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RE: D/s Wannabe and what to look for - 7/20/2004 1:51:04 AM   
Majiktrixs


Posts: 13
Joined: 7/20/2004
Status: offline
"Hello A/all" this has been around many years..... i thought it apropriate to add to this posted topic.

ACID TESTS for DOMS
Introduction
The term "acid test" is an old prospecting term. A powerful acid can dissolve most base metals in a matter of minutes. However, gold will stand up to most acids. So the Acid Test was an easy way for people to make sure they had a real nugget of gold and not a lump of the fool's variety. In the same way, these tests are meant to be quick ways to identify fake Doms. Passing all these tests is no guarantee. There is no replacement for getting to know your prospective partner as well as possible BEFORE YOU EVER MEET IN PERSON.
Most of these tests are designed for submissive females trying to sort through men claiming to be Doms online. They are largely based on the many questions I get asked by my female friends still searching for a Dominant partner. Some of them can probably be used by male subs as well, but for the most part, these tests are best for ferreting out male fakes.
Step One: Do the Math
Various estimates and surveys have placed the ratio of true (i.e., natural) male sexual Dominants to female sexual submissives at about one to ten. However, a quick count in any given D/s oriented chat room would lead you to believe that male Doms outnumber the subs at about two to one. If there is actually only one male Dom for every ten female subs, that means that 19 out of the 20 "Doms" you see online HAVE TO BE FAKES. Keep this in mind. There is a 95% chance that any man you talk to online claiming to be a Dom is no such thing. This leads us to our first rule, a rule that all statisticians and scientists already know by heart: "When in doubt, throw it out!"
Your search for a suitable Dominant partner (especially if you are seeking a serious long term relationship as well) could easily take years. That's hardly surprising, most people spend years looking for that special lover, be they vanilla or otherwise. So don't be disheartened by all these distractions. BUT DON'T WASTE YOUR TIME EITHER. If any of the prospects you are chatting with online makes you feel uncomfortable for any reason, drop him. Don't give him three strikes or extra chances to win. Block out his screen-name and move on. There was only a one in twenty chance he was legitimate anyway. Trust your instincts!
Step Two: Know Your Enemy
We call them Snerts. We call them HNGs (Horny Net Geeks). We call them Wannabes. We call them Control Freaks. And sometimes, tragically, we call them rapists and predators. They are all your ENEMY. Don't bother thinking they are anything less -- or more. Even a well-meaning Snert can land you in a hospital. Sexual Dominance and submission is not for dilettantes or amateurs: Not, no, and never! Even if he turns out to be a more or less nice guy, if he's not a Dom, he's not going to give you what you really need, and he will likely give you many things you don't (like medical bills and other assorted headaches).
The Snert
Snerts are basically looking for easy sex. They are counting on the (highly inaccurate) assumption that sexual submissives are simply easy lays. Nothing could be farther from the truth, but that doesn't deter them at all. They are typically middle aged to somewhat older men. They are often married. They are usually trying to bolster their flagging vanilla sex lives with some casual screwing around. They target submissives because they think that they won't make demands on their sexual prowess (another bad assumption). They can be easily spotted because they almost always demand or at least emphasize sexual intercourse being a part of their scenes.
The HNG (Horny Net Geek)
HNGs are usually the most harmless (and yet often the most annoying) of the enemy types. Most are teenagers and young men looking for some quick cyber-sex or even phone-sex. They are usually pretty sophisticated about their D/s jargon and the scenes they describe to you can be pretty elaborate. Geeks do their homework. They scour the porn sites for ideas, and hang out in D/s chats for hours on end learning the lingo. They are most easily spotted because they want to move on to cyber-sex and phone sex very quickly. They like to offer online collars, and spend hours on end in chat rooms playing with their subbies. Dont waste your time with them.
Control Freaks
The second most dangerous type of enemy is the Control Freak. Control freaks are what most psychologists and therapists call controlling personalities. They are the people that want to be in control of everything around them. They want all their family and friends to behave exactly as they say. They are extremely manipulative people. These men can be dangerous because many really have convinced themselves that they are Dominants as a way to justify their dysfunctional lives. Many inexperienced submissives find themselves naturally attracted to these men because outwardly they seem so in command of all things all the time. The truly ironic (and sad) thing is, a controlling personality is actually the closest thing to the OPPOSITE of a sexual Dominant. Control Freaks can be spotted because they often talk about taking care of you and also knowing what's best for you. They almost always try to play on your emotions, especially guilt. They also usually criticize and even resent the advice you get from other people. They often talk about 24/7 D/s relationships without going into any details about what kind of actual scenes they play. They are fond of telling you that they prefer the mental aspects of Domination and submission. They tend to be both demanding and argumentative. Nothing you do will ever be quite right. While all this may seem very repulsive and easy to avoid, be on your guard. The average control freak often seems very charming initially. Once they have their hooks into you, it's very hard to get untangled.
Rapists and Predators
The last and most dangerous type of enemy is the rapist or predator. These are the men most likely to damage your health or end your life. The truly frightening thing about these evil men it that there is NO easy way to spot them. Rapists can be anything from bums to bank managers, and anyone from family members to total strangers. One in four women has suffered an attack from these vile creatures, and one in seven men as well! Their motive is violence. The best defense is to never make yourself too vulnerable.
To defend yourself from predators, learn all the in's and out's of setting up a good Safety Net. Follow these procedures religiously. Most important of all, TAKE YOUR TIME getting to know your prospective play partners. This is good advice in any case. If you know your partner well, you're more likely to have a good time with him (because you will feel more comfortable during that first Scene). Predators are more likely to move on in search of easy prey. They tend to be impulsive. If a dom suddenly seems to lose interest in you after a period of time, you may have just saved your own life. Don't go chasing after anybody. A true Dom doesn't need to play hard to get.
Step 3: Know your goal!
Take the time to figure out what you want. Its often hard for newbie subs to do this because they lack knowledge of what choices are available to them. SO ARM YOURSELF WITH KNOWLEDGE! There are many fine publications, books, and internet websites that cater to sexual submissives. Start reading! Learn about the different types of play and how they should be conducted. Learn everything you can about how to set up a Safety Net. Learn all the dos and donts of meeting others and playing safely. Decide what your Limits are and set them down on paper. This may seem like a lot of homework to do in the name of fun, but also keep in mind that it's your ASS that's (literally) on the line here.
Know what a real Dom acts like. Remember, you are probably a sexual submissive because you ARE in control the rest of the time. You are strong! Likely even ambitious as well. You have a career, or goals, or a lifestyle that demands a high level of energy and control. Giving away your control is a beautiful respite from everyday life. Your power and energy is something you only want to give to someone you trust, and in intimate situations at that. It's a very personal thing to you.
Guess what? Sexual Dominants are usually the complement of this. We are strong people too, and we tend to be intelligent. We are often highly trained professionals or skilled craftsmen. However, we tend to avoid lifestyles and careers that demand we be in control all the time. We tend to be easygoing. I have never in my life met, or even heard of, an uptight sexual Dominant. We like being in control in INTIMATE situations. Its a respite from the way we live OUR everyday lives. We are not really the opposite of you, but we are the puzzle piece that fits next to you snugly. In another words, don't look for a Dom that's exactly like you. You won't find him. Don't look for a Dom that wants to run your whole life; he doesn't exist.
ABOVE ALL, if your prospective Dom seems like a generally nice guy, you're likely on the right track! Take the time to get to know him. Don't let the five control freaks on the other side of the chat room demand your attention. A natural Dom isn't likely to make demands until its time to play.

Step 4: Memorize the Acid Tests!
Test #1: When in doubt, throw it out! Dont waste your time with people that make you feel uncomfortable. Even if the guy was a real Dom, if his personality makes you feel uncomfortable, he's not going to be fun to play with.
Test #2: "You'd better call me Sir!" is the mating call of a HNG or control freak. Real Doms don't have to ask for titles, we EARN them. Most real Doms will say things like "please, call me Mike."
Test #3: "I want you to take my collar before you play with me." This is another common demand of fakes, most often made by control freaks. They have to isolate you from other people and their advice, and sometimes a little ol' "cyber-collar" is just the thing! Cyber-collars are worth less than the leather required to make one.
Test #4: If you get an Instant Message that says something like "On your knees you [slave, slut, bitch, whore, etc.]" This is the mating call of the HNG. Use some common sense here. Why waste time with somebody that's not even polite? There's a time and a place for these endearing terms, and it isn't online!
Test #5: "I don't have to answer that question" or "Its not proper etiquette for you to ask a Master that" are examples of some the dangerous LIES that control freaks and snerts use. This is the acid test I personally think is the most important! A Dom had better be ready to at least TRY and answer every question you have, and HONESTLY at that! It's literally your ass that's on the line! Never forget this!
Test #6: "It's my way or the highway!" or words to that effect, are the mating cry of the common control freak. Doms can have Limits too, but it's your Limits that count FIRST. Don't let any would-be dom tell you differently. Don't let any of the wannabe subs tell you differently either. Where Male Dom/Fem sub play is concerned, its ALWAYS LADY'S CHOICE! {{sub's choice}}
Test #7: Don't make decisions about a prospective life partner based only on his online play style. It's a very simple test if you think about it: would a real life Dominant waste time on cyber sex? Please take my word for it; the answer is NO. Forget it. Once you've done the real thing, cyber is just too damn dull.
Test #8: Ask your prospect if he's ever made any mistakes during a scene. If he says no, run for your life! If he says, very rarely, at least be suspicious. Everyone makes mistakes, even if they are experienced players. Sometimes submissives have Limits they don't even know about, and even the most careful and skilled Dom the world will trip over these occasionally. Remember, according to our good friends of the Christian faith, the last perfect guy to walk this planet got nailed to a tree for his trouble. So expect competence, but not miracles.
Test #9 "Im a [bank president, captain of industry, TV producer, self-made millionaire yadda yadda yadda.]" Wouldnt it be nice to meet a rich Dom? Sure it would! But use some common sense too. How many captains of industry have hours to spend in an AOL chat room? Also, think about this personality profile: if this super successful, always-in-control person is really into D/s, he's likely a submissive! I have met a lot of female submissives that fit this ambitious profile, but not one Dom yet!
Test #10 "I'm 33 years old, and Ive been a Master for 15 years." Gimme a break! What are the odds? When you ask about a Dom's level of experience (and it's a good idea to do so) remember to do the math as well. 18 year old boys don't care about the intricacies of D/s, they want to get laid. Trust me on this one, ladies. I was an 18 year old boy once! I personally believe that people do become what they are (be it gay, straight, Dom or sub) very early in life, but it takes maturity and training to be a Master. What are the odds a person became a Master when he was still using Clearacil?
Test #11 Ask for references! Especially if he claims to be very experienced. Talk to the references ON THE PHONE. Lots of HNGs have female screen-names set up to act as references for them! I notice that a lot of newbies seem to have trouble with this concept. Which is understandable since in the vanilla world its considered rude to talk to a guys ex-girlfriend. But in the D/s Scene it's the opposite. Experienced players will accept and accommodate this kind of request gladly.
Test #12 "I have three real life collared slaves right now, but you can't talk to them." Okay, when you consider the ratio and all, this sounds possible. What makes this an acid test failed (and failed miserably at that) is the last part. I have met couples (and even triples) that really were looking for an extra person to add to the mix. This is not uncommon at all in the Scene. But these couples were looking TOGETHER. If a dom has anyone already collared to them, you probably ought to talk to her FIRST!
Test #13 "I don't need safe words." Well of course he doesn't! If he said this he's likely a snert and therefore he's never really been in a scene! Of course he might be a predator, and then he wouldn't need safewords either. Need I say more?
Test #14 "My slaves trust me to set their Limits for them." If you hear a "dom" say this it's most likely because these slaves only exist in his mind. Or worse still, his slave is simply the victim of spouse abuse. Even so called TPE (Total Power Exchange) and other sorts of 24/7 (i.e., full time) D/s relationships should involve some careful negotiation.
Test #15 "I'm married, my wife can't know about us" If I have to explain this one to you, you've got problems. I have played with many married submissives in my time, but ONLY with the express permission (and more often than not, participation) of their husbands. Safe D/s requires complete honesty. You can't build a good Scene on lies. There are plenty of people that will be willing to tell you differently, but please note, they will all turn out to be adulterers (and hence, liars) themselves.
Test #16 Insert your own Acid Test here. You will learn much from your mistakes and missteps. If you form an online contact with a "dom" that falls through, analyze WHY it fell through. Don't make the same mistake twice if you can help it.
Step 5: Its not just the men you have to screen!
Finding some female submissives to be buddies with you on your quest is a very good idea. Especially if they are experienced players, they can give you unique perspectives, emotional support, and even references to legitimate Doms to play with. They can also, most importantly, provide a Safety Net for you during those first meetings with the men you meet. The benefits of teaming up with other women in your search should be obvious!
However, be just as cautious about what you hear from other women online as well. If you are so inclined to search for a Domme for instance, the Acid tests should apply just as well. Be very cautious about the women you meet online that claim to be submissives as well. There are a great number of female HNGs who live there D/s lifestyle in the vacuum of cyber-space. Their advice and experiences are not only useless in the real world, they can be dangerous. Another class of "female enemy" is even more tragic and dangerous: the Victim.
A Victim is just that: a victim of physical and or mental abuse that uses D/s as an excuse to continue denying the reality of her tragic situation. These people are disturbingly common as well. They are dangerous to you too! These women are not just full of very dangerous advice, but they are usually very vehement about telling you that their lifestyle is the only "real D/s." They can fill your head full of doubts faster than one of the male enemy types.
Spare little sympathy, tell them to get help, and stay the heck away from them (in exactly this order). It may seem mercenary, but it is in fact the right thing to do. This is my training as a CASA (Citizens Against Spouse Abuse) volunteer talking. An abuse victim can only save herself, and then only when she is ready to do so. If you let her vent her frustrations and fears on you, she will then go back to her familiar little hell. Leaving you emotionally drained and likely scared too. Your quest for safe play partners is going to be tough enough as it is. Avoid Victims completely if you can, and if you can't, urge them to get help. It's not your job to save the world. Keeping yourself safe and happy is enough work.

(in reply to serenity2u)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: D/s Wannabe and what to look for - 7/20/2004 4:43:08 AM   
LadyAngelika


Posts: 8070
Joined: 7/4/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: afmvdp
Secondly, I'd disagree about wanting to meet relatively soon after talking online. Meeting with the intended statement to jump into positions on the first sight is absurd and to be avoided in most circumstances but to just want to meet up and ensure that the person isn't trying to hide is a good thing. Also helps to ward off the secret lives club.


I can understand and respect your point of view on this topic. It was once mine as well.

What I realised though it that if I'm chatting with people online with the goal of finding a RL dynamic (which is what I’m looking for), meeting sooner then later is important for me. What I have come to realise, from the few experiences I have had, is that it is easy to build up expectations when people are not face-to-face.

Last night I actually had a meeting with a submissive man who I met online and talked to for over a month by phone. You figure that the phone would let a lot come through in terms of personality, style, etc. We got along marvellously and were very hopeful about the meeting. But once we got face to face, there was absolutely no chemistry. It is difficult to explain. I was not attracted to him and I don’t believe he was attracted to me. I believe that having met him sooner would have been a very good idea. The experience was somewhat disappointing (note: he didn’t disappoint me, but the situation did).

And by meeting earlier, I don’t mean getting out the whips & chains on date no 2. In my profile, I actually write something to the effect of “You should expect that we will spend some time getting to know each other before we play.”

All this being said, I don’t think that because someone doesn’t want to meet right away, that they are a “wannabe” (I don’t like this word either pixie) but rather that they are going at their own pace. I don’t see what this has to do with BDSM.

- LA

_____________________________

Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

(in reply to MistressZanthia)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: D/s Wannabe and what to look for - 7/20/2004 4:51:52 AM   
LadyAngelika


Posts: 8070
Joined: 7/4/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MistressZanthia
quote:

3. If they don't make you rules to follow....

Okay, I have problem with this one. I would never assume dominance over someone I've not met in person, and even then not until we mutually come to an agreement about a power exchange with each other. Not everyone is into "rules". Did you forget to complete the sentence with an "after the power exchange is agree upon?" What it says implies an online expectation of rules.


I agree with you on this post Zanthia. I would take out “I’ve not met in person” and we can agree to disagree on that one (because I believe it can work for other people and it’s not my business to judge them), but most definitely I agree with “not until we mutually come to an agreement about a power exchange with each other”.

I find that I meet an alarmingly huge amount of submissives, both male and female, that want to throw themselves at my feet right away, no questions asked. I get called Mistress by the second chat or phone call and I find it highly disconcerting. I wonder about these people’s sense of survival.

When, and only when you are wearing my collar can you call me Mistress (well Maîtresse in my case) – even the subs I play with on an occasional basis call me Mademoiselle.

Until then, we are negotiating. We are learning about one another. We are determining compatibility. I want a submissive to adore me for me, because they have gotten to know me and love the person I am, not because I hold a crop in hand.

- LA

_____________________________

Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

(in reply to afmvdp)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: D/s Wannabe and what to look for - 7/20/2004 11:22:52 AM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

When, and only when you are wearing my collar can you call me Mistress (well Maîtresse in my case) – even the subs I play with on an occasional basis call me Mademoiselle.


Hello,

I have a sense of irritation being called Sir by people I dont know, particularly in the lifestyle. In a Vanilla setting, I dont mind so much when it is simple courtesy.

There are a couple of lifestyle related scenarios where I quell my feelings on this matter, but generally I ask people to call me "Sinergy" or they can use my actual name which is Greg.

1) If a person is unable to not say Sir to a Dominant, I dont consider myself to be their Dominant, so I put up with it. Part of my objection to being called Sir in the lifestyle by people I dont know is they dont know me as a Dominant, they know me as this person they interact with in a certain social setting. Insisting they dont call me Sir would be, to me, as bad as if I was insisting they do call me Sir.

2) If a submissive is specifically ordered to refer to me as Sir by their Dominant, I feel it would be disrespectful to their relationship to ask them to call me something else.

Probably incorrect, but it seems to work for me.

Sinergy

< Message edited by Sinergy -- 7/20/2004 12:02:48 PM >


_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


(in reply to LadyAngelika)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: D/s Wannabe and what to look for - 7/20/2004 11:33:17 AM   
MzBerlin


Posts: 378
Joined: 7/3/2004
Status: offline
WARNING- BERLIN IS OFF TOPIC AGAIN

Hey, Y'all.
I don't call anyone Sir, Ma'am, Mistress, Master, blah, blah,blah, UNLESS I'm in that dynamic with them and that is what they desire. I am more interested in the dynamic of the relationship than in the titles and definitions they provide. I also don't resort to using what I call 'CRAZEE CAPS' (ex-Me, T/they, W/we, U/us) because I don't feel that I am an 'i'. I hope that makes sense. I am Berlin. If the person I feel submissive to is feeling all domly and wants to hear "Sir" that is a different story. I have recieved so many emails with CRAZEE CAPS and 'orders' to call the person sending by a certain title. I think it's just plain silly, and hit BLOCK with a quickness.
As Always
B

(in reply to Sinergy)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: D/s Wannabe and what to look for - 7/20/2004 2:58:12 PM   
wizcitrix


Posts: 20
Joined: 6/4/2004
Status: offline
I havn't read every single post on here so I may be repeating something someone else said but if they said it, it certainly needs to be said again. I think that tthe topic at hand is a bit offbase. You are talking about the internet as some evil place where a vast majority of people lie, cheat, steal, and abuse. I do not think this is any more or any less true then it is in real life. If you come online looking to become a sub/slave, and you meet someone who seems to be a very nice Dom which you are likely to have a relationship with, and then find out he is really an abuser or a false Dom, this is to be expected. The same exact thing is likely to happen offline.

The real truth to finding a Dom/Master is stop looking for one. Don't look for a romantic relationship of any kind be it the BDSM, vanilla, vampire, or any other intimate relationship. Be it online or offline thats a great way to get hurt and abused. Rather let nature take its course. Sit back, relax, talk to them, become a friend, learn who they are, what interests you share, etc. Anytime you get involved in a romantic relationship, your partner should also be your best friend. If you don't get to the best friend point the relationship certainly won't last long.

So now your thinking about some person in your head, whom you met online and who you did all these things with, and you find that they lied about every last piece of it. They had similiar interests as you until you found out the truth. They told you everything you wanted to hear and you poured out your soul to them. Yeah you got hurt but ya know what? Welcome to the real world. The same things that happen online also happen offline. A good way to tell if someone is a true Dom/Master is ask them some very specific and precise questions. Ask them how many subs/slaves they had in the past. If they say none there is a good chance they are being honest and sincere, If they tell you more then 0 ask for names, ages, dates, places, and how to contact the old subs/slaves. Take that information and contact them. Find out how abusive or mature this person is about the lifestyle, investigate them.

On a side note I do not agree with many of the rules of the original posting. I am very much a Master howerver I break your "spot a fake" rules nearly everyday. I don't give out my email, my real name, or my phone number, I also don't use instant messangers or goto chat rooms. Not because I can't handle peoples questions but rather because I am an experienced computer user who would rather the whole world not know his private life. If people followed the rules as you see them, I may never have met any of the wonderful and very bright individuals I have met. Everywhere you go people will break someone elses predefined rules. The key is not in the rules, but in the reasons they break them. If someone breaks the rules as you have defined them, don't be to quick to count them out, rather ask them why they broke those rules.

This is only my 2 1/2 cents but now you have it.

_____________________________

Albany Alternative
Albany Alternative Sex Blog

(in reply to MrThorns)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: D/s Wannabe and what to look for - 7/20/2004 3:15:10 PM   
wizcitrix


Posts: 20
Joined: 6/4/2004
Status: offline
quote:

Ask your prospect if he's ever made any mistakes during a scene. If he says no, run for your life! If he says, very rarely, at least be suspicious. Everyone makes mistakes, even if they are experienced players. Sometimes submissives have Limits they don't even know about, and even the most careful and skilled Dom the world will trip over these occasionally. Remember, according to our good friends of the Christian faith, the last perfect guy to walk this planet got nailed to a tree for his trouble. So expect competence, but not miracles.


Sorry to post 2 times so soon but this has me bugged. This is not at all true. There are exceptions to this rule (over all I like those rules). This one however personally affects me. There are usually two types of people who havn't made mistakes. The first one is someone who has been trained by a more experienced Dom/Master. If they were trained and shown exactly what to do and how to do it, they may have not ever made a mistake. Some people do have a natural ability to be a Dom/Master, just as some people can pick up a guitar and play it first time without ever having done so before. The other type of person is a person who grew up in a society or subculture, or was otherwise raised from birth to be a Dom. These people have learned from a very young age exactly how it is and is not done. They lived it, breathed it, feared it, and many more things I can't describe in words. More and more as more and more lifestylers appear you meet young adults who were introduced at ages usually as young as 10 to 13. These people have a firm grasp and understanding of the lifestyle. Most of them have witnessed it first and second hand from parents or other close relatives/friends. These people are not to be feared (except the subcultural ones) or counted out. As I said in my previous posting, before accusing find out why they don't fit into the "rules".

_____________________________

Albany Alternative
Albany Alternative Sex Blog

(in reply to wizcitrix)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: D/s Wannabe and what to look for - 7/20/2004 3:44:29 PM   
darkinshadows


Posts: 4145
Joined: 6/2/2004
From: UK
Status: offline
Angels thoughts are... every last one of us are responsible for our own decision and actions... regardless ... whether You want to blame the Dominant(if your sub/slave)...or visa versa... it still comes down to the fact that we are responsible for ourself. That is the nature of SSC... ignore that and You abuse the whole concept of what You actually practising(IMHO)...

What really makes Angel uncomfortable is the whole*wannabe* philosphy... whos right and whos wrong. People make mistakes and sure... there are people that dont learn from the mistakes they make... does that make them a wannabe?... Not in Angels opinion... Yes there are people that use and abuse ... but that goes for online and off. Realtime BDSM/ Ds/ S/m is no more and no less than online. It all comes down to feelings and the growth that occurs during a specific relationship. What is *fake* in one persons eyes is *real* to another. We should stop belittling and berating people for what they do and how they do it, because we have enough abuse and judgements from the 'normal'(and i do use that term losely) world.

What makes a person a Dom? Or a sub?... or a slave?... and even more... what gives anyone the right to claim they are 'True'? Each person is unique. Why can't we embrace the differences and stop blaming others for our own decisions when they go wrong?


_____________________________


.dark.




...i surrender to gravity and the unknown...

(in reply to serenity2u)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: D/s Wannabe and what to look for - 7/20/2004 5:09:18 PM   
SherriA


Posts: 544
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: wizcitrix
There are usually two types of people who havn't made mistakes. The first one is someone who has been trained by a more experienced Dom/Master. If they were trained and shown exactly what to do and how to do it, they may have not ever made a mistake.


I'd say the odds of that being inaccurate increase every time they do the activity in question. The simple fact is that eventually everyone makes a mistake - not a deadly one necessarily, but at least some small ones. And the inability to recognize them is a dangerous trait, imnsho.

If you learned to use a cane from someone who was an incredibly good teacher, you might not miss your target the first few times you swing one, but with every swing the odds that you'll be slightly off at least once increase, I believe. Blink at the wrong time, or have the car alarm go off, or have the bottom sneeze, or whatever - life happens, and no one is perfect.

quote:


Some people do have a natural ability to be a Dom/Master, just as some people can pick up a guitar and play it first time without ever having done so before.


Even Mozart hit a wrong note every now and then. It's reality. To err is human, and all that.

quote:


The other type of person is a person who grew up in a society or subculture, or was otherwise raised from birth to be a Dom. These people have learned from a very young age exactly how it is and is not done. They lived it, breathed it, feared it, and many more things I can't describe in words. More and more as more and more lifestylers appear you meet young adults who were introduced at ages usually as young as 10 to 13. These people have a firm grasp and understanding of the lifestyle. Most of them have witnessed it first and second hand from parents or other close relatives/friends. These people are not to be feared (except the subcultural ones) or counted out. As I said in my previous posting, before accusing find out why they don't fit into the "rules".


I don't buy this at all. It doesn't matter how long you've been raised around something - people are all individuals, and eventually all your cultural rules aren't going to be a perfect fit for someone who crosses your path. You'll make a mistake. It's reality. (generic you, not anyone in particular)

Frankly, anyone unable to admit that they can, will and do make mistakes, and likely will make more of them in the future, is someone I'm afraid of. That's a disaster waiting to happen, imnsho. If you don't acknowledge that you might make a mistake then you likely never learn how to deal with those errors. And everyone eventually WILL make a mistake, so I much prefer to be around those who have the ability to deal with those situations competently.

< Message edited by SherriA -- 7/20/2004 5:10:15 PM >


_____________________________

-- Sherri

Fighting for peace is like fucking for virginity.

(in reply to wizcitrix)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: D/s Wannabe and what to look for - 7/20/2004 6:08:16 PM   
angelthighhighs


Posts: 104
Joined: 5/29/2004
Status: offline
i don't believe in meeting a person from online especially too quickly but i do believe in meeting them before the "online fantasy" has had a chance to kick into gear. too many relationships end either because they moved too quickly or because they allowed what was going on online to get mixed into their real life thinking. yes you might click online real easy but clicking in real life isn't always that easy. when i have met anyone from online whether we've had a relationship online that might lead to a D/s relationship or if i'm just meeting in groups as i often do...i go with the attitude that i'm just meeting new friends. not even a possible Master...but equals...we're not D/s at that point, we're just person i'm meeting and me...who happen to perhaps be D/s

(in reply to Majiktrixs)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: D/s Wannabe and what to look for - 7/20/2004 9:57:30 PM   
MzBerlin


Posts: 378
Joined: 7/3/2004
Status: offline
THE MODS MAY MOVE ME. NOT SURE IF THIS IS EVEN CLOSE TO TOPIC, I JUST HAVE A QUESTION.
*clears throat*
Hey, Y'all-
I just don't understand all of the social formalities in regards to what one person with certain kinks or who is in a certain relationship or has a certain dynamic with another person calls somebody else. My name is Berlin, therefore I would like to be called Berlin. If I've just met someone and it's socially acceptable Mz Berlin will do. B is fine. The girl who likes He Who Must Not Be Named is fine. OK, Back to my question- is there a guideline as to who must call whom what in BDSM social situations? In both RL and On line? Does there need to be? Why can't we just address each other as people unless we're in on some dynamic?
As Always
B

(in reply to MzBerlin)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: D/s Wannabe and what to look for - 7/20/2004 10:04:35 PM   
SherriA


Posts: 544
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MzBerlin
OK, Back to my question- is there a guideline as to who must call whom what in BDSM social situations? In both RL and On line?

There's no standardized protocol. Most people in rl will simply address others as they would in a vanilla setting - as people, not roles. However, there are some subgroups who prefer a more formalized protocol, based on roles. I figure that unless they make it clear up front, I'm not obligated to buy into it. And if they do make it clear up front, I'm likely not going to be there, so it won't matter.

Online you'll find much more prevalence of people who insist that anyone who self-identifies as dominant should be addressed with a honourific, that all pronouns referring to that person should be capitalized, etc. Some subgroups insist that those who identify as submissive not be allowed to use personal pronouns at all, or that they speak in the 3rd person at times. It's all rather nonsensical to me, so I avoid those places.

quote:


Does there need to be? Why can't we just address each other as people unless we're in on some dynamic?

No, there doesn't NEED to be, but for some people that's a part of their kink. I'm ok with that, just as long as they let me know up front so that I can avoid those places.

< Message edited by SherriA -- 7/20/2004 10:05:16 PM >


_____________________________

-- Sherri

Fighting for peace is like fucking for virginity.

(in reply to MzBerlin)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: D/s Wannabe and what to look for - 7/20/2004 11:02:35 PM   
MzBerlin


Posts: 378
Joined: 7/3/2004
Status: offline
Thankyou, Sherri.
It's a very unclear subject and you made it come a lot more into focus.
As Always-
Berlin

(in reply to SherriA)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: D/s Wannabe and what to look for - 7/21/2004 3:34:19 PM   
melycious


Posts: 45
Joined: 1/20/2004
Status: offline
~i feel compelled to respond... having done the online and the RT thing.. i can say this..

online bears little resemblence to RT engagement with people..... BDSM online ...........is kinda like reading a book where you get to type in the parts you like.. and delete the rest..

wanttobe's is NOT a bad thing to be..i want to be ... a lot of things... there is nothing wrong with someone who is finding their way thru this and blunders along the way..that is not to say there are not liars and fakes online.. but they are also in the supermarket, at the local bar, at the desk next door to you at work.

When i first read the list of things.. my initial thought was.. how scary and lonely it must be to feel taht way, as thou everyone was out to pull one over on you.. when i read it again, i thought..while some of those things are true............ie.. take your time.. most are indicative only of harm that has been caused... and not of the lessons learned....

Perhaps.... instead of looking how someone doesnt fit our needs exactly, we look instead at what they have to offer and perhaps what i have to offer them..

all of that being said.. here is my best advice...

1. know who you are....
2. be open to learning who you might become
3. offer your assistance and not your judgement
4. dont become the person everyone else bitches about everyone else to....
5. dont assume that your experiences are everyone elses.. or ... even if they are.... that they effect them the same way.
6. be comfortable with yourself and your solitude


mely

(in reply to MrThorns)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: D/s Wannabe and what to look for - 7/21/2004 5:41:42 PM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

There are usually two types of people who havn't made mistakes.


I have yet to meet a single person who has not made a mistake.

What determines, for me, their measure as a person is whether they admit to making mistakes, make up for the mistakes they make, and learn from them.

Although my initial response was...

The world is divided into two sets of people, those who have made mistakes and those who will make mistakes. Then I realized that everybody will make mistakes, so set A was really a subset of set B, which got me thinking of the woman hitting on me in dancing who looks like my second grade teacher who taught me basic set theory, and...

*Sinergy's mind wanders off down the path less well trodden*

Just me, could be wrong, but there ya go.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


(in reply to melycious)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: D/s Wannabe and what to look for - 7/22/2004 3:45:05 AM   
MzBerlin


Posts: 378
Joined: 7/3/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: dark~angel

Angels thoughts are... every last one of us are responsible for our own decision and actions... regardless ... whether You want to blame the Dominant(if your sub/slave)...or visa versa... it still comes down to the fact that we are responsible for ourself. That is the nature of SSC... ignore that and You abuse the whole concept of what You actually practising(IMHO)...

What really makes Angel uncomfortable is the whole*wannabe* philosphy... whos right and whos wrong. People make mistakes and sure... there are people that dont learn from the mistakes they make... does that make them a wannabe?... Not in Angels opinion... Yes there are people that use and abuse ... but that goes for online and off. Realtime BDSM/ Ds/ S/m is no more and no less than online. It all comes down to feelings and the growth that occurs during a specific relationship. What is *fake* in one persons eyes is *real* to another. We should stop belittling and berating people for what they do and how they do it, because we have enough abuse and judgements from the 'normal'(and i do use that term losely) world.

What makes a person a Dom? Or a sub?... or a slave?... and even more... what gives anyone the right to claim they are 'True'? Each person is unique. Why can't we embrace the differences and stop blaming others for our own decisions when they go wrong?




Angel- (may I call you Angel?)
Your post hit a huge spot in me. I totally agree with everything you've said. I wish that other people could be as universal as we are. I am into the idea of "whole-istic" living, and that goes for my kinky self, too.
*I am a big hippie on the inside*
As Always-
Berlin

PS- I find it easiest to say that I am a "selectively submissive female" but that only defines part of me. It is the dynamic that creates the dynamic. It's circular. (sp?) Of course, I can be a bit Sadistic and a bit Masochistic and very Dominating in my professional and social life. But these things are just facets. They do not make up who I am at the core, but they do contribute.
B

(in reply to darkinshadows)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: D/s Wannabe and what to look for - 7/22/2004 3:46:58 AM   
MzBerlin


Posts: 378
Joined: 7/3/2004
Status: offline
I am indecent!! I apologize to everyone present.
B

*blushing furiously*

(in reply to MzBerlin)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: D/s Wannabe and what to look for - 7/22/2004 6:24:38 AM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

I just don't understand all of the social formalities in regards to what one person with certain kinks or who is in a certain relationship or has a certain dynamic with another person calls somebody else. My name is Berlin, therefore I would like to be called Berlin. If I've just met someone and it's socially acceptable Mz Berlin will do. B is fine. The girl who likes He Who Must Not Be Named is fine. OK, Back to my question- is there a guideline as to who must call whom what in BDSM social situations? In both RL and On line? Does there need to be? Why can't we just address each other as people unless we're in on some dynamic?
As Always


Hello Berlin,

I personally tend to be rather nice, laid back, and respectful. Additionally, I am extremely friendly. So I am usually able to pull off simply asking people how they would like to be referred to. Every so often I will meet somebody who identifies as X or Y or
Z who has issues with the way I approach them, and I will politely apologize and wander
off to find somebody who is more of an actual human being and less of a legend in their own mind.

The problem with stating "We should all use dynamic blah" is that there is no recognized central authority, no way to present the information to those who need it, as well as the fact that as a minority population there is a tendency to polarize within the minority and attack the other members.

In Feudal Japan, there was a recognized authority, and to fail to follow the rules of decorum laid down by said individual (The Shogunate) generally resulted in one's death.

From my perspective, I dont think a person can go far wrong from using the normal customs of polite society which have been developed for thousands of years. People who will be upset with a person for doing that (one's who scream "Im a BLAH so call me WORD" when you say hello) are going through life (my opinion here) with a chip on their shoulder waiting to get their non-consensual kink (being angry at strangers) satisfied.

Some people you just cant reach. (Cool Hand Luke)

Please give my regards to He Who Must Not Be Named.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle


(in reply to MzBerlin)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: D/s Wannabe and what to look for - 7/22/2004 8:56:33 AM   
muse


Posts: 25
Joined: 4/30/2004
Status: offline
quote:

I have a sense of irritation being called Sir by people I dont know, particularly in the lifestyle. In a Vanilla setting, I dont mind so much when it is simple courtesy.

There are a couple of lifestyle related scenarios where I quell my feelings on this matter, but generally I ask people to call me "Sinergy" or they can use my actual name which is Greg.




hmm..can i call You Sinny Poo? i can add Sir if You like.

< Message edited by muse -- 7/22/2004 8:58:01 AM >


_____________________________

there she was, in platform double suede....there she was, like disco lemonade.

(in reply to MzBerlin)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: D/s Wannabe and what to look for - 7/22/2004 9:21:25 AM   
darkinshadows


Posts: 4145
Joined: 6/2/2004
From: UK
Status: offline
quote:


ORIGINAL: MzBerlin


Angel- (may I call you Angel?)


Certainly, ...*smiles* Thank You!(Angel is a Hippie inside an out also...lol*)


_____________________________


.dark.




...i surrender to gravity and the unknown...

(in reply to MzBerlin)
Profile   Post #: 40
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