RE: "The City That Care Forgot"

RE: "The City That Care Forgot" (Full Version)

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Bethnai -> RE: "The City That Care Forgot" (6/7/2008 1:36:44 PM)
That rocks right off the bat. Do you track?

Irishknight -> RE: "The City That Care Forgot" (6/7/2008 1:46:42 PM)
I don't track anything anymore. I only listen to the tornado reports around here. Since I live on the Ar/Mo border, hurricanes are not a real worry. When I was living in Fl and Va, I did keep track of them as best I could. Now, if the news says that a hurricane is coming far enough inland to hit NE Ar, I am gettin the hell outta Dodge.

DomAviator -> RE: "The City That Care Forgot" (6/7/2008 2:08:14 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: cjan You can leave if you have the means to. That's one of the points. If you have no car, no money, at all, and not a pot to piss in, or are aged, ill or disabled you stay , prepare for the worst and tread water, if you're lucky. --- DA, and celticlird. your compassion for your fellow countrymen, as usual, underwhelms me. I hope you are never in a position to need a helping hand and are met with the same lack of compassion that you display to others. Wait, no... I hope that,exactly, is your fate. As I said, my 4 wheel drive Eddie Bauer Explorer - which is capable of evacuating me just about anywhere I want to go - including across creeks and through places where there arent even roads - in amazing comfort and style costs me $462 a month. This is $15.40 cents per day based on a 30 day month. Simple math $462 / 30 = 15.4 A person who can not raise $15.40 per day, through their own efforts is, not a contributing member of society. I have no love of parasites, hence the reason I purchased my dog and cat, but do not allow fleas to dwell upon them. I dont want to hear the "they dont have a car" excuse because for $15.40 a day they could have a top of the line luxury SUV with four wheel drive. If they are more the sedan type a BMW 325xi can be had for just over $11 a day. Of course used cars that arent in the luxury category can be had for much less... One think I am quite startled by observing the Katrina refugees., and I am sure Celtic can attest to this, is the number of obese ones... Perhaps if they cut back on their caloric intake, so as to reduce themselves to say 200 pounds or less, and got off their fat lazy asses to work they would be able to afford transportation and emergency preparedness supplies such as the ones I have on hand. The weight loss would also improve their ability to hike out if needed... [:D] (While reducing tax payer funded health care costs and increasing the number of parasites that can be loaded on a helicopter if evacuation is needed.) Another solution - have fewer children. If you dont have a job, and / or cant support the 5 kids you have already, then you need to be devoting your time to working - not fucking. A little afternoon delight is a luxury for those of us who can afford it.... You know, the buffet lunch at Treasures, and a blow job for dessert... The rich mans perk, but not a substitute for job hunting for the unemployed. Cutting down on the kids also helps the transportation issue as you dont need a greyhound bus to haul your family out of town. Finally, cigarettes (and I smoke a pack a day), liqour, fast food, etc - all of those things are expensive luxuries for those of us who can afford them... However, they are secondary to the realities of life. If you dont have a car, you need to be saving money for one - not buying bottles of Mad Dog 2020, beer, and lottery tickets... My asshole puckers every time I see a Katrina refugee buying alcohol, cigarettes, half a dozen happy meals or lotto tickets. As I said before, an Eddie Bauer Explorer can be had for the price of three crack rocks a day. They prefer the pipe to the SUV, then they face the consequences when it comes time to evacuate.

Irishknight -> RE: "The City That Care Forgot" (6/7/2008 2:15:05 PM)
How many of the "stranded people" could have walked the frak out? The answer is pretty simple .. a hell of a lot. As for the city not having the means, hmmm..... how many buses were sitting in the flooded areas full of water. I guaranty that our local school would send their buses out if asked to do so to save lives. It would also save their buses by getting them out of the area. The mayor had more than enough resources but not enough brains to use them.

Alumbrado -> RE: "The City That Care Forgot" (6/7/2008 2:17:10 PM)
quote: This statement by the NO mayor was made , as you very well know, when communications in the city were non-existant and was shown to be inacurate early on the the disaster . To cite it today is as disengenuous as Cheney' repeated claims that Al Quaida had ties to Sadam's regime. It is intellectually dishonest and, frankly, Alumbrado, you disappoint me. That statement was made by the NO mayor when he knew it wasn't true...because Katrina never scored the 'direct hit' on New Orleans. The city wasn't 'lost' to the storm, the streets were never heaped with hundreds of thousands of dead bodies, and there wasn't a swath of collapsed major buildings. Katrina veered away and made its real devastating landfall many miles away, only brushing New Orleans with some wind and rain from its weakest edge. The disaster occured when the levees built shoddily by corrupt local contractors (what a surprise) fell apart under the load of slowly rising extra water. The day after was plenty of evidence that Nagin was lying, and he continued to hold press conferences repeating the 'direct hit' lies (communications 'non-existent'? Who are you kidding?) in spite of the reality that looking out the window showed. That hoax was followed by more hoaxes along the lines of 'many of the police lost in the storm ' ( lost? They only existed on paper to begin with), the 'US troops machine gunning New Orleans citizens' and so on. All need to be called BS on, not romanticized. The last time this hoax came up, I posted links to actual photos of the 'Katrina aftermath' in New Orleans as opposed to where it actually hit. You have some nerve supporting such an easily disproven falsehood while projecting onto other people about dishonesty.

cjan -> RE: "The City That Care Forgot" (6/7/2008 2:20:59 PM)
So, by your standards and reasoning, DA, Katrina was a good thing that helped our society rid itself of self-indulgent parasites ? quote: Dickens: Ebeneezer groaned. Was there no escape from this foolishness? He tried to keep the world at bay, but it simply would not let him be. “Are there no prisons, no poorhouses?” he asked, hoping to get his point across with minimal fuss. “Plenty of prisons sir.” “And the workhouses are still in operation?” “They are, though I wish I could say they were not.” “The treadmill, and the poor law are in full vigor then.” “Both, very busy sir.” Scrooge sighed with relief. “Oh good. For a moment I thought from what you have said that something had happened to stop them in their usual course” “Under the understanding that they hardly provide Christian cheer of mind or body to the multitude, we are endeavoring to raise funds to buy the poor some meat and drink, and means of warmth. We choose this time especially because it is a time when want is most keenly felt, and abundance rejoices. What shall we put you down for?” “Nothing.” “You wish to remain anonymous?” What in the name of all that is holy was wrong with these men? How could anyone, even charity workers be so dense? “I wish, to be left alone. My taxes go to support the establishments I have mentioned, they cost enough, and those who are badly off must go there.” “But, many can’t go there. And many would rather die.” The second man finally spoke up. “If they’d rather die then they’d better do it. And decrease the surplus population.”

Vendaval -> RE: "The City That Care Forgot" (6/7/2008 2:24:39 PM)
Yes. The hurricanes were an easy way to minimize and/or eliminate the less desirable parts of New Orleans society. quote: ORIGINAL: stella41b quote: ORIGINAL: Bethnai This has been nothing but a property scam to remove the "bad" elements and put it in a suit that looks more acceptable to bank off the "soul". Sorry, I just had to type. Katrina makes me twitch. Aha, so this is why the rebuilding has been left to the casinos and nobody wants to talk about the trailer parks? Now I understand. (I think).

cjan -> RE: "The City That Care Forgot" (6/7/2008 2:27:10 PM)
Alumbrado, DA, IrishNight, et. al., Y'all are beating a dead horse. Regardless of who did/said what or who was responsible, be it local, state, fed government and/or corrupt builders/contractors and an inept Corp of Army Engineers...my question and concern and focus is, why, after three years of little action, do the American people not seem to give a damn about losing one of our major cities ? Have we become a nation of such selfish, hard hearted individuals as yourselves ? Say it isn't so, Joe. And, Alumbrado, I doubt whether the dead and displaced care very much if the disaster and flooding was caused by failure of the levves rather than a direct hit from the storm.

Estring -> RE: "The City That Care Forgot" (6/7/2008 2:30:28 PM)
The people of the US donated almost as much money and goods as they did for 9/11. And there were numerous reports of the government paying on fraudulent claims in the wake of the disaster. Nobody forgot the city. The lesson that people still aren't learning is that if you depend on the government to take care of you, whether it is on the federal level, state level, or local level, you will be screwed.

Irishknight -> RE: "The City That Care Forgot" (6/7/2008 2:34:55 PM)
Honestly, I admit to being hard hearted. If you go hiking in the mountains in the middle of winter and then get caught by the snow storm that the news has been telling us all is coming ... screw recuing you. My dollars should not go to stupidity and people shouldn't endanger themselves for you. If you get caught by a freak storm, I'll get right up to help look for you. If you see that a hurricane is coming and don't start walking ... that's your ass, not mine. If you can't walk, then it becomes the person in charge, in this case the mayor, who holds the responsibiliy to help you get out. If the shit pops up out of nowhere, I'll drive the boat to get you off the roof. The majority of the "stranded" were anything but stranded. They were lazy. If you are trying to help yourself, I'll help. If you are not, I'm not getting my tailfeathers ruffled doing all the work.

celticlord2112 -> RE: "The City That Care Forgot" (6/7/2008 2:35:11 PM)
quote: Alumbrado, DA, IrishNight, et. al., Y'all are beating a dead horse. Regardless of who did/said what or who was responsible, be it local, state, fed government and/or corrupt builders/contractors and an inept Corp of Army Engineers...my question and concern and focus is, why, after three years of little action, do the American people not seem to give a damn about losing one of our major cities ? Have we become a nation of such selfish, hard hearted individuals as yourselves ? Say it isn't so, Joe. If the actual residents of NOLA don't give enough of a damn to save their own city, what is anyone else supposed to do about it?

cjan -> RE: "The City That Care Forgot" (6/7/2008 2:40:34 PM)
So, just so we're clear, y'alls' position, toward your fellow countrymen is, basically, "Let them eat cake" and "devil take the hindmost".

DomAviator -> RE: "The City That Care Forgot" (6/7/2008 2:41:49 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: cjan Alumbrado, DA, IrishNight, et. al., Y'all are beating a dead horse. Regardless of who did/said what or who was responsible, be it local, state, fed government and/or corrupt builders/contractors and an inept Corp of Army Engineers...my question and concern and focus is, why, after three years of little action, do the American people not seem to give a damn about losing one of our major cities ? Have we become a nation of such selfish, hard hearted individuals as yourselves ? Say it isn't so, Joe. Yes Im hard hearted and I agree wholeheartedly with that dickens quote... Now for Celtic, Irish, Popeye etc... Tell me - if we all lived in the same place and OUR community was in danger of flooding due to a Levee break. Would we be looting or filling sandbags to shore up the levee? [:D] I bet we, and those like us would have shovels in hand holding the line wouldnt we? Its not without precendent... I recall floods in the midwest where every kid who could run a tractor loader was out in foul weather gear shoring it up.... Ive spent a summer on a wildland fire crew in Colorado where every man in town ages eight to eighty who could rake, shovel, or cut was building a break around town and the women and girls were cooking stew and bringing sandwiches... Didnt happen in NOLA did it? That cjan is the difference between a victim and a survivor...

Irishknight -> RE: "The City That Care Forgot" (6/7/2008 2:45:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: cjan So, just so we're clear, y'alls' position, toward your fellow countrymen is, basically, "Let them eat cake" and "devil take the hindmost". Incorrect, my position to ALL people is "Try to help yourself before you expect others to do it. Help does not mean that I do it for you. If you try and fail, I'll be glad to help you get it done." The first helping hand you look at should be your own.

cjan -> RE: "The City That Care Forgot" (6/7/2008 2:47:35 PM)
Thanky, kind sir (cough), for enlightening me on the difference between a victim and a survivor. Actually, I think it would be a grand idea to cede a piece of land to you, celticlaird, popeye and all those who hold your Ebeneezer Scrooge views. We could even pitch in to help you dig a moat and build a stockade so that you would be secure from us "victims" and riff-raff.

celticlord2112 -> RE: "The City That Care Forgot" (6/7/2008 2:48:43 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: cjan So, just so we're clear, y'alls' position, toward your fellow countrymen is, basically, "Let them eat cake" and "devil take the hindmost". My position is, explicitly, "we must tend our own garden" (the closing line of Voltaire's Candide).

popeye1250 -> RE: "The City That Care Forgot" (6/7/2008 2:51:12 PM)
Cjan, It's funny that our govt can't find the money to help out NOLA and the Gulf Coast but it was "no problem" finding $34.6 B Taxdollars for foreign aid 6 months ago! When do we start encircling Washington with a few million heavily armed Citizens?

Alumbrado -> RE: "The City That Care Forgot" (6/7/2008 2:55:21 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: cjan Thanky, kind sir (cough), for enlightening me on the difference between a victim and a survivor. Actually, I think it would be a grand idea to cede a piece of land to you, celticlaird, popeye and all those who hold your Ebeneezer Scrooge views. We could even pitch in to help you dig a moat and build a stockade so that you would be secure from us "victims" and riff-raff. The difference is that the victims are the ones you are trivializing, while some of the 'survivors' did so by gaming the disaster.

Irishknight -> RE: "The City That Care Forgot" (6/7/2008 2:55:45 PM)
A victim is someone who has NO control over the situation. Being able to walk out and CHOOSING not to makes one an idiot. And, DA is right. I would be out sandbagging and fighting for my community. I would come help you do the same thing to protect your community if it was needed. What I won't do is do it FOR you. I will work BESIDE you but not INSTEAD of you. Does that not make sense?

celticlord2112 -> RE: "The City That Care Forgot" (6/7/2008 3:00:16 PM)
quote: And, DA is right. I would be out sandbagging and fighting for my community. I would come help you do the same thing to protect your community if it was needed. What I won't do is do it FOR you. I will work BESIDE you but not INSTEAD of you. Does that not make sense? Makes perfect sense. But then, I'm the sort who refuses to be a victim of anything (except bad luck at cards).

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