RE: attitudes in general towards sissyboys (Full Version)

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petdave -> RE: attitudes in general towards sissyboys (1/26/2008 3:59:44 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen
There's little point in a sex life when one is deeply unhappy with one's self most of the time after all, and little prospect of having one either in that circumstance - who wants sex with a depressed, near suicidal with no confidence and no self esteem?



Yup, that would be "no one", true enough... Thank you for your insight on this discussion- it's not often one gets such a frank and thoughtful perspective on something like this.



LotusSong -> RE: attitudes in general towards sissyboys (1/26/2008 6:48:49 PM)

ORIGINAL: Nats

For someone who really "doesn't give a shit", and says that tv's, cd's, sissies, and ts's and "are all exclusive unto themselves and the motivations of each are unique",   (that was mean as a compliment) you sure have an odd way of trying to slam the shit out of them whenever possible. Since your little rant was born out of the threads in this forum, how come you didn't have the fortitude to start your male, cd, tv, ts, sissy-bashing thread in this forum??????  (Because we I wanted the opinon of a wider range of people and there were several threas on this subject here already on the Mistress forum)

http://www.collarchat.com/m_1563351/tm.htm
[/quote]

Maybe a different forum to finally get some answers without all the defensive posturing?  Join the discussions and have something to offer besides your suppositions of motive. 
 
I truely wonder why men are so compelled to assume female characterists..especially those they make fun on a regular basis in society. 
 
You have the right to be as offended as makes you happy.  The world will continue to spin,, night will still become day and your angst has about a much effect on opinions as sticking your finger in a bucket of water to see what kind of hole it leaves.



faerytattoodgirl -> RE: attitudes in general towards sissyboys (1/26/2008 9:22:27 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

And thats what it comes down to as well - whether one can continue in the original gender, making minor adjustments to one's life - or whether one has no choice but to transition as a last resort to avoid impending self destruction, on an "anything is worth trying" basis? If one can survive with such minor adjustments, I'd venture its a whole lot easier than the alternative and doesnt say anything about commitment or any such thing - after all, we dont encourage the depressed to become psychotic to prove anything do we?
E


thats what happens here in ontario.  alot of last resorts transition and then during the transition(when the penis becomes non functional) or after srs they commit suicide.  which in turn made ontario not cover the surgery anymore.  in 1998 it was taken off gov't funding.
then the new standards of care came in to play.  which is really really tough on alot of trans here.  mainly due to having to see 2 psychiatrists and getting 2 signatures stating they are women and ready for SRS.

now it costs i think $20,000 in montreal...i think there are only 2 provinces now that cover the transition.



tasha_tart -> RE: attitudes in general towards sissyboys (1/27/2008 6:30:47 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong

I truely wonder why men are so compelled to assume female characterists..especially those they make fun on a regular basis in society.  
 


I'd speculate (based on the small sample size of CDs that I know) that men "compelled to assume female characterist(ic)s" would be the least likely to make fun of women as part of their day-to-day lives.
 
I do apologize for confining my observations to my own personal experience.  I lack the insight to make pronouncements for entire sub-groups of humankind.
 
Tasha



LotusSong -> RE: attitudes in general towards sissyboys (1/27/2008 7:42:01 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: tasha_tart

quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong

I truely wonder why men are so compelled to assume female characterists..especially those they make fun on a regular basis in society.  
 


I'd speculate (based on the small sample size of CDs that I know) that men "compelled to assume female characterist(ic)s" would be the least likely to make fun of women as part of their day-to-day lives.
 
I do apologize for confining my observations to my own personal experience.  I lack the insight to make pronouncements for entire sub-groups of humankind.
 
Tasha


I speak from my personal experience and observations also...  If one is secure in themselves, they don't get offended.. and I don't .. people have opinions.
 
Tasha.. I also asked in my OP why men seem more prone to cross dressing than women do.  Do you agree that more men than women cross dress and when they do, they are more extreme..?



fluffyswitch -> RE: attitudes in general towards sissyboys (1/27/2008 7:48:32 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong
 
Tasha.. I also asked in my OP why men seem more prone to cross dressing than women do.  Do you agree that more men than women cross dress and when they do, they are more extreme..?

okay i just wandered onto this thread and i haven't read the entire thing. but...as for why there seems to be more mtf crossdressers than ftm crossdressers, it's because there are. something like 3% of the male population cross dresses while 1 to 2% of the female population does (i don't remember the exact stats but they're extremely low). no one really knows why. and i'm not sure if it's a matter of being more extreme than ftm or it's just a matter of more visability (but then i interact with a LOT more FTMs and drag kings/ftm cross dressers than MTFs and drag queens/mtf cross dressers).



petdave -> RE: attitudes in general towards sissyboys (1/27/2008 9:11:49 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong

I speak from my personal experience and observations also...  If one is secure in themselves, they don't get offended.. and I don't .. people have opinions.
 
Tasha.. I also asked in my OP why men seem more prone to cross dressing than women do.  Do you agree that more men than women cross dress and when they do, they are more extreme..?


Would you agree that there are more ways for a woman to adopt a masculine appearance without catching the "CROSSDRESSER!" label, than there are ways for a man to adopt a feminine appearance? By default, this would make MTF CDs appear more extreme.



SolangeRichards -> RE: attitudes in general towards sissyboys (1/28/2008 5:08:22 AM)

Accurate figures concerning female bodied crossdressing just simply do not exist, nor does anyone know whether the behavior is more prevalent in males versus females.

With women wearing slacks, ties and fedoras openly, it becomes hard to say where fashion ends and crossdressing begins.  Is a diesel dyke with her chain drive wallet, rough clothing and heavy boots more extreme than a drag queen?  Should we be asking?

We know that society takes little issue with a woman dressed as a lumberjack but this thread alone underscores there is a very big issue with lumberjacks dressing as women however.

Interesting is something from the Bible, Deuteronomy 22:5, "A woman must not wear men's clothing, nor a man wear women's clothing, for the LORD your God detests anyone who does this."

Noteworthy is that BOTH sexes are warned from the behavior.  Evidently biblical authors saw it as a problem BOTH sexes were prone to.

I guess those authors, like many posters to this thread, felt that one is to remain in, or at least maintain the facade of , the gender they were born into and that is that.....




LadyEllen -> RE: attitudes in general towards sissyboys (1/28/2008 6:05:30 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DominaJayde

I admit from the outset that I adore sissyboys, I think they are wonderful, but the one thing that distresses me greatly is the attitude towards a lot of sissyboys from other subs and indeed from a lot of  male dominants.  I have been shown messages from male dominants and from other male subs that have been sent to my boys, above and beyond the usual stupid message/troll type things.

With phrases such as 'hate' and 'die' along with suggestions that the world would be a better place if they just removed themselves from it, is this attitude prevalent in real life, or is this just a nasty online phenomena?

I tell my boys to report them if they are truly foul ones,  the feelings they have are often hard enough to come to terms with without the unnecessary added burden of others deciding that they don't deserve to find any kind of fulfillment.

DJ


(this was the OP on this thread by the way, for anyone wondering!)

OK - this is what happened this morning when I was at the doc's for blood tests. It doesnt concern sissyboys as such, but I think it says something about general society and trans behaviours - and about me.

Well, I walked in, booked in and took my seat in the waiting area. A wide variety of general society surrounded me - male, female, young, older, well dressed and not so well dressed - you get the idea.

Anyway, within a few minutes a name was called on the LED display board - big enough for all to see and acompanied by a loud beep - after all, this is how we all know its our turn.

"Mr Robert Jones to Sister Smith, Room 13" (names changed)

Out of the corner of my eye and then moving rapidly towards the door before me in answer to the call stepped a tall figure walking somewhat awkwardly, in heels, stockings and a skirt and a rather poor wig. No one saw the face as yet, but there was murmuring and whispering once the figure had entered Room 13.

A few minutes later the door opened and the figure reappeared. Mid 50s, poor make up, and strode away. The murmur rose again and some rough looking guy to the right said, and I quote "fuck me, was that a bloke? Shit, it gets worse round here", followed by much laughter.

I felt sorry for "Robert Jones". I felt I should do something or say something - nothing that would necessarily reveal my birth sex, but something you know? But I didnt. I sat there and waited and watched and listened to the expressions of incredulity and the jokes - and worst returned the expressions of disbelief. And justified with "its not my problem" and "why should I risk myself?" that I had done and said nothing - and joined in. Yes, for a moment there I felt the fear that others feel, the fear of harassment, humiliation, abuse and even violence - and yet comfortable in my female identity I fuckingwell joined in, to however little an extent.

And then it was my turn "Ms XXXXX XXXXX" came up on the board and I went in to be drained of a few millilitres. And not a soul suspected a thing.

E



rubberpet -> RE: attitudes in general towards sissyboys (1/28/2008 7:44:02 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DominaJayde

I admit from the outset that I adore sissyboys, I think they are wonderful, but the one thing that distresses me greatly is the attitude towards a lot of sissyboys from other subs and indeed from a lot of  male dominants.  I have been shown messages from male dominants and from other male subs that have been sent to my boys, above and beyond the usual stupid message/troll type things.

With phrases such as 'hate' and 'die' along with suggestions that the world would be a better place if they just removed themselves from it, is this attitude prevalent in real life, or is this just a nasty online phenomena?

I tell my boys to report them if they are truly foul ones,  the feelings they have are often hard enough to come to terms with without the unnecessary added burden of others deciding that they don't deserve to find any kind of fulfillment.

DJ




While the whole sissyboy thing isn't my thing, I'll be damned if I'll be one to make fun of them.  Everyone has a kink or a particular way they want to live, so far be it from me to say the way they live their life is wrong or silly.  Keep your heads up, boys.  It might not be my thing, but you still have a friend with me.[:)]

My name is rubberpet and I am the proud rubberclad slaveslut to my goddess, Mistress Lorelei.



Shawn1066 -> RE: attitudes in general towards sissyboys (1/28/2008 7:50:20 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong

I truely wonder why men are so compelled to assume female characterists..especially those they make fun on a regular basis in society. 



Well, I think it's important for you to look at it this way:

Men who crossdress are not necessarily the ones who "make fun" of feminine characteristics on a regular basis.  I think you may be grouping all men together into one group.  I'd say, if anything, men who crossdress regularly truly desire and respect those qualities.

DV's Fox



Reigna -> RE: attitudes in general towards sissyboys (1/28/2008 9:29:03 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: SolangeRichards
Accurate figures concerning female bodied crossdressing just simply do not exist, nor does anyone know whether the behavior is more prevalent in males versus females.


That's true. For that matter, I'd venture a guess that no one really knows exactly how prevalent the behavior is in males, either, although estimates likely are a bit more accurate.

For what it's worth, some people who study the matter say that the number of FtM gender reassignment surgeries is increasing dramatically, and may even be equal to the number of MtF surgeries. (No cite; sorry.) So it's not as if no females have an interest in exploring their potential as members of the opposite sex-gender. (And yes, some FtMs fetishize the behavior, much as some MtFs do.)





tasha_tart -> RE: attitudes in general towards sissyboys (1/28/2008 9:45:18 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong

Tasha.. I also asked in my OP why men seem more prone to cross dressing than women do.  Do you agree that more men than women cross dress and when they do, they are more extreme..?



LS:
 
Very good question...I'll take a shot at an answer.
 
I would hazard a guess that there are more m2f than f2m crossdressers.  That has certainly been my experience, though I have been in an LGBT club a time or two when there were quite an amazing (to me anyway...sheltered existence, you know) number of f2m dressers.  Some of them had gone to great lengths to look male just as m2f dressers do to look female.
 
Why the apparent difference in numbers?  I could guess at it, but I'm not going to.  I can't even explain why I'm a CD.  I'm fresh out of explanations for the big picture.
 
More extreme?  In some cases yes, I suppose so.  Some of this may be deliberate personal style, some may be the need to use heavier doses of makeup to cover beard shadow, some of it may be simple inexperience in makeup and dress leading to being a bit over the top.  The more experienced CDs I know tend to develop a lighter hand with makeup and figure out the style of dress that suits them.
 
However some of the "extreme"  factor may be in the eyes of the observer.  A male in female clothing, unless he's extremely passable or wearing very nondescript female clothing, is going to stand out and seem more "extreme" by comparison to the people around him, though that may have been the farthest thing from his mind.
 
A female in male's clothing?  That's something we all see everyday.  A woman in jeans, t-shirt, and work boots might have just gotten off her job, might just feel comfortable dressed that way...or she might be making a statement about her gender identity.
 
The female in male's clothing tends to blend in, unless she makes an effort to look more stereotypically male; the male in female clothing is much more likely to stand out, no matter how little he wants to.



DominaJayde -> RE: attitudes in general towards sissyboys (1/28/2008 10:38:29 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

<snipt>

But I didnt. I sat there and waited and watched and listened to the expressions of incredulity and the jokes - and worst returned the expressions of disbelief. And justified with "its not my problem" and "why should I risk myself?" that I had done and said nothing - and joined in. Yes, for a moment there I felt the fear that others feel, the fear of harassment, humiliation, abuse and even violence - and yet comfortable in my female identity I fuckingwell joined in, to however little an extent.

And then it was my turn "Ms XXXXX XXXXX" came up on the board and I went in to be drained of a few millilitres. And not a soul suspected a thing.

E


That is a very hard position to be in, most of us at one point or another have been in a place where we have decided not to speak up, and have dealt with our own feelings about that.





GoddessSassy -> RE: attitudes in general towards sissyboys (1/28/2008 11:33:48 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Shawn1066

Well, I think it's important for you to look at it this way:

Men who crossdress are not necessarily the ones who "make fun" of feminine characteristics on a regular basis.  I think you may be grouping all men together into one group.  I'd say, if anything, men who crossdress regularly truly desire and respect those qualities.

DV's Fox


You are so right about that statement.  I have many transgendered and cross dressers who truly adore women.   They truly marvel about how we dress and project our femine self.   I also have submissives that I believe are strong to want to explore and go beyond the realm of what they were brought up to believe on being  a male. 



tasha_tart -> RE: attitudes in general towards sissyboys (1/29/2008 10:04:39 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

A few minutes later the door opened and the figure reappeared. Mid 50s, poor make up, and strode away. The murmur rose again and some rough looking guy to the right said, and I quote "fuck me, was that a bloke? Shit, it gets worse round here", followed by much laughter.

I felt sorry for "Robert Jones". I felt I should do something or say something - nothing that would necessarily reveal my birth sex, but something you know? But I didnt. I sat there and waited and watched and listened to the expressions of incredulity and the jokes - and worst returned the expressions of disbelief. And justified with "its not my problem" and "why should I risk myself?" that I had done and said nothing - and joined in. Yes, for a moment there I felt the fear that others feel, the fear of harassment, humiliation, abuse and even violence - and yet comfortable in my female identity I fuckingwell joined in, to however little an extent.

And then it was my turn "Ms XXXXX XXXXX" came up on the board and I went in to be drained of a few millilitres. And not a soul suspected a thing.

E


Lady Ellen:
 
I doubt very much that any of us have never been guilty of that.  I know I have kept quiet, when the little voice inside me was urged me to say something about another's racist, sexist, or hateful remarks.
 
I'm not proud of that and, though there have been times when I did take a stand, I'll likely take the easy way out again someday.
 
I think it is sometimes akin to a reflex; we keep quiet without any real thought at the time.  It is only later, upon reflection, that we realize that keeping quiet was wrong, and that we should have spoken up for our principles.  We may also keep silent for fear of making ourselves the targets of the bullies.
 
It doesn't make us bad people; it just leaves us wishing we were better people.
 
Tasha



lindaks4u2use -> RE: attitudes in general towards sissyboys (1/30/2008 8:24:14 AM)

being transgendered I have found some who don't understand me and have even made negative comments to me. I don't let it bother me I move on some day I will find the local Domme who understands and is willing to help me. I am facinated with the female body and yes I want to be as much like it as possible, but even more I want to be more female in the mind as well. I do however not like to be lumped into the catagory of Crossdresser and I agree with the person who posted that if a person who wants to stay feminine after orgasm. I guess I am looking to be accepted by females and treated as one of you. I have met two ladies that have accepted me and I Love them both.

Linda



johnkenoly -> RE: attitudes in general towards sissyboys (2/28/2008 8:17:09 AM)

tell me your address, i will get to you if you are serious.



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