quote:

ORIGINAL: Muttling

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

quote:

ORIGINAL: Muttling

IMO, a don't buy gas day would have absolutely no impact.   Everyone would simply load up the day before and the day after.   The overall consumption for the month would go unchanged.   If you want to put the squeeze on them, start getting frugal with your fuel consumption.

As for Chavez, he's a Mussolini wanna be.  Just look to his ties to Iran and his repeated sabre rattling.  The sad part is that letting him cut off U.S. oil won't have an impact on his economy since his oil will be sold on the open market then resold to us.   If he want to play this game then we can easily rattle up the pressure with other economic games, but it's a game we must be careful at playing.    Give him enough rope and let him hang himself, don't usher him to the gallows or we will look like the antigonists to much of the world.

Muttling,


One of the claims of oil companies, is that tight supply periods are responsible the super high prices.

The issue of tight supply periods is more one of refinery capacity than crude oil supply and that's what makes the prices so unstable.   None of the oil companies hold reserves of crude OR refined fuel sizeable enough to stabalize the prices.

Frankly, there is absolutely ZERO economic reason for them to do so as storing such reserves are extremely expensive.

What's more, the refinery capacity is the real choke point in the system and our demand is currently bumping into the limits of refinery capacity.  When ONE refinery goes off line for scheduled maintenance it puts our supply in a huge lurch.  

While most want to blame the oil companies, the reason for this problem really isn't the fault of the oil companies.   It takes 20 to 30 years a billions of dollars to put a new refinery on line.   They simply can't afford the cost of it unless they want to build one in a third world country where political stability create enormous risk.  Once they build it in such a place, they will get massive political backlash for outsourcing it where the environmental laws aren't as stiff.   (No one bothers to think that it's those same laws that make it unfeasible to build one in a developed country.)

In short, it's a HUGE catch 22 for everyone.  The oil companies' answer is to try to expand capacity of existing refineries, but that can only go so far.

The whole situation is a massive mess of politics, capitalism, and manipulation.   The oil companies AND a multitude of governments are to blame for it.   What's more, we will be out of oil in another 100 years so we really do need to be serious about alternative fuels technology for a variety of reasons.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

So Owner, what do you think of a leader of a country being placed into power for life? How well does that sit with your principles? This link will help some click me

Dude,stop playing the noble good-doer act.

You know that there would be zero interest in  Venezuelan politics,if we didn`t get like half our oil from there.

Give me a fuck`n break,will ya?

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

      Thompson;   I read your link far enough to get to the part about the poor 'not having money for work-out plans.'   At that point I dismissed it as pure clueless, bullshit. 

    Perhaps you should try considering the context of the remarks you go leaping on. 

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

Dude? Not playing any act, just being me, and that seems to be what you have a problem with. So what does the interest in that country have to do with anything? I noticed you just avoided the question I asked. You really need top watch the hypertension, as it is a silent killer. You need to resude stress and this link should help reduce stress .

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

So Owner, what do you think of a leader of a country being placed into power for life? How well does that sit with your principles? This link will help some click me

Dude,stop playing the noble good-doer act.

You know that there would be zero interest in  Venezuelan politics,if we didn`t get like half our oil from there.

Give me a fuck`n break,will ya?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Muttling

The issue of tight supply periods is more one of refinery capacity than crude oil supply and that's what makes the prices so unstable.   None of the oil companies hold reserves of crude OR refined fuel sizeable enough to stabalize the prices.

Frankly, there is absolutely ZERO economic reason for them to do so as storing such reserves are extremely expensive.

What's more, the refinery capacity is the real choke point in the system and our demand is currently bumping into the limits of refinery capacity.  When ONE refinery goes off line for scheduled maintenance it puts our supply in a huge lurch.  

While most want to blame the oil companies, the reason for this problem really isn't the fault of the oil companies.   It takes 20 to 30 years a billions of dollars to put a new refinery on line.   They simply can't afford the cost of it unless they want to build one in a third world country where political stability create enormous risk.  Once they build it in such a place, they will get massive political backlash for outsourcing it where the environmental laws aren't as stiff.   (No one bothers to think that it's those same laws that make it unfeasible to build one in a developed country.)

In short, it's a HUGE catch 22 for everyone.  The oil companies' answer is to try to expand capacity of existing refineries, but that can only go so far.

The whole situation is a massive mess of politics, capitalism, and manipulation.   The oil companies AND a multitude of governments are to blame for it.   What's more, we will be out of oil in another 100 years so we really do need to be serious about alternative fuels technology for a variety of reasons.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

"what do you think of a leader of a country being placed into power for life"
 
It matters to me about as much as it matters to you.Which is little.

quote:

 
  What,all of a sudden you`re against every leader for life dictator?

1.It hasn`t happened in Venezuela.

2. It has happened and  is happening all over the globe.

Remember Saddam? We used to help him being a dictator ,when he played nicey-nice with us.

Why the sudden benevolence towards the Venezuelan people? Could it be their oil?

You`re so sincere and concerned for their welfare.I touched.

quote:


"Not playing any act, just being me,"

Lol,I`ll say...

The acting I refered to,was your fake concern over the  Venezuelans and there politics.That, and the fact that all this is about their oil,flew right over your head.

quote:


And I don`t have a problem with you,personally or otherwise.

How about staying on topic,and not worrying about me personally?I`ll promise the same.

My problem,..America`s problem,... are neo-con policies.If you want to defend them,welcome to the shit storm.

Why the hell are we going half way around the world to wage war for oil, when we could have invaded Venezuela, gotten oil and hot babes?

quote:


yeah,war for oil....again.

Only there`s no turrer-st down there.

How are you going to dupe Americans into another disaster?

quote:


Funny how you conflate the failure that is the Bush administration and America.

Kindly stop associating America and Americans with neo-cons.

quote:


Dude,stop playing the noble good-doer act.

You know that there would be zero interest in  Venezuelan politics,if we didn`t get like half our oil from there.

Give me a fuck`n break,will ya?

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

We do not purchase 1/2 our oil from Veneazuela. If we did it would be about 11 million bbls a day. If Chavez cut us off it would be the beginning of the end of his rule...he and Venezuela need every penny they can get from oil. That's all they have...like Russia and Mexico.

Well that's all Mexico had until Nafta caused corporations to move so much of our maunfacturing down there. Look, the Mexicans ought to be rich by now...hey ? If you want to look at the single most costly trade pact (Clinton) it is Nafta and that was like ALL 'free trade' aggreements...not 'free trade' agreements at all what with all of the agricultural and textile import restrictions.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aubre

Chavez shouldn't be surprised. If you nationalize people's property, you have to be prepared to take the hit in the courts overseas. If he didn't expect to be sued he really is a retard. His nationalization could very well cost him Citgo as well as all their other assets in Europe and America, and he shouldn't be outraged or upset by it. He should have known that there would be repercussions to his actions. If he stops selling us oil, it hurts him more than it hurts us. His competitors will thank him.

I would rather run out of gas any day than buy gas or a pack of gum from a Citgo station.

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aubre

Chavez shouldn't be surprised. If you nationalize people's property, you have to be prepared to take the hit in the courts overseas. If he didn't expect to be sued he really is a retard. His nationalization could very well cost him Citgo as well as all their other assets in Europe and America, and he shouldn't be outraged or upset by it. He should have known that there would be repercussions to his actions. If he stops selling us oil, it hurts him more than it hurts us. His competitors will thank him.

I would rather run out of gas any day than buy gas or a pack of gum from a Citgo station.

Aubre:
What will your position be should Chavez prevail and Exxon Mobil loose in their lawsuit?
Will you consider it a "perversion" of justice? Or will you agree that the rule of law was served and that Chavez was right?
thompson

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

Add to all of this that Venezuelan oil production is down, and likely that corruption is occurring that is draining off some of their revenues. Chavez is not stupid, and all this threat of cutting the US off, is just bluster. Here is a decent article on their oil production:  Venezuelan oil production

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

Muttling:
You might want to read this.  It might give you a little better understanding of what you are discussing.
http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=3792
 
and
http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/bus/stories/121107dnbusrefinery.2894c91.html

It would seem that some can do it in somewhat less than 20 to 30 years.  If one considers how much money the oil companies have and how much money they would make on the investment 3 to 10 billion dollars considered in that perspective is nothing more than a proverbial "drop in the bucket"
thompson

quote:

What will your position be should Chavez prevail and Exxon Mobil loose in their lawsuit?
Will you consider it a "perversion" of justice? Or will you agree that the rule of law was served and that Chavez was right?