

House of the Palindromedary

(in reply to Suleiman)
Profile   Post #: 95
RE: Cheating, Lying Kinksters - 1/11/2008 2:31:45 AM   
CuriousLord


Posts: 3911
Joined: 4/3/2007
Status: offline 		Cheaters are disgusting creatures, falling short of dignity or honor.

I wouldn't want one for a friend.  Still, as long as they don't hope for respect, no reason to avoid them in platonic interactions.

(in reply to xxblushesxx)
Profile   Post #: 96
RE: Cheating, Lying Kinksters - 1/11/2008 3:41:19 AM   
RCdc


Posts: 8674
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: xxblushesxx
And Evil; there is no way for me to discuss this community without using the word 'we' once in a while. Most here (from what they say) rely on trust, because this can be a dangerous road. I apologize if I insulted you. It was not my intention to do so. I suppose in a community this large, almost any time someone expresses an opinion, another might feel slighted. This was just an issue I have been dealing with a lot lately and wondered if others felt the same, or could contribute to my understanding of the matter.

~Christina


I believe the problem comes when you exclude - or rather try to include - people who do not feel they are part of some big old arm-in-arm 'community.  Before I was with Darcy, I never confined my relationships into what the 'community' decided.  I do it for me.  Lots of people here did and do that.  If I disagree with someone, that does not reflect a community or lifestyle, it reflects me. If I piss someone off?  Tough and deal.
 
So what you are saying is, because we practise BDSM, we are in some community.  Just because I drink coffee, doesn't put me in some sort of coffee community.  I might agree with some concepts that some people who practise BDSM also agree with, but there are many more I do not.
 
Just because someone cheats in a BDSM relationship, doesn't reflect BDSM as a whole.  If you think like that, you are wrong and pushing non consensually a hell of alot of people into some 'community' they don't want to be in and in reality, doesn't exist.
 
the.dark.


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love isnt gazing into each others eyes - it's looking forward in the same direction

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RE: Cheating, Lying Kinksters - 1/11/2008 3:46:52 AM   
RCdc


Posts: 8674
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: xxblushesxx
Is anyone else insulted when others come here and assume that we will condone any type of behavior even when it is destructive, and goes against the usual dynamic of trust and communication, just because we're 'kinky'?

~ Christina


No.  Are you?  And ifso, why?
 
the.dark.

_____________________________
RC&dc


love isnt gazing into each others eyes - it's looking forward in the same direction

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Profile   Post #: 98
RE: Cheating, Lying Kinksters - 1/11/2008 6:35:07 AM   
xxblushesxx


Posts: 9318
Joined: 11/3/2005
From: Kentucky
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong
 
PS- let me guess- you just got a sad surprise with a recent master?


Absolutely not. I was just curious. I'm very lucky to be with someone who is loving, loyal and honest. I wish everyone had that.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark
So what you are saying is, because we practise BDSM, we are in some community.

Actually no, I was talking about the collarchat forae contributers in general.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark
quote:

ORIGINAL: xxblushesxx
Is anyone else insulted when others come here and assume that we will condone any type of behavior even when it is destructive, and goes against the usual dynamic of trust and communication, just because we're 'kinky'?

~ Christina



No.  Are you?  And ifso, why?

Yes, as a matter of fact I am. This is why I asked this question. I don't understand why people assume that just because we are 'kinky' we are going to help facilitate lying and cheating, which is disrespectful to both your partner, the one you're cheating with, and even to yourself.

(in reply to LotusSong)
Profile   Post #: 99
RE: Cheating, Lying Kinksters - 1/11/2008 11:51:39 AM   
proudsub


Posts: 6142
Joined: 1/31/2004
From: Washington
Status: offline 		I wasn't going to respond to this thread since it would be repeating what i say on all the "cheating" threads, but this post got my attention.

quote:

My wife has been dealing with the fact that something was missing from our sexlife and her ability to fully enjoy sex at all. Through reading and research she discovered it was a need to be submissive. That knowledge scared the shit out of her, she didn't know how to tell me. Thinking I would think of her as a freak or something she kept it from me,


I was the same as your wife about 5 years ago and in a 34 year marriage then, except i did take it to real time to experience what i craved.

quote:

  As she now knows she could have come to me with anything at anytime. But speaking from this side of the fence, it hurt more than anyone will ever know, and we are still dealing with the reprocussions of those actions every day, and will probably continue to do so until that trust can be fully restored


That's pretty much what Hubby said and we are still rebuilding trust.  The good part is that He forgave me, said He understood, partially blamed Himself for not recognizing my needs, and He is now my Master.  He was more upset about the lies than the actual cheating.  I live with the guilt everyday and He lives with the hurt. My biggest mistake was not going to Him first with my dark desires. I hope this post helps someone who might be in the same situation.

_____________________________

proudsub

"Without goals you become what you were. With goals you become what you wish." .

"You are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts"--Alan Greenspan


(in reply to weneedyourhelp)
Profile   Post #: 100
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