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RE: is service always required? - 5/20/2008 4:35:46 PM

thetammyjo

Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Windygal

This sub offered himself to me as a "sissy maid" but he has had so little experience, I don't think he knew what is was going to entail. Mostly he wanted to be humilated and tied up. I have never had a sub who didn't have to do something for me, usually household chores, but if I knew someone adapt in the arts or carpentry and home repair, that could certainly be his service. Or even teaching me a computer program I want to learn. I like to play, but it is okay for me if I don't, I don't crave it like he does, so to me I am doing HIM a service and he owes me one :)

Not the sissy maid thing exactly but I did have someone who offered to just be a general all around house/yard servant. We negotiated, I in completely good faith, and then a few weeks into it he freaked and said "You never want to play with me" and ended things.

That was a few years ago and to be honest I just don't believe anyone who claims they want to do household or maid work or whatever any more.

I think you may have experienced a similar thing. Someone who talks a good game but really doesn't have a clue and doesn't negotiate as he should then blames you for his failures to communicate well.

_____________________________

Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips & Chains,

TammyJo

Check out my website at http://www.thetammyjo.com Or www.tammyjoeckhart.com

And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

(in reply to Windygal)

Post #: 21

RE: is service always required? - 5/20/2008 5:21:56 PM

Madame4a

Posts: 2045
Joined: 2/4/2008
From: Washington, DC area
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Windygal

This sub offered himself to me as a "sissy maid" but he has had so little experience, I don't think he knew what is was going to entail. Mostly he wanted to be humilated and tied up. I have never had a sub who didn't have to do something for me, usually household chores, but if I knew someone adapt in the arts or carpentry and home repair, that could certainly be his service. Or even teaching me a computer program I want to learn. I like to play, but it is okay for me if I don't, I don't crave it like he does, so to me I am doing HIM a service and he owes me one :)

Many.. oh many years ago, I mentioned to a close friend who was also the owner of a dungeon that I thought I'd get a sissy maid to clean for me.. she said... and I quote "just pay for it, having someone in the life do it is more trouble than its worth" ...

I took that to heart... and I always keep it in mind... its a nice thought, but the reality is very different...ultimately, I was told the supervision required was beyond what you got out of the deal.. and it was better to pay someone, or do it yourself...

_____________________________

You're crazy bitch
But you f*ck so good, I'm on top of it
When I dream, I'm doing you all night
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(in reply to Windygal)

Post #: 22

RE: is service always required? - 5/20/2008 5:43:02 PM

MasterFireMaam

Posts: 5587
Joined: 3/1/2006
From: Charleston, WV
Status: offline

It depends on the person. Some ONLY do service (god, I miss my houseboy), some are ONLY play partners.

If he offered to do the service, tell him not to complain. If he does, well, that'd be an indication to me that he's only offering what he thinks will get him what he wants.

Master Fire

_____________________________

The power of who we are can be intoxicating. The power of who we could be is humbling.
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Ms Relationship Books
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(in reply to Windygal)

Post #: 23

RE: is service always required? - 5/20/2008 8:16:55 PM

BoiJen

Posts: 2608
Joined: 3/7/2007
Status: offline

Yes I have come to toot my own horn. :)

I'm here to let you know us "service" individuals DO exist. While my relationship with MsK is not quid pro quo, I do get rewarded. She has not given me an official "points" system, or tit for tat system. I just know that if the dishes are done, it's one less thing She needs to worry about and frees up Her mind for things like "I wonder how x, y, and z would work during play." Or even better...acting on those impulses.

She calls it "natural and logical consequences." Naturally if things are done around the house and yard and Her world is "right" it means that She's comfortable and happy and unburdened by these things. Does that mean I don't need a tap on the shoulder when I'm in the mood and the dishes haven't been put away? No it means if She knows they haven't been put away She sasy to me (not all of the time) "I'm willing this thing to be done with my brain...do you know what that is?"

lol..it's more fun than anything else...as I said...play isn't the immediate reward...it's just one of many I get for doing "it" right.

(in reply to MasterFireMaam)

Post #: 24

RE: is service always required? - 5/20/2008 8:43:52 PM

subjtoyou

Posts: 12
Joined: 12/18/2006
Status: offline

I really think that a True Service oriented submissive will do whatever is asked without Immediate expectation of any kind of play. The thought does exist (for me, at least) that at some point, that play will occur. I would not think that whineing about a first encounter would be warrented. Perhaps after several times with no play, a question might be raised to the Domme. If the agreement in advance was service with no play, then there should be no cause to whine on the submissive's part.

(in reply to BoiJen)

Post #: 25

RE: is service always required? - 5/20/2008 8:47:29 PM

MissMagnolia

Posts: 3636
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MamaDomme1

~~FR~~

I had a sub once that actually contacted me offering to do certain things....... I had him do them, he whined.

Notice the operative word in my first sentence. *Had*. He was gone after the first whine.

You met the same guy I did, MamaDomme???? Cuz oh yeah, I've been there too.

_____________________________

if at first you dont succeed..then skydiving isnt for you

Resident Whip Cracker AND Resident Orbs Of Joy.

(in reply to MamaDomme1)

Post #: 26

RE: is service always required? - 5/20/2008 8:47:43 PM

ElanSubdued

Posts: 1511
Status: offline

Windygal,

quote:

This sub offered himself to me as a "sissy maid" but he has had so little experience, I don't think he knew what is was going to entail. Mostly he wanted to be humiliated and tied up. I have never had a sub who didn't have to do something for me, usually household chores, but if I knew someone adapt in the arts or carpentry and home repair, that could certainly be his service. Or even teaching me a computer program I want to learn. I like to play, but it is okay for me if I don't, I don't crave it like he does, so to me I am doing HIM a service and he owes me one. :)

This sounds a little too quid pro quo-ish to me. If you feel he owes you something because his companionship isn't enjoyable enough on its own merits, you might want to consider whether it's worth spending time with this submissive. I see nothing wrong with you asking for service, but it sounds like you're only doing this for the service. When this is the case, I've often found it's better to hire a professional, ask a friend for help, or just do the job myself. I mean, does a sissy wearing a frilly maid's outfit really get the toilet any cleaner? If your goal is to have a particular job done, I think you'd be far better off getting someone who shows up in their grubbies ready to work.

Case in point, when I offer (or I'm asked) to help a Domina with a job, I'm there to get the job done and to help in whatever way I can. It's possible, if there is romantic/BDSM chemistry between us, that play might happen afterward or on a different day, but at that moment the focus is on cleaning or on whatever the task is at hand. I certainly don't expect play. I'm there because I want to help the Domina. To me, this is the headspace of someone who truly wants to help you.

Elan.

< Message edited by ElanSubdued -- 5/20/2008 9:00:28 PM >

(in reply to Windygal)

Post #: 27

RE: is service always required? - 5/20/2008 10:07:09 PM

MISTRESSKUMA

Posts: 226
Joined: 8/15/2007
Status: offline

Love, romance, sexual attraction/affection aren't prerequisites for play.

Tell him if he wants to be serviced, he's going to have to bring something to the table.

Op, there's nothing to be ashamed of in saying you want to exchange his labor for your topping skills.

I think that you should tell the self-rightous and narrow-minded, judgmental people to open up their minds. Op, you are looking out for YOU and its your right to want what you want. To hell with those that have moral issues.

That man got serviced but seems clearly to not like you enough to not whine about doing two tiny little things for you. Good golly.

Do what's best for you and be proud you like kinky service men and can actually find them to and save money by not having to hire out a boring professional cleaner when you can have a more interesting "maid" do it. Each to their own - whatever pulls your chain

(in reply to ElanSubdued)

Post #: 28

RE: is service always required? - 5/21/2008 2:37:48 PM

Wickad

Posts: 428
Joined: 3/12/2005
Status: offline

(fast reply)

Greetings,

To the OP ... you teach people how to treat you. If you accept this type of behaviour then it means you are okay with it and it will continue. If this type of behaviour does not appeal to you, then you should figure out why it doesn't appeal to you and put a stop to it. That stop may include, but is not confined to, ending the relationship. It might also be a matter of re-negotiating the relationship so as to have your needs met. In any case, as long as you accept a behaviour you encourage it, so decide what you want and go for it.

As to my own way of doing things ... I seek service freely given. This does not mean that I don't want to play but it does mean that I am not willing to be blackmailed into Topping someone in order to get that service. Service to me is not solely housework. Service is attending events with me as my boy, going to the mall with me as a companion, performing useful tasks that the boy is better suited to than myself, etc. For me, housework is a very personal thing as the person doing it gets to see all my messy little foibles. I have to really know someone and trust them in order to let them clean my house. It is sort of an indication of my affection for someone to let them clean my personal space.

I hope this helps,
Wickad

(in reply to MISTRESSKUMA)

Post #: 29

RE: is service always required? - 5/21/2008 3:46:09 PM

undergroundsea

Posts: 2400
Joined: 6/27/2004
From: Austin, TX
Status: offline

Miscellaneous thoughts:

Service can be something that can enhance the relationship or take away from the relationship based on: (1) how the two feel about it, and (2) how each goes about it. There are different motivations to provide or receive service and a partner's response at each end of the power roles can enhance or deflate this motivation.

For one who provides service, there are internal and external rewards and costs of service. How one feels about it depends on the sum of these rewards and costs. Sometimes it is not until one performs service that one learns the difference between the fantasy and reality; in fantasy the focus is on the rewards whereas reality also brings into the picture the costs.

Some subs do offer service as a means to get in the door, and this service has expectations attached to it. I think a discussion about why one wishes to provide service would help uncover what expectations and motivations come with the offer.

Some people think service is essential to BDSM; I think it is not. It is one of many acitivties or expressions in BDSM--although a common one--but those who do not enjoy it would be better off without forcing it.

I enjoy service and for me it's not a way to earn rewards but an activity that is rewarding in itself. I have difficulty with two ideas I often see associated with service:

1) Sometimes people think I am in love with the act itself and that one is doing me a favor by letting me do acts of service at a general event (a party). How I feel about providing service is affected by how I feel about the recipient of the service. If I provide general clean-up help at an event, unless I have service chemistry towards the main recipient of this help, I am not being a service submissive but instead a thoughtful or helpful guest.

2) If a submissive is asking to be topped or is not generally contributing to the relationship, an exchange of service for the energy given by the domme is fair enough. To the extent it is suggested that a submissive cannot be interesting enough without providing service, I disagree. If I see a relationship to be a broader one based on mutual interpersonal interest, a suggestion that I must provide service to keep the interest of the domme would adversely affect how I feel about the relationship. That said, I could enjoy a relationship that is based on service only (not a broader BDSM relationship but one based on the power roles only) to the extent this arrangement creates that that inspires the interest in such a dynamic; for me what creates this interest is an energy and dynamic (it is not a desire to be topped as barter) and the absence of the energy and dynamic would cause the interest to dissipate.

Cheers,

Sea

< Message edited by undergroundsea -- 5/21/2008 3:50:47 PM >

(in reply to Wickad)

Post #: 30

RE: is service always required? - 5/21/2008 4:50:17 PM

ElanSubdued

Posts: 1511
Status: offline

Mistress Kuma,

Your post is addressed to the OP, but seemingly you made indirect references to my post so I'll respond.

--- Love, romance, sexual attraction/affection
--- aren't prerequisites for play.

Agreed.

--- Tell him if he wants to be serviced, he's
--- going to have to bring something to the table.

I could be wrong, but I think the OP already did this. Perhaps she may need to remind / reinforce this.

--- Op, there's nothing to be ashamed of in
--- saying you want to exchange his labor for
--- your topping skills.

Agreed again.

--- I think that you should tell the self-rightous
--- and narrow-minded, judgmental people to
--- open up their minds. Op, you are looking out
--- for YOU and its your right to want what you
--- want. To hell with those that have moral issues.

I don't see anyone being self righteous, narrow minded, or judgmental in this thread. Rather, people (myself included) have given opinions and advice as per the OP's request.

--- That man got serviced but seems clearly to
--- not like you enough to not whine about doing
--- two tiny little things for you. Good golly.

This is why I suggested it's better to find someone who *does* like the OP and someone who is motivated to help and provide service.

--- Do what's best for you and be proud you like kinky
--- service men and can actually find them to and save
--- money by not having to hire out a boring professional
--- cleaner when you can have a more interesting "maid"
--- do it. Each to their own - whatever pulls your chain.

I couldn't agree more. When you mix kink with a desire to get a job done, the job becomes more complex and time consuming. Why? Because now one must manage both job requirements and kink requirements. There is literally more work to do. If this is what the OP wants, more power to her. However, if she just wants the job done, this approach is likely to slow the process down. Honestly, when you invite someone over for cleaning-oriented service and play, the cleaning isn't likely to get as much focus as it would if it were the focus on its own. Likewise, if the arrangement is purely quid pro quo and there is no friendship and/or attraction involved, once the sub gets what he/she wants, their motivation to do anything else is significantly reduced. Thus, I agree with whomever it was that posted "get the sub to do the job first, before giving the reward".

Elan.

(in reply to MISTRESSKUMA)

Post #: 31

RE: is service always required? - 5/21/2008 4:52:16 PM

ElanSubdued

Posts: 1511
Status: offline

Windygal,

Everyone has given helpful advice. I just gave thetammyjo, Wickad, and undergroundsea's posts another read. In my opinion, their words, cumulatively, address your situation rather well.

Elan.

< Message edited by ElanSubdued -- 5/21/2008 4:56:33 PM >

(in reply to Windygal)

Post #: 32

RE: is service always required? - 5/21/2008 5:32:34 PM

vampchick88

Posts: 346
Joined: 4/10/2007
Status: offline

Hmmm I think with pet I'll be doing most of the cleaning and he'll have other 'expectations and services' that I require of him. Service can have so many definitions in the lifestyle, we put all expectations and hard limits on the table when we first began talking so we worked from there. Service is not always required in my book, but pet always goes out on a limb for me helping me anyway he can, offering any service that he can help me with, its like small reminders of his dedication, devotion, and what he's willing to do for me. I know its not meant to be looked at as anything big, but its always the small things that speak the most to me.~Lorelei

_____________________________

Proud owner of rubberpet, the best investment of my time, trust, and heart that any Domme could ever dream of.

(in reply to Windygal)

Post #: 33

RE: is service always required? - 5/21/2008 7:50:38 PM

sjskuared

Posts: 51
Joined: 1/6/2005
Status: offline

I have a different take on this. To me a dominant is entitled to some level of service. I might not like what she wants me to do or I might really want to go somewhere else instead of stay indoors cleaning the bathroom so that is where the domination and submission enters into it. Is there a string? That depends on the situation. I have not really been interested in a pure houseboy situation although I have offered to enter into temporary contracts for houseboy training. I would not be interested in a long term houseboy thing without some other type of relationship, which might be just a friendship no sex relationship but purely no strings or pure service would eventually grate on me.

Paradoxiically, even though I feel the dominant is entitled to service, I would want some kind of praise or at least feedback on the job, either good job or you need to do this better. Whether it is a need for appreciation or simple politeness I think there should be a thank you or pat on the head.

(in reply to vampchick88)

Post #: 34

RE: is service always required? - 5/21/2008 9:33:55 PM

jim64

Posts: 86
Joined: 10/21/2007
Status: offline

i am not service oriented. i do a lot of house work, (dishes, laundry, etc.) This is not lifestyle related. Just, because i have always done it. Yet, being new to this, i feel like it is a part of it. One i never even knew about. i will never be a good service sub/slave however because this just does not play into my kink.

pleased to wash dishes,
jim

(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 35

RE: is service always required? - 5/23/2008 6:35:36 PM

MistressScarlot

Posts: 51
Joined: 12/7/2006
Status: offline

I always require the boys that I train to earn their playtime with domestic service, even boys who give tribute.

For my own boys, they take care of me domestically to repay me for all that I do as their Mistress.

Mistress S

(in reply to Windygal)

Post #: 36

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