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Is A Contract Nessecary? - 4/1/2008 9:07:48 AM

Daddyslilpookie

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Hi, I married to my Master and I his slave, my question is, is a contract nessecary? I have asked Master and He says we don't need one. I asked him well, I want to know what is expected of me as his slave. He said do my chores, take care of our daughter and be obedient to him. Do you think a contract is necessary for us? Do many married D/s couples have contracts?

< Message edited by Daddyslilpookie -- 4/1/2008 9:15:20 AM >

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RE: Is A Contract Nessecary? - 4/1/2008 9:16:00 AM

softness

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For me... for the dynamic I look to join, for the implications of remaining it it for the long term, for the impact of it on my life and future, I would want a contract. I have no illusions that they are solid and water tight, but a statement of mutual obligation and agreement is useful.

When it comes to conversations of responsibility, of either the Owner or the property, it is useful to have a concrete, objective point of common reference. Conversations and misinterpretations of what the other is saying/meaning can lead toproblems down the line. Contracts where obligations and responsibilities have been mapped out in objective black and white (even if they are legally worth less than the paper they are written on) .. is a useful tool in the type of dynamic i am looking to enter.

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RE: Is A Contract Nessecary? - 4/1/2008 9:17:10 AM

akisha

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Contracts are never neccessary unless you and your partner feel that they are.

Trust me even if you have a contract it will not stand up in a court of law anyway.

If you want him to stipulate exactly what your role is then I guess you can push for one but it's a serious way of limiting yourself as well.

Questions to ask yourself:

Why do you feel it neccessary to have a contract ontop of everything else?

What will a contract fulfill in your life?

Will a contract make things better or easier?

I have never had a contract, in my D/s relationships we have always just talked and figured things out cause things change with time and under different circumstances. I find contracts limiting personally.

< Message edited by akisha -- 4/1/2008 9:18:23 AM >

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RE: Is A Contract Nessecary? - 4/1/2008 9:17:27 AM

chamberqueen

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Not everyone needs a contract. There are some nice things about it, especially if it includes hard and soft limits and you are afraid that those may be violated, but that doesn't sound like your case. If you feel the need for one and your Master doesn't, perhaps you could summarize what you feel you are to do for him in a paragraph or two and ask him to sign his name to it if he agrees with it.

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RE: Is A Contract Nessecary? - 4/1/2008 9:20:17 AM

DiurnalVampire

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I find contracts to be completely unnecessary. You should be able to learn what is expected of you as a slave without needing to have it written out. IF what is expected of you changes, does the contract need to be rewritten every time? Should you be able to refuse your Owners requests because it isnt in the contract?
You are married to him, that is the only contract you NEED. All otehrs are strictly fluff written between you and he, assuming he decides to grant you one. They arent legally binding, they arent recognized anywhere outside your relationship, and with proper communication it shouldnt be necessary.

DV

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RE: Is A Contract Nessecary? - 4/1/2008 9:23:40 AM

Daddyslilpookie

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I would like to thank you all for your quick responses, they are greatly appreciated

. I feel way better now and realize that a contract is useless and un-nessecary.

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RE: Is A Contract Nessecary? - 4/1/2008 9:23:40 AM

Stephann

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Contracts are communication tools.

Some people need a toolbox the size of a truck to change a lightbulb. Other people can build a shack with a rock and piece of glass. You decide what tools you need, to do the job, with the least amount of misery.

For our part, we say very simply that my slave's collar is her contract. In six months, we'll revisit that contract, and decide if it needs to be adjusted. This doesn't mean there's no value to putting expectations to paper, just that an element of our dynamic that we enjoy (and I believe we're in the minority) is that the expectations really are very simple: she's obedient, and she's beautiful. Period. (Yeah, yeah, as if it's really that easy ) Still, how she's obedient and beautiful could be listed in depth and detail, but part of what I enjoy about training my slave is the step by step, slow, basic instructions. Over time, those instructions have gradually (and organically) increased.

Warm Regards,

Stephan

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RE: Is A Contract Nessecary? - 4/1/2008 9:24:58 AM

Archer

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I have often said it is not the contract that is important it is all the work that goes into arriving at the contract that is valuable.

That said I have to disagree with the idea that contracts are worthless or un nessisary.
They can be very usefull for many people, they serve as a formalized way of finshing negotiations.

Again as many say about other aspects of what we do, It's not the destination it's the journey that matters.

< Message edited by Archer -- 4/1/2008 9:28:09 AM >

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RE: Is A Contract Nessecary? - 4/1/2008 9:26:29 AM

MissHarlet

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I agree that contracts are not always needed .. I have had relationships with them and without them .. it is whatever works for you and your Master that is important .

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RE: Is A Contract Nessecary? - 4/1/2008 9:32:13 AM

softness

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Archer

I have often said it is not the contract that is important it is all the work that goes into arriving at the contract that is valuable.

That said I have to disagree with the idea that contracts are worthless or un nessisary.
They can be very usefull for many people, they serve as a formalized way of finshing negotiations.

Again as many say about other aspects of what we do, It's not the destination it's the journey that matters.

I would certainly say that this has been the case for me. Seeing something written in black and white makes it real for me. The written word has a gravity that is, personally, much more serious than the spoken word. Hearing something is great ... but negotiating it, phrasing it, discussing it...and then seeing it committed to paper - has been very powerful for me,and given me a huge amount of comfort and confidence

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proudly wearing the blue collar of consideration to DK Leather, Leatherdykeuk, and LeatherEagle of the UK KRueL Leather Family

veritas, respectus honorque in corio

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RE: Is A Contract Nessecary? - 4/1/2008 9:32:39 AM

metalmiss

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Whether a contract is 'necessary' very much depends on the views of the people involved in the relationship.

My Master does not believe in the need for a contract, for very simple reasons which i agree with whole-heartedly.
Firstly, our relationship is TPE.. Within that i am left with only one choice that He has no responsibility for & that is the choice to withdraw my consent completely and walk away. This in itself leaves no room for a contract as the conditions of my involvement with Him are extremely clear - i was taken, i am His, what He says goes & if i have a problem with that i know where the door is. i know what He expects of me, how He likes His home kept, when it is best to serve His coffee, how i should dress to be pleasing to Him. It is something i do because He has ingrained it into me.. Not because it says i must on some piece of paper.. His expectations and needs change from day to day depending on His mood, what life decides to throw at us, even the weather.
To me such a document would actually cheapen things between us.

Secondly, how would one write such a contract? How can anybody actually sit down and write a document stating the exact rules and regulations of a relationship taking into account every concievable future situation that might be accountable to it? Could it be evolved over time and rewritten? And if so.. How many times would the formal nature of the relationship have to change before arriving at the point at which it actually defined what you are? Possibly never? Aren't relationships themselves a continually growing and changing thing? Wouldn't the mere presence of such a document tempt or leave room for the submissive to look for loopholes?

Just my thoughts..

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RE: Is A Contract Nessecary? - 4/1/2008 9:44:27 AM

Archer

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metalmiss, that is exactly the reason I tell people contracts are not a listing of all protocols.
The contract says what will be done protocols tell how it will be done.
Just my way of handling the question you raise.

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RE: Is A Contract Nessecary? - 4/1/2008 9:51:49 AM

Madame4a

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No surprise I find myself agreeing with Archer ...

like many things, its really about the relationship as well -- some of mine have been very narrow, impacting only a small part of my life and another's life, they have involved poly situations and that for me is why a contract might be a good thing

it helps, when something goes wrong to have a piece of paper to say "you agreed to this" -- even the submissive/slave pointing that out to the dominant, doesn't matter who -- I like leather relationships for this reason, you literally have the ability to write down everything that you want and agree to AND have something concrete to fall back on when things are not working

for me, it seems a great thing in some situations, particularly ones that are very narrow and relationships that are not primary in nature

does anyone HAVE to have one? No... and personally the last one I had, was ill-planned, it was between me and another dominant with a submissive -- funnily enough the contract should have been between me and the other dominant... live and learn

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RE: Is A Contract Nessecary? - 4/1/2008 9:58:10 AM

DesFIP

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I'm a great believer in letting relationships grow organically. But there are those who feel better if they can qualify everything, for some people the act of writing it down helps them think it out. And it is for those that contracts are most useful.

Of course if you feel you've been rushed into a situation and you're uncertain about the future then you should have one so you don't get hit later on by a demand you turn bi or abandon your family or whatever.

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RE: Is A Contract Nessecary? - 4/1/2008 9:58:29 AM

littleone35

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We did not need a contract, but we have one. it does not spell out the smallest details just the general things that are expected of me.

Matt's littleone

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RE: Is A Contract Nessecary? - 4/1/2008 10:07:32 AM

RCdc

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If your Masters says you do not need one, you do not.

the.dark.

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RE: Is A Contract Nessecary? - 4/1/2008 10:35:45 AM

OmegaG

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I don't need a contract, but I like having ours (which is technically called an agreement at this time, when we decide on permanancy we will have a covenant).

I like taking it out and reading it in my weaker moments. It doesn't list protocols or day to day expectations. It defines structures and larger expectations. In it it states that I am expected to be monogamous to him and I hold no expectation of monogamy for him. It states that I am free to express concerns and ask questions when they arise. Neither of these need to be written in black and white, but I like to see it. For the monogamy issue it reminds me, grounds me when I feel a twinge of envy for his activities that don't include me. For the communication issue it just gives me comfort that any needs that I may encounter (and have not yet thought of) can be expressed and that he values my thoughts and feelings.

Since we don't live near each other now, sometimes I need to read these words when communication with him can't be immediate at I tend to feel an urge to run away from relationships and protect my feelings when I'm stressed.

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RE: Is A Contract Nessecary? - 4/1/2008 10:44:09 AM

Poetryinpain

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OP - you have a marriage license - a sort of contract in itself. It is non-specific, yet there are certain things that are intrinsically a part of that contract: faithfulness, loyalty, and respect to name a few.

A slave contract can be as generic as a job description (even including the ubiquitous "other duties as assigned"), or it can be as detailed as the contract you sign when building a home. Just remember that the only one who can enforce the contract is one of the parties signing it; there is no other adjudicator.

pip, showing off her vocabulary

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RE: Is A Contract Nessecary? - 4/1/2008 10:45:48 AM

CelticPrince

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quote:

Hi, I married to my Master and I his slave, my question is, is a contract nessecary? I have asked Master and He says we don't need one. I asked him well, I want to know what is expected of me as his slave. He said do my chores, take care of our daughter and be obedient to him. Do you think a contract is necessary for us? Do many married D/s couples have contracts?

lilpookie,

Girl, your already married, that is the biggest contract of all.

CP

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RE: Is A Contract Necessary? - 4/1/2008 11:09:24 AM

Mercnbeth

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Archer
I have often said it is not the contract that is important it is all the work that goes into arriving at the contract that is valuable.

EXACTLY - It isn't the contract it's the process of creating a contract that is important. It is a wonderful communication tool. It opens discussion on all the things you'd like to do, want to do, and need to do. It helps to define the relationship. It sets expectations and responsibilities of both parties. It is invaluable as an ongoing reference.

That represents our contract process. It took a long time to formulate our contract in final form. We used many different references and sources to come up with the final product. It has been 5 years, but if memory serves, there was some negotiation and a little compromise; but most important there were many long discussions. A signed copy is displayed framed in our bedroom.

Your situation is a little different; married to your Master. For you, a contract may provide a demarcation point, a distinction of identity, if you will, from 'married' to 'married slave'. As someone else pointed out, the end decision is his, but it could be a process that would be very beneficial.

Good Luck!

(in reply to Archer)

Post #: 20

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