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raped for being sub? - 7/23/2004 7:28:24 AM

sbmssvkitten

Posts: 61
Joined: 1/1/2004
From: North West UK
Status: offline

i didn't post this to be lectured by certain people. lecturing won't change it.

i only posted it as the subject came up on another forum and i thought it would be interesting to hear other peoples stories. or could this only happen to me?

i made the mistake last year and ask in my usual chatroom if someon would go to cinema with me as i didn't want to go alone. one guy who was a regular said he would meet me at the cinema and so we went to see the film. all public and stuff and the peopel in the room knew and most of them are real to. he seemed genuin so i thought why not as i would not go anywhere alone with him and i never ever wanted or even had the slightest intention to play with him ever.
still i seem to trust people far too easily so the next day he said he would be in town again in a day for a business meeting and would pop in 5 minutes for a cup of coffee. i didnt see too much problems there as i wasnt living alone, i had a bedsit in a student house so always other people there to and i played frequently in that room and think it safer than an hotel where noone knows you. anyways he turned up even though i told him that i would never ever play with him. he was in a weird mood the second he got there and did with me what he wanted. after people said he raped me, even thought it was only his fist. he damaged me. then some poeple said noone could play with me if i don't want but he did. a dom i was seeing later said that i pobably switched into sub-mode right away when he got there and hence could get his way. i tried to stop him as he really hurt me but that seemed useless so i just tried to forget it as i can't turn back time and i didn't fancy telling the police what i do i my personal life.
now a few weeks ago i heard that he does that to a lot of subs and right now tries to lure one from the states to live with him. she is aparently selling her farm....

_____________________________

tini lil innocent sweet kitten,
view my slave certificate and
my website

Post #: 1

RE: raped for being sub? - 7/23/2004 7:39:17 AM

Sinergy

Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline

quote:

anyways he turned up even though i told him that i would never ever play with him.

If you said "no" it is rape.

I am rather militant on this issue since I teach women's self defense :)

Just me, could be wrong, but there ya go.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle

(in reply to sbmssvkitten)

Post #: 2

RE: raped for being sub? - 7/23/2004 7:44:54 AM

melycious

Posts: 45
Joined: 1/20/2004
Status: offline

kitten..

i'm sorry for the pain and struggle this interaction has caused you. Lecturing is really irrelevant and to be honest.. what other people think or call or name the interaction is really not that important.. what is important is what YOU think of the interaction, and how it affected you... in the end of all of our day to day interactions, the only one we have to make peace with is ourself.

Perhaps the bigger question for you, is not, why did this happen to me or could it only happen to me.. but .. where is my head, my circle of friends, why did i feel the need to make a connection with someone i really didnt know at all?

As you stated, you had opportunities to do things differently, not look for a companion to go to the movies in a chat room, not give him your address, not allow him over for coffee, etc, dont get me wrong.. i'm not lecturing, simply put... sometimes, its more important to look at why you choose to do those things then to beat yourself up for doing them.............

As for police intervention, only you can decide, as for other subs, its a judgement call, and perhaps the interaction wasnt for you, but it is for someone else? hard to tell, hard to know....

Personally, i have meet up wiht someone and been very specific about not playing, and then finding myself in a place where play was introduced and i went along with it.. luckily i didnt have any long lasting issues, other then i had to look at myself in the mirror the next day.. and wonder why did i allow myself to be put in that place............ who gained from it? and why did i feel the need to expose myself to someone in that way?

i hope things resolve for you, and you make some good plans for meeting in the future and establishing a good circle of friends in RT ...

mely

(in reply to sbmssvkitten)

Post #: 3

RE: raped for being sub? - 7/23/2004 8:23:56 AM

sbmssvkitten

Posts: 61
Joined: 1/1/2004
From: North West UK
Status: offline

hmm

_____________________________

tini lil innocent sweet kitten,
view my slave certificate and
my website

(in reply to melycious)

Post #: 4

RE: raped for being sub? - 7/23/2004 8:41:39 AM

Zoycite

Posts: 24
Joined: 5/15/2004
From: Hopewell Jct, NY
Status: offline

You sound like me, being raped oh 3 times in my life right now, all by my 'friends'

Lets see, my first time was a rape, I was drugged up on anti depressents and I didn't know what was going on. My second was with a boyfriend, I said no... he took advantage of me, I suppose I let him do with me as he wanted because I wanted to get it over and done with.... and maybe because I used to care and trust him. My third was a good friend of mine who had fallen in love with me, I had a boyfriend at that time and he had come up from PA to visit me. We slept in a hotel room (I trust my friends enough, you know?) and I fell sleep, I woke up to him on top of me, in me.... now I didn't try to push him off I said "No... you're not Billy" and that was it. My body lay there helplessly, and I don't know why. I figured it was because he was my friend and I didn't want to get him in trouble, I didn't want to scream I didn't want to remember to think about it... to even try to struggle. Let him have his one night thrill.... as I bleed from the inside.

Perhaps it was the same with you? Even for me, I am a switch... I am both sides. I just was so slave like for some reason. I don't have a reason besides perhaps you trusted them and cared for them... and then were in such a state of shock you thought it be a dream or you blanked out and wanted to go to somewhere else in your mind.

I am sorry for your pain though, because I know what it is like. I do hope you heal... you will in due time. Though cowering at men for some time is always a hard thing because you don't know why you do it, you trust others but you will still have that weary feeling, at least I know I did.

I hope you are well... I can only try to help and give advice on my own experiences.

_____________________________

"Love is a double edged emotion, both pleasure... and pain"

[image]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v19/zoycite/Untitled6.jpg[/image]

(in reply to sbmssvkitten)

Post #: 5

RE: raped for being sub? - 7/23/2004 9:13:27 AM

LadyAngelika

Posts: 8070
Joined: 7/4/2004
Status: offline

kitten,

I'm sorry for your pain. melycious is right when she writes : “what is important is what YOU think of the interaction”.

Many women, and even some men, have experienced rape & sexual aggression. And though it may be a lesser occurrence, it can also happen to Dominants. I have had an experience where I played with a man who claimed to be sub only to have him try and turn the tables on me. I can have a resolute mind about my dominance, but I am 5’5” and relatively robust whereas he was 6’1” and quite strong. I managed to get out of the situation using my voice and my mental strength before anything serious happened but it did leave me traumatized.

Following that, much like melycious suggests, I took a look at my decision making processes and took more precautions.

I always try to get consent to play at a time before any play begins. E.g.: I meet someone, we talk, and we go back to our respective homes. We often do this a few times. Then I will email or call and ask if they are into going further. Then we meet again. I do this because 1) I believe it is important to get to know someone and discuss issues and limits before we get into the heat of the moment, and 2) I understand how it can be hard for a submissive to express that they don’t want to consent to play in the heat of the moment.

Whatever gender, sexual orientation or kink you identify as, when someone does something non-consensual to you, it is an aggression.

- LA

<edited for a typo>

< Message edited by LadyAngelika -- 7/23/2004 9:15:24 AM >

_____________________________

Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

(in reply to Sinergy)

Post #: 6

RE: raped for being sub? - 7/23/2004 9:52:42 AM

SirAardvark

Posts: 13
Status: offline

Being a sub has nothing to do with being raped. Cutting through the romantic illusions of BS that prevail far too often, you as a human being have a right to say no. There is no difference if a vanilla man rapes a vanilla woman or a dom rapes a sub. In fact, in many way, the rapist dom is far worse since he is preying off of what should be a consensual power exchange.

For what its worth, switching into sub mode is a very normal and human thing to do under such circumstances, and you should not blame yourself. You were not raped by the virtue of being a sub.

I hope that in some way the replies you received helped.

SirA

(in reply to sbmssvkitten)

Post #: 7

RE: raped for being sub? - 7/23/2004 10:27:42 AM

Leonidas

Posts: 2078
Joined: 2/16/2004
Status: offline

You are right in characterizing your actions as a mistake. You are also right that you don't need a lecture. I'm sure that you are a big girl, and perfectly capable of learning from the mistakes that you made on your own. The mistakes that you made don't make what he did any less wrong. He was dead wrong, and criminally so, but I'm sure that you know that too.

I'll offer something for you to think about in the hopes that it might help. The man took something from you by force. Whether you give him the power to continue taking from you, is up to you. For the amount of time that you are in agony over what happened, you are allowing him, and his act, to have power in your life. For the amount of time that you are robbed of joy, he is still robbing from you. You can say no.

Take care of yourself

Leonidas

(in reply to sbmssvkitten)

Post #: 8

RE: raped for being sub? - 7/23/2004 10:37:14 AM

LadyShoshin

Posts: 492
Joined: 7/19/2004
From: Burlington, Ontario
Status: offline

Sexual assault is sexual assault, you told him no and he ignored your boundaries. It sounds like he is a predator who has found fertile hunting grounds in the BDSM lifestyle. Make sure the subbie grapevine is working in your area, the subs he has raped need to say so. If you know the email addy of the one he is luring, write to her & tell her point blank about your experience, if you can get other subs to tell their stories, you may save some woman a lot of heart ache.

Let people in the community know he is dangerous, you can still go to the police, they don't give a shit about your lifestyle, if the women he has raped come forward you will have gotten a serial rapist off the streets. What happens when one fights back and he kills her, you will never forgive yourself. By coming forward you can save a life.

_____________________________

PHLOX: “It’s unethical for a doctor to cause harm...I can inflict as much pain as I like.”

(in reply to sbmssvkitten)

Post #: 9

RE: raped for being sub? - 7/23/2004 10:41:28 AM

sbmssvkitten

Posts: 61
Joined: 1/1/2004
From: North West UK
Status: offline

well it was over a year ago, i had just lost contact with a dom who i think loved but never managed to meet, then i went home jus tto find out thta i would spend my two weeks holidays with my family in hospital watching my grand dad die, and when i came back that dom broke off all contact with me. i was just sitting in my room crying cause icouldn't get over my grand dad and he not being any help what so ever wasn't good either. so maybe that made it easier for this guy to abuse me. he didn't have sex with me but he fisted me, first time ever, and i only ever had sex once before that, he tore me as i was bleeding and very sore for a while, guess that happened by my trying to pull away as he wouldn't stop even though i was screaming my head off. the damage he casued didn't go away though as he stretched me far too much, i can't keep my 'plug' in anymore since.

the dom i was with after took nearly three motnhs before we met as he decided i needed time to get over the one who just disapeared and he knew about the 'rape'. meeting him turned out that we didn't click so a week later i met my current master by chance. we are together since the days after we first spoke on pm and i am living with him since 4 months. yesterday i knew him for 11 months

_____________________________

tini lil innocent sweet kitten,
view my slave certificate and
my website

(in reply to Leonidas)

Post #: 10

RE: raped for being sub? - 7/23/2004 10:46:19 AM

sbmssvkitten

Posts: 61
Joined: 1/1/2004
From: North West UK
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyShoshin

Sexual assault is sexual assault, you told him no and he ignored your boundaries. It sounds like he is a predator who has found fertile hunting grounds in the BDSM lifestyle. Make sure the subbie grapevine is working in your area, the subs he has raped need to say so. If you know the email addy of the one he is luring, write to her & tell her point blank about your experience, if you can get other subs to tell their stories, you may save some woman a lot of heart ache.

Let people in the community know he is dangerous, you can still go to the police, they don't give a shit about your lifestyle, if the women he has raped come forward you will have gotten a serial rapist off the streets. What happens when one fights back and he kills her, you will never forgive yourself. By coming forward you can save a life.

i don't know the woman he is after right now, i heard form another sub who he nearly move din with that he has someone else, also she told me that he isn't divorced but lives with his wife and son. she had several of his id's from and aparently he is well known in the UK chatrooms now.
you saying he might kill someone? no he wont, i stopped him by pulling away at last, aparently all it needed was to get him away. but he is a liar and no dom at all, he is just some guy who thinks he can get cheap sex.

_____________________________

tini lil innocent sweet kitten,
view my slave certificate and
my website

(in reply to LadyShoshin)

Post #: 11

RE: raped for being sub? - 7/23/2004 11:28:18 AM

sub4hire

Posts: 6775
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

Kitten,
Knowledge is power. You made a mistake and you've learned from it. You are 100% correct lecturing you now isn't going to do anything.
If you know for a fact this man has done this to several. Depending on the statute of limitations in your area file rape charges. The mere fact you said no and he still had his way with you means it was rape. Any jackass would do the same. It doesn't matter if you are a sub or a vanilla woman.
Get the others to file with you and hey, he could be looking at being raped by the big boys himself in prison.

(in reply to sbmssvkitten)

Post #: 12

RE: raped for being sub? - 7/23/2004 12:01:16 PM

melycious

Posts: 45
Joined: 1/20/2004
Status: offline

~agrees that no means no... and non consent is non consent.. but i must say.. and i think kitten said it over and over........... sometimes what we think and feel is not the same as what our actions are..... i'm not condoning such behavior, as i believe that folks that play together are accountable to each other for tuning in.. i just also think..that sometimes, the messages we give, regardless of why we give them, are mixed.

As i said earlier, what felt so wrong to kitten, may well have felt like an awesome scene to some other person, that the forceful fisting and screaming was part of an earlier email, or something they discussed in a chat room... one of my favorite sayings.... there are 2 sides to every story and then there is the truth, for each of us, what we percieve as the truth looks different from each side..

i personally dont know the truth here, all i know is what i hear, which is kittens confusion about why she made the choices she did, and how she can integrate what she learned from them into her life now. I also hear the age old question, if i'm submissive, does that open me up to submitting to things i dont agree with, does being submissive in my heart mean that people will walk all over me to achieve their goals..and the biggest.. could it happen again?

perhaps i say this too much.. but know yourself first.. who you are, what you are comfortable with, learn from what you didnt know, and dont beat yourself up too much about how you learned it...

mely

(in reply to sub4hire)

Post #: 13

RE: raped for being sub? - 7/23/2004 12:34:03 PM

atmt777

Posts: 21
Joined: 5/23/2004
Status: offline

screams from the rooftops"DEATH AND RAPE ARE ALL THAT AWAITS RAPISTS AND THOSE NOT UNDERSTANDING THE UNSPOKEN NO IN A WOMANS EYES AND BODY" (kills all the rapists he can find)

Attachment (1)

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Vs0.0 and a bag full of nuts...

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Post #: 14

RE: raped for being sub? - 7/23/2004 4:40:20 PM

SherriA

Posts: 544
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

No lectures, just some questions.....

You say you "switched into sub-mode" when he got there. Do you not choose who you will submit to, or do you automatically submit to anyone who declares himself to be dominant?

I'm not sure I really understand what "switched into sub-mode" means. Does it mean that you became compliant and did whatever he wanted? That doesn't seem to be the case, since you say you resisted. So what does "switched into sub-mode" mean?

You said in the first post that you live in a house where other people are always present. In a later post you said you were screaming your head off. Did no one check to see what the problem was?

As for being too "stretched" to keep a plug (tampon?) in, try kegals. The vagina is a potential space...when there's nothing in it taking up room, it closes up on itself, pretty much. You can tighten and strengthen the muscles, though I'm having trouble understanding how they could have become so stretched that it's still an issue a year later. I'd suggest discussing this with your gynecologist, because it doesn't seem to be a natural reaction, at least from my understanding of what you're saying.

_____________________________

-- Sherri

Fighting for peace is like fucking for virginity.

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Post #: 15

RE: raped for being sub? - 7/23/2004 5:18:50 PM

LadyBeckett

Posts: 865
Joined: 2/4/2004
From: Scotland/Tennessee
Status: offline

Stories like this, even when a bit vague, leave me with the willy nillies. Committing an act of violence against another is wrong. Morally, Spiritually, and Legally...wrong. Once it is done, it can't be undone. All that can be done is what you are doing. Educate others, so that it won't happen again, to you, or to someone else. Remember this, learn from it, and take positive, realistic steps toward preventing this from happening to you again, with someone else.

You were a victim for a moment. I don't believe you are now.

_____________________________

Lady Beckett

_______________________________________________

"Submissive boys yearn to fall into their proper place, so the rest of their life will." ~ Lady Beckett

(in reply to sbmssvkitten)

Post #: 16

RE: raped for being sub? - 7/23/2004 6:39:51 PM

proudsub

Posts: 6142
Joined: 1/31/2004
From: Washington
Status: offline

Thank you for sharing your story sbmssvkitten, i'm sure that wasn't easy. I'm sorry you had to go through that. I also was wondering if anyone heard you screaming. BTW consensual fisting, even if done slowly can also cause tears and bleeding, but i have never heard of any long term damage.

_____________________________

proudsub

"Without goals you become what you were. With goals you become what you wish." .

"You are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts"--Alan Greenspan

(in reply to sbmssvkitten)

Post #: 17

RE: raped for being sub? - 7/23/2004 6:51:14 PM

MzBerlin

Posts: 378
Joined: 7/3/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyBeckett

Stories like this, even when a bit vague, leave me with the willy nillies. Committing an act of violence against another is wrong. Morally, Spiritually, and Legally...wrong. Once it is done, it can't be undone. All that can be done is what you are doing. Educate others, so that it won't happen again, to you, or to someone else. Remember this, learn from it, and take positive, realistic steps toward preventing this from happening to you again, with someone else.

You were a victim for a moment. I don't believe you are now.

*stands up and applauds*

Kitten-
You don't know me, and I don't know you, but feel free to mail my box and I will give you my IM if you'd like to talk about this. Or anything else for that matter.
As Always
(with a hug, if accepted)
Berlin

(in reply to LadyBeckett)

Post #: 18

RE: raped for being sub? - 7/24/2004 2:18:43 AM

sbmssvkitten

Posts: 61
Joined: 1/1/2004
From: North West UK
Status: offline

apparently noone heard or my screaming just seemed loud to me cause when i play with someone i want to play, at least before i was with my master, i didn't make a sound as to prevent people from hearing it or because it embarassed me. maybe i was unlucky and the other tennants were all out. all i know i sthat i screamed and he wouldn't stop so i tried to pull away.
and the thing i said about ' switching to sub-mode' is something the dom i was with at taht time said wheni told him what had happened. hence i never ever been with a dom on my own ever again if i didn't want to play. i threw one guy out once, the first 'dom' i met, at he didn't respect me and he did it again after i gave him another chance so i stopped him as i had no respect left for him. but that wasn't the first time i played with that guy, althought i met him to play so that was still different than what this 'rapist' did as i had told him that i woudnt play with him even before meeting and he still played and i sort of let him and i still don't know why. so i can't answer your question as to why i submitted.

_____________________________

tini lil innocent sweet kitten,
view my slave certificate and
my website

(in reply to MzBerlin)

Post #: 19

RE: raped for being sub? - 7/24/2004 2:55:09 AM

atmt777

Posts: 21
Joined: 5/23/2004
Status: offline

fisting is an unusual thing for men to understand. what they dont get is that just because a baby can come out does not mean you can just ram your fucking fist in there. The best i've ever done was four fingers i never ask but i do push the limits, a real dom should have been able to tell from body language alone that it wasn't fun for anyone but him, and the point of limit pushing is always suppose to be a good time for the giver AND reciever. He sounds like a serial rapist(profile).

_____________________________

Vs0.0 and a bag full of nuts...

(in reply to sbmssvkitten)

Post #: 20

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