TPE=Trust, Responsibility, Commitment (Full Version)

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MistressVnus -> TPE=Trust, Responsibility, Commitment (3/13/2008 12:17:35 PM)

I'm not really sure why I'm starting this thread.  But feel an inspiration.  Probably from all the posts regarding misuse of Dominance, wayward slaves, and the like.

I was mentored in a way where I was taught that to be Dominant wasn't just about control, or taking, or "playing."
It was serious.  It was a huge responsibility to take a slave, or sub, or Alpha, or Princess, or Prince.  Whatever you want to call the person who is conceding their will to you.  It meant that they are trusting you with their well being and that it is my responsibility to insure that their well being is maintained.  Mentally, physically, spiritually.  It meant that someone is trusting Me with their life.  Looking to me for guidance, training, and trusting that some of the paces I put them through will make them a better person, all the way around.  Even if they don't see it at the time. And, it meant having my own ducks in a row in order to do so.  So, should we ever part, there isn't a bad thing one could say in regards to My integrity, trustworthyness, or taking the responsibility of their well being lightly.

It meant that I must stay aware.  Know when to push.  Know when to back off.  Recognize a boundary, even though it has been unspoken.  That I am being trusted to have the skill, and connection, to see it.  It doesn't need to be said.  And, also trusting that if something does need to be said, that I am listening.  It means that the one who has relinquised their will to me is trusting that I will have their best interest at heart.  Even if I make a mistake.  And, that even when they may make a mistake, they will endure correction,  not abandonment.

My mentor taught me what to look for in a slave.  He taught me how to pick their brain.  Find the vulnerabilites.  Find their sensitive spots.  Tread carefully around those spots.  And to recognize when a slave is suffering in a way that is not conducive to my goals for "us" but is unwilling, or afraid, to speak up for fear of displeasing me.

I was taught that as much as I expect my slave to commit, that I, too, am committing.  Just as deeply.  It isn't a game.
There are needs we are fulfilling for each other that the outside world doesn't understand.  And through this, we tighten the binds.  We grow.  We make mistakes.  We process our struggles privately to maintain each others dignity.  We forgive.  We move on to the next step.  But most importantly, we stick to our committments.  We maintain our integrity.  We maintain our honor.

If we do that.  No matter what happens....neither one would ever walk away in an undesired light. Or, feeling they weren't good enough, or sub enough, or Dominant enough, or human enough.  That we loved, fulfilled, and brought enlightenment to each other.  No matter how short, or long, the time together may be, for whatever reason, it would be a time that neither party would ever have wished they hadn't experienced.

I am not great.  I am not famous.  I am not rich.  But if I can leave this legacy with those who've choosen to surrender their will to me....well, then....just maybe....I am.

What does a TPE mean to you?  What do you see as the essential elements for a sound foundation to a TPE relationship?  Whether you be one taking the will or surrendering the will, what is your ideal TPE relationship?  What do you hope it brings to you?  What do you hope to impart to the other?  What do you hope to fulfill for yourself and your counterpart?  How would you want it to end, if it did?




thetammyjo -> RE: TPE=Trust, Responsibility, Commitment (3/13/2008 1:15:13 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MistressVnus

What does a TPE mean to you? What do you see as the essential elements for a sound foundation to a TPE relationship? Whether you be one taking the will or surrendering the will, what is your ideal TPE relationship? What do you hope it brings to you? What do you hope to impart to the other? What do you hope to fulfill for yourself and your counterpart? How would you want it to end, if it did?


My gut level reaction to your question is that I don't believe in TPE.

I don't think it is healthy for any adult human being to give up all of their power nor do I think that is it realistic.

I have authority from my slave and he happens to be a fairly powerful individual. I expect him to use that power for me, for him, for our family, and I have the responsibility at times, when I choose, to decide how his power, mine, and ours is used.

I hope our dynamic helps each of us become the best possible person we can become. If that journey continues then it is a good thing. Should our 24/7 ever interfere with that, then the dynamic is best ended.

I don't fantasize about how such things end because I've had several different experiences and I know that I cannot realisticly control everything so I can't honestly predict an ending scenario. I know which ones worked best for me but I am not the only person of concern.




Ostentatious -> RE: TPE=Trust, Responsibility, Commitment (3/13/2008 1:23:55 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MistressVnus

What does a TPE mean to you?


Nothing really.  I think it's unrealistic.  I think I'm with Tammy Jo.




PsyVamp -> RE: TPE=Trust, Responsibility, Commitment (3/13/2008 1:30:33 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MistressVnus

to be Dominant wasn't just about control, or taking, or "playing."
It was serious.  It was a huge responsibility to take a slave, or sub, or Alpha, or Princess, or Prince.  Whatever you want to call the person who is conceding their will to you.  It meant that they are trusting you with their well being and that it is my responsibility to insure that their well being is maintained.  Mentally, physically, spiritually.  It meant that someone is trusting Me with their life.  Looking to me for guidance, training, and trusting that some of the paces I put them through will make them a better person, all the way around.  Even if they don't see it at the time. And, it meant having my own ducks in a row in order to do so.  So, should we ever part, there isn't a bad thing one could say in regards to My integrity, trustworthyness, or taking the responsibility of their well being lightly.

It meant that I must stay aware.  Know when to push.  Know when to back off.  Recognize a boundary, even though it has been unspoken.  That I am being trusted to have the skill, and connection, to see it.  It doesn't need to be said.  And, also trusting that if something does need to be said, that I am listening.  It means that the one who has relinquised their will to me is trusting that I will have their best interest at heart.  Even if I make a mistake.  And, that even when they may make a mistake, they will endure correction,  not abandonment.

Find the vulnerabilites.  Find their sensitive spots.  Tread carefully around those spots.  And to recognize when a slave is suffering in a way that is not conducive to my goals for "us" but is unwilling, or afraid, to speak up for fear of displeasing me.

I was taught that as much as I expect my slave to commit, that I, too, am committing.  Just as deeply.  It isn't a game.
There are needs we are fulfilling for each other that the outside world doesn't understand.  And through this, we tighten the binds.  We grow.  We make mistakes.  We process our struggles privately to maintain each others dignity.  We forgive.  We move on to the next step.  But most importantly, we stick to our committments.  We maintain our integrity.  We maintain our honor.

If we do that.  No matter what happens....neither one would ever walk away in an undesired light. Or, feeling they weren't good enough, or sub enough, or Dominant enough, or human enough.  That we loved, fulfilled, and brought enlightenment to each other.  No matter how short, or long, the time together may be, for whatever reason, it would be a time that neither party would ever have wished they hadn't experienced.

What does a TPE mean to you?  What do you see as the essential elements for a sound foundation to a TPE relationship?  Whether you be one taking the will or surrendering the will, what is your ideal TPE relationship?  What do you hope it brings to you?  What do you hope to impart to the other?  What do you hope to fulfill for yourself and your counterpart?  How would you want it to end, if it did?


*sighs*

I do so love to hear from others who take it to the same level of commitment that I believe in.  Thank you for starting this thread, no matter where it goes.  It reminds me that there are others who believe there is so much more than just playing.

I need the commitment to the dynamic, the willingness of the submissive (by whatever name) to follow my lead, to trust me completely.  I need to be true to myself, to know when to push buttons and to know when to back away.
If one comes to me, it is always my hope that should they leave, they will be in a much better position in life than they were at their arrival. 
In my dynamic at this time, I can honestly say that if he were to leave today (even though he has a long way to go) he would still be in a much better position to make a better life for himself than he was when he came into my life.

To me, this means that yes, I must have my "ducks in a row".  I do not believe one can be a Master (by whatever name) if one cannot take care of ones self first.  How can you take care of another if you can't take care of yourself? 

This does not imply that a physical disability would prevent a person from being a good Master.   A person bound to a wheelchair can still be a Master, given the resources (ie mental/emotional/financial etc) to handle their own life with minimum interference from others.
Yes, bad luck hits all of us from time to time.  Temporary set backs aren't what I refer to in the above paragraphs. 

Here is an example.  If one doesn't have any means of income, no place to live, no viable skills but is pushy and demanding.. that does not make one a Master.  Being able to top does not make one a Master.

I could go on and on, but in the end, it is really only my own moral code- to each his own.  I hold myself to certain standards, not ever to perfection though.  I make enough mistakes of my own, and I own up to each and every one of them. 

I guess I could blame the porn industry, lol, for making D/s or M/s all about sex.  I didn't learn from the porn industry though so for me, if any playing has a sexual overtone, it is a side effect as opposed to the main purpose.
M/s, on the other hand, is not playing.  It is a way of life for me.

I hope that makes some kind of sense.

Lady Jag






MistressVnus -> RE: TPE=Trust, Responsibility, Commitment (3/13/2008 1:37:08 PM)

I can see your point.
However, I think there are relationships, all over the place, where one gives up their power.  Look at abusive relationships.  That person has absolutely relinquished their power.  And honestly believe they have no choice.
Only in that instance, it was taken, not given.  And that is only one example.  If you need, I can site more.

I think a person like that has an unfulfilled need to be controlled, to please.  And, to be appreciated for it.  Unfortunately, their attributes are often misused against them instead of "for them" by a person who understands, and appreciates, those attributes.

I think it is very real.  TPE is very real.  Just not always, consentual.




Ostentatious -> RE: TPE=Trust, Responsibility, Commitment (3/13/2008 1:40:00 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: PsyVamp


*sighs*

I do so love to hear from others who take it to the same level of commitment that I believe in.  Thank you for starting this thread, no matter where it goes.  It reminds me that there are others who believe there is so much more than just playing.

Lady Jag



I think it's very wrong to suggest someone who doesn't believe in TPE is just a player.  I think that is completely ignorant if truth be told.  Not very open minded of you is it.




PsyVamp -> RE: TPE=Trust, Responsibility, Commitment (3/13/2008 1:41:34 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ostentatious

quote:

ORIGINAL: PsyVamp


*sighs*

I do so love to hear from others who take it to the same level of commitment that I believe in.  Thank you for starting this thread, no matter where it goes.  It reminds me that there are others who believe there is so much more than just playing.

Lady Jag



I think it's very wrong to suggest someone who doesn't believe in TPE is just a player.  I think that is completely ignorant if truth be told.  Not very open minded of you is it.



Is there anything in my quote that says "someone who doesn't believe in TPE is just a player"?  I didn't even make mention of the words...

Please read what is written instead of what you think you see




Pyrrsefanie -> RE: TPE=Trust, Responsibility, Commitment (3/13/2008 1:42:09 PM)

I've given thought to what it would be like to have a TPE relationship.  Real, serious, deep thought.

I agree with what Tammy Jo and Ostentatious have both said, that it seems unrealistic, for a couple of reasons.

Firstly, I don't know if this is a common thing or if it's just me, but it takes a lot out of me mentally (and sometimes physically) to dominate, especially for an extended period of time, say a few days non-stop.  After that point I really just need some recovery time, a break from it all.  I don't hand control over to my pet, but I don't really focus on the D/s part of things... more like I just enjoy his company and spending time just being myself with him.  I couldn't imagine a TPE where it's absolutely non-stop, no downtime to relax and come down off of my cloud... I don't have the strength for it!

Then there's the fact that my darling pet is also my best friend.  I couldn't imagine not being able to just sit on the couch with him sometimes and watch stupid movies, crack stupid jokes, play videogames, go out on the town and just be ourselves... I fell in love with him in the first place for who he is underneath all the kinky fun, and I would truly despair over losing the ability to have that during our goofball times.

I'm not really qualified to argue about the safety or sanity of an adult giving up complete control to another person... but I can say that it's not something I, personally, would be happy about.  I guess I'd be flattered that my slave trusted me that much, but I'd still have to decline.

Despite all of that... I think that there definitely should be a good, strong trust component to any play.  Responsibility as well for that other person's safety and well-being, if only for a short time.  Commitment is where it can go either way -- some people just want to have fun once in a while and not treat it as anything serious, which I don't think is necessarily a bad thing if both parties understand that it does not designate a relationship and agree to those terms.  Then there are others, like me, who are fairly monogamous creatures that mate for life.  I don't think one form or another is superior or inferior.

For the people who have experience with TPE, enjoy it, and can make it work for them... I say more power to you, and may you have a long happy life with your other.  :)

Just my two cents~

xoxo
Pyrrsefanie




Ostentatious -> RE: TPE=Trust, Responsibility, Commitment (3/13/2008 1:43:39 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: PsyVamp


Is there anything in my quote that says "someone who doesn't believe in TPE is just a player"?  I didn't even make mention of the words...

Please read what is written instead of what you think you see




Not a player as in 'I have many girlfriends'.  A player as in 'someone whose only interested in play'.

Keep up, I kept your own words for you to read...

My point stands and is unanswered.





MistressVnus -> RE: TPE=Trust, Responsibility, Commitment (3/13/2008 1:43:53 PM)

I was gonna say the same thing, PsyVamp.  But, you need no help.  *smile*

BTW...did we go to different schools together?  *wink*




PsyVamp -> RE: TPE=Trust, Responsibility, Commitment (3/13/2008 1:50:22 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MistressVnus

I was gonna say the same thing, PsyVamp.  But, you need no help.  *smile*

BTW...did we go to different schools together?  *wink*



We may have..lol. 
Seems people get offended by things that aren't there.. it will always be that way I suppose. 

quote:


Not a player as in 'I have many girlfriends'.  A player as in 'someone whose only interested in play'.

Keep up, I kept your own words for you to read...

My point stands and is unanswered.


I answered you.  End of story.
But, if you need more clarification:  I said that there can be more to this life than playing. 

I cannot help it if you read words that don't exist.





MistressVnus -> RE: TPE=Trust, Responsibility, Commitment (3/13/2008 1:50:28 PM)

quote:

Not a player as in 'I have many girlfriends'.  A player as in 'someone whose only interested in play'.


I can't speak for PsyVamp.  But I know that in my original post I was referring to it being more than play more along the lines of  "causal play."  You know, we do TPE for this hour and call it TPE, for this hour.  Or, I can take a slave, and make them do all sorts of things I want without understanding the responsibility of it all.

I know that I did not mean a "player" as in the meaning of someone who just likes to make numerous conquests and notches in their belt. 

Did someone push a button here?




MistressVnus -> RE: TPE=Trust, Responsibility, Commitment (3/13/2008 1:52:54 PM)

quote:

Seems people get offended by things that aren't there.. it will always be that way I suppose.


Oh, it's there.  It's just that they told on themselves rather than someone was blatently pointing it out.  *chuckle*




Ostentatious -> RE: TPE=Trust, Responsibility, Commitment (3/13/2008 1:54:14 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: PsyVamp

I answered you.  End of story.
But, if you need more clarification:  I said that there can be more to this life than playing. 

I cannot help it if you read words that don't exist.



You suggested to somehow be more serious you had to believe in TPE.  It's plain as day and narrow-minded.

End of story.




Ostentatious -> RE: TPE=Trust, Responsibility, Commitment (3/13/2008 1:56:45 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MistressVnus

quote:

Not a player as in 'I have many girlfriends'.  A player as in 'someone whose only interested in play'.


I can't speak for PsyVamp.  But I know that in my original post I was referring to it being more than play more along the lines of  "causal play."  You know, we do TPE for this hour and call it TPE, for this hour.  Or, I can take a slave, and make them do all sorts of things I want without understanding the responsibility of it all.

I know that I did not mean a "player" as in the meaning of someone who just likes to make numerous conquests and notches in their belt. 

Did someone push a button here?



You've misunderstood what I said, as I think I may have misunderstood you.

I don't view TPE as something to be done for an hour which led to my initial disagreement.

TPE doesn't mean for an hour, TPE by definition is TOTAL from my understanding, meaning control of everything.

Possibly my bad, possibly not.




MistressVnus -> RE: TPE=Trust, Responsibility, Commitment (3/13/2008 1:59:39 PM)

quote:

Firstly, I don't know if this is a common thing or if it's just me, but it takes a lot out of me mentally (and sometimes physically) to dominate, especially for an extended period of time, say a few days non-stop.  After that point I really just need some recovery time, a break from it all.  I don't hand control over to my pet, but I don't really focus on the D/s part of things... more like I just enjoy his company and spending time just being myself with him.  I couldn't imagine a TPE where it's absolutely non-stop, no downtime to relax and come down off of my cloud... I don't have the strength for it!

Then there's the fact that my darling pet is also my best friend.  I couldn't imagine not being able to just sit on the couch with him sometimes and watch stupid movies, crack stupid jokes, play videogames, go out on the town and just be ourselves... I fell in love with him in the first place for who he is underneath all the kinky fun, and I would truly despair over losing the ability to have that during our goofball times.


See.  This is why I think I started this thread.  Because I wanted to see how everyone interprets what a TPE is!!
To me, that's where the trust comes in.  That I see it is time for "down-time" and my slave trusts me to see that.  And, we can have fun, be silly, and do all sorts of other activities w/o loosing our dynamic.  Without him/her forgetting to say Mistress, or asking if I need anything.  To me, TPE doesn't mean we are constantly engaged in "scene" activites but, rather that we maintain a "mindset" of the psychodynamics we have comitted to.




Ostentatious -> RE: TPE=Trust, Responsibility, Commitment (3/13/2008 2:02:33 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MistressVnus

See.  This is why I think I started this thread.  Because I wanted to see how everyone interprets what a TPE is!!
To me, that's where the trust comes in.  That I see it is time for "down-time" and my slave trusts me to see that.  And, we can have fun, be silly, and do all sorts of other activities w/o loosing our dynamic.  Without him/her forgetting to say Mistress, or asking if I need anything.  To me, TPE doesn't mean we are constantly engaged in "scene" activites but, rather that we maintain a "mindset" of the psychodynamics we have comitted to.



I don't think you're describing TPE.  Total Power Exchange means you give control of every part of your life, your well-being and your needs to someone else.

What you're talking about, from my understanding is just a normal Ds dynamic where respect is paramount at all times.

Personally, I think it has nothing to do with TPE at all.

However, as you say, it's all about our accepted definitions.




PsyVamp -> RE: TPE=Trust, Responsibility, Commitment (3/13/2008 2:07:05 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pyrrsefanie



Then there's the fact that my darling pet is also my best friend.  I couldn't imagine not being able to just sit on the couch with him sometimes and watch stupid movies, crack stupid jokes, play videogames, go out on the town and just be ourselves... I fell in love with him in the first place for who he is underneath all the kinky fun, and I would truly despair over losing the ability to have that during our goofball times.

I'm not really qualified to argue about the safety or sanity of an adult giving up complete control to another person... but I can say that it's not something I, personally, would be happy about.  I guess I'd be flattered that my slave trusted me that much, but I'd still have to decline.

xoxo
Pyrrsefanie



This is interesting... my pet and I do all these things, sometimes our life is so "vanilla" it would be difficult for an outsider to think anything else of our dynamic.
The power exchange exists because he is my submissive .  I have not taken away his right to an opinion - he is rather strong minded (read stubborn if you will..lol).  He has a say in just about anything.  It just so happens that I reserve the right to override any decisions that I wish.

My pet can always question any decision I make, and I will listen to his words.  If he has a valid point, I have no problems changing my mind, if it is in the best interest of the household. 

Here is an example.  He needs to go to school and learn a trade or get a degree.  I will enable him to do so, but I will not pick the subject.  The subject of his studies is his decision because it will have an effect on the rest of his life-even the life he will have when I am no longer his Mistress.  He has no choice in whether or not to go to school, but he does have a choice in the degree/trade.

The bottom line is this.  I make the decisions with the input that he provides in mind. 




thetammyjo -> RE: TPE=Trust, Responsibility, Commitment (3/13/2008 2:10:24 PM)

For me, the idea of TPE ignores some realities of life. It isn't a matter of me needing a break from being the dominant, just my recognition that I own a slave, an adult slave, not a child, so he can and should be able to take care of himself and that means he needs to have some power.

Even if we are watching television I am still the owner and he is still my property but I know better than to think I have all of his power. Commitment does not equal TPE for me simply because I don't believe in that TPE concept.

I think even the most kinky dynamics require the same to flourish as any other human relationship -- commitment to work things out, honesty, communication, building trust, mutual needs and desires, willingness to grow, and flexibility to adjust to life. The rest is a matter of time, how long can you help it work, and are you strong enough to let go if it isn't working.




PsyVamp -> RE: TPE=Trust, Responsibility, Commitment (3/13/2008 2:10:47 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ostentatious

quote:

ORIGINAL: MistressVnus

quote:

Not a player as in 'I have many girlfriends'.  A player as in 'someone whose only interested in play'.


I can't speak for PsyVamp.  But I know that in my original post I was referring to it being more than play more along the lines of  "causal play."  You know, we do TPE for this hour and call it TPE, for this hour.  Or, I can take a slave, and make them do all sorts of things I want without understanding the responsibility of it all.

I know that I did not mean a "player" as in the meaning of someone who just likes to make numerous conquests and notches in their belt. 

Did someone push a button here?



You've misunderstood what I said, as I think I may have misunderstood you.

I don't view TPE as something to be done for an hour which led to my initial disagreement.

TPE doesn't mean for an hour, TPE by definition is TOTAL from my understanding, meaning control of everything.

Possibly my bad, possibly not.



So does this mean you are done arguing about something that I never said?




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