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RE: Me...an Elitist??? - 2/18/2008 2:23:09 AM

Lordandmaster

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I wouldn't call you an elitist--that's kind of overstating the case--but your friend has a point. And anyway, we tend to overdramatize the physical risks of BDSM. Yes, there are risks. No doubt about that. But you must be experienced enough to be able to watch out for them yourself, and as long as you don't allow yourself to be completely incapacitated, you should be able to warn a fledgling dom when he's fucking things up. It's not as though you're going to suffer mortal wounds if you allow a newbie to flog you one day. So I think the real issue isn't so much the damage that a newbie could cause as his inability to go as far as you'd like. If you're really into extreme masochism, you've probably endured things that neophytes have never even imagined.

quote:

ORIGINAL: probablyknowme

Well, I was talking to a Dominant friend of mine the other day about my search, and we were discussing my tendancy toward gravitating to the more experienced Dominants. As I explained to him, my needs are very much geared to the heavy masochist side, and if someone is inexperienced and trying to play at my prefered level, it would be very easy to do some damage. His point was that if experienced bottoms/subs don't ever play with new Dominants, then how would the new people learn. And he laughingly called me an elitist. That kind of made me feel a little guilty, as one of my passions is education in the community.

(in reply to probablyknowme)

Post #: 21

RE: Me...an Elitist??? - 2/18/2008 2:46:39 AM

Evility

Posts: 915
Joined: 12/19/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: WalterRego
I find myself constantly saying, "But please don't do ____ for me, or because You think I might like or want it. Do what You want."

A submissive who actually "gets it". Wonderful way to start a day.

Off to work. Play nice, y'all.

(in reply to WalterRego)

Post #: 22

RE: Me...an Elitist??? - 2/18/2008 3:10:15 AM

probablyknowme

Posts: 1875
Joined: 9/19/2007
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No, it wouldn't do any damage if I let an inexperienced Dom flog me (been there done that). And when I have served as a teaching bottom, I can and have pointed out that that flogger wrapped badly, or that cane was kinda close to the kidney area, or that rope cuff was too tight and cutting off the circulation.

You're right, though, in my search for a Dominant, it is the newbies inability or unwillingness to go to that edge with me that very often makes me pass them by. Let's face it, when I first started in this lifestyle, I was nowhere near the masochist that I am now. That simple flogging was limit pushing for me when I first discovered this lifestyle. I can well imagine that the same can be said for a new Dominant. So, my playing with a Dominant that is happy with a flogging, and I am needing the release of a good hard electro-torture, that would not be a good fit. So, maybe I am an elitist...or maybe I am just greedy and needy.

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(in reply to Lordandmaster)

Post #: 23

RE: Me...an Elitist??? - 2/18/2008 4:48:00 AM

IrishMist

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Experience, in the sense that you are suggesting, means very little to me. What does matter is that I know the person very well; and that they know me very well.

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Post #: 24

RE: Me...an Elitist??? - 2/18/2008 8:03:00 AM

chellekitty

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Joined: 3/27/2005
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quote:

are you willing to scene/play/explore a relationship with someone who was not as experienced as you? If not, why? and if you are willing, has anything happened that put a spotlight on that discrepancy?

i am in a relationship with someone who is not as experienced as me...it's a pain in the ass...because he's also very smart (not that i would be with someone less intelligent than me) but...i don't know...it's hard to put it into words...i know he's Dominant, but he won't say he is because if he said he was, he would be "deviant"....like that's a bad thing...and beating on people is bad...and bondage is bad, unless its just to hold you still for sex.........so....we're getting there...but i have to put on my breaks and not go straight to the ball gags and snake whips....

oh and as for the being an elitist...don't worry about you....i picked out one of the best whip handlers in the country who was hiding out in the bar at a convention to sit down next to and chat with for a few hours, cause he looked like someone "on par" with me...i ate my humble pie when i got home and realized who he was....

chelle

_____________________________

One thing I know: the only ones among you who will be really happy are those who will have sought and found how to serve. ~Albert Schweitzer

(in reply to probablyknowme)

Post #: 25

RE: Me...an Elitist??? - 2/18/2008 8:13:55 AM

DiurnalVampire

Posts: 8125
Joined: 1/19/2006
From: Nashville, TN
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Learning from a submissive when you ask to do so, is not being topped from the bottom. When the Dominant ASKS tohve something taught, then they are still controlling the situaton even if they are learning. Topping means trying to reroute a scene from whqat the Dominant wants to what the submissive would prefer without permission or interest in that new route from the Dominant.

I play with people at a much lower level of expereince often. The difference is they are not doing anything TO me. I can easily understand a heavy masochist not wanting someone green, unless that someone was being monitored. For you to enjoy it, it has to be rough, but for them to be capable of that sort of play will take a LOT of time. If you met someone who you were interested in that was green, I am sure you could find the patience to walk them through everything you need. But just from the get-go I would not trust my safety in your situation to someone who didnt know one end of the whip from another.

DV

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VampiresLair

(in reply to lusciouslips19)

Post #: 26

RE: Me...an Elitist??? - 2/18/2008 8:16:28 AM

Leatherist

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If I put my stupid ego before my desire to learn, I would never have gotten any real life experience at all. This obsession people have with topping from the bottom only points to thier own insecurity. It's really not that hard to say "I'd rather not.."

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Post #: 27

RE: Me...an Elitist??? - 2/18/2008 8:21:32 AM

SubbieOnWheels

Posts: 590
Joined: 12/14/2007
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Is it elitist to expect your Dominant to be the kind of person to give you what you need? It seem to me that to settle for less is not being true to yourself.

That being said, there are very few Dominants who do NOT have more experience than I, but I still seem to be approached by many of them.

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(in reply to chellekitty)

Post #: 28

RE: Me...an Elitist??? - 2/18/2008 8:50:45 AM

ProlificNeeds

Posts: 1061
Joined: 5/19/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: probablyknowme

My point to this is...are you willing to scene/play/explore a relationship with someone who was not as experienced as you? If not, why? and if you are willing, has anything happened that put a spotlight on that discrepancy?

I am willing to play with someone who is inexperienced if they show a genuine desire to learn. A key factor also is learning to heed my experience on a matter when it exceeds his own. The idea of being an experimental guinea pig for a top or Dominant is actually hot to me. The thing is, for it to be hot, the person needs to be genuinely interested in learning, and not just sating himself with no regard for the bottom half of the experience.
I do think it effects the dynamic to a degree, but doesn't make a power exchange impossible, or even difficult. There simply has to be an understanding that the sub's wisdom is at the Dom's disposal, and should be used.

(in reply to probablyknowme)

Post #: 29

RE: Me...an Elitist??? - 2/18/2008 9:18:24 AM

littleone35

Posts: 2828
Joined: 2/17/2005
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I wanted an experienced Dom(found him). I don't want to have to teach someone how to dominate me. It is just a personal preference.

Matt's littleone

(in reply to ProlificNeeds)

Post #: 30

RE: Me...an Elitist??? - 2/18/2008 9:36:31 AM

DarkDaddyZ

Posts: 805
Joined: 4/7/2006
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That Elitist term is a double edge sword and many wear that label some act as elitists and get offended when they are called out as such. I enjoy chemistry so it doesn't matter when it comes to some physical BDSM play (like flogging, paddling, even playing with signal whips) if a person has a shit load of experience or not. Yet in some of the heavier play I am into, I wouldn't be comfortable doing it in "public kinky settings" with Simone with no experience though I'd be more comfortable doing it privately. However, I have also had long term relationships with partners that didn't have a lot of experience that I was comfortable topping and going hard in scenes because it was about the chemistry. There has also been times that I've topped bottoms that had more experience than me and I admit having butterflies at first. Lastly, there are some who like to star fuck to give them points (for those who don't know, star fucking is topping or bottoming: (okay Dominating or submitting) to someone who is well known in a local or national/international community just to say they played with them) to make them feel "special."

Z-

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Post #: 31

RE: Me...an Elitist??? - 2/18/2008 10:35:35 AM

probablyknowme

Posts: 1875
Joined: 9/19/2007
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I have actually seen that a lot, DarkDaddyZ, and find it somehow distasteful. I have noticed that the "stars" for the most part have a certain magnetism, something about them that draws people to them, aside from their public role. So, sometimes the desire for the "star" is simply a response to that magnetism.

_____________________________

The human mind is like a TV set. When it goes blank, it's a good idea to turn off the sound.
-Anon.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NewcomersOK/

(in reply to DarkDaddyZ)

Post #: 32

RE: Me...an Elitist??? - 2/18/2008 11:18:53 AM

DarkDaddyZ

Posts: 805
Joined: 4/7/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: probablyknowme

I have actually seen that a lot, DarkDaddyZ, and find it somehow distasteful. I have noticed that the "stars" for the most part have a certain magnetism, something about them that draws people to them, aside from their public role. So, sometimes the desire for the "star" is simply a response to that magnetism.

Many times there is chemistry. I've topped a few well known bottoms and bottoms to a few. But there was a connection between both of us to make that happen. So I agree with what you say there but sometimes it's quite clear when someone just wants the notch.

Some "Stars" will admit that they get off on just the using aspect of someone like that, many won't. That's a kink in itself and I get that.

DDZ-

_____________________________

"Flirting is part of the job description." DJ Jesus (Lucy Daughter Of The Devil)

Vanilla Official Music Page http://www.myspace.com/djzulu

(in reply to probablyknowme)

Post #: 33

RE: Me...an Elitist??? - 2/18/2008 12:42:23 PM

crouchingtigress

Posts: 4387
Joined: 3/19/2006
From: Maui
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i have a saying feel free to use it if it serves you to...."its none of my buisness what some one thinks of me..."

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(in reply to lusciouslips19)

Post #: 34

RE: Me...an Elitist??? - 2/18/2008 1:01:16 PM

Sylphid

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Joined: 2/16/2008
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You're trying to do what's best for you, you know what you want and what can make you develop better. If that is being elitist well so be it.
I'm generally considered ageist as I've got some age criteria but who cares? You're playing for yourself, not the others...

(in reply to probablyknowme)

Post #: 35

RE: Me...an Elitist??? - 2/18/2008 1:33:48 PM

lusciouslips19

Posts: 9792
Joined: 9/8/2007
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If i would have to teach someone how to dominate me, it would lose its fun because then I am in charge. So if they had no experience but potential I would want them to be mentored. If they were not naturally Dominant and couldnt be in command, I would not be interested at all.

< Message edited by lusciouslips19 -- 2/18/2008 1:35:30 PM >

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Post #: 36

RE: Me...an Elitist??? - 2/18/2008 3:20:59 PM

DoctorYale

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Joined: 8/7/2007
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In reply to JuliaOceana - You are truly special and from my perspective understand, totally, the true meaning of this relationship. As to the general question of elitism, I am proud to be an elitest.

(in reply to juliaoceania)

Post #: 37

RE: Me...an Elitist??? - 2/18/2008 4:45:42 PM

littlebitxxx

Posts: 732
Status: offline

<FR>
I don't mind bottoming once in awhile to a learning Top if the desire to learn and get good is an honest one. I wouldn't do edge play (fire, knives, etc) though with anyone but an experienced one because of the trust level needed. Sometimes though, in order to get a fix, an experienced Top is what does it. As for Domination: no submitting to a newbie here. He's gotta prove he knows what the hell he's doing before I let him anywhere near my mind.

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There is no such thing as can't unless it is followed by yet

It is the meaningless little acts that become meaningful in the doing.

The people that mind don't matter and the people that matter don't mind.

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Post #: 38

RE: Me...an Elitist??? - 2/18/2008 4:54:11 PM

probablyknowme

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Joined: 9/19/2007
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Well, see, I wasn't even addressing submitting to anyone who was experienced or not. I, too, could not submit to some one who was not experienced enough to be competant while getting inside my head. (It's dark in there, and there are big scary things that bite!

*grin*)

_____________________________

The human mind is like a TV set. When it goes blank, it's a good idea to turn off the sound.
-Anon.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NewcomersOK/

(in reply to littlebitxxx)

Post #: 39

RE: Me...an Elitist??? - 2/18/2008 5:33:23 PM

xolarkinxo

Posts: 73
Joined: 9/10/2005
Status: offline

Topping from the bottom is a turn-off for me so when I was looking, it was for someone experienced.

Larkin

(in reply to lusciouslips19)

Post #: 40

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