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how can i serve my DOM better ? - 10/1/2005 4:42:53 AM

lmystery21901

Posts: 5
Joined: 9/7/2005
Status: offline

WE/we are new to this lifestyle. i am very submissive to HIM when it comes to the physical acts i am more than willing, but when it comes to the simple things in day to day life it is harder for me, examples saying SIR outside of a scene or off the computer, asking HIM to do things that i should be more than willing to do, like closing the bedroom door becouse HE is closer. mind YOU/you my DOM puts me in my place, but i still have problems, not as far as not wanting to, just adjusting to the newness of it all. WE/we were in a vanilla marriage for 13 years so it was for the most part always equal. now that we embarked on this journey i am wanting to submit to HIM completely, even outside of a scene. any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Post #: 1

RE: how can i serve my DOM better ? - 10/1/2005 5:10:20 AM

Rover

Posts: 2634
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline

The only answers to this question that have any relevance to your relationship are those from your Dominant. No one else can know what he wants, likes or dislikes.

I suggest that you sit down (frequently) to discuss the various ways in which he discovers that he'd like you to serve him.

John

(in reply to lmystery21901)

Post #: 2

RE: how can i serve my DOM better ? - 10/1/2005 5:22:24 AM

CanisMajor

Posts: 42
Joined: 9/2/2005
Status: offline

This is the sort of thing that I think can take some time. You shouldn't expect to change your habits quickly. That said, there are probably a few things you can do to help yourself along. One thing is to act a little more self-consciously, giving some thought and consideration to what you are about to do or say in advance. My partner and I have found that a lot of old habits are just ingrained, and at first you have to be vigilant if you want to overcome them.

Another useful thing to do might be to think about why your habits are as they are. My partner had a bit of a stumbling block over calling people "sir," because she thought that it was a word loaded with a significance that (in my opinion) it doesn't have. We discussed that, and I explained that I thought it was merely a respectful form of address, and that everyone deserves respect until they've done something to lose it - so why not use the word? It is only politeness. This sort of thing may not have anything to do with you, of course - it is just an example from our life about one of these surprisingly difficult things. In any case, figuring out the reasons things are as they are can sometimes help you when it comes time to make adjustments.

Finally, I have to say that there are certain things which drastically improve my partner's attitude and behaviour overall. In her day to day living, she reacts very well to having me set the schedule and goals for the day, and does better if I keep that to myself and issue frequent orders to keep us on the right track than if I give her a core dump at the beginning of the day for her to follow on her own. She responds well to supervision when she's doing things - I'm not talking about standing over her watching her do stuff, but I do frequently inspect what she's up to and tell her whether she's doing a good job. But most of all, I think her overall attitude for the day is benefited most by a ritual at the beginning and end of the day in which I spend ten minutes or so ordering her around. This might involve trivial service tasks, or telling her to assume different positions, or ordering her to change her hair a few times, or whatever. The ritual isn't about what she does; it is about her taking orders and getting a little exercise of her submissive nature. Everything that she finds symbolic and meaningful that we can cram into this ritual is included - for example, she wears nothing but a collar, and she starts by kneeling.

Will any of this stuff help you? I have no idea. But it has worked for us. Feel free to adapt anything that works to your use and throw out anything that doesn't.

_____________________________

The Big Dog

(in reply to lmystery21901)

Post #: 3

RE: how can i serve my DOM better ? - 10/1/2005 5:28:15 AM

iamMasters

Posts: 65
Joined: 5/16/2005
Status: offline

Imystery I know how you feel and what you mean, going through the same situation ourselves, but I haven't got the answers.

CanisMajor, I like you suggestions and will show your post to Master for his comments.

(in reply to CanisMajor)

Post #: 4

RE: how can i serve my DOM better ? - 10/1/2005 6:05:43 AM

EmeraldSlave2

Posts: 3645
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

Be patient and work on focus.

Every submissive starts out saying they have no patience. In two years they've either learned to be patient or they don't call themselves submissive anymore.

You're new, youmake the most mistakes and have the hardest times when you're just starting out. Keep yourself focused, take this time to enjoy and experiment. Some people use rituals, some people use talking, some people just ride out the frenzy.

Just do what feels more like being you.

(in reply to lmystery21901)

Post #: 5

RE: how can i serve my DOM better ? - 10/1/2005 7:51:27 AM

perfection20005

Posts: 419
Joined: 4/20/2005
Status: offline

Everything to do with the lifestyle is very new to both of you, so just give it time. It won't happen overnight. You might not realize it now, but you are learning from your mistakes, or else you wouldn't have posted on here! Good luck to both of you.

_____________________________

perfection

"I took one look at Him, and I knew He was my Master."

(in reply to lmystery21901)

Post #: 6

RE: how can i serve my DOM better ? - 10/1/2005 9:41:06 AM

ImpGrrl

Posts: 575
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

quote:

My partner had a bit of a stumbling block over calling people "sir," because she thought that it was a word loaded with a significance that (in my opinion) it doesn't have. We discussed that, and I explained that I thought it was merely a respectful form of address, and that everyone deserves respect until they've done something to lose it - so why not use the word? It is only politeness.

This logic only works if *all* men/masculine-ID'd women (who have stated that they prefer it) are called "sir" - not just d-types.

If it's just d-types that are being called "sir", then the logic fails.

I've seen that "logic" used a lot by people who mean "all d-types" when they say "all people" in that statement - I'm not saying *you're* saying that.

H

(in reply to CanisMajor)

Post #: 7

RE: how can i serve my DOM better ? - 10/1/2005 9:55:57 AM

thetammyjo

Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline

Imystery21901:

Did you jump into 24/7 or have you eased into it?

The answer I think will help you determine had to progress.

_____________________________

Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips & Chains,

TammyJo

Check out my website at http://www.thetammyjo.com Or www.tammyjoeckhart.com

And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

(in reply to lmystery21901)

Post #: 8

RE: how can i serve my DOM better ? - 10/1/2005 10:09:28 AM

IronBear

Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: lmystery21901

WE/we are new to this lifestyle. i am very submissive to HIM when it comes to the physical acts i am more than willing, but when it comes to the simple things in day to day life it is harder for me, examples saying SIR outside of a scene or off the computer, asking HIM to do things that i should be more than willing to do, like closing the bedroom door becouse HE is closer. mind YOU/you my DOM puts me in my place, but i still have problems, not as far as not wanting to, just adjusting to the newness of it all. WE/we were in a vanilla marriage for 13 years so it was for the most part always equal. now that we embarked on this journey i am wanting to submit to HIM completely, even outside of a scene. any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

G'day lass,

Trueth is that like starting anything new you are going to get confused, frustrated, bewildered and at times down right angry. If you are both new to this, I'd hazzard a guess that your Master is feeling similar. I know I did, I read and talked to people on the phone and on messanger. they taught me but it wasn'y till I had a visit from a Gorean Master and his slave that I suddenly saw all I had been learning fall into place. It was embarassing at first when I visited friends and slaves would kneel and call me Master. I was green in the lifestyle (but it also felt jolly good too).

The best advise I can give you is to be patient. You are like the kids in their first few weeks a school for the first time. Everything is so different to what you are used to. These forums are a great place to read, learn and ask questions. If your Master is willing, it may do him the world of good for his own development to visit here too. If you are going to scenes, you may find people who you can strike up a friendship with so both of you can get mentors. That would be a huge help. personally I do like placing a new submissive with a trusted and experienced one to help her over the newness and give personal insights from experience. Masters can gain so much this way too.

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to lmystery21901)

Post #: 9

RE: how can i serve my DOM better ? - 10/1/2005 10:56:25 AM

Lordandmaster

Posts: 10943
Joined: 6/22/2004
Status: offline

Going from a long-term vanilla relationship to a master-slave relationship WITH THE SAME PERSON is one of the most difficult things to do. The fact that you're aware of the problems is the most important point. Failing because you're not aware of why you are failing is much more difficult to overcome than failing for reasons that you understand.

I'd advise you to make sure he understands your sincerity, and to ask him to correct you whenever it is necessary.

(in reply to lmystery21901)

Post #: 10

RE: how can i serve my DOM better ? - 10/1/2005 1:02:38 PM

Evanesce

Posts: 2325
Joined: 9/14/2005
Status: offline

quote:

WE/we are new to this lifestyle. i am very submissive to HIM when it comes to the physical acts i am more than willing, but when it comes to the simple things in day to day life it is harder for me, examples saying SIR outside of a scene or off the computer, asking HIM to do things that i should be more than willing to do, like closing the bedroom door becouse HE is closer. mind YOU/you my DOM puts me in my place, but i still have problems, not as far as not wanting to, just adjusting to the newness of it all. WE/we were in a vanilla marriage for 13 years so it was for the most part always equal. now that we embarked on this journey i am wanting to submit to HIM completely, even outside of a scene. any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

I would say the most important thing you can do is to be patient with yourself, and give yourself time to adjust to the new dynamics of your relationship. Maybe ask him to gently remind you when you ask him to do something that should be your responsibility to do.

Have the two of you established what your respective responsibilities are? If not, then that's a good place to start. Decide what each of you is responsible for, and then make a conscious effort not to place that responsibility on the other person. Also, just taking the time to think about what it is you're asking of him, and whether it really is something you SHOULD be requesting that he do, might help readjust your mindset to the one you want to have.

Denise
the Kaptin's wench

(in reply to lmystery21901)

Post #: 11

RE: how can i serve my DOM better ? - 10/2/2005 12:51:43 AM

CanisMajor

Posts: 42
Joined: 9/2/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ImpGrrl

quote:

My partner had a bit of a stumbling block over calling people "sir," ....

This logic only works if *all* men/masculine-ID'd women (who have stated that they prefer it) are called "sir" - not just d-types.

Let's just stop right there for a second, because I think we're approaching this issue from very different perspectives. My partner and I do not engage in this lifestyle because it is "logical," and we do not choose our activities and rituals within the lifestyle on the basis of how logical they are. If we did, things would be considerably less interesting and exciting than they are. For example, most of the orders I give to canisminor are completely illogical - they would not stand up to even a modest inspection of their intellectual rigor. However - and for us this is absolutely key - those orders lead to us having a lot of fun and deriving a lot of satisfaction from the lifestyle even though they aren't a result of a logical framework that governs our behaviour.

Regarding salutary matters specifically, we have never set out to define a protocol specifying forms of address that can be arrived at through a hierarchy of boolean tests, and I don't expect our practices would meet any similar criteria.

quote:

If it's just d-types that are being called "sir", then the logic fails.

I've seen that "logic" used a lot by people who mean "all d-types" when they say "all people" in that statement - I'm not saying *you're* saying that.

Well, I really don't understand where you are coming from, nor do I understand what sort of logic you are describing here. I just don't "get" it, but that's ok - I know where we are coming from and what our practices are and mean for us.

My partner's difficulty was with showing people proper respect. I didn't think she was respectful enough around others, and when it was discussed with her, she agreed. But she also explained that she had a lot of anxiety when performing the various activities through which this respect is expressed in our society. So she tended, as a result of this anxiety and consequent shyness, to appear to be somewhat arrogant and aloof to others.

When I say she had difficulty showing respect to people, I mean people - I don't mean d-types, I mean our insurance agent, our next door neighbors, or whatever. One manifestation of this difficulty was an especially strong reluctance on her part to use the word "sir." She felt that using the word "sir" in reference to another person was a form of degrading and humiliating obeisance that stripped her of dignity. In discussions with my sub about proper respectful behaviour toward others (in and out of the lifestyle), I discovered she had this attitude about "sir" which was very foreign to my own. Growing up in an English household, and having had military service, I consider "sir" to be a routine element of everyday courteous salutation. As a result of our discussion and some practice on my partner's part, she eventually overcame these issues to an acceptable degree.

Now, you bring up d-types, and women, as some sort of contraindication to the use of the word "sir." For whatever reason, canisminor has never had as much reluctance to use the word "ma'am" in reference to her female acquaintances, so this wasn't an issue I felt I could use as an example of how to overcome old and bad habits. So I didn't bring that up in reply to the OP.

For reasons that should be obvious, I don't have a particular problem with canisminor referring to d-types as "sir" (or "ma'am") - if our insurance agent rates this sort of expression, surely a dom deserves as much (at least until they show themselves to be complete tools). Nor would I consider it scandalous if she referred to an s-type as "sir." It is not her place to make snap determinations that certain people aren't worth her expression of respect. However, my general rule regarding people within the lifestyle is that once we understand someone's preference concerning form of address, it is most polite if we respect that preference; nevertheless, I don't generally feel a need to be slavish about pandering to those preferences at all times, as long as the overall attitude is appropriately respectful.

Again, we do not engage in these practices (or their exceptions) because we think they are logical - we do it because we think it is appropriate and because we think it lubricates our journey through life. I don't have any problem at all with anyone conducting their BDSM practices on a logical basis, not by a long shot. It is just that Mr. Spock-like analysis is not the approach we've taken to exploring and resolving all the various issues we've encountered in this relationship.

So that's my twenty cents....

Oh, and one other thing. Given my partner's strong feelings about the use of the word "sir," I am especially proud of her success at overcoming this issue. At one time, using "sir" was for all practical purposes a hard limit for her. It takes a lot of courage to move beyond such a limit, and that's one reason why my sub is particularly special to me.

_____________________________

The Big Dog

(in reply to ImpGrrl)

Post #: 12

RE: how can i serve my DOM better ? - 10/2/2005 12:27:21 PM

Awakener

Posts: 88
Joined: 9/18/2005
Status: offline

First let me tell you that there is no right way or better way to do things in general. Only as it pertains to yourself and partner/s.
I also think I need to mention that there is a difference between a submissive and a slave. It sounds as though you lean towards slave, that you wish to completely surrendr to him. Well this is a very difficult goal. And can not be done in a couple of weeks. There is no reason you have to do it all at once. Or even do it all the time. Many people are perfectly happy to keep this lifestyle confined only to the bedroom. I'd suggest you not pressure yourself, things will come togethor over time.
I also believe that much more if this burden belongs to your Dom/Master. In my opinion it is up to you to come to him with your doubts, problems, fears, whatever. But ultimetly his responsability to bring about the changes. Well I guess what I'm saying is that it is his place to train you. You feel you are not serving properly. Well what does he think? Does he agree with that assesment? If so what has he done to chnage your behaviour to beter suit the relationship. You must at all times express your needs, to him. Needs not necissarily wants. But I believe it is up to him to see they are fulfilled.
Perhaps as you are both new you should step outside of the lifestyle at times and really discuss this. Discuss it outside the D/s M/s roles. Discuss it as would colleauges. We all of us are living things and evolve constantly. We are always learning about ourselves and finding out that what we thought last year sems wrong this year.
Anway just relax. As long as you have desire, a willingness to evolve, and remeber that opinions are not facts. I think you will find happiness.

(in reply to lmystery21901)

Post #: 13

RE: how can i serve my DOM better ? - 10/2/2005 1:09:39 PM

ImpGrrl

Posts: 575
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

Please note the bit in my original post where I said:

quote:

ORIGINAL: ImpGrrl
I've seen that "logic" used a lot by people who mean "all d-types" when they say "all people" in that statement - I'm not saying *you're* saying that.

That was the entire point of my mini-rant - it had nothing to do with the way that you and your partner handle things.

It's a statement used *as* "logic" by others, where it plainly isn't (logic). My peeve was about that :)

H

(in reply to CanisMajor)

Post #: 14

RE: how can i serve my DOM better ? - 10/2/2005 1:22:21 PM

Awakener

Posts: 88
Joined: 9/18/2005
Status: offline

I undrstood ImpGrrl. I think most did. But with the written word it's easy to think your being attacked and to then attack back.

(in reply to ImpGrrl)

Post #: 15

RE: how can i serve my DOM better ? - 10/3/2005 5:40:53 AM

CanisMajor

Posts: 42
Joined: 9/2/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ImpGrrl
Please note the bit in my original post where I said: ....

I'm able to read, and read what you wrote; my trouble comes at the next stage of communication: As I said, I didn't understand it. I'm not sure who your referent is, in what way their practices are illogical, or why they are supposed be logical in the first place.

Lest Awakener raise doubts, I'm neither feeling attacked nor attacking anyone. My verbosity results from the importance of the issue to my relationship, but I assure you I was feeling nothing but engaged interest when writing - I certainly intended no hostility. The response itself resulted from a gut feeling that I needed to clarify something. Perhaps that instinct was justified. If my peculiar practices are being used to shine the cold light of judgment on others, I'm appalled.

_____________________________

The Big Dog

(in reply to ImpGrrl)

Post #: 16

RE: how can i serve my DOM better ? - 10/3/2005 5:48:10 AM

KatyLied

Posts: 13029
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Pennsylvania
Status: offline

The best thing you can do is pay attention to the things he tells you that he wants, enjoys, as far as service and your demeanor. It's all part of being "trained" (god I do hate that word) for what he needs from you.

Good luck.

(in reply to lmystery21901)

Post #: 17

RE: how can i serve my DOM better ? - 10/3/2005 5:51:25 AM

ChereeAmoor

Posts: 185
Joined: 8/1/2005
Status: offline

lmystery21901, I have pretty much the same question you do! We all want to know how we can do more and do better for those we love. I live with my husband of a couple of decades, and we invited another Dom last year to live with us - so I guess our situation is a bit unusual - but for what it is worth, here are a few items:

You say sometimes it is hard:

quote:

saying SIR outside of a scene

I call both by their first names. Always have. Simply TOO shocking!

And asking someone to do something, turn off the light, hand the mustard out of the fridge, close the door, whatever, doesn't mean you are not submissive - I honestly do not know how I would manage without help now and then.

Rover is absolutely right - talk, communicate, write a letter, talk, you have got to figure out between the two of you what works and what won't. IronBear, among others, is absolutely right when he counsels patience.

Best of luck to you!

(in reply to lmystery21901)

Post #: 18

RE: how can i serve my DOM better ? - 10/3/2005 6:58:36 AM

lmystery21901

Posts: 5
Joined: 9/7/2005
Status: offline

i would love to thank all of YOU/you for YOUR/your comments they have been so helpful. i have learned alot by being on here and frm the great emails i have received. the information that everyONE/one has offered has been very helpful. i have been learning alot about submission and the life that i wish to live. WE/we have had many offers on MENTORING. this is a very hard subject for me. i have been with my HUSBAND/MASTER for 13 years and WE/we have never invited anyone into the privacy of OUR/our sex life. weither it be in person or in writing. any suggestions on this would greatly be helpful as well.
thank YOU/you.

(in reply to ChereeAmoor)

Post #: 19

RE: how can i serve my DOM better ? - 10/3/2005 8:55:37 AM

Lordandmaster

Posts: 10943
Joined: 6/22/2004
Status: offline

Even if those offers are well-intentioned (and, unfortunately, many offers of "mentorship" are not well-intentioned), they're probably not in your best interest. You two know each other better than anyone else ever will. Work out your problems with each other. It sounds as though you know what you need to work on, and have every desire to do it. A mentor would only get in the way. If you ever do bring a third person into your sex life, let it be your idea and do it on your own terms.

quote:

ORIGINAL: lmystery21901

WE/we have had many offers on MENTORING. this is a very hard subject for me. i have been with my HUSBAND/MASTER for 13 years and WE/we have never invited anyone into the privacy of OUR/our sex life. weither it be in person or in writing. any suggestions on this would greatly be helpful as well.
thank YOU/you.

(in reply to lmystery21901)

Post #: 20

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