quote:

ORIGINAL: Boondoggle

I strongly think that the idea that life will somehow be easier if a sex is 'assigned,' especially via an irreversible medical procedure, is complete bullox. As much as gender is a socially constructed idea, the biology of sex differences is so ingrained into our existence, from the levels of hormones to the formation of the brain, that no sort of operation, no matter how young, will somehow magically 'make' the child one gender or another. Because this has been practiced routinely for so many years, if it worked, intersexed people wouldn't know they were born that way. Everyone I've ever met or heard speak who identifies as intersexed knew, at an instinctual level, that something wasn't 'right.' It's not like their parents told them on their 18th birthday, "Oh, by the way, you were born with genitalia which was considered abnormal and corrected at birth without your consent."

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

And the ultimate reason for this spectrum and ranking approach [whereby some transsexuals are perceived as being more trans than others] is the perceived shame of being a crossdresser - a shame to which adverse comments about crossdressing only adds.
E

quote:

ORIGINAL: zoescherry
Sissys like any other kink are a mixture of all sorts of characters, some great fun to hang out with and some who will bore you to tears. Im a sissy i make a point of telling folks that its part of the humiliation the fun of playing this way,
zoe

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

Youre right to point all this out. But in my view the whole idea of a spectrum is exactly wrong for so many reasons, as is the promotion of any idea of ranking.

Leaving aside the distinct diagnostic criteria, and I accept there can be some crossovers in those respects, it is just so dangerous to make recourse to either a spectrum or a ranking.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Reigna

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

And the ultimate reason for this spectrum and ranking approach [whereby some transsexuals are perceived as being more trans than others] is the perceived shame of being a crossdresser - a shame to which adverse comments about crossdressing only adds.
E

Word. And word.

Here's something else to consider. Generally, people who are officially diagnosed as crossdressers do not have access to certain treatments available to those officially diagnosed as transsexuals. So if you want these kinds of treatment, you MUST be a "real transsexual" and not "just a crossdresser." Because, you know, if you're just a crossdresser you're only in it for sexual thrills, and your problems are trivial; whereas if you're a real transsexual, you need serious treatment. This unfortunate and I think false dichotomy has bled out into the community, where it further exaggerates some people's need to see themselves as transsexuals and not as crossdressers.

quote:

ORIGINAL: petdave

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

Youre right to point all this out. But in my view the whole idea of a spectrum is exactly wrong for so many reasons, as is the promotion of any idea of ranking.

Leaving aside the distinct diagnostic criteria, and I accept there can be some crossovers in those respects, it is just so dangerous to make recourse to either a spectrum or a ranking.

While i understand your concerns, i'm a little unclear as to what solution you'd endorse? i can't imagine a binary solution would be an improvement, but i'm not coming up with any other scheme of distinction....

quote:

ORIGINAL: Reigna


Zoe, I love this description. For some reason I cannot interface with CM's interface, so I must ask you publicly--will you start a thread on the topic of sissies and humiliation? It's of great interest to me, not least because my sub is a sissy who loves humiliation of all kinds. Of course he and I talk about it, but I'd love to hear other perspectives. Yes, you probably will be flamed; but it looks like there are others here who'll watch your back.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

Whilst I will maintain that the whole spectrum and/or ranking approach is wrong and dangerous, I think its also the case that dividing "trans" into two groups is misleading - though it often serves as a useful shorthand to do so; gender identity disordered in one group and broadly recreational trans in the other.

The real confusion lies in the umbrella term "trans" I think, which tends to lump all transgender identities and behaviours into one group from the start - necessitating explanations as to differences after the fact. If there were different descriptors (in the sense of lacking any commonality of terms) then it would make things easier. And this lumping together also makes possible the spectrum and ranking phenomena. I would contend that had one division or the other a distinct descriptor and identity - such as intersex provides for those concerned, then we could escape a lot or even all of the confusions, for both those under the "trans" umbrella and those outside it.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen


The part I can never get my head around though, is why one can get the treatment regardless of the true diagnostic circumstances, as long as one can pay, whilst without the money it is unavailable, again regardless of diagnostic circumstances.

That is not unique to gender issues.  It applies to pretty much any medical and mental health issue.

Why is it that the psychologists et al who specialise in this area, can be tricked into recommending treatment that is not required? I think one of the problems at least is the large amount of "coaching material" available on the internet - "if you say this, this and this, you'll get the diagnosis". This coupled to the feminisation fantasy and the monetary means is a deadly combination. I had my own story to tell - not "this, this and this", which I have to say caused me at varying times to be taken more seriously and less seriously depending on the psychologist concerned.

Since psychologists rely on what the patient them them, a lying patient is going to get an incorrect diagnosis.  If a patient has been convincing himself for years that he is truly TG, then that "sincerity" is going to mislead the psychologist.

And what I really cant get over is that men who find feminisation a turn on seem so rarely to grasp the idea that once their penis is taken away (through chemical or ultimately surgical means), the whole thing will have lost much or all of its enjoyment factor. And then there are the men who do find this out - and would you believe, having gotten the diagnosis and having commenced hormonal treatment and lost their penis - then become the clientele of the viagra merchandisers, so they can still "get it up"!?

I will here again repeat what I've said so often on these boards - and this board in particular; transition is not easy. Even if you really are transsexual its not easy. Even if you really are transsexual and have the good fortune to pass well, its not easy. Even if you really are transsexual and have the good fortune to pass well and you have the funding, its not easy. Its just about the most difficult thing in the world to do, and far from safe. It means enormous risks and tremendous burdens for the person concerned and for their support network (assuming the person isnt ostracised). It brings with it pain (real, non erotic pain) - both physical and psychological, and the risk of financial ruin. Its a last resort - it shouldnt ever be a "want to" but should always be an "absolutely need to, no other way to go on". 

In my very limited experience of CDs who've convinced themselves they are TG (only two, so the sample size is small) I've found that they may have serious psychological/psychiatric issues.  They are unhappy with themselves and their lives, and have convinced themselves that becoming "the girl of their dreams" will sort everything out.
 
Of course the rational person knows this couldn't be farther from the truth.  I emphasize that I am referring to two specific people I've known, not to any general class of people.   One of these individuals was PTSD (among other issues) and the other was bipolar, so there issues with life in general were many  Another disclaimer...I am not labelling people with PTSD or bipolar disorders in general as any sort of nut case.  Indeed these two individuals were sweet people, but their lives were a mess.  Internet-ordered female hormones just made them worse.


And there is nothing - repeat, nothing, wrong with being a crossdresser, transvestite or whatever appellation is preferred. Enjoy it and dont do things which will reduce that enjoyment - the only difference between crossdressing and dressing in rubber / leather / PVC and so on after all, is the societal pressures we all live under (including transsexuals) to conform to a gender model. Dont risk wrecking your life, your health and your general well being for the sake of a fantasy or for the sake of trying to avoid embarassment, or for the sake of some fake competition.

Amen.  I have seen the imposition of a hierarchy in action.  Girls who've had the whole gamut of SRS surgeries looking down on those who've only had their genital surgery, looking down on those who are content to remain pre-op, looking down on those who are content to remain non-op, but live as female, and so on.
 
In my nonprofessional opinion, in any group, especially small and/or marginalised groups there are always individuals who make up for their own shortcomings by putting others down.  "Well, if you were a real __fill in the blank__..." or "You can't be a real __fill in the blank__..." are two common forms.


I sometimes consider my life over the last few years - dont get me wrong, its getting back on track now and is the life I needed - and yet if only it were the case that I might have survived as a male, crossdressing from time to time, life would have been so much easier! For me and for my family and my whole life - yes, there'd have been the potential for embarassment, but embarassment is nothing next to the difficulties of transition. And I had it easy, very easy, by comparison to many who transition.

E

quote:

ORIGINAL: tasha_tart

Even well-meaning people, who really want to understand, to have it explained, just can't get their heads around it.  They may also have a tendency to conflate gender identity with sexual identity, which muddies the water further.  I do know whereof I speak on this; my ex-wife really tried to understand, but ultimately couldn't.
 
Tasha

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ORIGINAL: LotusSong

quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong


Attaching "phobia" to a word is simply just a slam.  Phobia means an irrational"fear".  What is it that there is to fear?   Catching cooties? :) I wish there was a suffix one could add to a word that means "I just don't give a shit".   

I've examined my soul and have found that at my worst I suffer from:
 
Transtedium
CDdahdee
Lesbianlahlah
and Homohohum
hmmm ... not one phobia though.  I just see people as people.  

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

quote:

ORIGINAL: SolangeRichards

Really......why push the mistresses in general who are not interested in feminization, and frankly, why push the sniping ones?  They bring nothing to the table other than negativity and we all really have enough of that in our lives

The point of the exercise should be drawing feedback from the ones interested.  They are the voices we need to listen to.  They are the ones who walk with us in our lives.

The rest just really don't matter as much.  They are clear they aren't involved,  they are clear they are negative to it all and as result, it should be clear to us they really don't count in the same way.......

quote:

ORIGINAL: petdave
i do see your point there... The popular belief that "transvestite" and "transgender" are pretty much the same thing really doesn't do anyone any good. i'm just curious because i do consider myself to be somewhere in-between those two categories, so on the one hand a scale or series of levels makes sense, but on the other, i think the levels would be very hard to define in a worthwhile manner. It's like, short answer crossdresser with a "but", long answer transgender with an "except" [:D]