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Responsibility to Self - 11/5/2005 6:41:46 PM   
kyraofMists


Posts: 3292
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline 		I have heard many statements lately where it appears that some are abdicating their responsibility for self to another. That this is what they think a D/s or M/s relationship is about. That the Dominant is the one responsible for the health, happiness and safety of the submissive and the submissive relies solely on them. It could be that my impressions are wrong, but is this the prevailing attitude about the relationships that we have? When a submissive enters a relationship with a Dominant do they relinquish their responsibilities that they have to themselves?

For myself, I am responsible for my health, happiness and safety. I am responsible for making sure that my needs are met. I am responsible for maintaining my well-being, physically, mentally and emotionally. I am responsible for making sure that I am in a relationship that will meet my needs and satisfy me. My Lord or alandra are not responsible for this and they can only help me along my path, but not do the work for me. I am in a poly M/s relationship and He controls whatever He wishes to control about my life. However, His first rule is that I am to protect His property, even if that means protecting it from Him. If my needs are not being met, then it is my responsibility to communicate this to Him. He has no wish to break His toys, but as well as He knows me, He still doesn’t know me better than I know myself. If I think that something He wishes me to do will damage or harm my well-being, then I am required to bring it to Him so that we may discuss it. I am responsible for making sure that I continue to grow and improve my character strengths and overcome my weaknesses. No one else can do it for me.

This is my opinion and I am not trying to say that everyone should share it. For me, if I do not take care of me, then I cannot take care of anyone else. And taking care of His property is taking care of Him.


Knight's kyra
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RE: Responsibility to Self - 11/5/2005 7:02:56 PM   
slavedesires


Posts: 669
Joined: 3/2/2004
Status: offline 		i have heard or read similar statements ALOT ..."I don't want to be a 100% 24/7 slave, because then I would lose part of myself....and then I wouldn't be the charming, witty, funny woman that I am..."

It is so sad that these girls think this way. D/s, M/s should be an interdependence not a codependence.

i agree with you kyra, 100%. If i did not retain my own sense of self and destiny on our journey, i am not sure Master would want me.

kudo's for such a lovely post.

_____________________________

i speak only my personal opinion, sometimes O/ours.

"i am the keeper of fragile things and i have kept what is indisolvable."
....the greatest gift.....vulnerability

(in reply to kyraofMists)
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RE: Responsibility to Self - 11/5/2005 7:26:59 PM   
LaMspeach


Posts: 794
Joined: 12/4/2004
From: Philadelphia area, PA
Status: offline 		I agree, kyra. I also believe. We can't make some one else responsible for our Happiness. We must find Happiness within before we can find it from out side sources.

I also believe we can't give away what we don’t have control over. So if we don’t have control over own lives, how can we give that control over to Our Master.

_____________________________

peach ~ LordandMasters devoted alpha slave
"Only when the year has grown cold does one know that the pine and cypress are the last to wither"



(in reply to kyraofMists)
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RE: Responsibility to Self - 11/5/2005 8:27:18 PM   
OscarHargraves


Posts: 693
Joined: 8/9/2005
Status: offline 		I'm sure there are relationships out there that work just as you've said where the Master is responsible for everything. I couldn't live like that and wouldn't want too.

Kyra you have the right idea. Don't let anyone change your mind on this. Your Master is indeed very wise and obviously is comfortable both with himself and his relationship with the two of you. I especially like your comment about 'His first rule'. That shows good sense and discretion along with an honest concern for his ladies. Do what's right FOR YOU and don't worry about what some of the other people do. Each person has to find their own nitch to occupy and you seem to be right where you should be.

Oh, and your Master appears to be a very lucky fellow. Good luck in all you do.

< Message edited by OscarHargraves -- 11/5/2005 8:28:20 PM >

_____________________________

Never drive faster than your guardian angel can fly ! !

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RE: Responsibility to Self - 11/6/2005 12:37:17 AM   
Phoenxx


Posts: 253
Joined: 1/1/2004
From: Swift Current
Status: offline 		Well said kyra. A Master can help and can guide, but ultimately without feed back we can do nothing. If you are not happy with yourself, no one can give you happiness.
I can and do set limits and goals for my girl(s). And expect them to be met. But if they are dangerous to their physical, mental or spiritual safety or growth, I need to be told. That is part of the responsibility of any sane person. Keeping yourself safe and happy.
Hey, I don’t know everything… just a bit of it ;-)
Tony

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RE: Responsibility to Self - 11/6/2005 1:03:41 AM   
Wolfie648


Posts: 600
Joined: 9/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

I have heard many statements lately where it appears that some are abdicating their responsibility for self to another. That this is what they think a D/s or M/s relationship is about. That the Dominant is the one responsible for the health, happiness and safety of the submissive and the submissive relies solely on them. It could be that my impressions are wrong, but is this the prevailing attitude about the relationships that we have? When a submissive enters a relationship with a Dominant do they relinquish their responsibilities that they have to themselves?


Yes what you describe is out there but I assure you it is hardly prevalent. Don't judge yourself by others standards - do what is right for you.

D (owner of j).

zomg I had a little i!

< Message edited by Wolfie648 -- 11/6/2005 1:04:08 AM >

_____________________________

Possibly.

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RE: Responsibility to Self - 11/6/2005 2:53:56 AM   
swtnsparkling


Posts: 1738
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		kyra,

Well said. Agree
Thank you


_____________________________

Never make anyone a priority who treats you as an option 2003

Walk in Peace
A "No" uttered from deepest conviction is better than a "Yes" uttered merely to please



(in reply to kyraofMists)
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RE: Responsibility to Self - 11/6/2005 5:21:17 AM   
fyreredsub


Posts: 3403
Joined: 10/7/2005
Status: offline 		i'm new to this lifestyle as a submissive. i have always considered myself to be strong and independant, a take charge kind of girl.
i have set numerous goals for myself 6 years ago and i am almost through achieving them and i take great pride in the fact i did it by myself.i am raising a housefull of kids.........and what is best about it is 6 yrs ago my ex hub's last words were..."you'll never make it"...well living well is the best revenge,lol.
no one is responsible for me or my world...................
however, i do not think it is wrong to have my Dom/Master incorporate behavior modification training so that i will be more successful or businesslike in the working world.
i can attain diet and exercise for my health on my own but a gentle nudge and rewards or discipline if that is the case ...can help on days when i don't feel like it.
just as i am proactive about my training and finding out what it is i need..........having a Dom/Master will not change me to any degree.........maybe polish me is about all

< Message edited by fyreredsub -- 11/6/2005 5:24:53 AM >

_____________________________

"Accordingly, men must then either fulfill their nature, or deny it, and in denying their nature, deny us ours, for ours is the complement to theirs. " Renegades

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RE: Responsibility to Self - 11/6/2005 5:25:15 AM   
KatyLied


Posts: 13029
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Pennsylvania
Status: offline
quote:

Don't judge yourself by others standards - do what is right for you.


wonderful words

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RE: Responsibility to Self - 11/6/2005 7:07:30 AM   
thetammyjo


Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline 		kyraofMists:

I would say that everyone in a relationship (regardless of the type) is responsible for their own safety and happiness by at the very least letting the others know there is a problem.

Obviously a 2 year old may not know the words to express the problems or the desire, a 2 year old may not be able to determine what is happening. But we are all adults, yes, who engage in BDSM of its many forms.

Plus as a dominant let me say that I know my own limits. I am not a mind reader and even if I were, my body is my body, I can't know what is going on internally with another body even as a mind reader I would see only the perceptions not the physical reaction. To expect me to be 100% responsible to protect and guide another human being is the equivalent of me not being honest with myself about what I'm capable of.

Do others have an impact on our lives, can they sometimes harm us against our will? Sadly yes. But that doesn't mean we need to act like it is all the time and completely out of our hands.


_____________________________

Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips & Chains,

TammyJo

Check out my website at http://www.thetammyjo.com Or www.tammyjoeckhart.com

And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

(in reply to kyraofMists)
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RE: Responsibility to Self - 11/6/2005 8:01:39 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline 		It tends to be a very romantic/passive perspective on submission/slavery. After a few months/years, they figure it out.

On the one hand, a dominant can very well be in charge and direct all of the things a slave does/encounters. It's a lot of work, specially in the beginning, and usually requires a fair amount of financial independent on the part of the dominant.

It is an interesting paradox I find between everyone clamoring how they are NOT a doormat! and are in fact a strong woman...and yet wanting to not be responsible or worry about anything when it comes to their personal relationship.

(in reply to kyraofMists)
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RE: Responsibility to Self - 11/6/2005 8:06:42 AM   
MistressYlwa


Posts: 263
Joined: 8/25/2005
Status: offline 		Personally, I find it impossible to control every aspect of a sub's wellbeing. As it has been said, they are the ones who know themselves better, physically, than anyone else.

Mistress Ylwa


You see what power is - holding someone elses fear in your hand and showing it to them! - Amy Tan

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
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RE: Responsibility to Self - 11/6/2005 8:49:32 AM   
LadyHibiscus


Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline 		Thank you for your wonderful post, Kyra!

Ms F

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RE: Responsibility to Self - 11/6/2005 8:59:58 AM   
MsIncognito


Posts: 742
Joined: 5/24/2005
Status: offline 		I think the mistake that many submissives/slaves make is that they surrender themselves to the person (i.e. the Dom or Master) when what they should surrender themselves to is submission or slavery itself. The Dom or Master simply provides a venue for them to express their submisison or slavery. I think it is too easy to abdicate personal responsibility when one surrenders themselves to another - it almost seems like a logical extension of surrender that this other person will become the one who is responsible. By surrendering to the submission/slavery rather than the person one retains personal responsibility and also retains their sense of self if the Dom/Master is suddenly no longer in the picture.

(in reply to kyraofMists)
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RE: Responsibility to Self - 11/6/2005 9:18:31 AM   
RiotGirl


Posts: 3149
Status: offline 		Gee and here i was thinking i wasnt such a good sub/slave. Hehehehe. Responsible for my self first? Responsible for my relationship? Really i thought i worried too much about it. During scenes, my safety is my first concern. And really, i always thought i should be leaving it up to him to be concerned about, but i cant. He says i worry too much, and i probably do, but when it comes to anything in my life i like to make sure its "okay". The orgy we didnt go to. Because i stressed my concerns on disease. i suppose i could of just let him worry about it and if i caught something blame it on him latter eh? Sounds like fun. When it comes to our relationship, and our M/s relationship, i worry and take care that things are going well. If i dont think something is on target, i bring it up.

i dooooooooooo love the idea that i am just being responsible, instead of just worrying too much or egads topping from the bottom! Cos really my IDEA was that we were supposed to just leave it all up to them. Glad i am not being less submissive.

thanks for the post OP, i learned something

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RE: Responsibility to Self - 11/6/2005 9:49:25 AM   
shydesiresMaster


Posts: 5
Joined: 7/23/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MsIncognito

I think the mistake that many submissives/slaves make is that they surrender themselves to the person (i.e. the Dom or Master) when what they should surrender themselves to is submission or slavery itself. The Dom or Master simply provides a venue for them to express their submisison or slavery. I think it is too easy to abdicate personal responsibility when one surrenders themselves to another - it almost seems like a logical extension of surrender that this other person will become the one who is responsible. By surrendering to the submission/slavery rather than the person one retains personal responsibility and also retains their sense of self if the Dom/Master is suddenly no longer in the picture.


Well said.

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RE: Responsibility to Self - 11/6/2005 10:21:53 AM   
KnightofMists


Posts: 7149
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MsIncognito

I think the mistake that many submissives/slaves make is that they surrender themselves to the person (i.e. the Dom or Master) when what they should surrender themselves to is submission or slavery itself. The Dom or Master simply provides a venue for them to express their submisison or slavery. I think it is too easy to abdicate personal responsibility when one surrenders themselves to another - it almost seems like a logical extension of surrender that this other person will become the one who is responsible. By surrendering to the submission/slavery rather than the person one retains personal responsibility and also retains their sense of self if the Dom/Master is suddenly no longer in the picture.


thank you for sharing these thoughts... I very much like this line of thinking and it is that is provoking thoughts of my own... and I love it when that happens.

_____________________________

Knight of Mists

An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

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RE: Responsibility to Self - 11/6/2005 11:15:09 AM   
kinkiminx


Posts: 73
Joined: 10/5/2005
From: Brighton, Sussex, UK
Status: offline
quote:

I think the mistake that many submissives/slaves make is that they surrender themselves to the person (i.e. the Dom or Master) when what they should surrender themselves to is submission or slavery itself. The Dom or Master simply provides a venue for them to express their submisison or slavery. I think it is too easy to abdicate personal responsibility when one surrenders themselves to another - it almost seems like a logical extension of surrender that this other person will become the one who is responsible. By surrendering to the submission/slavery rather than the person one retains personal responsibility and also retains their sense of self if the Dom/Master is suddenly no longer in the picture.


That's an interesting perspective... i partially agree, in the sense that a sub shouldn't need to give up all responsibility, though the idea that its better done by surrendering to submission itself is something which isn’t necessarily always true. though i'm not saying its wrong as i don't believe there's a right and wrong way to have a D/s relationship written in stone, but there is a right way for each couple that's completely different in each case.

For me, surrendering to submission or slavery would mean very little as i have no desire to be "a slave" or be "a sub" only someone's sub who i feel the desire to submit to. i can't, in all honesty describe myself as a sub at this moment, as i don't have a Dom!
If i enter into a D/s relationship, what is important is that I'm submitting to that person, and not simply the fact that i'm submitting.

As for retaining my sense of self, i cannot imagine myself wanting to ever lose it, in fact i would hope that a happy D/s relationship can promote a healthy sense of self in both the Dom and thr sub. In submitting, i would be giving up *control* but never giving up responsibility. D/s is part of life, but not all of life; i believe in having a healthy vanilla side to life too, and getting away from the world and my responsibilities is not my purpose for having a D/s relationship, possibly wouldn’t be a healthy one, and would make me feel like i was offering a Dom a burden more than a gift.

quote:

If I think that something He wishes me to do will damage or harm my well-being, then I am required to bring it to Him so that we may discuss it.


Exactly! In complete agreement here; one of the biggest responsibilies of a sub is to communicate with their Dom, if you don't voice your concerns, how can you expect someone to consider them?!

kinkiminx

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RE: Responsibility to Self - 11/6/2005 2:20:19 PM   
ImpGrrl


Posts: 575
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MsIncognito

I think the mistake that many submissives/slaves make is that they surrender themselves to the person (i.e. the Dom or Master) when what they should surrender themselves to is submission or slavery itself. The Dom or Master simply provides a venue for them to express their submisison or slavery. I think it is too easy to abdicate personal responsibility when one surrenders themselves to another - it almost seems like a logical extension of surrender that this other person will become the one who is responsible. By surrendering to the submission/slavery rather than the person one retains personal responsibility and also retains their sense of self if the Dom/Master is suddenly no longer in the picture.


I'm only interested in surrendering/submitting to the person I'm interested in surrendering/submitting to. He's only interested in me submitting to him. Not some idea/institution of a relational role.

This in no way lessens my personal responsibility (nor my perception of it).

I know I'm not the only s-type who feels this way.



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RE: Responsibility to Self - 11/6/2005 2:30:03 PM   
BeingChewsie


Posts: 1633
Joined: 10/27/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ImpGrrl


quote:

ORIGINAL: MsIncognito

I think the mistake that many submissives/slaves make is that they surrender themselves to the person (i.e. the Dom or Master) when what they should surrender themselves to is submission or slavery itself. The Dom or Master simply provides a venue for them to express their submisison or slavery. I think it is too easy to abdicate personal responsibility when one surrenders themselves to another - it almost seems like a logical extension of surrender that this other person will become the one who is responsible. By surrendering to the submission/slavery rather than the person one retains personal responsibility and also retains their sense of self if the Dom/Master is suddenly no longer in the picture.


I'm only interested in surrendering/submitting to the person I'm interested in surrendering/submitting to. He's only interested in me submitting to him. Not some idea/institution of a relational role.

This in no way lessens my personal responsibility (nor my perception of it).

I know I'm not the only s-type who feels this way.




No, you are not. I wanted to be enslaved by and to the _man_ not a concept. In many ways it increased my responsibility because I'm fully accountable to him and responsible for following _his_ directives in regard to my health, saftey, etc. His standards are bit higher than my own. I would let me eat chocolate, for starters :).

(in reply to ImpGrrl)
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