The nature of the submissive/slave mindset

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p0rnioke -> The nature of the submissive/slave mindset (4/5/2008 3:36:08 AM)
Dear community of bent people, I present a question: Is it contrary to being a sub/slave, if she is assertive about what she wants from a relationship? Is being passive a part of the definition of sub/slave? I ask because although a dom, honest communication about desires of my partner is very important - and yet in some conversations that I've had, i've gotten the impression that my 'ideal' of my sub/little girl, is scary to some- in that I will not allow my partner to abandon all self determination. Indeed I wish to mentor my partners success in all aspect of her life, such as I can. Your considered input is most appreciated. p0rnioke

lusciouslips19 -> RE: The nature of the submissive/slave mindset (4/5/2008 4:03:43 AM)
You will be introduced to a number of bad ass assertive sub/slaves through this thread. Nice to make your aqaintence. Open communication is vital to a good D's relationship. Your fantasy sub fits the descrition of Most here. You sound like a Dom with integrity. The kind that is really abusive but using BDSM to be abusive is not who we choose for this community.

MRandme -> RE: The nature of the submissive/slave mindset (4/5/2008 4:20:41 AM)
Hello p0rnioke, It is not contrary to the nature of a slave or sub to be expect their needs to be met, in general. There may be some who feel that as long as their D-type gets His/Her needs met, they will be happy. Most of us, though, do this because it does fulfill our needs in some way and a relationship that doesn't fulfill it probably won't last that long. Specifically, even as a slave, i have ways to assure my needs in the relationship are being met. i have a journal that i may use to write down any thoughts or issues. i have used it to talk about my feelings and have also approached my Master directly. Open communication with no fear of reprisal means that my needs can be met while i meet His. Easy. Basic. To most of us, submissive/slave does not equal doormat. g

eyesopened -> RE: The nature of the submissive/slave mindset (4/5/2008 4:27:09 AM)
my definition of submission is to yield to the power and authority of another. Yield what exactly? If a person does not perceieve that they have any personal power or personal authority what exactly are they yielding? That's just my view. YMMV However, there are people who tend to blast the more timid souls and declare that submissives should be strong assertive people. Not everyone is. There is room for the "doormat" as well. i'm a combintation of both. i absolutely hate being the center of attention or a focal point in public. However, in my job i easily conduct presentations to large groups of people 50-100-200 or more. i get over my shyness because i percieve the subject matter to be the focal point, not me personally. In many aspects of my life and my relationship i am absolutely assertive, strong, capable. i am a supervisor of department within a very large corporation. i see no conflict between being submissive and being assertive but i see nothing at all wrong with being submissive and passive.

lusciouslips19 -> RE: The nature of the submissive/slave mindset (4/5/2008 4:32:19 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: eyesopened my definition of submission is to yield to the power and authority of another. Yield what exactly? If a person does not perceieve that they have any personal power or personal authority what exactly are they yielding? That's just my view. YMMV However, there are people who tend to blast the more timid souls and declare that submissives should be strong assertive people. Not everyone is. There is room for the "doormat" as well. i'm a combintation of both. i absolutely hate being the center of attention or a focal point in public. However, in my job i easily conduct presentations to large groups of people 50-100-200 or more. i get over my shyness because i percieve the subject matter to be the focal point, not me personally. In many aspects of my life and my relationship i am absolutely assertive, strong, capable. i am a supervisor of department within a very large corporation. i see no conflict between being submissive and being assertive but i see nothing at all wrong with being submissive and passive. agreed. and here you can be your authentic self. Although beware of the flames![sm=anger.gif]

p0rnioke -> RE: The nature of the submissive/slave mindset (4/5/2008 4:48:45 AM)
Thanks foks - it's nice to find thoughtful, articulate kinky folk like me. This is difficult to discuss within my own community for some reason, so an outside sounding board, I concluded, is a resource I should find and cultivate... p0rnioke

jeffman1234 -> RE: The nature of the submissive/slave mindset (4/5/2008 5:00:36 AM)
Maybe you want a sub and not a slave?

lronitulstahp -> RE: The nature of the submissive/slave mindset (4/5/2008 5:02:10 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: jeffman1234 Maybe you want a sub and not a slave? hmm...only took 7 posts for that to pop up [image]http://www.collarchat.com/micons/m21.gif[/image]

KatyLied -> RE: The nature of the submissive/slave mindset (4/5/2008 5:06:25 AM)
Maybe you need a different local community? Personally speaking, submission is best for me when it is with someone who understands and appreciates my personality. I'm certainly not very passive, although in the right circumstances I can become passive. I feel that the dominant has the job of providing an environment in which I want to submit and in which I wish to continue to submit. I can be outspoken, and spikey. If a dominant doesn't get that or can't handle it then it's obvious he's not the dominant for me. I don't remain in a relationship where my needs are not met. I like this part of your post the best: quote: Indeed I wish to mentor my partners success in all aspect of her life, such as I can. I certainly crave oversight that comes from a dominant. But it has to "fit" with what I want and need in order to work.

wisteriaV -> RE: The nature of the submissive/slave mindset (4/5/2008 5:20:59 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: eyesopened my definition of submission is to yield to the power and authority of another. Yield what exactly? If a person does not perceieve that they have any personal power or personal authority what exactly are they yielding? That's just my view. YMMV However, there are people who tend to blast the more timid souls and declare that submissives should be strong assertive people. Not everyone is. There is room for the "doormat" as well. i'm a combintation of both. i absolutely hate being the center of attention or a focal point in public. However, in my job i easily conduct presentations to large groups of people 50-100-200 or more. i get over my shyness because i percieve the subject matter to be the focal point, not me personally. In many aspects of my life and my relationship i am absolutely assertive, strong, capable. i am a supervisor of department within a very large corporation. i see no conflict between being submissive and being assertive but i see nothing at all wrong with being submissive and passive. Yep what she said...nicely put by the way!

xxblushesxx -> RE: The nature of the submissive/slave mindset (4/5/2008 6:11:48 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: jeffman1234 Maybe you want a sub and not a slave? pffftttt.... [sm=rant.gif][sm=iwin.gif]

p0rnioke -> RE: The nature of the submissive/slave mindset (4/5/2008 6:17:56 AM)
Jeffman1234=: please elaborate on this, and tell me: what do you percieve as the difference between the two? xxblushesxx: "pffftttt" ????

gypsygrl -> RE: The nature of the submissive/slave mindset (4/5/2008 6:24:46 AM)
quote: There is room for the "doormat" as well. Thank you. :) I'm a bit of a doormat. I can assert myself effectively if the situation requires, but its work for me and not my default mode.

Littlepita -> RE: The nature of the submissive/slave mindset (4/5/2008 6:48:31 AM)
I'm a little girl/slave/slut and I'm very assertive about what I want in my relationship. My Daddy is also adamant that I reach my full potential as his property and as a productive member of society. I read your profile and liked it very much. Good luck in your search. [:)]

beargonewild -> RE: The nature of the submissive/slave mindset (4/5/2008 7:15:58 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: p0rnioke Dear community of bent people, I present a question: Is it contrary to being a sub/slave, if she is assertive about what she wants from a relationship? Is being passive a part of the definition of sub/slave? I ask because although a dom, honest communication about desires of my partner is very important - and yet in some conversations that I've had, i've gotten the impression that my 'ideal' of my sub/little girl, is scary to some- in that I will not allow my partner to abandon all self determination. Indeed I wish to mentor my partners success in all aspect of her life, such as I can. Your considered input is most appreciated. p0rnioke I can't see a sub/slave being assertive as being contradictory. To me, that measure of assertiveness is a good indication that the sub knows what they want and need in a relationship and has the determination to do so. I see this as an assest knowing that that person still has a mind of their own and will not allow themselves be treated in a negative manner.

Mercnbeth -> RE: The nature of the submissive/slave mindset (4/5/2008 7:22:36 AM)
quote: Is it contrary to being a sub/slave, if she is... "a" submissive/slave mindset does not encompass all those who identify as submissive/slave. if you want to delve into the nature and motivations of a particular submissive/slave's mindset, it will most likely be VERY different than the next particular submissive/slave's nature/motivations/mindset. some folks submit in the bedroom/dungeon, only. some folks submit only to their partner, in an established relationship. some folks have a submissive personality, yet prefer to dominate in the context of an intimate relationship. some folks have a dominant personality, yet prefer to submit to another in the context of an intimate relationship(s). each one of those folks will have a different mindset about their submission and what it means in the context of their lives. some are contrary to others. some need their submission "inspired", some "feel" more or less submissive, depending on the physical acts they are performing, some just plain submit, period. the only one-true-way that matters is the path *you* have chosen. quote: ...in some conversations that I've had, i've gotten the impression that my 'ideal' of my sub/little girl, is scary to some... get used to it and welcome to the club---everybody's ideal here is scary to someone...[:)]

AMaster -> RE: The nature of the submissive/slave mindset (4/5/2008 7:42:35 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth quote: Is it contrary to being a sub/slave, if she is... "a" submissive/slave mindset does not encompass all those who identify as submissive/slave. if you want to delve into the nature and motivations of a particular submissive/slave's mindset, it will most likely be VERY different than the next particular submissive/slave's nature/motivations/mindset. some folks submit in the bedroom/dungeon, only. some folks submit only to their partner, in an established relationship. some folks have a submissive personality, yet prefer to dominate in the context of an intimate relationship. some folks have a dominant personality, yet prefer to submit to another in the context of an intimate relationship(s). each one of those folks will have a different mindset about their submission and what it means in the context of their lives. some are contrary to others. some need their submission "inspired", some "feel" more or less submissive, depending on the physical acts they are performing, some just plain submit, period. the only one-true-way that matters is the path *you* have chosen. quote: ...in some conversations that I've had, i've gotten the impression that my 'ideal' of my sub/little girl, is scary to some... get used to it and welcome to the club---everybody's ideal here is scary to someone...[:)] Well said. I totally agree, but I never could have articulated the thoughts as well as you have.

ownedgirlie -> RE: The nature of the submissive/slave mindset (4/5/2008 8:08:24 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: p0rnioke Is being passive a part of the definition of sub/slave? I wanted to comment on this - passive may be part of the mix, but isn't necessarily all of it. Sometimes I am required to be passive, sometimes I'm required to be assertive. If I were always passive, I wouldn't be able to be proactive in my slavery and would merely wait for instructions at every turn. With submissives and slaves alike, there are many styles, many preferences, many personality traits, various strengths and weaknesses, to varying degrees. And to answer your inquiry about what some feel is the difference between a submissive and slave, I would invite you to use the Search function (top right hand side of your page) and you can enjoy a lifetime's worth of reading of all the different debates on the topic. You'll see it's a much dreaded and debated topic on these boards. And what beth said was perfect - everyone's ideal is scary to someone. [;)]

Maya2001 -> RE: The nature of the submissive/slave mindset (4/5/2008 8:51:26 AM)
I agree wholeheartly with what Beth said I am very passionate about certain issues/things in life, one Dom made the mistake of ignoring after I stated very clearly in the beginning figuring as time went along that in my growing submission to him that he could just order/force me to drop those views ...big mistake ...because I will turn polecat when forced to go against things things I value or feel is important to me

LuckyAlbatross -> RE: The nature of the submissive/slave mindset (4/5/2008 9:04:31 AM)
Many subs/slaves when they first get into this tend to want to be totally passive- a spoiled pet type who doesn't have to think, doesn't have to worry, doesn't have to be RESPONSIBLE. And there are some relationships in which the dynamic is centered around that sort of interplay and personality types and that's fine. But for the most part, people are just people. What makes Ms or Ds different really just tends to be the authority dynamic. The personality quirks, desires, pressures and such are all as varied as you'll find anywhere else.

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