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RE: Shaping and Molding - 5/20/2008 1:43:59 PM   
SimplyMichael


Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline 		I am not usually one for flowery wording over substance but this seems like the thread for it.

If you are unable to get a woman of the quality/level/thinness/whatever because you don't have what it takes to attract/keep one and then "molding" someone you took on as "less than/defective/unworthy" and forcing them to become what you would otherwise not be able to have.  In short, taking someone as a "fixer-upper" and trying to make them "better".

The problem with that is that most trying to do so don't have the requisite skills, if they did, they could find a suitable partner in the first place and would in all likelyhood have a different outlook anyway.  All they end up doing is making the submissive feel like a piece of shit and defective

I look at my partner as a beautiful rose who's growth I wish to shape, who's blossoms I want to achieve their fullest potential, who's structure I want to be graceful and strong with vibrant green foliage.  I don't want to take a weed and make it into a rose, I want the most perfect rose I can mold and shape.  I do that by nurturing it with what it needs for vibrant growth, cutting away the branches that are growing in the wrong direction, pruning the old blossoms to make way for the new.  A wild rose has a certain beauty, but I want a carefully manicured and picture perfect long stem red rose and one achieves that only through choosing an exceptional specimen to work with and then applying experience, dedication, and lots of hard work.

But the results?  Breathtaking...

(in reply to Owner4SexSlave)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: Shaping and Molding - 5/20/2008 1:49:17 PM   
CalifChick


Posts: 10717
Joined: 10/28/2007
From: California
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DominantJenny
Emphasis added...because my response is...are you? Really? Completely someone's ideal, with nothing they might want to change even a little?


I was referring to the negative connotations of the words.  To me, you shape and mold clay (for example) into what YOU want it to be, not necessarily what is best for it or what it wants to be (we'll forget for a moment that clay doesn't "want" anything).  Changing a little, encouraging, nurturing strengths, TO ME, none of that is shaping/molding.

If it is to you, that's fine.

I would hope that I can be someone's "ideal" and still not be perfect.

Cali


_____________________________

AKA "The Undisputed Goddess of Sarcasm", "Big Bad Cali" and "Yum Bum". Advisor to the Subbie Mafia, founding member of the W.A.C. and the Judgmental Bitches Brigade, member of the Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair-a's and Team Troll

(in reply to DominantJenny)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: Shaping and Molding - 5/20/2008 1:55:48 PM   
CalifChick


Posts: 10717
Joined: 10/28/2007
From: California
Status: offline 		Michael and I were typing at the same time, and you nailed it for me... I'm nobody's fixer-upper, and THAT'S the connotation I get from the phrase.  Thanks Mikey!

Cali


_____________________________

AKA "The Undisputed Goddess of Sarcasm", "Big Bad Cali" and "Yum Bum". Advisor to the Subbie Mafia, founding member of the W.A.C. and the Judgmental Bitches Brigade, member of the Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair-a's and Team Troll

(in reply to CalifChick)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Shaping and Molding - 5/20/2008 2:25:19 PM   
softness


Posts: 2918
Joined: 8/1/2006
From: Leeds, UK
Status: offline 		laughs ... is so totally content to be someones "fixer upper"

and is struggling to see the difference between Michael's very lovely poetic description of shaping the bloom ... and the desire to slim down ... tone up ... or in otherways titivate a girl because she is not quite perfection

its the same thing surely? shaping a bloom .. or molding clay ... or taking a rundown home and restoring its glory ... they are all about releasing innate potential - transforming the raw materials into something enw and vibrant according to one persons vision?

or am i way off the mark?

_____________________________

proudly wearing the blue collar of consideration to DK Leather, Leatherdykeuk, and LeatherEagle of the UK KRueL Leather Family

veritas, respectus honorque in corio





(in reply to CalifChick)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: Shaping and Molding - 5/20/2008 2:30:05 PM   
AquaticSub


Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner4SexSlave

For submissive/slave types;
"What does being shaped and molded actually mean to you personally"



It means nothing.

Those who seek to mold me can look elsewhere. I have changed and will continue to change throughout my relationship with Valyrean, but he has also changed and will continue to change.

We mold each other.

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to Owner4SexSlave)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Shaping and Molding - 5/20/2008 2:30:24 PM   
Justme696


Posts: 3236
Joined: 1/7/2008
From: Royal kingdom of the Netherlands
Status: offline 		I hate the words...my girl is not clay

_____________________________

~Been there, done that, got the t-shirt

(in reply to Owner4SexSlave)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Shaping and Molding - 5/20/2008 2:40:44 PM   
Owner4SexSlave


Posts: 1311
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline 		I'm proud I took a "fixer upper" and where she is today and how things have turned out for her 4 UM's,

In the start, she was taking prozac, was working a dead end factory job, was living in the bad part of town, had low self esteem, not much confidence, and many other things.

She's no longer on prozac, graduated from college with Honors, Is working out in the field helping people in need, Living in a different area, has great self esteem and confidence, Hell she even stopped smoking, so many other things.   3 of her UM's graduated from school now, off to college with scholarships and whatnot..

What the Hell is really so bad about a "Fixer Upper"...? 

(in reply to SimplyMichael)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: Shaping and Molding - 5/20/2008 2:43:28 PM   
Owner4SexSlave


Posts: 1311
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: softness

laughs ... is so totally content to be someones "fixer upper"

and is struggling to see the difference between Michael's very lovely poetic description of shaping the bloom ... and the desire to slim down ... tone up ... or in otherways titivate a girl because she is not quite perfection

its the same thing surely? shaping a bloom .. or molding clay ... or taking a rundown home and restoring its glory ... they are all about releasing innate potential - transforming the raw materials into something enw and vibrant according to one persons vision?

or am i way off the mark?

If you are, just know you are not alone!

(in reply to softness)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Shaping and Molding - 5/20/2008 2:44:00 PM   
LivLifeByMyRules


Posts: 6
Joined: 11/26/2004
Status: offline 		I have to agree with CreativeDominant about the desire for clear communication, and the challenge in achieving it. As part of my business I have used an exercise where I share a single word with the audience, a simple word, "dog" and people are amazed when you begin to get specific, that not one person in the room had an identical representation of such a simple word. Now add into the mix, such a diverse lifestyle as D/s, and open the floodgates for massive communication challenges.

With that said, there were a few thoughts that arose while reading the different responses. For me, life is a continuing journey of exploration and evolution. Change is constant, growth is optional. No matter what age, I hope to retain that perspective on life. So I would also look for that mindset in someone I would be entering into a relationship with. I am constantly shaping and molding myself into the best person I can be, and I seek someone who has that same "standard". As others also noted, there has to be compatability on every level, mental, emotional, spiritual, sexual, physical and financial for the foundation to even be created. And when the common foundation is present, then... in my perception, the shaping and molding are done to help each person become the best that they can become. Accent the assets, and limit the liabilities. (I've experienced that even that phrase can have people ready to crucify me). The reality is that we all have strengths and areas for improvement. In the relationship I seek, I would avoid at all costs a "fixer-upper", based on my definition of that phrase.  I am not looking to "save" or "rescue" or "build into my perfect ideal". AND I know what I seek in a partner, and am willing to help create that with the person who has that vision for themselves.

(in reply to Owner4SexSlave)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: Shaping and Molding - 5/20/2008 2:46:07 PM   
Justme696


Posts: 3236
Joined: 1/7/2008
From: Royal kingdom of the Netherlands
Status: offline 		well there is a difference to fall in love with some one in a bad situation...or to take some on on purpose to change her.

_____________________________

~Been there, done that, got the t-shirt

(in reply to Owner4SexSlave)
Profile   Post #: 50
RE: Shaping and Molding - 5/20/2008 2:54:31 PM   
MadRabbit


Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
Status: offline 		FR

It doesn't mean shaping or molding an individual into my ideal partner.

It means taking my ideal partner and showing them my individual prefences and how I like certain things.

How I like a bourbon and coke, how I like my cock sucked, the types of clothing I like to see my girls wear or don't wear, how I like their hair, etc, etc are shallow and superficial things that have no bearing on the "self" of the individual.

It's when you are not simply tailoring the external, but rather trying to change the internal, whether to improve or decline, that leads to problems.


< Message edited by MadRabbit -- 5/20/2008 2:55:41 PM >

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to Owner4SexSlave)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: Shaping and Molding - 5/20/2008 2:55:35 PM   
CalifChick


Posts: 10717
Joined: 10/28/2007
From: California
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner4SexSlave
What the Hell is really so bad about a "Fixer Upper"...? 


For you and others, apparently nothing.  For me, a heck of a lot.  For instance, I found the motivation within myself to lose weight, I didn't look outside myself for that, because I have found that when I try to change what I look like for someone else, it is always a disaster.  It has to be me doing it for ME.  But again, not everybody is like me.  And thank god for that.

Some of us are damsels in distress.  Some aren't.

Cali




_____________________________

AKA "The Undisputed Goddess of Sarcasm", "Big Bad Cali" and "Yum Bum". Advisor to the Subbie Mafia, founding member of the W.A.C. and the Judgmental Bitches Brigade, member of the Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair-a's and Team Troll

(in reply to Owner4SexSlave)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: Shaping and Molding - 5/20/2008 2:58:55 PM   
MadRabbit


Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner4SexSlave

What the Hell is really so bad about a "Fixer Upper"...? 


Motivation and the will to change is something that has to come internally, or else you will always be dragging and pushing them along...or in a lot of cases, no real change will ever occur.

It's the difference between the word "support" and the word "fix" in this connotation.

Edited to Add : It's pretty arrogant to think that you can really do anything to "fix" someone's internal issues...which why I think it constantly leads to problems when people try and do it. All you can do is "support" them as they deal with the issues themselves.


< Message edited by MadRabbit -- 5/20/2008 3:02:17 PM >

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to Owner4SexSlave)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Shaping and Molding - 5/20/2008 3:15:06 PM   
MadRabbit


Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: softness

laughs ... is so totally content to be someones "fixer upper"

and is struggling to see the difference between Michael's very lovely poetic description of shaping the bloom ... and the desire to slim down ... tone up ... or in otherways titivate a girl because she is not quite perfection

its the same thing surely? shaping a bloom .. or molding clay ... or taking a rundown home and restoring its glory ... they are all about releasing innate potential - transforming the raw materials into something enw and vibrant according to one persons vision?

or am i way off the mark?


I think it comes down to motivation, the person involved, and how one goes about doing it.

"Supporting" someone to improve and become better with a sense of security that they are "good" enough to be with you as they are now

V.S.

"Fixing" someone because they aren't "good" enough to be with you as they are now.

One is a positive and constructive and the other is a negative and a double edged sword that will probably end up damaging the person's self esteem even more.


_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to softness)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: Shaping and Molding - 5/20/2008 3:18:50 PM   
Owner4SexSlave


Posts: 1311
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner4SexSlave

What the Hell is really so bad about a "Fixer Upper"...? 


Motivation and the will to change is something that has to come internally, or else you will always be dragging and pushing them along...or in a lot of cases, no real change will ever occur.

It's the difference between the word "support" and the word "fix" in this connotation.

Edited to Add : It's pretty arrogant to think that you can really do anything to "fix" someone's internal issues...which why I think it constantly leads to problems when people try and do it. All you can do is "support" them as they deal with the issues themselves.



Often it's not the lack of motivation or will that is holding somebody back. 
It's their own fears, sense of worth, or belief in what they can do, is where the problems lays.

If you feel that this "arrogant"? Honestly?  To take somebody, and help fix there sense of value? Worth?  To have them face their own fears?  





(in reply to MadRabbit)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: Shaping and Molding - 5/20/2008 3:25:50 PM   
Owner4SexSlave


Posts: 1311
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit
"Fixing" someone because they aren't "good" enough to be with you as they are now.


"Fixing" by no implies what you just stated.  Seems like this word "fixing" also carries a negative meaning for some people as well.




(in reply to MadRabbit)
Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Shaping and Molding - 5/20/2008 3:27:08 PM   
Justme696


Posts: 3236
Joined: 1/7/2008
From: Royal kingdom of the Netherlands
Status: offline 		fixing in the context used..did sound negative to me too.
I guess helping/supporting was meant?

_____________________________

~Been there, done that, got the t-shirt

(in reply to Owner4SexSlave)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: Shaping and Molding - 5/20/2008 3:28:17 PM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline 		The thing with the Pygmalion obsession is that the sculptor runs the risk that his statue will shun him once he has finished perfecting and polishing her.

_____________________________



(in reply to Justme696)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: Shaping and Molding - 5/20/2008 3:30:25 PM   
SimplyMichael


Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

quote:

ORIGINAL: softness

laughs ... is so totally content to be someones "fixer upper"

and is struggling to see the difference between Michael's very lovely poetic description of shaping the bloom ... and the desire to slim down ... tone up ... or in otherways titivate a girl because she is not quite perfection

its the same thing surely? shaping a bloom .. or molding clay ... or taking a rundown home and restoring its glory ... they are all about releasing innate potential - transforming the raw materials into something enw and vibrant according to one persons vision?

or am i way off the mark?


I think it comes down to motivation, the person involved, and how one goes about doing it.

"Supporting" someone to improve and become better with a sense of security that they are "good" enough to be with you as they are now

V.S.

"Fixing" someone because they aren't "good" enough to be with you as they are now.

One is a positive and constructive and the other is a negative and a double edged sword that will probably end up damaging the person's self esteem even more.



What Rabbit said!  Saying "you are a fucked up piece of shit but sleep with me and I will make you better" isn't exactly uplifting.  Saying "you are a fucked up piece of shit but I see your inner beauty and I want to help you blossom" sounds great.  Being able to guide/inspire/force someone to blossom requires a larger dose of skill and luck than most people possess.

(in reply to MadRabbit)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: Shaping and Molding - 5/20/2008 3:30:59 PM   
UR2Badored


Posts: 506
Joined: 2/3/2007
Status: offline 		Without  some degree of shaping and molding, what exactly would a submissive be yielding to? 

_____________________________

A man who carries a cat by the tail learns something he can learn in no other way
Mark Twain

(in reply to Owner4SexSlave)
Profile   Post #: 60
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