|
Owner59 -> RE: Iran: Israel will soon disappear (2/26/2008 10:07:33 PM)
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: Alumbrado
quote:
ORIGINAL: Owner59
ps.I`m also fascinated that Alumbrado/luckdog will see my thoughts on solutions think I`m a holocaust denier.
The thoughts that I'm seeing claim that the historical references which document that Arabs or Muslims had been involved in the Holocaust or other pre-Israel genocidal pogroms are BS and vile propaganda which should not be cited .
I'm also seeing others hijack attempts to discuss realistic solutions by claiming that the Jews are the ones whose actions need to be criticised, and dismissing the history of violence against them (Holocaust et al.) as quote:
...whatever [Jews, Bush, kindergarten bullies, whatever] thinks they did.
On the documented fact that there were 1920s Mufti directed Palestinian death squads targeting Jews in Jerusalem, one response was...quote:
'What facts?'.... and ..... 'Jews lived in Palestine before World War II without any animosity toward them... lived in peace. It was only when an invasion force displaced these people from their homes that they became angry.'
Those may not be denial or derail in your book, but they will do until a 'real' denier comes along.
And trying later to spin the straw argument that this was a noble defense of all Arabs/Muslims who weren't involved (insinuating that the naming of specific names, places, and incidents from history books was wholesale slander), does nothing to inspire confidence in altruistic motives.
Speak the words, wear the label...now who spoke these words, in specific reference to the historical article on Al-Husseini's Arab/Muslim campaign of genocide against the Jews in collaboration with the Reich?
quote:
Not sure what you were trying to do by linking middle eastern Arabs with the nazis,but is was pure bullshit and vile propaganda.
As I stated, I have no intention of debating with any of you whether or not the the Arab role in the Holocaust, or the other dates and atrocities against Jews I listed actually occurred, since they are a matter of record...
If you want to deny them, feel free to back it up to someone else, and feel free to complain when I call it denial.
Now for those willing to address real solutions, it is mandatory to quit relying on sound bites, and address these factors:
>That linked to (among other things) centuries of Muslim/Arab and European attempts at genocide, many Jewish people currently believe (rightly or wrongly), that their lives depend upon supporting Israel's policies.
>That linked to (among other things) recent events involving territory, in the eyes of many Palestinians, their survival is linked to the successful actions of their leaders.
Because without grasping that both sides of this cycle of violence think they are acting in the right, and that both sides are in fact perpetuating it, there will be no solutions found. Read up on conflict mediation, this is a core principle.
Admit to that in total, not in part, and we can start talking about the current mistakes on the parts of both governments.
Here`s a great example of where you go wrong.
You can`t even get the quotes striaght or who made them.
You`re atributing quotes to me I didn`t make.
Two of the four quotes,are not mine.Clean it up.
As I said before,this is how wars start."Ball Of Confusion"
"I'm also seeing others hijack attempts to discuss realistic solutions by claiming that the Jews are the ones whose actions need to be criticised, and dismissing the history of violence against them (Holocaust et al.)"
Your "hijack" obsession seems silly and pointless,especially when you don`t seem to know wtf a hijack is or isn`t.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I said that both sides are at fault and both sides have dirty hands.And that the lopsided policy of the last 7 years hasn`t worked.
And I`ve said nothing about Jews.My criticism is of some of Israel's policies.
"by claiming that the Jews are the ones whose actions need to be criticised,"
Again,this dirty play of putting ugly words and thoughts into other people`s mouths is completely transparent.Obviously you can`t win an arguement,without putting words in other`s mouths.
Tell ya what....
Why don`t you just save me the trouble and argue both sides?
You don`t seem content to handle just your side.You put the words into my mouth,then you can respond with sincere outrage.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I haven`t dismissed the horrible legacy of violence and bigotry against Jewish people.
I said that that history doesn`t give the government of Israel a free pass.
And that bringing up Europe, to justify Israel`s policies is complete bullshit.
Sorry,but Arab blood isn`t worth any less then Jewish blood.
They both count.Sorry if that seems unfair.
The continuing cycle of violence and the people who will continue to die indefinitely ,call for solutions and people of good will.
I don`t think you`re that type.
Admit to that in total, not in part, and we can start talking about the current mistakes on the parts of both governments.
How arrogant is that?
Is this how you treat your family,friends and associates?You must be a real gas to party with.
How about chilling on the debate killing word-bombs,and staying on topic?
I suggest that that would be more productive than smear or giving ultimatums.
|
|
|
|
