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Between Sir Gawain and Master John - 2/2/2008 6:15:45 PM

TracyTaken

Posts: 615
Joined: 2/1/2008
Status: offline

I was wondering if any resident Dominants have struggled with the idea of chivalry as an opposite to dominance. Mine has and it has taken/is still taking some effort on both sides to overcome it. By chivalry, I don’t mean beheading green knights and slaying dragons, but: The idea that a gentleman is to serve a lady, and after her all other ladies. Most especially in this category is a general gentleness and graciousness to all women. (Wiki’s general definition, but it works) If so, how did you/do you deal with it?

Post #: 1

RE: Between Sir Gawain and Master John - 2/2/2008 6:17:24 PM

RedMagic1

Posts: 6470
Joined: 5/10/2007
Status: offline

Once a Daddy Dom enters a midlife crisis, he turns in his white horse for a bitchin' Camaro.

(in reply to TracyTaken)

Post #: 2

RE: Between Sir Gawain and Master John - 2/2/2008 6:19:54 PM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline

Actually it's the subs who tend to be the trouble makers in this domain- they want a gentleman and a casa nova and a barbarian all in one, and they want eacho one to come out in a particular way at a particular time. When that doesn't happen they toss out "You aren't a real dom" and THEN the doms get all confused and flustered.

http://www.collarchat.com/m_1205164/mpage_1/key_gentleman/tm.htm#1205660
mistaking kindness for weakness

http://www.collarchat.com/m_856653/mpage_1/key_gentleman/tm.htm#857014
too nice

http://www.collarchat.com/m_848523/mpage_2/key_gentleman/tm.htm#848969
Mr. Nice guy is not Mr. Nice Dom?

http://www.collarchat.com/m_825792/mpage_1/key_gentleman/tm.htm#825829
Can a dom be a gentleman?

http://www.collarchat.com/m_799563/mpage_1/key_gentleman/tm.htm#799760
what makes a 'real' dom?

http://www.collarchat.com/m_775753/mpage_1/key_gentleman/tm.htm#775760
dominants who show emotions, weakness or vulnerability

http://www.collarchat.com/m_771270/mpage_1/key_gentleman/tm.htm#771630
Does gentle master mean weak?

http://www.collarchat.com/m_668725/mpage_1/key_gentleman/tm.htm#668733
Too polite?

http://www.collarchat.com/m_505491/mpage_1/key_gentleman/tm.htm#505668
Seeking consensus: dominant as gentleman?

http://www.collarchat.com/m_433779/mpage_1/key_gentleman/tm.htm#433966
Master...in slaves' eyes!

http://www.collarchat.com/m_380311/mpage_2/key_gentleman%252Cdom/tm.htm#384513
dom vs gentleman

http://www.collarchat.com/m_266268/mpage_1/key_gentleman%252Cdom/tm.htm#266288
the gentleman dom with feelings

Is the term gentleman dom an oxymoron?

Gentlemen vs nice guy

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to TracyTaken)

Post #: 3

RE: Between Sir Gawain and Master John - 2/2/2008 6:30:33 PM

GreedyTop

Posts: 52100
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Savannah, GA
Status: offline

I want a dom that respects me and treats me as a lady (as much as I am comfy being treated so.. since I am and always have been a tomboy, thats questionable..LOL).. but I do not discount his 'domliness' for doing so.

Does that make sense?

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

Post #: 4

RE: Between Sir Gawain and Master John - 2/2/2008 6:32:44 PM

TracyTaken

Posts: 615
Joined: 2/1/2008
Status: offline

quote:

Actually it's the subs who tend to be the trouble makers in this domain- they want a gentleman and a casa nova and a barbarian all in one, and they want eacho one to come out in a particular way at a particular time. When that doesn't happen they toss out "You aren't a real dom" and THEN the doms get all confused and flustered.

Thanks LA, but I was asking about Doms who struggle with the idea.

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

Post #: 5

RE: Between Sir Gawain and Master John - 2/2/2008 6:36:26 PM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline

I don't think they usually struggle with the idea of whether to be a good guy or an asshole, I think they struggle trying to hook up with chicks who give completely mixed signals, unrealistic masculine ideals and then reject them on their own irrationality.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to TracyTaken)

Post #: 6

RE: Between Sir Gawain and Master John - 2/2/2008 6:44:07 PM

TracyTaken

Posts: 615
Joined: 2/1/2008
Status: offline

quote:

I don't think they usually struggle with the idea of whether to be a good guy or an asshole, I think they struggle trying to hook up with chicks who give completely mixed signals, unrealistic masculine ideals and then reject them on their own irrationality.

Okay, thanks. I now know what you think. I am not talking about being a good guy or an asshole. I am talking about a perceived duality, overcoming a long-held belief, values one was raised with, etc.

I get the feeling that you object to the question.

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

Post #: 7

RE: Between Sir Gawain and Master John - 2/2/2008 6:55:30 PM

sexyred1

Posts: 8998
Joined: 8/9/2007
Status: offline

I am not a Dom, but I believe that some think it is "unDomly" to do many things, including be chivalrous. I think those who are truly secure in their own masculinity, strength and character would be secure enough to be chivalrous or anything else, if they so desire.

(in reply to TracyTaken)

Post #: 8

RE: Between Sir Gawain and Master John - 2/2/2008 6:57:27 PM

xxblushesxx

Posts: 9318
Joined: 11/3/2005
From: Kentucky
Status: offline

I have to say, OP, that if you look closely at the answers you have been given, there is a LOT of wisdom in there regarding the question you asked.
Just relax a bit and think about it.
Really.

~Christina

and of course they do, as we struggle between what the world thinks we should be (independent and yet dependent, and what our lifestyle thinks we should be)

_____________________________

~Christina

A nice girl with a disturbing hobby

My femdom findom blog: http://www.MistressAvarice.com

(in reply to TracyTaken)

Post #: 9

RE: Between Sir Gawain and Master John - 2/2/2008 6:59:46 PM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline

I don't know anyone who feels he has to serve the entire world. Even Mother Teresa limited herself to one specific population.

But The Man is the most civil, and soft spoken man I've ever known. Loved by kids and animals. Admired by lots of my female friends.

He doesn't serve me, he pays attention to me, listens to me, and takes my needs into account. And he protects me. None of which stop him from deciding what we should do, even over my vociferous objections.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

(in reply to sexyred1)

Post #: 10

RE: Between Sir Gawain and Master John - 2/2/2008 7:00:07 PM

takenbyjohnr07

Posts: 787
Joined: 11/26/2007
Status: offline

My Ower was raised in a southern family, where all doors are opened for a women, packages are carried and all the stuff you see in the movies. It took me a while to get use to this as good as it is. He also sees himself as my Knight and my protector, which he is. He is so gente with me like i am a priceless piece of porcelain. which blows me away. .

_____________________________

i am the sole property of Johnr. He is the love of my life and the greatest Owner and i will live to serve and, please him only every day of my life.

(in reply to TracyTaken)

Post #: 11

RE: Between Sir Gawain and Master John - 2/2/2008 7:04:20 PM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline

If you're talking about doms who are conflicted about being sadistic, then yes, but that doesn't seem to be the question you are asking.

Good manners aren't about "serving" anyone- they are about facilitating social interactions between unique individuals and provide a baseline of behavior to allow for the potential of closer intimacy and a when intimacy is not desired so that everyone feels good at the end of the day.

Secondly, service isn't submissive- the best masters tend to be ones who see themselves as providing service to the world and the relationships they inhabit.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to takenbyjohnr07)

Post #: 12

RE: Between Sir Gawain and Master John - 2/2/2008 7:11:42 PM

SirJohnMandevill

Posts: 546
Joined: 11/10/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: sexyred1

I am not a Dom, but I believe that some think it is "unDomly" to do many things, including be chivalrous. I think those who are truly secure in their own masculinity, strength and character would be secure enough to be chivalrous or anything else, if they so desire.

I wouldn't consider myself especially "chivalrous" per se, but there are certain things I will do for my submissive that fall broadly into that realm, e.g., opening doors, helping her on/off with her coat. The submissive who wins my heart would be quite capable of doing such things herself, but will gladly want me to do so as her Domonant.

Les (Purveyor of Fine, Handcrafted Kink)

_____________________________

Iam an eroticist
I am a fully eroticized being
No more neuroses
I found my strip naked soul soup
With the deviant ingredient
---The B-52s

(in reply to sexyred1)

Post #: 13

RE: Between Sir Gawain and Master John - 2/2/2008 7:20:42 PM

sweetwenchie

Posts: 1993
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Sacramento, California
Status: offline

i've always preferred a man that knows when to be a gentleman, and when to be a sadistic son of a bitch. It might sound greedy to want both in one, but if i can manage knowing when to be a lady and when to be a whimpering, begging, masochistic slut, then i know it can be done.

< Message edited by sweetwenchie -- 2/2/2008 7:23:27 PM >

_____________________________

"To make oneself an object, to make oneself passive, is a very different thing from being a passive object." - De Beauvoir

"You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist." - Nietzsche

(in reply to TracyTaken)

Post #: 14

RE: Between Sir Gawain and Master John - 2/2/2008 7:23:00 PM

Gwynvyd

Posts: 4949
Status: offline

I am not a Dom.. but a Domme. I know that many have issues thinking Dom/mes have to be big, and bad and tough. *sighs* and any sign of kindness is a weakness.

Personaly I have a code of honor. This includes treating every woman as a Lady, and every man as a Genleman. ( Amongst other things )
mercy, courage, valor, fairness, protection of the weak and the poor. being willing to give one’s life for another’s, being faithful to God, protecting the innocent, being the champion of good against evil, being generous and obeying God above all others.

You can be a Dom/me and do this with out having any issues, and find submissives who do not find issues with it.

You do not need to be an over bearing asshole to be a Dom/me. As most people assert.

Gwyn

_____________________________

Self avowed Geek-Girl~
Come for the boobs, stay for the brains.

Be the kinda woman that when your feet hit the floor in the morning the Devil says "Oh shit, shes awake..."
~ Softandshy's "Shiney"

(in reply to TracyTaken)

Post #: 15

RE: Between Sir Gawain and Master John - 2/2/2008 7:27:04 PM

SirJohnMandevill

Posts: 546
Joined: 11/10/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: sweetwenchie

i've always preferred a man that knows when to be a gentleman, and when to be a sadistic son of a bitch.

Hmmmmmmm...and I didn't think you even knew me, wenchie!

Les (Purveyor of Fine, Handcrafted Kink)

_____________________________

Iam an eroticist
I am a fully eroticized being
No more neuroses
I found my strip naked soul soup
With the deviant ingredient
---The B-52s

(in reply to sweetwenchie)

Post #: 16

RE: Between Sir Gawain and Master John - 2/2/2008 7:31:14 PM

sweetwenchie

Posts: 1993
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Sacramento, California
Status: offline

LOL perhaps not personally, though i have met Many that fit that description.

_____________________________

"To make oneself an object, to make oneself passive, is a very different thing from being a passive object." - De Beauvoir

"You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist." - Nietzsche

(in reply to SirJohnMandevill)

Post #: 17

RE: Between Sir Gawain and Master John - 2/2/2008 7:32:17 PM

sexyred1

Posts: 8998
Joined: 8/9/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: sweetwenchie

i've always preferred a man that knows when to be a gentleman, and when to be a sadistic son of a bitch. It might sound greedy to want both in one, but if i can manage knowing when to be a lady and when to be a whimpering, begging, masochistic slut, then i know it can be done.

I so agree with you; that is what I try to convey in my profile!!

(in reply to sweetwenchie)

Post #: 18

RE: Between Sir Gawain and Master John - 2/2/2008 7:33:18 PM

Rover

Posts: 2634
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline

That's just way too complicated for me. I just act like myself, and do what I want. Someone is attracted to that or not.

John

_____________________________

"Man's mind stretched to a new idea never goes back to its original dimensions."

Sri da Avabhas

(in reply to TracyTaken)

Post #: 19

RE: Between Sir Gawain and Master John - 2/2/2008 7:34:28 PM

sweetwenchie

Posts: 1993
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Sacramento, California
Status: offline

i've perved your profile a few times, i think your desire for one such as that came through.

_____________________________

"To make oneself an object, to make oneself passive, is a very different thing from being a passive object." - De Beauvoir

"You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist." - Nietzsche

(in reply to sexyred1)

Post #: 20

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