Yob culture. (Full Version)

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wankerforuse -> Yob culture. (1/20/2008 6:55:41 AM)

We have a huge problem on yob culture here in the uk,and yet to make matters worse our wonderful goverment introduce pubs that can open 24hours.So basically it's 24 hour drinking which in my opinion has added to the problem,and made it alot worse than what it was.

And not only that but the goverment should'nt allow any alcohol related commercials,and they being the goverment.Should also impose curfews,which in my opinion would do away more or less altogether with yob culture.Basically my ideas would make yob culture a thing of the past .But can you think of any ideas aswell please that may eliminate yob culture forever,if you do please kindly leave your views here thanks very much indeed.




christine1 -> RE: Yob culture. (1/20/2008 6:57:50 AM)

i'm not familiar with what "yob culture" is?




Aneirin -> RE: Yob culture. (1/20/2008 7:45:31 AM)

Yob; n. Chiefly British Slang.

A rowdy, aggressive, or violent young man.

[Alteration of BOY (spelled backward).]


Meaning #1: a cruel and brutal fellow
Synonyms: bully, tough, hooligan, ruffian, roughneck, rowdy, yobo, yobbo


What lacks in what can be called our yobbish British culture, is respect and there, possibly fear of authority. Youths and indeed others out of control have to a large extent a free hand in what they do, such is the effectiveness of our police force and there the judicial system.

The police used to be the bastions of law and order, often it was on the appearance of a police constable that unruly people would desist in their actions and be told the error of their ways.

Now the police lack the bark they once had, the police force has softened, thanks to politicians and political correctness. Also police numbers have been cut and I would say that in the past a typical police constable would have been the type of person that is not afraid to enter an afray and root out the ring leaders, they possibly having a physical stature to suit. Now I understand police have largely lost their requirements for a certain height and fitness level, more emphasis now being put upon intellect.

Of course it is not just the fault of the police and the judicial system, respect for another has broken down to be nearly non existant, some children have zero respect even for their own parents, anyone else in a position of authority does not stand an earthlies hope in receiving respect.

Respect to a lot of the youth is what weapon you carry, not the natural respect people in a civilised society have for each other and authority.

Then it can be put upon the upbringing of the child, where has that gone wrong, surely it is not the parents fault, maybe it is that parents feel they have lost the authority to discipline their offspring, and fear what may happen to them if they do the right thing. Fear of outside bodies taking an interest.

What I do feel is the cause of all this in the UK, is just a general break down in society, natural order has been eroded.

I feel we have to get get back the natural order of things, and there hopefully most things will right themselves.




pahunkboy -> RE: Yob culture. (1/20/2008 8:10:07 AM)

...I live in one of 3?? states that dont sell liquor in stores. [grocers and the like]  Sundays are closed.  Funny enuff AA is filled up all the time.  Even the big cities pretty much shut down between 4-6 am- to cutail crime. NYC- buses are routes so as to not arrive in the dead of night.

IMO it helps.

In Chicago- the loop- one can see the sidewalk change- buseness people go home and street people congregate. then vice versa. 

no one wants to live near a bar.




RCdc -> RE: Yob culture. (1/20/2008 8:13:15 AM)

I haven't noticed any difference in 'yob culture' at all - only the reporting upon it.
Media sensationalism.
 
But I guess what you give out, you get back as well hey.  I can quite happily walk through the streets at midnight from the station to home - I prefere not to - but I can quite safely and I am not in some upper class area.  I believe  people blame yob culture instead of accepting and being responsible for their own ability(or rather inability) to interact, understand and their own lack of empathy - with others.
 
christine -  yob culture would be like the gang culture in the states.  Hope that makes it clearer.
 
the.dark.




Aneirin -> RE: Yob culture. (1/20/2008 8:35:55 AM)

I agree there is an increase in media coverage, possibly leading to the belief that we do have a problem, but there are other indicators aside for the desire to make money from public fear.

As a child, I was brought up to respect my elders and those in positions of authority, authority automatically gained my respect for what it was, authority.That went for all those in positions of authority, an authority given by their public office status.

Now as a youth, out with my pals, we would get up to things as youths do, but the appearance of an officer of the law, or even a priest in uniform, we would calm our activities and show respect. The appearance of an officer of the law does not mean we were engaged in criminal activities, they were about then, plodding their beat, on foot.They knew all the places kids went and indeed knew most of us by sight at least.

Now, as I walk around the place that I live, I do come across groups of youths doing what youths do, I think. But there is a difference in the way they act when meeting a lone person, an adult. There is often verbal abuse and name calling. Petit I know, but it shows a lack of respect.

I know adults that avoid the places that youths congregate, they say they do not fear the youths, but what they themselves might do if confronted and forced, and there the likely consequences from the law, who seem all too interested in the prosecution of normally law abiding citizens, not the original problem, the cause, people the law often knows well as a problem, but lacks the ability to deter effectively.

In reality, the people I know who say they do not fear yobbish behaviour, do.




RCdc -> RE: Yob culture. (1/20/2008 8:44:57 AM)

Yeah, well we always disagree on this hey A.
I do not see any difference in the present that there was in the past.  I remember the name calling from groups of people when I was a teen, and there is only a few years between you and I A.
 
I do believe that something you said is true, that people don;t want to go to where there are groups around because they might get in trouble when they fight back - but that is what I mean by getting what you give.  If you think there will be trouble, and expect trouble, you get trouble.  You give off bad vibes, you leave yourself an open target.
 
the.dark.
(.gigglescozno-onewouldDAREthinkwewerebestbudsheythewaywedisagree.)[;)]
 




meatcleaver -> RE: Yob culture. (1/20/2008 8:48:44 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: wankerforuse

We have a huge problem on yob culture here in the uk,and yet to make matters worse our wonderful goverment introduce pubs that can open 24hours.So basically it's 24 hour drinking which in my opinion has added to the problem,and made it alot worse than what it was.

And not only that but the goverment should'nt allow any alcohol related commercials,and they being the goverment.Should also impose curfews,which in my opinion would do away more or less altogether with yob culture.Basically my ideas would make yob culture a thing of the past .But can you think of any ideas aswell please that may eliminate yob culture forever,if you do please kindly leave your views here thanks very much indeed.


I don't think alcohol has anything to do with yob culture otherwise you would expect other European countries to be suffering more than Britain from it. Where I live you can drink 24 hours a day, the legal drinking age is 16 and alcohol in shops is far cheaper than in Britain but you never see drunks staggering around the streets or drunken fights.

The problem I perceive to be in Britain is its materialist 'me' culture and the general disregard for public space which no one seems prepared to take ownership of any more. Actually I don't blame anyone not taking ownership because if they did, they would be more likely to be prosecuted for protecting public space than those vandalising public space and attacking passers-by.

Actually, I think Britain has the same problem as the US, the ideology and supremacy of the individual takes precedence over the needs of the community as a whole.




RCdc -> RE: Yob culture. (1/20/2008 8:49:59 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: wankerforuse

We have a huge problem on yob culture here in the uk,and yet to make matters worse our wonderful goverment introduce pubs that can open 24hours.So basically it's 24 hour drinking which in my opinion has added to the problem,and made it alot worse than what it was.



Im just going to add that 24hour drinking laws only came into being a few short time back.  I think it is laughable to insist this is a cause.  If anything, the smoking ban has caused far more problems, with people being forced to drink on the streets outside.
 
the.dark.




Aneirin -> RE: Yob culture. (1/20/2008 8:52:15 AM)

althoughwearebestbudswearedifferentpeoplewithourownundrstandingsandtheremustagreetodisagree




RCdc -> RE: Yob culture. (1/20/2008 8:54:13 AM)

[:D][;)]

the.dark.




Owner59 -> RE: Yob culture. (1/20/2008 9:04:32 AM)

  Consider yourself lucky.

Here in the states,the NRA has made sure that all our YOBs(as well as the mentally challenged and every other nut-case),are armed to the teeth w/ an ocean of firearms,as easy to get as groceries.




Lucylastic -> RE: Yob culture. (1/20/2008 11:58:00 AM)

Agrees with Dark, regardin the smoking outside, ....peeves me no end, (yeah yeah I know its easy ...just quit) to have to stand out in the rain /snow/ heat just to have a fag and update my nicotine level. It would peeve me even more so if I had to do it in a pub, or outside a pub....... drunk peeved and nicotine deprived, what a mix, makes me wanna rip off someones face just thinking about it. Its probably a good job I dont go out  drinking anymore.
back to the OP...yobs have been a problem for as long as I can remember, I cannot imagine the chaos that would ensue if you tried to curfew an age group, the cost would be incredible... and be practically impossible to carry out.
I dunno what the answer is, I dont think there is one.
Lucy
who needs to go and have a cigarette







slaveboyforyou -> RE: Yob culture. (1/20/2008 12:36:10 PM)

quote:

Consider yourself lucky.

Here in the states,the NRA has made sure that all our YOBs(as well as the mentally challenged and every other nut-case),are armed to the teeth w/ an ocean of firearms,as easy to get as groceries.


Bullshit Owner.  I am glad I have the right to defend myself here.  A year ago I walked into a convenience store to buy some beer, and there was 5 young guys standing around the entrance drinking.  One of the guys tried to high five me, and I just ignored him and walked into the store.  The little asshole followed me in and berated me for "leaving him hanging."  I say little asshole, but this kid was at least 6'3" and 220 lbs.  His buddies joined in, and I was legitimately scared.  The clerk was an old man, so he wasn't much help.  I was irritated that he didn't call the police.  They would have wiped the pavement with me in a fight, and I knew it.  After purchasing my beer, I walked back out to my truck and they followed me.  I reached behind my seat and got my gun out, and guess what?  The little bastards didn't fuck with me anymore.  I didn't have to say a word.  The appearance of my .357 did all the talking.  So I am glad that we have the right to defend ourselves from thugs.  You can denigrate the NRA all you want, but they are the only ones defending our right to self defense.   




Griswold -> RE: Yob culture. (1/20/2008 12:53:30 PM)

Aneirin, you're from the UK....'splain sumpin to me...I'm not trying to be funny...just honestly curious.

How can your cops keep order without a gun?  Or is that just a myth that we've heard over here in America?

It reminds me of that joke Robin Williams made when he was in your country 10 years back or so (okay...now I'm trying to be funny) when he was talking about the Bobby's over there and he said "if you're a criminal....what's to worry about...you steal something, a Bobby comes up and says 'STOP!!!!!.....or I'll say stop again!!!!!'".




stella41b -> RE: Yob culture. (1/20/2008 1:01:23 PM)

I'm sorry, but when you look at British culture at the moment, what do you really expect?

What is British culture? Big Brother? Coronation Street and Eastenders?

It can't be popular music. I honestly can't tell the difference between a modern pop song and a ringtone for a mobile phone. And I mean, take a look at our new British music superstars.. I know of a Pete Doherty, can't tell you how he sings, all I know is that he's trying to keep in the knickers of some supermodel and he can't handle his drugs. Then you got Amy Winehouse who also has a problem with the liquor and as we're led to believe drugs.

And these are supposed to be good role models? More than this, people suddenly don't have a clue where this 'yob culture' comes from?

I'll tell you where it comes from. It comes from things like education cutbacks, it comes from teenagers not having enough parental contact because both parents have to work late at the office, it comes from communities being destroyed and this preoccupation with image and fitting in. The causes of this 'yob culture' have been building up over many years and people have been sticking their heads in the sand and pretending that it doesn't exist or that it's got nothing to do with them. Same old situation, parents blame teachers, teachers blame parents, and everyone blames the government. This is nothing new. It's been happening ever since Elvis Presley made rock and roll popular in the late 1950's. It's always far far easier to blame someone else than get together and collectively face the issues.

So okay, yes, we can impose curfews, restrictions over drinking, give out ASBO's, but bear in mind that if this is what you want then you're basically asking for a totalitarian, police state, and this is exactly what half of Europe spent 60 years fighting against and is also a major reason why the Second World War happened.

I'm sorry, but I feel very strongly about this. Not long back I got accused of 'living off taxpayers' money' through funding where it was suggested I get a proper job. But you know, you can't have it both ways. And it's precisely people like me who take the taxpayer's money and funding and use it to fight 'yob culture' by giving these yobs something to occupy their time and their lives with, a platform from which they can speak out and teach them things like self-respect.

If you deny young people the right to express themselves and to create their own culture and communities then they get disillusioned and start behaving negatively towards society, and this is why you have yob culture. So what are you going to do? Clamp down on these people?

Wakey wakey people, it's not just young people into all this, but a lot of adults too. If you were to throw everybody who according to the media were being yobs this country would collapse because half the population would be in jail.

I've even got people telling me 'it's just part of the culture'. Well I'm sorry, it's not part of my culture. I just not long back got rid of an administrator from my theatre because she couldn't handle her drink and drugs - I refuse to share my experience or artistic work with anyone who abuses alcohol or drugs or who behaves anti-socially.

It's the same old argument - you either pay taxes and live in a decent, civilized society or you don't and you face the consequences. Some people don't know they're born in this country. Take healthcare for instance. If you're ill you just go to a doctor and get treatment, thanks to the NHS. I'm prepared to bet that there's a lot of Americans who'd love to have a system like our NHS in the States rather than what they have and their issues with medical insurance companies.

Incidentally I now have a theatre, we're starting performances on February 28th at 8pm in Battersea Park - and guess what - no funding, this has all come out of nothing. Anyone is welcome to come along as long as they're not yobs - and I mean this - therefore I'm backing up my words with actions. This is a project that's going right through London and I'm currently setting up a workshop for the hoodies on Broadwater Farm in Tottenham.

It's nothing particularly brilliant, I'm just using an old, outdated concept known as 'entertainment'. You might actually remember it, stuff like films that everybody had to go see and talk about, TV programmes and concerts that people remember for years,, and musicians who were known for the music they played and the way they sang rather than what they smoked, snorted and drank.

Or if you prefer you can believe everything you read in the tabloid press and continue to support totalitarianism and the development of a police state. Go vote for the politicians who will clamp down on this 'yob culture' - work out for yourselves the difference between drinking and abusing alcohol - but please don't start whining when the authorities start clamping down on 'violent pornography' (someone holding a riding crop in their underwear) and with it the whole BDSM community. In fact, maybe better to stop and think long and hard about all this and work out whether you're actually fighting 'yob culture' or actively stereotyping and labelling other people and spoiling their fun.

I don't care, I'm only passing through anyway and am working with people so that this project continues after I'm gone. I've given up wasting my hreath trying to reason with people who believe everything the media tells them and who refuse to see the reality of what's actually going on around them.




ladyeleanor -> RE: Yob culture. (1/20/2008 1:08:40 PM)

ipso, fatso, asbo, tesco...




NorthernGent -> RE: Yob culture. (1/20/2008 1:41:49 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

I think Britain........the ideology and supremacy of the individual takes precedence over the needs of the community as a whole.



I agree.

England has always been a rough and ready place. Fighting, drinking, gambling, anti-social behaviour etc is nothing out of the ordinary, and if you go back 100 years, you'll find parts of English cities were no-go areas for the police - intrusions into certain areas resulted in the police being assaulted/stabbed etc. This still happens today, when the authorities go into certain areas, they are attacked (it's rare, but it does happen).

Have a read of some accounts of European travellers to England in the 17th and 18th centuries: they were taken by surprise at the level of violence and anti-social behaviour, so there's something in our culture which has been around for a long time.

I'd suggest it's because we've always been fiercely independent. As a nation, we've never really valued public space and society in the same way the French, Germans etc have done; for example, the Germans and Russians have their Fatherland, the French term it patrie, but we've never had an equivalent. I'd suggest that the reason why we have such high levels of anti-social behaviour in England is, in part, underpinned by the same factors which make us arguably the most creative people on this planet: the amount of ideas which come out of England is astounding for a country this size, as is our taste for casual violence.

The conservatives make me laugh. They harp on about "getting back to the old England, with widespread English virtues and morals" - it never existed, except within the four walls of the imagination of dreamers fueled by too many vitamin c drinks.




ThinkingKitten -> RE: Yob culture. (1/20/2008 3:32:43 PM)

Bring back corporal punishment

(half serious).




seeksfemslave -> RE: Yob culture. (1/20/2008 4:01:08 PM)

oh its me lol......
Never mind going back 100 years, things have got steadily worse over the last 50 years. I know. I've lived thru' it.
The reason....PC liberalism and  those charged with the responsibility of maintaining Law and Order being  unequal to the task.
Basically clueless they are !
They are even having to put metal detectors at school entrances now, looking for weapons. What a larf.
Hard labour applied early in the scumbags "career" backed up by corporal punishment. Thats the answer.
The first to post violence only breeds violence gets a poke in the eye with a policeman's truncheon.
adding: I dont suppose the police carry truncheons any more, more likely a manual explaining what to do when confronting ethnic minorities or how to read a "client" his rights.....in 103 different languages.

I've just watched  Bridges of Madison County....lovely film...just thought I would say that lol




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