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RE: Contradictory Dogma - 3/19/2008 1:13:53 PM

Lordandmaster

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That link you posted (which, incidentally, was a link to the well-known scientific site called fucking WIKIPEDIA) stated that it is impossible to know how many viable fetuses have been aborted because viability varies from one pregnancy to another. Besides, many late-term abortions are medically indicated: the fetus has virtually no chance of survival, and can only harm the mother. I don't like the idea of ELECTIVE late-term abortion (so in that respect I guess I'm even more conservative than you are--yay, imagine that), but there are medically exigent cases where it would be insane not to intervene. The whole thing is a red herring.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

As to nobody being capable a settling my hypothetical wager, the link I posted (#102) estimated the US number for 1997 at slightly over 1000 post-viability abortions. Even if the outlawing of a particular procedure reduced that number by 90% (a very generous estimate), that is still more than twice the number of executions in 2007 . The '97 number is about 13 times the number of US executions in '98. Still no comparisons to be made?

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RE: Contradictory Dogma - 3/19/2008 6:20:01 PM

TheHeretic

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster

That link you posted (which, incidentally, was a link to the well-known scientific site called fucking WIKIPEDIA)

         Do you have any idea how many of the Google hits for that were to right-wing/fundamentalist sites? Would you have preferred one of those? Wiki at least sourced the statistic in question to a pro-choice organization. Sometimes you just default to the easy one. I don't see you complaining about the one you quoted.

      Talk about red herrings...



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RE: Contradictory Dogma - 3/19/2008 7:48:19 PM

TheHeretic

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quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

(2) There is an alternative to execution, life imprisonment without parole.

Where there is life, there is hope, DC. The people who commit the most horrible crimes deserve to have that taken as well. Warehousing sociopathic violent predators, and sending them a steady supply of young, dumb, victims who got busted selling weed isn't good enough.

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RE: Contradictory Dogma - 3/19/2008 7:54:37 PM

Real_Trouble

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

(2) There is an alternative to execution, life imprisonment without parole.

Where there is life, there is hope, DC. The people who commit the most horrible crimes deserve to have that taken as well. Warehousing sociopathic violent predators, and sending them a steady supply of young, dumb, victims who got busted selling weed isn't good enough.

This seems like a straw-man response to me; the quote you reference is not advocating, necessarily, our specific system of life imprisonment. Rather, it references the possibility of some form of life imprisonment.

In the same way, I would state that I certainly support forms of a death penalty, but I do not support our current usage or legal structure surrounding our death penalty.

Likewise, to rebut your specific comment there, I would point out that the most common factors between individuals on death row are as follows:

- Poor
- Minority
- Uneducated

Does this mean that, if you are arguing against life imprisonment for these individuals as we currently have it, that you're okay with educated white violent predatory sociopaths having a steady supply of victims, but not black / latino / asian uneducated ones?

A cheap shot, clearly; I do not suggest this is your view, but this is my point about your argument as well.

Edit - Punctuation.

< Message edited by Real_Trouble -- 3/19/2008 7:55:40 PM >

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RE: Contradictory Dogma - 3/19/2008 8:41:28 PM

TracyTaken

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quote:

This seems like a straw-man response to me;

It seemed nonsensical to me. The straw man makes his own kinda sense, however illogical.

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RE: Contradictory Dogma - 3/19/2008 8:45:39 PM

TheHeretic

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Real_Trouble

Does this mean that, if you are arguing against life imprisonment for these individuals as we currently have it, that you're okay with educated white violent predatory sociopaths having a steady supply of victims, but not black / latino / asian uneducated ones?

Not at all, Troub. Actually, if you click the link LaM quoted at the top of the page(not wiki), you'll find the majority on death row are white. That doesn't alter that blacks are on death row and in our prisons in disproportionate numbers to the general population, of course. If they have commited the crime, I don't care if they're purple. Neither should the needle/noose/cynanide gas.

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