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ORIGINAL: AAkasha

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ORIGINAL: LadyLou

I have been a bit of a lurker here lately, but felt compelled to respond to this thread, as it resonates with me also. First things first though, hello :D

It’s a sad fact that ‘femdom’ porn seems male focused, because it is, that is where the big money is. The porn industry is about making money, and when it comes to femdom porn, most directors that make it just don’t have a clue, and cater to the angle they know that will make them money safely, hence why most of it is rubbish.

I actually think it’s a slight underestimation of the quality femdom porn market, I think there are also a lot of male subs who would buy into it as well, nowhere as near as much as the pantomime femdom porn, but I think femdom porn directed towards women, will inadvertently interest some male subs (please raise your hands if this is you lol), thus making it commercially viable.

I would pay, for quality porn that appeals to me. I’ve been looking for some for a long time, and found nothing but clichéd tripe. There have been times where I have been so dissatisfied with the quality of femdom porn, that I have considered making my own; I was so motivated by the utter tripe available that I went and did some long research into making my own femdom porn.


My femdom porn wish list:

I have various ideas for what I want to see, but the most important aspect is intensity and passion. Virtually all porn is lacklustre, stiff and comical. I want to see the participants *really* into it. Chemistry is SO important. As someone mentioned, I want to see the subtlety of the responses and interaction, as well as the more overt.

If the passion, intensity and chemistry is right, it doesn’t matter what the people look like, and to a certain extent, the activities.

Another thing that bothers me about femdom (and mainstream) porn, is the obsession with cock. I don’t care for close up shots of it, I don’t want to see a man frantically beating it off trying to stay hard for hours. I want to deal with the erection when I am ready and when/if I want it. Until then, it isn‘t important, it gets ignored, and he is my play thing - I want to see this reflected in femdom porn. The disproportionate male focus in any porn is big a turn off for me.

The whole, ‘weak male pig’ thing is a complete turn off as well.

And yeah, I agree about some femdon porn ‘storylines’ being about hating men, I don't want to see that, I can't relate to it. I want to see it from the angle of attraction, and doing it because they like each other… because BDSM is how they express their lust, as this is the angle I relate to.

I honestly get fed up with leather/pvc clad men and women in femdom porn, to me it’s the signature of bad femdom porn. I want to see realistic looking people. I want to see curvy attractive fem doms, and realistically/naturally attractive guys.

If it has a storyline, it needs to be a good, realistic plot and great storyline. A leather clad woman carrying a crop under her skirt, whilst watching over a male plumber in her kitchen is not realistic lol, and obviously catering to men. If it is a fantasy, then I want to see it treated as such, with a top notch story line and actors that can carry it off.

I also don’t want to see the woman ‘doing all the stuff’ to the man whilst he lays back and laps it up all the time. Whilst I want to see him being played and toyed with, and want to see his reaction to it, I’m also a sensation hedonist, and want to vicariously experience her getting pleasured and receiving. To me BDSM/domination isn’t necessarily about the male being passive, it's about the male pleasing whether that be in a passive or active role.  

Oh, and the most important thing - no fake orgasms! Another thing that is lacking in femdom (and vanilla) porn, is the genuine female orgasm, and the route that gets her there. I want to see femdom porn focused on the female orgasm - pretty much all porn I have seen, regardless of genre, lacks this. It’s almost as if it’s non existent, and when it does show it, it’s invariably fake, instantaneous, at the whim of the male, and achieved unrealistically.

Woah, that is a long list lol. So, uhhh, anybody know of any femdom porn like that? ;) I can’t believe there is not a market for all that is in my femdom porn wish list lol.

I'm with you on the entire wishlist. However, there's a big problem:  budget.

You want a good story line with a plot?  That requires a great script and believable actors.  Not likely found in porn.
You want intensity and passion?  That comes from not only chemistry, but great lighting, editing and music.  Not likely found in porn.

There's a whole list of reasons why porn in general can never be stylistically and passionately sound - it's not porn any longer, it's a feature film, or a short film - and with all those films come huge budgets, and still, often fall flat because it's so hard to get that to work.  I think that's the big challenge.

I'm all about finding a solution though - that isn't about hundreds of thousands of dollars, of course...
Akasha

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ORIGINAL: Coupleofwhats

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyLou

I have been a bit of a lurker here lately, but felt compelled to respond to this thread, as it resonates with me also. First things first though, hello :D

It’s a sad fact that ‘femdom’ porn seems male focused, because it is, that is where the big money is. The porn industry is about making money, and when it comes to femdom porn, most directors that make it just don’t have a clue, and cater to the angle they know that will make them money safely, hence why most of it is rubbish.

I actually think it’s a slight underestimation of the quality femdom porn market, I think there are also a lot of male subs who would buy into it as well, nowhere as near as much as the pantomime femdom porn, but I think femdom porn directed towards women, will inadvertently interest some male subs (please raise your hands if this is you lol), thus making it commercially viable.

I would pay, for quality porn that appeals to me. I’ve been looking for some for a long time, and found nothing but clichéd tripe. There have been times where I have been so dissatisfied with the quality of femdom porn, that I have considered making my own; I was so motivated by the utter tripe available that I went and did some long research into making my own femdom porn.


My femdom porn wish list:

I have various ideas for what I want to see, but the most important aspect is intensity and passion. Virtually all porn is lacklustre, stiff and comical. I want to see the participants *really* into it. Chemistry is SO important. As someone mentioned, I want to see the subtlety of the responses and interaction, as well as the more overt.

If the passion, intensity and chemistry is right, it doesn’t matter what the people look like, and to a certain extent, the activities.

Another thing that bothers me about femdom (and mainstream) porn, is the obsession with cock. I don’t care for close up shots of it, I don’t want to see a man frantically beating it off trying to stay hard for hours. I want to deal with the erection when I am ready and when/if I want it. Until then, it isn‘t important, it gets ignored, and he is my play thing - I want to see this reflected in femdom porn. The disproportionate male focus in any porn is big a turn off for me.

The whole, ‘weak male pig’ thing is a complete turn off as well.

And yeah, I agree about some femdon porn ‘storylines’ being about hating men, I don't want to see that, I can't relate to it. I want to see it from the angle of attraction, and doing it because they like each other… because BDSM is how they express their lust, as this is the angle I relate to.

I honestly get fed up with leather/pvc clad men and women in femdom porn, to me it’s the signature of bad femdom porn. I want to see realistic looking people. I want to see curvy attractive fem doms, and realistically/naturally attractive guys.

If it has a storyline, it needs to be a good, realistic plot and great storyline. A leather clad woman carrying a crop under her skirt, whilst watching over a male plumber in her kitchen is not realistic lol, and obviously catering to men. If it is a fantasy, then I want to see it treated as such, with a top notch story line and actors that can carry it off.

I also don’t want to see the woman ‘doing all the stuff’ to the man whilst he lays back and laps it up all the time. Whilst I want to see him being played and toyed with, and want to see his reaction to it, I’m also a sensation hedonist, and want to vicariously experience her getting pleasured and receiving. To me BDSM/domination isn’t necessarily about the male being passive, it's about the male pleasing whether that be in a passive or active role.

Oh, and the most important thing - no fake orgasms! Another thing that is lacking in femdom (and vanilla) porn, is the genuine female orgasm, and the route that gets her there. I want to see femdom porn focused on the female orgasm - pretty much all porn I have seen, regardless of genre, lacks this. It’s almost as if it’s non existent, and when it does show it, it’s invariably fake, instantaneous, at the whim of the male, and achieved unrealistically.

Woah, that is a long list lol. So, uhhh, anybody know of any femdom porn like that? ;) I can’t believe there is not a market for all that is in my femdom porn wish list lol.

Yes!
You're totally right about female orgasms: I roll my eyes everytime porn depicts going down on a woman as two licks and a kiss that instantly yields a mindblowingly orgasm. (If only!) Or they make it seem that ALL women can orgasm with just penetration: how convenient.

I also really really really don't get the pathetic groveling sub thing. That does NOTHING for me. Who came up with that, and why do so many guys gravitate towards it? It's just tiring and obnoxious.

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ORIGINAL: Coupleofwhats

Lately, I've found myself growing increasingly frustrated by Femdom's pornographic offerings. There's TONS of it out there, to be sure... but nothing I've seen really does it for me. I find that the storylines are usually ridiculous, the actresses look bored AND we spend 99% of the scene zoomed in on her. I want to watch a male sub be tortured, moan lasciviously in pain... not stare at a vulva or watch some dude lick her butt.

And why is everything about hating men? I have yet to find a Femdom clip that involves LIKING the sub. Or even acknowledging the sub as human. (Sooooo over the subhuman slave bit.)

Any suggestions on where to look?

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ORIGINAL: LadyLou
I think femdom porn directed towards women, will inadvertently interest some male subs (please raise your hands if this is you lol), thus making it commercially viable.

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I honestly get fed up with leather/pvc clad men and women in femdom porn,

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ORIGINAL: BoiJen

I'm still waiting on anything decent involving a FemDomme and a female bottom that can actually take shit.

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ORIGINAL: LadyLou
I agree, that great acting isn’t going to be found in porn lol. I think that a lot of this can be overcome by a couples or play partners who are willing maybe?

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ORIGINAL: subtex

I ran across a little 20sec clip that I like because the woman was wearing a t-shirt and jeans.  I don't usually like whipping scenes but this one seemed like a real scene between husband and wife in a garage.  I'm not sure why I like it but I think maybe so much porn is sameo-sameo anything that seems like real life is interesting.

http://www.rude.com/v/4PQ2cCYgyKk   I think you have to create an account to see this.

Here's a clip from Dusk Till Dawn that shows if you have enough budget even man hating POV can be good.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=zWhx2Q4dmt8

I would like to see storyline and relationships explored.  Something along the lines of Secretary would be great.  I think it would do well among sub men.  BTW how much money would it take to make a good porn movie?

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My biggest beef about this kind of porn is that some very quality subs watch these films and get the idea that this is how they are to behave when they are dominated - either like groveling idiots or like monotonous robots.

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ORIGINAL: AAkasha

The first time I saw any kind of femdom porn I was part shocked, part disgusted, and part hysterical - some of the stuff was downright *stupid* between the licking, groveling, hoods, dog barking, robotic "Yes Mistress" stuff - I mean I thought "oh my god, do people think that THIS is what I do when they find out I am into female domination!?"  I thought even a *ballgag* looked STUPID.  A dog leash? HELL NO!  All of that charade, to me, seemed absolutely laughable- how two people could engage in that and not LAUGH at each other was beyond me.  Yet, I was tying up my boyfriends every chance I could get, pulling hair, making them *beg*, making them kneel, forcing them to crawl, making them eat out of my palm, making them whimper .... I just wasn't *there* yet. 

Still, now, when I make a man wear a ballgag, and a collar and leash, and CRAWL to me, you can bet it's not stupid and campy and lame - at least, is't not to ME.  But is it to someone else?  Maybe.  That's what I don't understand or know.  I know that when I started dating and domming a lot of submissive guys I had to stop a LOT of bdsm "play" and say "hold it.  Dial down your SUBBYNESS about 10 notches, stop with the groveling and robotic 'yes mistress no mistress anything you want mistress' and when I say CRAWL, don't flop around on the floor like an embarrasment, do it SLOW and SENSUAL..." and we went from there, and toned down all that "caricature" submissive stuff that comes from bad BDSM porn.

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ORIGINAL: Morsigil

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ORIGINAL: AAkasha

The first time I saw any kind of femdom porn I was part shocked, part disgusted, and part hysterical - some of the stuff was downright *stupid* between the licking, groveling, hoods, dog barking, robotic "Yes Mistress" stuff - I mean I thought "oh my god, do people think that THIS is what I do when they find out I am into female domination!?"  I thought even a *ballgag* looked STUPID.  A dog leash? HELL NO!  All of that charade, to me, seemed absolutely laughable- how two people could engage in that and not LAUGH at each other was beyond me.  Yet, I was tying up my boyfriends every chance I could get, pulling hair, making them *beg*, making them kneel, forcing them to crawl, making them eat out of my palm, making them whimper .... I just wasn't *there* yet. 

Still, now, when I make a man wear a ballgag, and a collar and leash, and CRAWL to me, you can bet it's not stupid and campy and lame - at least, is't not to ME.  But is it to someone else?  Maybe.  That's what I don't understand or know.  I know that when I started dating and domming a lot of submissive guys I had to stop a LOT of bdsm "play" and say "hold it.  Dial down your SUBBYNESS about 10 notches, stop with the groveling and robotic 'yes mistress no mistress anything you want mistress' and when I say CRAWL, don't flop around on the floor like an embarrasment, do it SLOW and SENSUAL..." and we went from there, and toned down all that "caricature" submissive stuff that comes from bad BDSM porn.

"Dialing down the subbiness" is something I can get on-board with.When I watch a movie or a porn or play a video game I am seeking a conduit to fantasy. I like the characters to be deep, the story believable yet rich (even in fantasy or sci-fi contexts), and I have a personal appreciation for gritty realism. With your average "do me" male oriented femdom porn I often see one of two mistresses involved: the domme they warned you about, and the one who is simply doing it for a paycheck. The subs are all desperate fetishists. In other words, the characters are cliched and lifeless, we are throw into a story we know nothing about, and we don't even have an emotional attachment to the characters.

I was at a play party once and the host put on some porn. We all gathered to watch the opening during a lull in coversation, and it went from many close up shots of a woman enjoying the weather on a beach chair to her feet being licked by a leather masked man who came from outside the shot. I yelled, "AAAAH SEA MONSTER!", we had a laugh, and the host turned the crap off.

Anyway, tangents aside, it's difficult to box the swell of emotions that become involved when these acts are performed live. Most guys who watch this stuff will never have a dominant woman in their life (outside their vanilla wives), and are not willing, nor do they desire, to become anymore involved in their porn than it takes for them to come. I imagine someone with enough capital to start a small company oriented on porn for dommes and subs who genuinely wish to experience the reality of submission could make at least enough money to stay afloat. Truthfully I think they'd make tons of money, because even the worst porn makes undeserving people rich, and a quality film would become something of a staple in BDSM communities I'm sure.

I already have a brand name idea: BMFM - By Mistresses For Mistresses.

So this kind of fits in with a post I nearly started yesterday: can anyone give me a tidy list of genuine movies which either have BDSM/power play as the focus ("The Secretary"), or maybe not as the focus but a teasing little side note? I'm really looking for stuff of even higher quality than "The Secretary" and I know it is out there, because if it isn't then I'm stuck with the tripe we're all bitching about.

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ORIGINAL: Morsigil

I read a brief synposis of Bull Durham on IMDB and I began grinning as soon as they mentioned Susan Sorandon's role. I've read your story about the hockey galla and the penalty box.. You weren't the producer of this film were you?

Regarding the feasability issue, I made the mistake of not clearly defining what exactly "we're" creating here. I really like the ideas that you had, for instance the lack of direct footage of the strap-on going into the guy's ass, etc. The more carnal version of that scene, as you suggested, is what some men expect when they purchase a film like that, and you brought up a good point: the two audiences are unlikely to support each other.

That being said, if they won't support a tasteful film willingly then maybe it could be done a little less directly. Like a large coporation, a pornogrophy studio could invest it's money in a new brand, a new product, in order to diversify or publicize their company. While they normally provide relatively high quality movies that may try to stretch the envelope, but still "deliver", they could use their revenues (once comfortably making a profit) to produce this larger scale niche picture which may find some purchase in the general public as well as their core "do me" populace.

I have a feeling that there is a market for tasteful, pornographic cinema, and it simply hasn't been tapped with the correct appeal and business model. In Portland we have Cinema 21, a local theatre that plays indy films which vary in subject, and some of those movies selected to play are heavy in sexuality. In Portland at least, there are plenty of pretentious, intellectual, cinephiles who would love an excuse to righteously laud and support a quality, kinky film.

Hmmm... In my rambling I've found myself deep in "personal opinion" and "theoretical situation" territory.

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ORIGINAL: AAkasha

Oh, and how can I forget..one of the *hottest* kinky music videos ever - Taste It by INXS:  http://youtube.com/watch?v=eSuZHd5wLi4&feature=related


Akasha