RE: Dominants & Self Importance (Full Version)

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Constrictor1 -> RE: Dominants & Self Importance (4/23/2008 3:31:08 PM)

Hi cloudboy!
Interesting question. I am important to myself. (The ego posits itself.) I am important to my mom. I am important to my brother. I am important to my slave. And indirectly to her son. If I had pets I would be important to them. To most other people I am pretty unimportant, and like it that way. As an aside to your question, I find that my slave is the most important thing I have/own. At this time I declare myself Master to only one , but W/we are searching for another. To others I am just Tim. I take what I do for those in my sphere of influnce very seriously. I do not take myself all that seriously since I am just a man with strengths and weaknesses. I constantly find myself laughing at some of the silly things that I do. I hope this does not fit into guidelines you have described, but if it does.....so be it. everyone has different perceptions. I hope this reply helps

Constrictor1



ownedgirlie -> RE: Dominants & Self Importance (4/23/2008 9:32:34 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

Thanks for all the replies. I must say STEELOFUTAH's response seemed particularly resonant ---- which is that for some subs "being used" is a turn on but isn't really the foundation for a LTR. (Not everything needs to be a LTR.)


Assuming "being used" is the only thing going on in that relationship, perhaps you're right.  But one can very much "be used" in a long term relationship, while still being a whole bunch of other things.  I have been Master's slave for 4 years.  I see him as superior to me but that is not a reflection of a negative view of myself.  It's simply how our relationship is structured.  He uses me when he wants to.  He uses me sexually, as his secretary, travel planner, researcher, massage therapist, companion, pet, you name it.  He sees to my needs while doing so.  We do not have a boyfriend/girlfriend/lover type of relationship, and we are both immensely fulfilled.

So yes, one can be used long term, have a rich and deep relationship, and be quite fulfilled.  This doesn't float everyone's boat, but it floats mine. :)



Leatherist -> RE: Dominants & Self Importance (4/23/2008 9:36:50 PM)

Insecure nariccism will always seek validation.



Loveisallyouneed -> RE: Dominants & Self Importance (4/24/2008 3:52:33 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

The flip side of the equation is: can a Dom be self effacing and unimportant --- and yet retain his or her dominance?

To use myself as an example, I don't think of myself as "important," but I do think some things are important. Hence, if I were a dominant, I would have an arrogance about things I believed in but a general sense of personal modesty. Hence a sub under me would strive for personal excellence to improve her own value and importance --- not to make me feel that **I** am important.


Interesting.

I've yet to see anyone mention "love", which has an amazing effect on those who place their own importance above others.



LaTigresse -> RE: Dominants & Self Importance (4/24/2008 4:11:44 AM)

Never assume that just because you cannot "see" something, it does not exist. Perhaps it is because, for some people like myself, we know so deeply within ourselves that those that are important to us and hold us important to them, share a deep love. It is the reason they are important to us.

I think if the question had been something like, "who is important to you, in your life and why?" or "In who's life are you important, and why?", you would have seen that little 4 letter word written a great deal.



stella41b -> RE: Dominants & Self Importance (4/24/2008 5:43:54 AM)

Being dominant is about being able to inspire, lead and influence. You become important only through other people, not yourself.



Real_Trouble -> RE: Dominants & Self Importance (4/24/2008 5:50:03 AM)

I'd post on this topic, but the text box that has been provided for my response is not large enough to fit my ego.

Ahem.



Loveisallyouneed -> RE: Dominants & Self Importance (4/24/2008 5:54:33 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

Never assume that just because you cannot "see" something, it does not exist. Perhaps it is because, for some people like myself, we know so deeply within ourselves that those that are important to us and hold us important to them, share a deep love. It is the reason they are important to us.

I think if the question had been something like, "who is important to you, in your life and why?" or "In who's life are you important, and why?", you would have seen that little 4 letter word written a great deal.


I am important only to the degree my love is valued by someone whom I love, trust and respect.

If none value my love, I am completely unimportant.

Loving one's self (self-importance) is no great feat, as anyone can accomplish that.

But to be loved by another whom one trusts, respects and loves creates a sense of value that no self-importance can touch.

Or so it is with me.



LaTigresse -> RE: Dominants & Self Importance (4/24/2008 8:59:31 AM)

I have known quite a few people that found it much easier to love others than themselves. But that is not what this thread is about now is it?



Loveisallyouneed -> RE: Dominants & Self Importance (4/24/2008 9:11:20 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

I have known quite a few people that found it much easier to love others than themselves.


You've misunderstood me.

It is not a question of what is easier, but rather what is more valuable.

Even mass murderers have thought themselves important enough to take the lives of others: why place self-importance on a pedestal when it has so little to do with our importance in the real world?

For that, only one who knows me, loves, trusts and respects me can validate any sense of self-importance I may have, providing she is one whom I also love, trust, respect and know. Otherwise there is no way of knowing whether the importance I assign myself is the result of ego or the result of an accurate assessment of my worth to those in my world.

If there are none who fit that description, then it really doesn't matter what I think of myself, for to the outside world I have no value whatsoever.

quote:


But that is not what this thread is about now is it?


From the OP:

"Is dominance, then, the project of self importance; making oneself important to another and valuing oneself highly?"

I believe my answer to this is "no, dominance is about making one's Beloved important and valuing her highly."




opentopassion -> RE: Dominants & Self Importance (4/24/2008 9:21:15 AM)

I find those with limited experience , try to cover that. Sometimes with unfounded self importance .
It's sad but mostly misleading . I'm trusting them with my life .. I expect and deserve honesty .I'm not here
to stroke someones ego at the expense of my safety .




Leatherist -> RE: Dominants & Self Importance (4/24/2008 9:56:23 AM)

True!
 
But who was it that created the much more common "gift of snubmission"-because I want to put that sucker in an oil drum and drop his ass into the marainas trench!
 
[:D]



Mercnbeth -> RE: Dominants & Self Importance (4/24/2008 10:16:39 AM)

There is no problem with feeling "self important" as long as the 'self is being represented accurately and the definition of self 'importance' represents fact when the representation is tested in the light of day, or, in this case, within a relationship. Coming in without integrity and attracting someone with lies would doom anyone eventually. The open trusting person, may not do anything up front, but eventually, when the work of 'acting' as the represented persona becomes too much they eventually see the truth and run away. That's why I always recommend that people verify and check everything possible before investing emotions and energy. Frauds are actually easy to determine. And nobody, Dom or sub, should accept "trust me" as an answer to a personal question at the inception of a contemplated relationship.

When I hire someone and find out they've lied, or as a well know Presidential candidate puts it "misrepresented", on their resume I make it a point to contact them and tell them; "Gee - you had the job based upon the interview, but verifying the facts I found you lied. Sorry - good luck."

I wonder what goes through people's minds when they lie so blatantly. Whether it's marital status, hight, weight, age, history, or plagiarized information. Anyone with so little confidence really has nothing to offer. Only a fool or someone just as shallow and insecure would find that kind of individual an ideal partner.

"Love" becomes a crutch for the insecure. It's a forgiving and accepting term. However, coming from a person 'outed' as shallow and lacking integrity, what does it represent? How weak must you be to believe you have to lie to attract a partner? At best, it becomes a ploy to achieve an agenda.

Love without confidence and self assurance is meaningless. Love coming from a fraud is valueless, no matter how nice the word sounds.



Loveisallyouneed -> RE: Dominants & Self Importance (4/24/2008 10:30:50 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

There is no problem with feeling "self important" as long as the 'self is being represented accurately and the definition of self 'importance' represents fact when the representation is tested in the light of day, or, in this case, within a relationship. Coming in without integrity and attracting someone with lies would doom anyone eventually. The open trusting person, may not do anything up front, but eventually, when the work of 'acting' as the represented persona becomes too much they eventually see the truth and run away. That's why I always recommend that people verify and check everything possible before investing emotions and energy. Frauds are actually easy to determine. And nobody, Dom or sub, should accept "trust me" as an answer to a personal question at the inception of a contemplated relationship.

When I hire someone and find out they've lied, or as a well know Presidential candidate puts it "misrepresented", on their resume I make it a point to contact them and tell them; "Gee - you had the job based upon the interview, but verifying the facts I found you lied. Sorry - good luck."

I wonder what goes through people's minds when they lie so blatantly. Whether it's marital status, hight, weight, age, history, or plagiarized information. Anyone with so little confidence really has nothing to offer. Only a fool or someone just as shallow and insecure would find that kind of individual an ideal partner.

"Love" becomes a crutch for the insecure. It's a forgiving and accepting term. However, coming from a person 'outed' as shallow and lacking integrity, what does it represent? How weak must you be to believe you have to lie to attract a partner? At best, it becomes a ploy to achieve an agenda.

Love without confidence and self assurance is meaningless. Love coming from a fraud is valueless, no matter how nice the word sounds.


That appears to be a good argument to shun anyone who speaks of Love, for if anyone speaking of Love can so thoroughly defraud others, why trust anyone who speaks of it?

Appealing to the cynicism and/or paranoia works on some folks, those pre-disposed to such doubts about their own ability to perceive sincerity and fraud.

And certainly there is enough fear-mongering in bdsm public forums to create a receptive audience, and thus feed the casual bdsm 'scene' where love is not required but fresh recruits seem to be in constant demand.

Just makes those of us whose bdsm practice is intimately intertwined with Love all the scarcer until Love is no longer something sought in public.

Then there will be no more talk of loved ones lost, for there will no loved ones involved in bdsm.

People can speak cynically of love, or the deceased. No accounting for poor social skills.

Doesn't change the fact that people love, and people die.



Leatherist -> RE: Dominants & Self Importance (4/24/2008 10:33:41 AM)

Love is sick when used to justify codependence.



MadRabbit -> RE: Dominants & Self Importance (4/24/2008 10:36:52 AM)

I agree completely, Merc. The real issue is when the line is crossed from "self important" to "self deception".

We get to see examples of this all the time on message boards like this. Claims to being members of secert elite organizations, falisfied personal histories, false credentials of being formally or specially "trained", egotistical images being created of virtue and integrity when the subtle actions of the person are not consistant with the ideal, falsifying personal tragedies in order to gain pity and sympathy, and false claims of contributing to important parts of BDSM history.

The "self importance" that we see on the Internet is often nothing more than a superficial image in a shameless attempt to hide insecurities.



kittinSol -> RE: Dominants & Self Importance (4/24/2008 10:40:56 AM)

It's not because we're into BDSM that quite a few of us aren't mentally scarred by some trauma buried deep in our past. In fact, I reckon that's a big source of people's sexual and other quirks.

I sometimes wonder whether some of the more 'boisterous' Dominants aren't trying to assert their sense of self-worth through their dominance. Perhaps some of them are insecure because of some experience sustained in childhood, hence their need to be so self-important in the eyes of others?

Just wondering...



Leatherist -> RE: Dominants & Self Importance (4/24/2008 10:43:13 AM)

Mom didn't love them, and dressed them funny?

[:D]



ShaktiSama -> RE: Dominants & Self Importance (4/24/2008 10:45:07 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol
Perhaps some of them are insecure because of some experience sustained in childhood, hence their need to be so self-important in the eyes of others?


Actually, most of us are suffering from post-traumatic stress following a series of alien abductions.

Sorry, we thought you knew.



Loveisallyouneed -> RE: Dominants & Self Importance (4/24/2008 10:45:25 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Leatherist

Love is sick when used to justify codependence.


Love does not perpetuate dysfunctional behaviour.

Love seeks to liberate us from dysfunctional behaviour.

Otherwise it isn't Love.



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