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RE: What If? - 6/4/2008 4:31:39 PM

celticlord2112

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Alumbrado

Sorry, this is simply not true. I know too many commissioned and non-commissioned military members with family or even themselves born in foreign countries,with DoD top level clearances. FI a concern, but not the total and automatic bar that DA claims.

DA did not claim the bar was total and automatic. His claim was (correctly) that the totality of Obama's answers would not augur well for his receiving a security clearance. DA is quite certain that Obama could not receive a security clearance, and that much is undeniably problematic, but that does not change the reality that Obama's background does have question marks that a security check would flag.

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RE: What If? - 6/4/2008 4:55:41 PM

pinksugarsub

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LotusSong

quote:

ORIGINAL: pinksugarsub

i know this thread is supposed to be tongue-in-cheek, but i do wonder about an Obama presidency; he'd still have a Democratic Congress but i don't know if he has the experience to deal with entrenched lawmakers and the underbelly of politics. It was incredibably bad in Florida; i can only imagine what goes on at the federal level.

That, and the fact that the executive branch has grown so huge, especially with the Dept of Homeland Security. i really wonder what kind of learning curve he'd be on, and how well we'd do while he scaled it.

pinksugarsub

My post here wasn't all that tongue in cheek. Know that saying "Be careful what you wish for.. you may get it"?

Obama can no longer play the race card because with the nomination.. it is no longer an issue and the reverse would be true.. if Hillary got it- females could no longer say "I'm held back because of the glass ceiling".

Either situation puts their success or failure squarely in their laps.

There's actually a name for the logical fallacy in yr arument, but i forget it, and i'm too lazy to go look it up. Basically, "all poodles are dogs, but not all dogs are poodles".

The existence of an African-American presidency or a female presidency does not, by extension, eliminate all racism and sexism in America. It does, however, show that change has occured.

i remember when Kennedy ran for office, and P/pl debated whether he was fit to serve, as he was a catholic and therefore "beholden" to the Pope. Nowadays i dun think another catholic candidate would be subjected to that kind of speculation.

Things change; some get better, some get worse, and it's not the same for E/everyone.

i beginning to think P/pl who deny that racism even exists in this country are a lil "off"....but that's just me.

pinksugarsub

< Message edited by pinksugarsub -- 6/4/2008 4:58:38 PM >

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Post #: 42

RE: What If? - 6/4/2008 5:28:48 PM

slvemike4u

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Well said pinksugarsub...Obama's nomination should be hailed has the step forward it is,not the finish line it isn't

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RE: What If? - 6/4/2008 5:30:09 PM

atursvcMaam

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quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

How true and how sad.....once becoming President-Elect our new Commander-in-Chief is the at the top of the security-apparatus food chain....anything less and we are a banana republic.Whether that mans black or white the constitution makes no provision for...probably because the founders never could have envisioned a black president,apparently some still can't

quote from atursvcmaam

"What if they did?
What if the people around you are more concerned with putting the best person in office?
What if people are seriously concerned in getting answers to questions on issues of importance here and now. Not simply picking on a candidate based on where someone in his family might have been born.
Security is a real issue."...If the basis of your objection is the color of his skin ,which is the example i posted than that by definition is RACISM,it's really very simple when you see a black candidate instead of just a candidate you have a problem....sorry

Oh crap, you all are looking to kill my screen which is now all full of Pepsi.

About 4 years ago, another Democrat candidate promised and proposed to bring all of our troops home from the Mid east. i questioned his military background of 4 purple hearts as "does that mean he forgot to duck 4 times?" i was admiring Mr Bush's perhaps unanticipated result that after moving forces into the middle east, Al Qaeda did not do a follow up to 9/11 on US soil. McCain has issued his plan, Hillary discussed potential response scenarios, Obama plans to pull out of Iraq and redeploy in Afghanistan. i also recall that some congressional members of his party have proposed reinstating the draft over the last 4 years. quietly and unsuccessfully.
my color issue is that i would hate to see my kids in mandatory green.

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RE: What If? - 6/4/2008 5:32:41 PM

Irishknight

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I'm not sure anyone has denied that it exists in this country. Most of us just seem to assert that there are now more nonbigots than bigots. Sure, every single one of us has some event that has left us leary of a certain race or group of people. It is how we overcome that little part of us that makes us bigot or not. If we act on those feelings we become that which we should all rightly scorn. If we overreact, we are discriminating against our own ethnic group and we become laughable. If we treat each person as an individual that we don't owe anything to and who owes us nothing then we have overcome that little monster.

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RE: What If? - 6/4/2008 7:00:04 PM

pinksugarsub

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Irishknight

I'm not sure anyone has denied that it exists in this country. Most of us just seem to assert that there are now more nonbigots than bigots. Sure, every single one of us has some event that has left us leary of a certain race or group of people. It is how we overcome that little part of us that makes us bigot or not. If we act on those feelings we become that which we should all rightly scorn. If we overreact, we are discriminating against our own ethnic group and we become laughable. If we treat each person as an individual that we don't owe anything to and who owes us nothing then we have overcome that little monster.

i'm in favor of Restuitution, especially from corporations with proven histories of profitting from slave labor or the slave trade...which includes some very prominent insurance companies W/we're all familiar with.

i'd love to debate the issue with You s'time Irishknight. i'd have to do my research again 1st, so i'm not prepared to do so right now, but maybe soon?

pinksugarsub

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Post #: 46

RE: What If? - 6/5/2008 6:22:09 AM

atursvcMaam

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quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

How true and how sad.....once becoming President-Elect our new Commander-in-Chief is the at the top of the security-apparatus food chain....anything less and we are a banana republic.Whether that mans black or white the constitution makes no provision for...probably because the founders never could have envisioned a black president,apparently some still can't

quote from atursvcmaam

"What if they did?
What if the people around you are more concerned with putting the best person in office?
What if people are seriously concerned in getting answers to questions on issues of importance here and now. Not simply picking on a candidate based on where someone in his family might have been born.
Security is a real issue."...If the basis of your objection is the color of his skin ,which is the example i posted than that by definition is RACISM,it's really very simple when you see a black candidate instead of just a candidate you have a problem....sorry

one of your earlier quotes "you might be taken seriously...again if the charge of racism doesn't fit don't wear it... " (by the way, you are mixing up posters)

My friend, when my children, or someone that i work with, tries to redirect a discussion away from the point at hand i get suspicious. On the 2 occasions in my life that someone has called me a racist face to face,
    The first i dismissed one as a misunderstanding. i used a word that sounded bad within earshot of someone who took offense. my error, and it has been resolved.
       In the second, i was an appliance salesperson, we had an "limit one" ad on a TV that sold under our cost. A gentleman came in and wanted 2 of these TV's at the advertised price. i calmly pointed out to him that this was not possible. He loudly proclaimed that i was a racist. My supervisor, in a very brief statement said, "You could have picked anyone in the store to make that accusation, and i might have had to believe you, but you picked the wrong guy." The gent who started this looked at my boss and realized that continuing to claim unfair treatment on this basis was not going to go anywhere. i sold him 2 alternate TV's shook his hand, and told him, honestly, to have a great day.
       Back to the point, why is it that Obama and his supporters pull out this accusation whenever they don't want to answer a question regarding international skills? What is the reason for the sidestepping, where is the lie hiding?

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live hard, die young and leave a good looking corpse when you die.
Love ya, but, when the zombies start chasing us, i am tripping you.
The glass is always full, the question is, "with what?"

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RE: What If? - 6/5/2008 10:23:11 AM

slvemike4u

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Okay as i am loathe to direct the charge of racism at anyone i don't know let me be clear here,what I said and what I meant was if ANYONE's vote was based soley on the basis of color that by definition is racism.Again if it doesn't fit don't wear it,but some here have questioned,based on some security form whether or not the nominee from the Democratic Party is qualified to be a janitor,that is at the least an unkind and disigenuous question...again if offended I apologise

< Message edited by slvemike4u -- 6/5/2008 10:24:25 AM >

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