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Spill all..or a white lie? - 3/28/2008 2:13:13 AM

wideeyedgirl

Posts: 56
Joined: 11/12/2005
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This question is drawing from my personal experiences past few months and a friends current decision to make. Kinda got me thinking..
when you meet Someone and it is..just..not.happening. at. all.
How long do you have to stay to be polite? do you tell them why, even if its rude? (BO, unkempt, werid vibe, not as the represented themselves..?) Or just smile, say something nice, and use the pattened "Its not you..its me", line? Especially if its not something a person can change.

How does being submissive (aka: usually nice!) and being polite still balance with getting a person to know..there is no chance?

Post #: 1

RE: Spill all..or a white lie? - 3/28/2008 2:16:17 AM

SixFootMaster

Posts: 829
Joined: 9/27/2007
Status: offline

From this dominant's perspective - the truth is more useful and healthier. If it's BO, then hey, maybe they'll do something about it - perhaps no one has ever had the courage to tell them before. If it is something they can change, then hopefully they will want to, and will.

You're doing them no favor in the long run by lying to them.

Six.

_____________________________

How-so oft fresh injurious deed
Doth turn Janus' petulant gaze
'pon the rocks and storm rift sea
And littered wood of broken days
disregard for toil shown
no ground broken, no seed sewn.

(in reply to wideeyedgirl)

Post #: 2

RE: Spill all..or a white lie? - 3/28/2008 2:20:40 AM

wideeyedgirl

Posts: 56
Joined: 11/12/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SixFootMaster

You're doing them no favor in the long run by lying to them.

Six.

I know! But its so much easier to not deal with sticky emotions. <g> Seriously, tho. thank you for reaffirming what I should have been thinking. Human being first.

_____________________________

~ " Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for thou are crunchy and go well with ketchup " ~
My opinions are my own. They do not represent my Owner, or past Trainers unless specifically noted. Flame me only, thanks.

(in reply to SixFootMaster)

Post #: 3

RE: Spill all..or a white lie? - 3/28/2008 2:33:22 AM

eyesopened

Posts: 2798
Joined: 6/12/2006
From: Tampa, FL
Status: offline

i have actually gotten up from the table where i was having coffee and said "i'm sorry, this might sound weird but i am just not feeling any connection with you whatsoever. Please let me pay for your coffee since i wasted your time."

Another time i had driven 5 hours to meet with someone and was just plain uncomfortable with the guy. Not that he was a bad guy or anything it just was not going to work for me at all. Once again i said simply that i did not feel the connection i wanted to feel and please excuse me but i feel its best i go home... and i turned around and drove another 5 hours home.

It's not kind or polite in my opinion to delay the inevitable. Kind of like taking a bandage off... hurts a lot less if ya just rip it off quickly than try to peel it away slowly.

_____________________________

Proudly owned by InkedMaster. He is the one i obey, serve, honor and love.

No one is honored for what they've received. Honor is the reward for what has been given.

(in reply to wideeyedgirl)

Post #: 4

RE: Spill all..or a white lie? - 3/28/2008 4:32:22 AM

WalterRego

Posts: 276
Joined: 12/28/2004
Status: offline

I think this is much harder for a sub to deal with than a Dom(me) because we are used to and want to give ourselves to someone. Used to accepting, and adapting ourselves to another. We take for granted that it is our role to bend ourselves to another. It is part of our essence. When we find ourselves unable to do it, it can trigger difficult inner conflicts.

For me it is the hardest thing I have faced as a submissive. A while back, it happened several times over a short period of time and I was a wreck, thinking that something had changed about my submissiveness or character or spiritual essence. Thinking that if a person’s appearance or something about them turned me off, I was not only not a submissive, but not really even a decent human being.

I’d e-mail, talk on line with a Dominant, speak on the phone for a while, enjoying their personality, wanting to go further with them.

And then when we met, or on several occasions, when we played: total turn off. I was miserable, not knowing what to say or how to say it. Twice I went back to them more than one time, just not knowing how to get out, or what to say. Not wanting to hurt their feelings. I felt trapped.

Perhaps it would be nicer or better as SixFoot says to tell, but I personally find it impossible to tell a person that they have a personal hygiene problem or even “odor”; that their house is a pig stye beyond even my submissive desire to clean for them. Or that their style of play is just totally devoid of any imagination or interest. Once it was ...please don’t anyone flame me.....her weight and physical condition (which to be fair, had been concealed). It is not within my nature to do that.

And so I resorted to white or even off white lies. To get out of the immediate situation: severe indigestion, an emergency in the office or with my children. To discontinue the relationship: something(s) on going in my life or inability to accept something essential to their kink.

I finally came to the rationale that I work hard on making and keeping myself at least presentable, well groomed, and fit. I’m not an adonis, nor do I require a Venus. But some things just reflect on who and what a person is essentially. If a Dominant can’t control her own life or immediate surroundings or be aware of certain things about herself , her grooming or physicality (or chooses to ignore them).....how can I put myself into her care or trust? How can I trust that she will be aware of my physical or safety needs? If I bicycle and run and hike all the time, and have made that known from the outset, what kind of relationship can we have if she can't walk down the block without discomfort? How can I submit to her when she doesn't even see those things as a problem? And so, I resort to white lies or excuses.

BTW, I also impose those kinds of standards on myself. If a Dominant appears not interested after an e-mail, meeting or playing, I won't pursue her. Nor do I approach women who are significantly younger than I even if I think I am attractive or fit enough to. I don't want to put anyone else in an uncomfortable position any more than myself.

< Message edited by WalterRego -- 3/28/2008 4:45:33 AM >

(in reply to wideeyedgirl)

Post #: 5

RE: Spill all..or a white lie? - 3/28/2008 5:01:00 AM

Dnomyar

Posts: 7933
Joined: 6/27/2005
Status: offline

OP curb your emotions and say sorry not what Im looking for and leave. Dragging someting out just makes it worse.

(in reply to WalterRego)

Post #: 6

RE: Spill all..or a white lie? - 3/28/2008 6:54:37 AM

pinkwind

Posts: 367
Joined: 1/9/2005
Status: offline

Honesty, or the lack of it, and reticence in ending something that should be ended quickly for the benefit of both parties has got very little to do with submission, IMHO.

The right time to tell someone there is something wrong is when you have thought all through and know that what you feel is right, and not a moment longer. There is absolutely nothing to be gained by stringing someone along under a false pretence, and the sooner the other person is told the less emotional investment, the less hurt they will feel.

The point is that there isn't just one person's feelings to be considered here, and if one person cannot be honest with their feelings about another this early on in a relationship, and begins to lie, there is little hope for either to be happy, and an end should be called sooner rather than later.

(in reply to wideeyedgirl)

Post #: 7

RE: Spill all..or a white lie? - 3/28/2008 7:42:05 AM

Poetryinpain

Posts: 341
Joined: 3/20/2008
Status: offline

~fr~

I have always found it difficult, even in a vanilla relationship, to tell a man that I just don't feel a connection. I was raised to be nice - never hurt anyone's feelings - always blame myself, even if it's the other person's fault - etc., etc.

My rationale for being honest and saying, "Please excuse me, but I'm not feeling anything here," is that I'm not assigning blame. I may tint the truth a little and say I don't know what it is, but there's just something a little "off" with our pairing, and I don't see that it could be changed. (I figure if I say I can't put my finger on it, he won't feel like I'm putting down any part of his personality or anatomy.) If he presses, I may say something to the effect of, "I have issues with ABC." Whatever - I make it about me being picky, rather than him being unlikeable.

And, honestly, there have been men who have been wonderful friends, but for whom I've not felt a smidgen of sexual or romantic interest. In those cases, I've been open and honest, and they've laughed in momentary embarrassment and continued being my friends.

pip

_____________________________

There is none so blind as he who will not see.

(in reply to pinkwind)

Post #: 8

RE: Spill all..or a white lie? - 3/28/2008 7:45:57 AM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline

Neither.

You don't have to say "You're fatter than in the picture" or "You have no fashion sense". All you need to say is "I'm sorry but I don't feel any chemistry for you so there's no chance of this relationship going further".

And then wait for their response. If they whine about it or get angry, wish them goodbye. If they take it with grace, then why not finish your coffee, you might just make a new friend.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

(in reply to Poetryinpain)

Post #: 9

RE: Spill all..or a white lie? - 3/28/2008 7:52:19 AM

Leatherist

Posts: 5149
Joined: 12/11/2007
Status: offline

It's much nicer to just tell someone politely-and not waste thier time or allow them to become infatuated when nothing is going to happen.

_____________________________

My shop is currently segueing into production mode.

I'm not taking custom orders.

(in reply to wideeyedgirl)

Post #: 10

RE: Spill all..or a white lie? - 3/28/2008 7:57:16 AM

childofpain

Posts: 44
Joined: 1/16/2007
Status: offline

It's better to speak up and tell them.
I met a man that I had been talking to for some time. When we met at the place I noticed he was dirty and smelled not so great. I assumed he had just come from work, it was 6:30pm....
After asking about his day I found out he'd been off work that day. At that point I told him that he should have showder and wore clean clothed as well as cleaning the BLACK out from under his nails.
He thanked me and we went our our ways. Later he did e-mail me and told me had talked to his older brother and the brother advised him he needed to apologize to me. He did....no we will never meet again...but I hope it helped the next girl see him in a better light. I think it helped him, really.

(in reply to wideeyedgirl)

Post #: 11

RE: Spill all..or a white lie? - 3/28/2008 8:45:09 AM

littleone35

Posts: 2828
Joined: 2/17/2005
Status: offline

I think honesty is the best policy. Before i was with Master i met this Dom, i could tell he was not that into me. I was showered, dressed nice, groomed but i guess i was not what he was looking for. He should have just told me and not wasted my time. Everybody has different tastes no harm in that. Just tell him i am sorry this is not working for me. Of course when i met Master instant connection.

Matt's littleone

(in reply to childofpain)

Post #: 12

RE: Spill all..or a white lie? - 3/28/2008 8:52:33 AM

TethersEnd

Posts: 102
Joined: 1/29/2007
Status: offline

Keep in mind that even ommission can be viewed as a lie.
It's hard to say "i'm just not into you that way" but by not saying it your only causing them and yourself greif.
spit it out as kindy as you can. best case, you've gained a friend, worse case you loose one you thought you had.

_____________________________

The problem with communication ... is the illusion that it has been accomplished.
~George Bernard Shaw

(in reply to littleone35)

Post #: 13

RE: Spill all..or a white lie? - 3/28/2008 8:52:45 AM

CalifChick

Posts: 10717
Joined: 10/28/2007
From: California
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: pinkwind
There is absolutely nothing to be gained by stringing someone along under a false pretence, and the sooner the other person is told the less emotional investment, the less hurt they will feel.

I need to have that tattooed on my forehead.

Cali

_____________________________

AKA "The Undisputed Goddess of Sarcasm", "Big Bad Cali" and "Yum Bum". Advisor to the Subbie Mafia, founding member of the W.A.C. and the Judgmental Bitches Brigade, member of the Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair-a's and Team Troll

(in reply to pinkwind)

Post #: 14

RE: Spill all..or a white lie? - 3/28/2008 9:24:42 AM

WalterRego

Posts: 276
Joined: 12/28/2004
Status: offline

Did you want that tattoo backwards, so that you can read it in a mirror, or straight, so that a Dominant can read it while considering you?

(in reply to CalifChick)

Post #: 15

RE: Spill all..or a white lie? - 3/28/2008 9:42:22 AM

CalifChick

Posts: 10717
Joined: 10/28/2007
From: California
Status: offline

I was thinking straight on, so if someone just isn't that into me, they'll tell me right off.

Cali

_____________________________

AKA "The Undisputed Goddess of Sarcasm", "Big Bad Cali" and "Yum Bum". Advisor to the Subbie Mafia, founding member of the W.A.C. and the Judgmental Bitches Brigade, member of the Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair-a's and Team Troll

(in reply to WalterRego)

Post #: 16

RE: Spill all..or a white lie? - 3/28/2008 9:47:38 AM

WalterRego

Posts: 276
Joined: 12/28/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Leatherist

It's much nicer to just tell someone politely-and not waste thier time or allow them to become infatuated when nothing is going to happen.

I thought the OP was asking what you tell the other person about why you are ending, rather than if or when you tell them. And that's what my response was focusing on. I have no difficulty telling a person that I just don't think it's going to work, but, I do have difficulty telling them the reason if it may be hurtful. So I have usually lied or made up some excuse.

And sometimes, if you've had a good run up to a meeting, telling them immediately right then might obviously reveal that it is something about their grooming or appearance. Other times I've wanted to consider whether it was a one time thing which might not occur in the future.

I just see no reason to say something which even if true, might be hurtful, especially when they never realized it before, or perhaps do know it but saying it would only exaccerbate their hurt feelings.

(in reply to Leatherist)

Post #: 17

RE: Spill all..or a white lie? - 3/28/2008 9:53:57 AM

Leatherist

Posts: 5149
Joined: 12/11/2007
Status: offline

I won't lie. I also won't be pruposely cruel.

But if something really bothers me, I will say it. There is no cruelty involved in it-it's more about compassion. People cannot always see things about themselves that others do. If I had something noticible that hurt me in the world-I would rather know-than keep doing it.

I feel the same in helping others.

_____________________________

My shop is currently segueing into production mode.

I'm not taking custom orders.

(in reply to WalterRego)

Post #: 18

RE: Spill all..or a white lie? - 3/28/2008 10:07:23 AM

petitespitfire64

Posts: 182
Joined: 10/4/2007
Status: offline

How can anyone in this lifestyle even CONSIDER not being totally honest in thier dealings? I expect kinksters to be FAR more honest and have more integrity than the nilla world.
PLEASE tell these people the truth... it's the only way they can improve or understand.
I've dated men who were turned off because I have scars or two teeth that were knocked out by a bungee cord. Telling me I'm too fat or too thin or ...whatever...for thier tastes. I'd MUCH rather they be completely honest than let me get to liking them and string me along and just dump me later on.
And I have to agree...when all else fails, just saying "there is no chemistry" is fine too.

_____________________________

**Daneene**
"The right thing to do isn't always the popular thing to do"

(in reply to Leatherist)

Post #: 19

RE: Spill all..or a white lie? - 3/28/2008 10:17:38 AM

xxblushesxx

Posts: 9318
Joined: 11/3/2005
From: Kentucky
Status: offline

Uhm...I just say I'm sorry, but I'm getting back together with my ex-dom, but I didn't want to stand you up, and it's always nice to have friends, yanno? Then I smile reallllly nice.
I really don't think telling someone I'm not personally attracted to him (for whatever reason) honestly helps them. It's not like they're going to get better looking or develop a personality just 'cause someone isn't attracted to them.

_____________________________

~Christina

A nice girl with a disturbing hobby

My femdom findom blog: http://www.MistressAvarice.com

(in reply to petitespitfire64)

Post #: 20

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