BDSM art and stories now illegal (Full Version)

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ShadeDiva -> BDSM art and stories now illegal (10/9/2005 6:12:40 PM)

Welcome to Nazi America where now even written fictional stories involving BDSM are now considered illegal, and a crime worth prosecuting.

http://xbiz.com/news_piece.php?id=10680

I'll be taking down all my libraries and galleries for a bit I think.

What will you other artists be planning to do?

Cuz don't think for a second that if they are going after stories that they won't be also going after images - cartoon or not.

Sadly I'll be shutting down the library and galleries of my community sites. KinkyArtists.com will no doubt be the hardest hit.

I'm on the fence about whether or not to fight this or not, but I just don't have the reserves for a battle with the government - especially since they are being so whacked out these days.

I'm just totally depressed about our country right now. *sigh*




JohnWarren -> RE: BDSM art and stories now illegal (10/9/2005 7:07:11 PM)

"Pornography" has long been a obsession with the Bush White House. Just prior to 9/11 the Attorney General announced a multistate conference intended to "combat indecency". 9/11 derailed that. However, with the failure of about everything else they've tried, (in the words of another horror movie) They're Back!

Here's some recent events

> 1 Suicidegirls.com is pulling all BDSM photo.
> http://suicidegirls.com/boards/Everything+SG/81705/
>
> 2 Insex.com is for sale and plans to close (only 4mil)
>
> http://www.insex.com
>
> 3 the FBI raided red-rose-stories.com and it is closed
> http://www.red-rose-stories.com/
>
> 4 the FBI raided Max Hardcore this week
>http://www.avn.com/index.php?Primary_Navigation=Articles&Action=View_Article&Content_ID=242607
> http://www.maxhardcore.com/FBI.html
>
> 5.Yellowdisipline.com is closed

6. beautybound.com is closed

http://www.subnation.org

http://www.theledger.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20051008/NEWS/510080427/0/FRONTPAGE



ToYourKneesForMe -> RE: BDSM art and stories now illegal (10/9/2005 7:23:28 PM)

Now, that thourghly depressed me.

If they where throwing books into bon fires, people would be upset. But, it seems they think it is ok since this is the internet.

Times of book burning, we must fear.

Maverick:



sirmagicky -> On the subject of Red Rose (10/10/2005 8:56:09 AM)

BDSM has always been a "gray" area when it comes to the Community Standards rule in the defining of obscenity. However, what has not been is animals and children.

In the case of Red Rose the following is alleged:

"Publishing pedo fantasy stories about 6 month old babies getting finger fucked is OBSCENE, is over the line, and should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law,” posted one user on GFY.com, although YNOT has not yet been able to verify the exact nature of the targeted stories. “I have no sympathy for this site. It should not be protected as free spreech [sic]. The entire premise is to cater to the fantasies of pedos at the most debased and perverted levels imaginable. When you are writing sexually perverse stories describing pornographic acts on infants, toddlers, and children you are generating the same effect [sic] as if you were publishing pictures of such.. "

Source:
http://www.ynot.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=news_article&sid=9839

IF the above is true, then no wonder. This shouldn't come as a surprise people, Republican administrations have been consistent on their war on sex going all the way back to the Reagan Adminstration and Attorney general Edwin Meese.

I'm not condoning I'm merely stating, this is nothing new and very predictable.
If you're going to serve this stuff up on the web, get a server in Denmark. Is it right ?
Doesn't matter, this is the way it is until we change it via either the political process or
revolution.


Sir Magic

---

Magic's Law: #19
There is no such thing as absolute Destiny or Freewill,
for both are carefully interwoven into the fabric of the
human universe.
Destiny is the door presented before you...
Freewill is the choice whether to walk through it.

Magic's World
http://darkangel.com



perverseangelic -> RE: On the subject of Red Rose (10/10/2005 3:15:27 PM)

I followed a bunch of links and came up with a quote that seems to sum up the new outlook on what is "obscene"

Content that includes ""includes bestiality, urination, defecation, as well as sadistic and masochistic behavior." " (from here)

I can understand requiring removal of all content including children. Seems to make sense. But those statutes? In stories? This is a problem to me.



sub4hire -> RE: BDSM art and stories now illegal (10/10/2005 3:21:22 PM)

Welcome back, old news though...or at least old to me.



WickedKev -> RE: BDSM art and stories now illegal (10/10/2005 5:14:00 PM)

One thing I find disturbing in all this, is that in both the US and UK similar things are happening. At one time it was always said that we must defend our freedom. But now Bush and Blair are always harping on about defending Democracy even if it means giving up our freedoms. If people can't see what is wrong with that then I feel there is no hope for any of us.



JohnWarren -> RE: BDSM art and stories now illegal (10/10/2005 5:17:05 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: WickedKev

One thing I find disturbing in all this, is that in both the US and UK similar things are happening. At one time it was always said that we must defend our freedom. But now Bush and Blair are always harping on about defending Democracy even if it means giving up our freedoms. If people can't see what is wrong with that then I feel there is no hope for any of us.


They want freedom. The problem is it's THEIR freedom, not ours. Not an uncommon point of view. After all, if you give people real freedom they might do things you don't want 'em to do.



krikket -> RE: BDSM art and stories now illegal (10/10/2005 6:15:29 PM)

What i find to be one of the saddest parts of this whole mess, is that the lack of knowledge that was freely available to anyone who was able to get on-line, will no longer be there. I realize that underage kids went places they were supposed to go (DUH!!), the fact is they were a good source of information for the "newbies" of this world.

i stumbled onto subnation back in 1996, just after it went on-line. my eyes went wide, my heart started beating faster, and my palms were sweaty --I felt like Dorothy on the yellow brick road -- not finding the wizard at the end, but a place where i truly belonged -- i was finally home. The changes in my life over these past 10 years have been amazing, when i stop to think about it, and most of those changes began their birth on-line at sites like these. There's so much mis-information out "there," and i knew that even then. However, sites like subnation were there to repair some of the damage the poor sites caused, and spread some important ideas (over and above kink), like safe sex, as well as sane and consensual (good ideas in 'nilla as well). i did a quick check and found that cuffs.com and castlerealm.com are still up, but i have to wonder for how long. A number of years ago there was something called "Adult check" that was supposed to "stop" minors getting onto adult sites, but these new rules go further than that..they stop adults from going to adult sites (at least that's my understanding).

Reading John's list feels like i'm reading the obits, leaving me feeling sad and scared and angry and frustrated. i don't know if there's even a solution, especially with the supreme court being filled with Bush cronies. i only pray that once in office the justices remember it's their job to keep the constitution and democracy free and safe from the idiots who sometimes"!?" get into office. i like to hope that "this too shall pass" and that maybe the world will be turned right side up again... <sigh>


krikket



WickedKev -> RE: BDSM art and stories now illegal (10/10/2005 6:18:08 PM)

Seems very similar to life in the medieval era. Then it was the church that had the real power and they ensured that they kept power by keeping the mob ignorant and useing superstition. Nowadays it is the politicians who use scare tactics to take away more and more of our freedoms all under the banner of democracy. But yet in both our so called democratic system democracy is nothingmore than an illusion. The real power base in the corperations, ok I will now wait fo the knock on my door, will it be the FBI or MI6?



JohnWarren -> RE: BDSM art and stories now illegal (10/10/2005 6:47:24 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: krikket
Reading John's list feels like i'm reading the obits, leaving me feeling sad and scared and angry and frustrated. i don't know if there's even a solution, especially with the supreme court being filled with Bush cronies. i only pray that once in office the justices remember it's their job to keep the constitution and democracy free and safe from the idiots who sometimes"!?" get into office. i like to hope that "this too shall pass" and that maybe the world will be turned right side up again... <sigh>



There is some hope. Earl Warren was a conservative, union-busting governor and turned out to be one of the most enlightened Justices in the history of the court. Even Blackmun, whom Nixton trusted to be a barrier against the growth of people's rights, was the author of Roe v Wade.

There is something about sitting in that chair knowing that generations of law scholars and students will be reading your words, that you truely don't have to answer to anything but your conscience that can make a person grow.

Then again, we have Anton Scalia!



happypervert -> RE: BDSM art and stories now illegal (10/10/2005 7:50:44 PM)

quote:

Here's some recent events

This is all part of the effort on the war on terrorism. The real beef the radical Islamists have with the west is the decadent lifestyle. Eliminate the decadence and eliminate terrorism. That is a lot simpler than finding and eliminating Bin Laden.

quote:

There is something about sitting in that chair knowing that generations of law scholars and students will be reading your words, that you truely don't have to answer to anything but your conscience that can make a person grow.

Then again, we have Anton Scalia!

I think Scalia is fully aware that generations of legal scholars will be analysing his work and he intends to influence them. But then again we have Clarence Thomas who is too dumb to realize that future generations of legal scholars will be laughing at him.



frenchpet -> RE: BDSM art and stories now illegal (10/11/2005 2:54:15 AM)

Aw... it will pass. In the 60's, de Gaulle's zealous minister (US : secretary) of culture (... just wondering, who is secretary of culture in the USA ?[8D]) André Malraux banned the slightest forms of pornography. Cineasts had a great time making allusions to sex and homosexuality in all their movies, to play smart ass with the censors. The funny thing is that André Malraux used to sell pornographic books when he was young (that is, at a time when André Gide was tried for pornography). He was just blinded by de Gaulle's erm... conservatism.

Where are we now regarding censorship ? Well, if I stay up late enough I can hear famous people on TV openly talking about their S/M kinks, and once in a while I see collections of pornographic / BDSM books for sale, between comic books and history books. (And a former minister of culture encouraged gay pride parades in Paris).

Dubya won't be here forever.



JohnWarren -> RE: BDSM art and stories now illegal (10/11/2005 4:29:39 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: frenchpet

Aw... it will pass. In the 60's, de Gaulle's zealous minister (US : secretary) of culture (... just wondering, who is secretary of culture in the USA ?[8D]) André Malraux banned the slightest forms of pornography. Cineasts had a great time making allusions to sex and homosexuality in all their movies, to play smart ass with the censors. The funny thing is that André Malraux used to sell pornographic books when he was young (that is, at a time when André Gide was tried for pornography). He was just blinded by de Gaulle's erm... conservatism.

Where are we now regarding censorship ? Well, if I stay up late enough I can hear famous people on TV openly talking about their S/M kinks, and once in a while I see collections of pornographic / BDSM books for sale, between comic books and history books. (And a former minister of culture encouraged gay pride parades in Paris).

Dubya won't be here forever.


But his supreme court appointments will be around for a long time. Burger was instrumental in turning back literary freedom with Miller v California.

And while we are waiting for your expected change, how many will be hurt?

It's easy to laugh about the thunder... when the lightning hits far away.




onceburned -> RE: BDSM art and stories now illegal (10/11/2005 6:17:24 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: JohnWarren
Then again, we have Anton Scalia!


Our new Chief Justice, John Roberts, may be cause for concern too. Granted, people can change a lot in 20 years, but in 1985 he recommended that Reagan not be given the CDC's summary: "As far as our best scientists have been able to determine, AIDS virus is not transmitted through casual or routine contact."

Reagan went on to give a speech saying he wouldn't let a child of his go to school or play with a child who has AIDS. The speech contradicted a CDC advisory that had been issued three weeks earlier which stated "casual person-to-person contact as would occur among schoolchildren appears to pose no risk."

Roberts defended his views in a memo:"I do not think we should have the President taking a position on a disputed scientific issue of this sort. There is much to commend the view that we should assume AIDS can be transmitted through casual or routine contact, as is true with many viruses, until it is demonstrated that it cannot be, and no scientist has said AIDS definitely cannot be so transmitted."

quote:

Roberts's speculation about "AIDS transmission" was as indefensible in 1985 as it is today. By 1983, scientists had identified a retrovirus as the cause of AIDS. This retrovirus, later named Human Immunodeficiency Virus (HIV), was known to infect only upon entering the bloodstream, directly or through mucosal membranes--not through intact skin. AIDS had been diagnosed only among individuals having intimate sexual contact with those infected, or those who were exposed to infected blood or blood products. There were no cases of AIDS identified among the caregivers and family members who were not sexual partners of those with AIDS.

http://www.thenation.com/doc/20051010/webber

If our Chief Justice (for the next 30 years!) was willing to obstruct medical advice from the CDC back then, it has me wondering what other expert testimony he will be willing to ignore.



imtempting -> RE: BDSM art and stories now illegal (10/11/2005 7:35:48 AM)

Wait they want to ban porn :( Thats it im going on stike...



frenchpet -> RE: BDSM art and stories now illegal (10/11/2005 3:10:20 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: JohnWarren
It's easy to laugh about the thunder... when the lightning hits far away.

I'm not laughing... actually this kind of thing is exactly why I'm not crossing the pond, although I could make a much better living (I also have US citizenship...). That and maybe the fact that American people seem to take food either not seriously enough or too seriously.[8D]



Lordandmaster -> RE: BDSM art and stories now illegal (10/11/2005 3:26:10 PM)

I'm not so sure that this right-wing stuff will pass away, at least not easily. There won't be significant political change in this country without some degree of popular outrage, and we are nowhere near that stage yet. Yes, 67% (or whatever it is) of the respondents in this poll and that poll say they don't approve of the job the President is doing, but in 2008 you can be damned sure they're going to vote against their interests yet again--that is, unless the economy is so bad by then that people really start to suffer (as in 1992). It just shows that even the people who are upset are upset for the wrong reasons. I mean, really, with all the unspeakable things that have been done since the election heist in 2000, people are up in arms over GASOLINE PRICES??? I don't know whom I'm more pissed off at: the President or the American electorate.



anthrosub -> RE: BDSM art and stories now illegal (10/11/2005 4:37:56 PM)

This thread occupied my thoughts a good part of the day. I always find myself getting angry whenever I allow myself to think of Bush for more than 10 seconds. My impression of him can be summed up in two words..."presumptious arrogance."

When he gave the State of the Union address in 2003, part of his speech was directed at the Iraqi people at large. He did his little "lean forward on the podium and smirk" thing that apparently is supposed to make him look folksy and said something to the effect of "we will be restoring your freedom" with a grin. The whole thing reminded me of the "Everyone wants to be an American" myth and he surely seemed to be brimming with it that night.

Now we see him inserting his version of what he believes are "good" people to sit in the Supreme Court. He claims to be all for religious freedom, yet everything he does is specifically oriented towards Christianity; as if when all is said and done, that really turns out to be the best "faith" to base all our initiatives on. If he was any more transparent, he'd be Handi-wrap. I can't wait for his term to end. I genuinely believe the next administration is going to be tasked with damage control and recovery from his escapades.

anthrosub



Sketchy -> RE: BDSM art and stories now illegal (10/12/2005 9:29:51 AM)

Now see this bugs the crap out of me. I'm working on developing my hentai art skills. Someone going to tell me it's illegal to do it? If i didn't already hate this government with a burning passion, I sure as hells do now. >.<



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