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RE: Angry with Master - 3/1/2008 1:24:14 PM   
ownedgirlie


Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline 		RM I do not speak to my Master as I speak to others.  I do not challenge him as I challenge others.  I do not argue with him as I argue with others.  He is my Master, not a colleague, compatriat, fellow board poster, etc.

Blushes' post was a post directly to me.  Her references, while indirect, were in reference to things I have said about myself on the boards.  If I misinterpreted, perhaps she would like to correct me.

As for Maya, yes, she did say a lot of "if" statements about the OP.  Statements that did not come from the OP.  There was a lot of speculation about the OP, and I do not understand where it came from.  I also said the OP may have valid reasons for her anger.  But Maya spoke about advising the OP incorrectly, and I gave no advice.  So if Maya's posts were not intended toward me, perhaps she would like to clarify as well.

Admittedly, my "duh" was rude, and for that I apologize. 

If you are content with your sub being angry at you, then that is a dynamic that works for you.  My Master neither appreciates anger toward him nor cattiness, but he expects me to speak up for myself to others when I feel it is necessary.

< Message edited by ownedgirlie -- 3/1/2008 1:26:19 PM >

(in reply to RedMagic1)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: Angry with Master - 3/1/2008 1:27:08 PM   
BitaTruble


Posts: 9779
Joined: 1/12/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: awakenednj

Is being angry with your Sir a completely unacceptable thing?


Well, yeah. Most things which may have a negative impact on the relationship I share with Himself are going to be unacceptable. It may be unavoidable, but that doesn't make it any less unacceptable.

Anger generally stems from a situation which has arisen and causes one to lose ones perspective and react in a manner which is illogical because, let's face it, what purpose does reacting in anger serve that would not be better served by some other reaction which is less volitile?

quote:

What do you do if your sub/slave is angry with you? (Especially if you know you could have handled something slightly better....) Any thoughts on the topic of anger towards the dominant would be welcome...


When I get into an emotional state which is unacceptable, I breath. Seriously. Inhale, exhale until I turn my agitated state into one which is calm and mature so I can deal with the situation which has caused my reaction. I'm fairly even keeled, so it's not something I have to do very often (usually when hormones are raging due to my peri-menopausal state) but, none-the-less, the manner in which I deal with any emotion is my responsibility and if I allow that to impact the service which Himself requires from me, then it's my bad, not his.

Basically, though, I pretty much just don't get mad any more because when I fuck up, I accept it and when Himself yells at me for something over which I had no control, I know he's not mad at me, he's mad at some situation and I'm just handy so I don't take it personally. If he wants to use me to vent his frustrations at the world, that's okay by me. That just comes with the territory of being his slave.

Celeste



_____________________________

"Oh, so it's just like
Rock, paper, scissors."

He laughed. "You are the wisest woman I know."


(in reply to awakenednj)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: Angry with Master - 3/1/2008 1:39:50 PM   
ownedgirlie


Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: xxblushesxx

Girly, I totally agree with you regarding contempt. Imo, that is the one emotion, along with lack of caring that will break a relationship into bits.

I agree, completely.

quote:


The reason why I disagreed with some of the things that you said is because imo, (and in psychiatry) it is not normal or good to hide anger even from yourself. Not everyone can be, or should be at a point where they do not feel anger for their SO. I wanted to let the OP know that it really *is* ok, to have anger, and, (depending upon the parameters of your relationship) to even display it and to discuss it. It's how relationships grow.

blushes, I agree that is it not good to hide anger.  And I agree that sometimes anger is warranted.  Because of some things I have been through in my life, and some quite recent, in fact, I learned that harboring anger is self destructive (for me, anyway), and I learned to recognize when I am beginning to feel it so I can understand it and redirect it.  I was a very angry person for most of my life - filled with rage, in fact.  It took a lot for me to void myself of that so I could live a happy, healthy life.  I do not enjoy feeling anger at my Master, as it harms us both.  He understands anger can exist, but his telling me it is inappropriate is his way of teaching me to stay in check with myself.


quote:


I believe a Dom who expects *no* anger in a relationship, really expects the submissive to *pretend* or to channel that anger into something else.

Agreed.  And my Master doesn't expect me to never feel anger.  He just reminds me that it isn't appropriate for our dynamic.

quote:


I don't believe that is healthy at all times.

Also agreed.  But for some, it is healthy in certain dynamics.  Just this week I told my Master that I had felt angry at him about a rather big situation that occurred, but that my love, respect and trust for him were bigger than that, so the anger dissipated quickly and never needed mentioning again.  I recognized my situation and moved on from it.  There was no need to deal with the anger, because I channeled it into something healthier for me and for us.

quote:


I believe that subs/slaves should know that they can be (at different times), angry, jealous, upset, selfish, sad, and a whole plethora of emotions just like any 'normal' person. Because we *are* people.

I stand by my opinions that ones state of mind is a choice, and what we choose to give our energy to is up to us.  How we choose to be affected by such things is also up to us.  I am not an advocate of suppressing emotions, god knows I was the queen of that for the first 40 years of my life.  I am, however, an advocate of choosing how we are affected by those things that afflict us.

quote:


We do attempt to temper our actions and reactions, and that is good. Most of us want more than anything to give to others and to help others, and that is good too. I just think that too many come into this expecting to be the perfect this, or the best that.
And yanno....we can't.
We can be perfect for the one we're with. (sort of)
And we can be perfect for our own relationships. (kind of)

Well I wish we were this agreeable in our former posts to each other.  I know I will never reach perfection, but I will always strive for it.  It's just who I am.  I will never be perfect for him.  But I will always try to improve upon what I am.  Personally, I'm just happier when I do that.  Consequently, so is he.

quote:


But, I just don't want others thinking that in order to be submissive you have to totally subjugate all of your feelings and emotions.

Nor do I.  I was never taught to do that in this relationship, nor would that ever be accepted in this relationship, and I will never advocate doing that. 

quote:


That's ALL I tried to say.
I stand by it.



All due respect, I wish you had said all that originally, rather than make comparisons over what kind of submissive thinks she may be better than another.  But what's said is said, and we seem to be in agreement now.  I apologize for my rudeness in saying "duh" to you.

I wish you well.

< Message edited by ownedgirlie -- 3/1/2008 1:40:32 PM >

(in reply to xxblushesxx)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Angry with Master - 3/1/2008 1:45:11 PM   
Tantriqu


Posts: 2026
Joined: 12/29/2006
Status: offline 		It's all in how it's expressed.
My last sub came to meet me in Europe.  He forgot that since I don't have an EU passport that it would take longer for Me to get through customs.
his first words to Me after a six-week separation were 'You're late.'

!!
I sat down without touching him, told him to get me a drink then to walk around until his head was clear.
It was clear by the time he arrived with My lime and Perrier.  he realised that he was angry at the delay and worrying that something at happened, and that the way he chose to express it was completely wrong, as well as unempathetic since I was the one just off a 9-hr flight and a looooong line at customs.

Refreshed, W/we went to the hotel room where he could -- apologise--.  he understood how better to communicate his negative emotions,and I had all the orgasms for the next week.  Win/win.

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: Angry with Master - 3/1/2008 1:59:03 PM   
RCdc


Posts: 8674
Status: offline 		Hi blushes, I appriciate you responding.

quote:

Dark, what I meant was that it is easier to be submissive when your SO is not right there.
I know it is easier for me when HoneyMaster isn't here sometimes because He is not micro-managing me the way He can tend to do when He is here.


Absolutely cool for you - but that is for you.  It may be easier to be submissive when your SO is not right there for you and some others - but for myself and some others similar to me, it certainly doesn't become easier - it doesn't become harder either.  For some people it may.  But for me?  My submission isn't any harder or easier - it just is.  I don't switch off when he isn't around, I am submitting and serving regardless.  I do things I know he would desire.  I don't 'let my hair down' or become less of who I am -  my submission is still exactly how it is.  But then Darcy doesn't micromanage me, that isn't in our relationship and it isn't his fetish nor desire.  But Darcy isn't any different when I am with him, to when I am not.  We are the same people, regardless of who we are with and where we are.
 
So stating that being LDR is easier to be submissive is not correct for everyone.  I don't apologise for disliking and correcting being told how much easier it is for me to be submissive when Darcy is not here by someone who isn;t involved in our relationship.  I surmise and assume that you probably do not mean to - but that is basically what you have done.

quote:

It's just very different and much easier.


Great - for you -  but for me it isn't.

quote:

It's like imagining marriage and living it...In my imagination, we will live happily ever after, He will always be handsome, charming, kind and considerate, and I will be loving, dutiful, warm and beautiful....
Then along comes...
bills
sickness
um's
silly temper tantrums
misunderstandings
insecurity
and any multitude of things that make up every day life...
and that's when the hard work comes in.


And marriage to Darcy for me, is exactly how it is right now.  I do not simply dream or imagine.  I live the dream, I live the life I deserve.  All those you listed above - it what makes a relationship - If I dream simply 'happy ever after' that is a fantasy that is doomed to fail.  I am just one of those people who is a realist and maybe that is what is different between you and I.  I don't pretend.  I don't seek nor want perfection.  I live.
 
Again, I do appriciate that you responded, but earlier you were adament there is no one true way - now you are 'preaching it' (can't think of a better word I am afraid so please take no offense).  Please don't assume you know that when I was LDR with Darcy it was easier to submit - it might be for you, for others - but not for all.
 
the.dark.

_____________________________
RC&dc


love isnt gazing into each others eyes - it's looking forward in the same direction

(in reply to xxblushesxx)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Angry with Master - 3/1/2008 1:59:12 PM   
LaMspeach


Posts: 794
Joined: 12/4/2004
From: Philadelphia area, PA
Status: offline 		To the OP
I don’t get angry at Master for a few reasons. "I” end up feeling bad. I knew what I was getting into when I entered my relationship; he made sure my eyes were wide open. I know he tries his best and we aren’t perfect people living in a prefect world. He gives me what HE  wants to give me , when he wants to give it to me... anything else in my mind would mean that I had some control  and to be honest I don’t want that type of control. I derive comfort from knowing when he is giving me something it is because he wants to plan and simple.

I guess I am twue  wanna be slave- blow up doll also.... laugh I wish some one would let some of the air out my hips.

Edited to add… Master allows me to have whatever feelings I want to have. However I must be respectful and pick my timing while showing them.  I am encouraged to talk about feelings before they form into bad feelings like anger.  

< Message edited by LaMspeach -- 3/1/2008 2:36:54 PM >

_____________________________

peach ~ LordandMasters devoted alpha slave
"Only when the year has grown cold does one know that the pine and cypress are the last to wither"



(in reply to Tantriqu)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Angry with Master - 3/1/2008 1:59:38 PM   
awakenednj


Posts: 657
Joined: 2/10/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie
The OP did not say her dom told her it was wrong.  She asked others what their views are.

The OP did not say her dom is riding her hard or disrespecting her emotional limits.

The first accurate statement in your post is that we do not have enough information about the OP.




No- Sir did NOT tell me it was wrong to feel angry. He is not riding me hard or disrespecting my emotional limits. I don't know if he's appreciate me stating more in a public place... But he screwed up a little, then I screwed up a little, and now I'm punished.... I might not have screwed up if he hadn't first (which he stated he agreed wth me on) .... but I'm still punished.  I am angry (although less so now) because i have apparently earned my first punishment and I don't feel I did anything wrong.

This posed more questions in my mind-which is why i made the OP more broad. I didn't want to hear ONLY thoughts that apply to this specific incident.... which I do realize is relatively minor.

And BTW- I know it's thread about anger- but no fighting on my thread!!! LOL (couldn't resist saying it)

(in reply to ownedgirlie)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: Angry with Master - 3/1/2008 2:08:30 PM   
awakenednj


Posts: 657
Joined: 2/10/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: CelticPrince

Anger is not accelpted, disappointment is, If I have done something that was viewed as wrong by a sub, then she is expected to to advise me of such and why she is disappointed. After filtering that input, if she was correct in her view I would acknowlege that fact.

CP


I think I understand you. As has been pointed out- anger happens... but (correct me if I am misunderstanding) you expect your sub to examine her own emotions- filter herself-know herself- and gve back to you what is appropriate, not just the knee-jerk response.... Is that it? Disappointment in my life has always come after thinking something through... and then realizing it disappointed me. The intial reactions to the situation would be hurt or angry or afraid or whatever....

Am i understanding you?

(in reply to CelticPrince)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Angry with Master - 3/1/2008 2:14:20 PM   
colouredin


Posts: 4279
Joined: 2/2/2007
Status: offline 		A friend of mine has a hard time modifying her emotional reactions, she doesnt just feel them she instantly expresses them and hurt people around her, she doesnt meant to and she cant be held accountable for it she is having a crisis at the moment, but she has helped me to look at my own response to emotion, i very much internalise it normally have a debate with it in my head i weither reject it as irrational or let it fester. Though letting all your emotions carry you away as soon as you feel them can harm others hiding them all in boxes can harm you. Its a case of spotting the important ones, analyzing why you feel them, see what would make the situation better and then talking about it. Many things done in the heat of the moment are regretted later and its far better to identify what it is you think you need to help yourself, whether you can give it or you need to ask someone else for it.

_____________________________

Resident Lime(y) Tart
There would be no gossip without secrets
I don't want to be anything other than what I've been trying to be lately

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELvfMJoKDAk

(in reply to awakenednj)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: Angry with Master - 3/1/2008 2:22:02 PM   
BitaTruble


Posts: 9779
Joined: 1/12/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: awakenednj


But he screwed up a little, then I screwed up a little, and now I'm punished.... I might not have screwed up if he hadn't first (which he stated he agreed wth me on) .... but I'm still punished.  I am angry (although less so now) because i have apparently earned my first punishment and I don't feel I did anything wrong.



Awakened .. please read what I bolded. It's a contradiction with which you should try to come to terms. That he screwed up first is not relevant to your screw up and subsequent punishment for that screw up. His screw up is on him. Your screw up is on you. The dynamic you share is one in which 'you' garner punishment for screwing up. Is it fair? Perhaps not. Is fairness part of your dynamic? That's a question only you and he can answer. If you can, try to set aside his culpability in being the catalyst for your screw up and see if you can accept responsibility for your own part in screwing up.

You guys need to talk this through. I would ask him .. What lesson are you trying to teach with this punishment? How is this punishment going to teach me that lesson? What sort of behavior do you expect should this happen in the future? How should I handle it when a situation arises from your direct action that is worrisome or bothersome to me? Can you help me to process these sorts of situations so they are handled in a manner which will not negatively effect my ability to submit to you?

Good luck.

Celeste

_____________________________

"Oh, so it's just like
Rock, paper, scissors."

He laughed. "You are the wisest woman I know."


(in reply to awakenednj)
Profile   Post #: 50
RE: Angry with Master - 3/1/2008 2:28:40 PM   
RedMagic1


Posts: 6470
Joined: 5/10/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BitaTruble
It's a contradiction with which you should try to come to terms.

I agree.


_____________________________

Not with envy, not with a twisted heart, shall you feel superior, or go about boasting. Rather in goodness by action make true your song and your word. Thus you shall be highly regarded, and able to live in peace with all others.
- 15th century Aztec

(in reply to BitaTruble)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: Angry with Master - 3/1/2008 2:32:31 PM   
awakenednj


Posts: 657
Joined: 2/10/2008
Status: offline 		BitaTruble-

Thank you - and I understand what you are saying.... and i agree with it. I was having trouble finding a way to word that without giving specifics. I am being punished, I did do something less than optimal-despite it's root cause, and I do accept that. I don't FEEL I did anyhting worthy of punishment, but agreed in the beinging to his terms and that means his call. Just 'cause i understand didn't mean I didn't feel angry.

I only posted that much of the situation because i don't want anyone in a million years thinking badly of my Sir... and it looked like a little bit of assumption was happening...

But this is just the beginning for us... I kinda wanted to ponder the anger and other negative emotions and hear others thoughts before anything seriously difficult came up. 'Cause  it brought up a lot of other questions and way-to-possible situations in my mind.

< Message edited by awakenednj -- 3/1/2008 2:34:59 PM >

(in reply to BitaTruble)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: Angry with Master - 3/1/2008 2:52:45 PM   
Nineveh


Posts: 1299
Joined: 2/5/2008
Status: offline 		Obviously sometimes a sub or slave is going to be angry with her master.  To hide that and deny that it is happening is for her to keep some of herself from him and that would be wrong.  Now, of course, just because she is angry doesn't mean that she is going to get anapology, or anything else, but a good Dom should be able to handle the fact that he will make his sub angry sometyimes.  Sometimes he will make mistakes, and he should realize when he makes them even if he should not always admit that he has made a mitake immediately.  Now, after a sub has expressed her anger her master may require that she sit quietly, and she should do so, whether she is angry or not, but that does not mean that she should not be angry, or that she should not make her master aware of that fact.

(in reply to awakenednj)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Angry with Master - 3/1/2008 2:55:32 PM   
Aylee


Posts: 24103
Joined: 10/14/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Nineveh

Sometimes he will make mistakes, and he should realize when he makes them even if he should not always admit that he has made a mitake immediately. 


Why should he not admit it? 

_____________________________

Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam

I don’t always wgah’nagl fhtagn. But when I do, I ph’nglui mglw’nafh R’lyeh.

(in reply to Nineveh)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: Angry with Master - 3/1/2008 3:06:06 PM   
Nineveh


Posts: 1299
Joined: 2/5/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

quote:

ORIGINAL: Nineveh

Sometimes he will make mistakes, and he should realize when he makes them even if he should not always admit that he has made a mitake immediately. 


Why should he not admit it? 


Immediately?  There often are occasions where it is best to examine mistakes that were made after the current situation is resolved, rather than in the middle of it.  Taking the time to aknowledge and analyze a mistake could easily break topspace/subspace.  This is assuming it is a relatively minor mistake of course.

(in reply to Aylee)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: Angry with Master - 3/1/2008 3:30:25 PM   
Lumus


Posts: 5968
Joined: 9/16/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: awakenednj

Is being angry with your Sir a completely unacceptable thing? What do you do if your sub/slave is angry with you? (Especially if you know you could have handled something slightly better....) Any thoughts on the topic of anger towards the dominant would be welcome...


As previously stated, you're entitled to be upset; it's what you do with that feeling - how you express it - that determines how you're treated in turn.

I stop, listen, consider what she's saying [is she repeating herself or working towards a point?], and weigh her reasoning against what actually happened.  If she's repeating herself, I calm her down until she can make coherent points.  If she makes good points, I acknowledge them.

Whether her points are good or not, I respond with my own thoughts in parallel with hers, so she knows precisely the reason for my displeasure.  Then we discuss the issue and an agreement is met, which sometimes involves punishment, sometimes not.

I'm not perfect.  Neither is my girl.  As long as we work towards mutual understanding, I'm content.


< Message edited by Lumus -- 3/1/2008 3:31:34 PM >

_____________________________

<Talk to educate; listen to learn.>

~ the other half of "L&L" ~

I have been dubbed the Rainmaker. Do not make me take your water for my tribe.

(in reply to awakenednj)
Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Angry with Master - 3/1/2008 3:37:06 PM   
PanthersMom


Posts: 2215
Joined: 11/26/2007
From: Cleveland Ohio
Status: offline 		1-anger is normal, you are human and have feelings no matter what your role
2-if there is a problem, communication is always better than silence
3-if a dominant made an error, they shold apologize and repair the situation and the sub should accept the fact that the dominant is human and has off days too.

why do subs feel they aren't supposed to feel anger or disappointment or anything negative in connection with their dominant?  i have never understood the concept.  submissive isn't dead or inhuman.  if there are no ups and downs in a relationship, there is no life, no passion, no soul.  a relationship without emotion is fake.
PM

_____________________________

That which does not kill me, better run pretty damn fast

I miss my ex, but my aim is improving!




(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: Angry with Master - 3/1/2008 3:44:26 PM   
SummerWind


Posts: 314
Joined: 7/4/2007
Status: offline 		Please give an example of what you are mad about.......

(in reply to awakenednj)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: Angry with Master - 3/1/2008 5:24:09 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline 		And I thank Awakened for bringing such a poingant issue to the table and showing how Ds does not in any way allow us to avoid these issues or be any less complex just because one person is in authority and the other isn't.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to SummerWind)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: Angry with Master - 3/1/2008 6:38:34 PM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline 		Anger is an emotion. If he were to tell me that I was not allowed to be angry at him he would be telling me that I am not allowed to feel what is inside of me. He does not tell me what to feel, what he does do is tell me what is an inappropriate display of my emotions. He has taught me a great deal about how to handle anger, mostly by his example. We have been seeing each other for going on two years... in that time we have been angry at each other. How we show that anger is the important thing. Yelling at him is never allowed. Being disrespectful is never allowed. Telling him I am upset and need time to process  what I feel is the appropriate way to act. I have learned to recognize the rise in emotions that lead to saying things I may regret or doing things that I may regret. I have come a long way in the appropriate way to process anger.

I went through a period of needing to learn how to manage my anger before I met my Daddy. I was depressed and I aimed a lot of anger in at myself instead of acknowledging who I was angry with and why I was angry with them. I vented my anger in inappropriate ways. If I began dating a dom that told me I was not allowed to be angry at him, I would probably laugh at him and tell him he was completely wrong for me. No one would make me take a step back into being depressed and out of touch with my emotions. To be honest I think it is abusive to a person to make them deny their feelings... just my opinion.

Now I have to end this post as Daddy has just told me that I will be spending the night in the closet pondering my emotional outbursts


_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to awakenednj)
Profile   Post #: 60
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