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2008 Snowfall in Northern Hemisphere and Global Warming - 2/21/2008 7:41:26 AM   
OrionTheWolf


Posts: 7803
Joined: 10/11/2006
Status: offline 		Can some of the Global Warming experts tell me how Global Warming gives us higher snowfall in the Northern Hemisphere?

Also, I am trying to find it again, but I could have sworn I saw a newsflash that all that artic ice that melted has reformed. Anyone have a link to that?

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RE: 2008 Snowfall in Northern Hemisphere and Global War... - 2/21/2008 7:50:06 AM   
MichiganHeadmast


Posts: 726
Joined: 8/13/2006
Status: offline 		You didn't get the memo?  It's now "climate change."  Solves the problem of folks having to alternate wetting their panties about "global cooling" and "global warming" every 20 years.

Now go out and buy some carbon credits from Al Gore.  He's gotta heat that environmentally friendly mansion.

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RE: 2008 Snowfall in Northern Hemisphere and Global War... - 2/21/2008 8:59:49 AM   
Hippiekinkster


Posts: 5512
Joined: 11/20/2007
From: Liechtenstein
Status: offline 		The higher the temperature, the higher the partial pressure of water vapor. The more water vapor in the air, the more snow when that air cools sufficiently.

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RE: 2008 Snowfall in Northern Hemisphere and Global War... - 2/21/2008 9:02:35 AM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline 		But how do you know that they're "Real" global warming people?
If they're not wearing a green sportscoat and a beanie with a propellor on top I don't listen to them.

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RE: 2008 Snowfall in Northern Hemisphere and Global War... - 2/21/2008 9:03:33 AM   
LadyHibiscus


Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline 		I insist on a TINFOIL beanie or they're not real.

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RE: 2008 Snowfall in Northern Hemisphere and Global War... - 2/21/2008 9:23:44 AM   
meatcleaver


Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

Can some of the Global Warming experts tell me how Global Warming gives us higher snowfall in the Northern Hemisphere?

Also, I am trying to find it again, but I could have sworn I saw a newsflash that all that artic ice that melted has reformed. Anyone have a link to that?


Because the term 'global warming' is a lazy term for 'climate change'. The predictions are that as the average temperature of the earth rises, there will be extreme and unusual weather and seasons will become unclear.

For example, normally in February I go skating on the canals and singels (little canals) here, instead I have been walking down to the bar in my tee shirt and having lunch outdoors on the bar's terrace.

Actually it is more like autumn weather today or maybe early spring, there are buds on the trees, which is far too early.

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RE: 2008 Snowfall in Northern Hemisphere and Global War... - 2/21/2008 9:30:58 AM   
luckydog1


Posts: 2736
Joined: 1/16/2006
Status: offline 		Orion, What hippie said is right.  More mositure equals more snow.   Even if the planet warms 5 degrees, it will still be very cold at elevation, and get more snow, due to more storms.

Also the Artic Ice freezes every witner and melts somewhat in the spring.  The ice still freezes down and touches Canada and Alaska.  But it is taking longer to form each fall, and going out faster in the spring.  The ice that doesnt melt keeps shrinking, and the ice does does reform is thinner.

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RE: 2008 Snowfall in Northern Hemisphere and Global War... - 2/21/2008 5:59:02 PM   
Aneirin


Posts: 6121
Joined: 3/18/2006
From: Tamaris
Status: offline 		I read somewhere that the ice that is melting is refreezing somewhere else.

I think the planet has the right to change it's appearance in our lifetime, I mean, why should it remain static when it never has done before?

Even long before human kind's short existance on Earth, and it is short in comparison to the age of the planet.


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RE: 2008 Snowfall in Northern Hemisphere and Global War... - 2/21/2008 6:19:10 PM   
Sinergy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster

The higher the temperature, the higher the partial pressure of water vapor. The more water vapor in the air, the more snow when that air cools sufficiently.



The problem, Hippiekinkster, is that you are using "real science" and "basic physics" to try to clarify for the uneducated and Dittoheaded populations why something happens.  In my experience, this works as well as attempting to mix oil (knowledge) with vinegar (right-wing politics).

I posted last year about 36 cubic miles of antarctic ice mass disappearing as determined by gravity sensing satellites.  The response I got was that the satellite measurements were wrong because of issues with computer modelling the results.  I spent months trying to get the posters involved to clarify, since I used to build computer models for a living and really wanted to understand their point of view, but they crawled off to sulk and refused the opportunity to face peer review of their vast scientific knowledge.

To break it down, if 36 cubic miles of ice melt, it raises the water temperature (think of what happens to the Scotch when the ice cube melts) and allows the earth to heat up.

When the earth heats up, some water (say, in the ocean) transforms from a liquid state to a vapor state and enters the atmosphere.

This vapor cools to some degree, allowing things like winter to cool it below the triple point of water.

When it drops below the triple point, the vapor forms into a water or solid state (rain or sleet/snow, for those playing the home game) which falls on the earth.

Two issues come up.

1)  Melting water raises water levels and displaces 1 billion people from the coastal cities they live in to other places.  But FEMA proved that cities that get sunk by hurricanes (predicted for 20 years prior to it by global warming alarmist types, and responded to as a surprise nobody could have predicted by global warming nay-sayers) can be easily relocated to football stadiums and trailer parks in the middle of nowhere.

2)  Human beings can survive in a very narrow range of temperatures.  Sure, our military is in 140 degree weather in Iraq, which I imagine they describe as "balmy," but when the average temperature gives us regular temperatures of 160 or 180, people start to die off.  I say people, because the people who argue against global warming dont really give a good gawd damn how many frogs or coral reefs or spiders or tree moss or whatever dies off.

Sinergy



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RE: 2008 Snowfall in Northern Hemisphere and Global War... - 2/21/2008 6:52:41 PM   
Gwynvyd


Posts: 4949
Status: offline 		Thank you for explaining this to the kids playing the home version game.

Yes.. you get more snow.. there is more vapor and water in the atmosphere with all of that melting..

you also get higher water levels.. and combined with El Nino / El Nina which directly effect my state... it sucks.. http://www.pmel.noaa.gov/tao/elnino/el-nino-story.html

You gotta love these folks who go ehhh fuck it.. nothing can possibly be happening.. even when something like the massive hurricane season of 05 and Katrina.. *shakes her head* http://www.noaanews.noaa.gov/stories2005/s2540.htm

You arent going to be surfing on Lake Michigan in Dec folks... winters are going to be worse.

Gwyn

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RE: 2008 Snowfall in Northern Hemisphere and Global War... - 2/21/2008 6:58:40 PM   
Sinergy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Gwynvyd

Thank you for explaining this to the kids playing the home version game.



I do what I can, Gywnvyd.

GlobalWarmingAlarmistergy


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RE: 2008 Snowfall in Northern Hemisphere and Global War... - 2/21/2008 7:02:50 PM   
carlie310


Posts: 256
Joined: 9/23/2007
Status: offline 		I have no idea of the validity of this guy's claims, but I saw this article today & thought I'd toss it out there.

http://discovermagazine.com/2007/jul/the-discover-interview-henrik-svensmark

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RE: 2008 Snowfall in Northern Hemisphere and Global War... - 2/21/2008 7:05:11 PM   
servantforuse


Posts: 6363
Joined: 3/8/2006
Status: offline 		After a winter of near record cold since the beginning of Decenber and 80 inches of snow, I'm ready for some global warning. Wisconsin needs a warm up.....

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RE: 2008 Snowfall in Northern Hemisphere and Global War... - 2/21/2008 7:10:28 PM   
Sinergy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

After a winter of near record cold since the beginning of Decenber and 80 inches of snow, I'm ready for some global warning. Wisconsin needs a warm up.....


[sarcasm]

I forgot, it is all about you.

[/sarcasm]

Sinergy


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"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
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"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


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RE: 2008 Snowfall in Northern Hemisphere and Global War... - 2/21/2008 7:18:00 PM   
slaveboyforyou


Posts: 3607
Joined: 1/6/2005
From: Arkansas, U.S.A.
Status: offline 		So what if global warming is happening?  I am not saying it isn't; I am not an expert on the subject.  Unlike a lot of posters here, I will readily say, "I don't know."  It's not that hard, just swallow your ego and try it some time.  My knowledge of global warming comes from what I have read and seen.  Honestly, it doesn't sound like the end of life to me.  Yeah, we will lose some land to rising seas.  Yes, it will be warmer.  It's not the first time that the Earth has been considerably warmer.  We are not going to maintain our present climate perpetually, no matter what measures we take. 

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RE: 2008 Snowfall in Northern Hemisphere and Global War... - 2/21/2008 7:21:09 PM   
cyberdude611


Posts: 2596
Joined: 5/7/2006
Status: offline 		Global warming? That's being debunked as we speak?

Volcanic activity under the earth's crust and ocean floor in the polar regions has increased in the past 20 years and continue to increase. The sun is going through a polar shift resulting in more solar radiation impacting earth. The average surface temperature over the past 20 years has increased only by 0.5 degrees F and the atmospheric temperature has remained unchanged during that same time period.

Our CO2 involvement in global warming is still in debate. Mother nature creates far more CO2 naturally every year than humans do collectively in a decade. Our contribution of CO2 due to industrializaion is minimal. Risisng CO2 levels also tends to favor growth and thickness of vegitation.

What I dont understand is the global warming alarmists out there that think the earth is a static body, that it never has nor will it ever change and has always been the same. This planet goes through cycles, changes, and phases. The whole premise behind weather forecasting is identifying cycles. Back in the middle ages, the earth was even warmer than it is today. In some areas it was much, much warmer. A huge block of ice in antartica has recently been identified as being only 2,000 years old which is extremely young meaning much of the ice at the polar regions was not there just several thousand years ago. They recently found fossils of tropical plants in Siberia and Alaska!

My point is that there is a lot about this planet that we do not understand. The earth is 4 billion years old. We have only been around for a blip in this planet's history. Yes, pollution is a big problem that needs to be taken care off. But to claim our miniscule contribution of CO2 is somehow going to lead to the extinction of the human race by 2050?.....GIVE ME A BREAK! That's a fabricated scare tactic to promote a political agenda. And you are a fool if you fall for it.

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RE: 2008 Snowfall in Northern Hemisphere and Global War... - 2/21/2008 7:26:20 PM   
servantforuse


Posts: 6363
Joined: 3/8/2006
Status: offline 		20 years ago so called experts were worried about the earth being to cold. They were proven wrong just as Al Gore and the other alarmists will. I for one will not be buying 'carbon credits' from a company started by Mr. Gore. It's a hoax...

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RE: 2008 Snowfall in Northern Hemisphere and Global War... - 2/21/2008 7:28:31 PM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
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This is the other response from the global warming naysayers.

"It is a really big and complex problem that I personally cannot understand, so dont ask me to change anything or do anything apart from what I am already doing."

While I know your approach works for a lot of people, please go explain to the people in New Orleans that despite the fact that people had been predicting the flooding of the city since the 1960s based on climate studies, our government never bothered to ask the Dutch how they have lived below sea level for hundreds of years, and the river that their port uses for access to the Zuiderzee has no dead zones bigger than half the states in the United States, and failed to do anything to prevent the calamity brought by Katrina.

For those playing the home game, I am pointing out a few things.

1)  We know what the problem is.

2)  We know what we are doing to add to the problem.

3)  We know what to do to ameliorate the problem, but.

4)  We dont care enough as a country to do anything about it, even when the problem directly impacts our own citizens.

Not-hiding-my-head-in-the-sandergy.


_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


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RE: 2008 Snowfall in Northern Hemisphere and Global War... - 2/21/2008 7:39:33 PM   
CraZYWiLLiE


Posts: 161
Joined: 1/24/2008
From: HD NM
Status: offline 		I always thought after an ice age it would be normal for ice to melt....

During the Dinosaurs the earth was warmer, then a major impact caused a nuclear winter.

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RE: 2008 Snowfall in Northern Hemisphere and Global War... - 2/21/2008 7:45:02 PM   
slaveboyforyou


Posts: 3607
Joined: 1/6/2005
From: Arkansas, U.S.A.
Status: offline
quote:

While I know your approach works for a lot of people, please go explain to the people in New Orleans that despite the fact that people had been predicting the flooding of the city since the 1960s based on climate studies, our government never bothered to ask the Dutch how they have lived below sea level for hundreds of years, and the river that their port uses for access to the Zuiderzee has no dead zones bigger than half the states in the United States, and failed to do anything to prevent the calamity brought by Katrina.

For those playing the home game, I am pointing out a few things.

1) We know what the problem is.

2) We know what we are doing to add to the problem.

3) We know what to do to ameliorate the problem, but.

4) We dont care enough as a country to do anything about it, even when the problem directly impacts our own citizens.

Not-hiding-my-head-in-the-sandergy.


Um, that doesn't sound like a environmental problem.  That's a problem with engineering and with logistics.  New Orleans is going to have storms like that.  It always has.  New Orleans residents were all warned to get out, that the storm was going to be bad.  Maybe the next time one is heading their way, they will listen.  Sometimes it takes a tragedy to knock some sense into the stubborn.  Now the state government of Louisiana definitely had it's head up it's ass.  They should have ordered a evacuation and planned for it.  The federal government is not allowed to step into matters like that until the state requests it. 

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