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Birth control = abortion? - 7/22/2008 7:12:38 AM

defiantbadgirl

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What will they think of next?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/cristina-page/hhs-moves-to-define-contr_b_112887.html

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RE: Birth control = abortion? - 7/22/2008 7:32:05 AM

Owner59

Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
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This shit,is what I think about when the mediocrity claims there`s no difference between republicans and democrats.

You would`t be seeing this bull-crap if there was a democrat in charge.

We had the faith-healer in charge of our medical stuff,corporate insiders making regulations about corporations,corporate polluters in charge of regulating pollution,or you had one of many buddies and former roommates of Bush in charge of a major government agency.

At least Clinton hired the best and brightest to run the government and put actual doctors,and not faith-healers in positions of power.

(in reply to defiantbadgirl)

Post #: 2

RE: Birth control = abortion? - 7/22/2008 7:33:05 AM

hizgeorgiapeach

Posts: 1672
Status: offline

OY. Shit like this simply reminds me of why I'm glad I had my tubes tied years ago, and I'm getting closer and closer by the day to menopause...

Personally, I'm a strong advocate of Freedom of Choice on all fronts. My definition of when "life" begins - when the fetus has sufficient development to survive seperate from it's host, and therefore can survive as something other than a parasite on another organism. If a woman Wants to have a kid - great, more power to her. If she wants to Avoid having a kid - great, don't try to force her into doing so. As for men - until such time as they're able to concieve, gestate, and deliver a baby that has lived as a parasite in THEIR body - they get no say as far as I'm concerned. To me, they quit having a right to a voice in this particular issue 22 years ago. (And no, I won't apologize for this particular bit of gender bias - guys don't face pregnancy, women do.)

This is an already overcrowded mudball that we collectively call "home." Indiscriminate breeding does nothing to help that, and a lot to hurt it. Religious nuts who want to curtail reproductive responcibility on the part of those who choose not to burden an already overstrained system should be taken out and SHOT - multiple times - to make room for those whom they would foist off on the rest of humanity.

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(in reply to defiantbadgirl)

Post #: 3

RE: Birth control = abortion? - 7/22/2008 7:58:12 AM

DomKen

Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline

Nice little end run around Griswold v Connecticut. With the present SCOTUS they'll probably get away with it too.

(in reply to hizgeorgiapeach)

Post #: 4

RE: Birth control = abortion? - 7/22/2008 8:07:33 AM

greenearth21

Posts: 228
Joined: 7/9/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: hizgeorgiapeach

OY. Shit like this simply reminds me of why I'm glad I had my tubes tied years ago, and I'm getting closer and closer by the day to menopause...

Personally, I'm a strong advocate of Freedom of Choice on all fronts. My definition of when "life" begins - when the fetus has sufficient development to survive seperate from it's host, and therefore can survive as something other than a parasite on another organism. If a woman Wants to have a kid - great, more power to her. If she wants to Avoid having a kid - great, don't try to force her into doing so. As for men - until such time as they're able to concieve, gestate, and deliver a baby that has lived as a parasite in THEIR body - they get no say as far as I'm concerned. To me, they quit having a right to a voice in this particular issue 22 years ago. (And no, I won't apologize for this particular bit of gender bias - guys don't face pregnancy, women do.)

This is an already overcrowded mudball that we collectively call "home." Indiscriminate breeding does nothing to help that, and a lot to hurt it. Religious nuts who want to curtail reproductive responcibility on the part of those who choose not to burden an already overstrained system should be taken out and SHOT - multiple times - to make room for those whom they would foist off on the rest of humanity.

***gives a standing ovation**** Exactly what I would have said ...just much more concise and feistier (I just made that a word)

(in reply to hizgeorgiapeach)

Post #: 5

RE: Birth control = abortion? - 7/22/2008 8:08:52 AM

sub4hire

Posts: 6775
Joined: 1/1/2004
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We need to get the truly stupid people out of office. Get in less stupid people. Maybe just a few IQ points higher.

I don't agree that birth control should be the same as abortion. Yes people I am aware it says it is the Department of Health and Human services. Though I am also up on the Abstinence only act which is a Bush program. Many..(too many) states participate in.
Nebraska is one of those states. They take billions of dollars from the federal government every year to teach nothing. Nothing beyond abstinence. If a child asks a question about sex the teacher will refuse to answer. Leaving the child no where to get the right answer. The churches try to step in around here and teach something. Somehow getting all of your education from a pastor on sex just doesn't seem right.
Then people wonder why the teenage pregnancy rates continue to get higher and higher.

The 18 year old kid who lives next door to me told his mother the other day he "lost" his little card school gives him. She talks to him about sex all of the time..in some regard. He has a new girlfriend. We were talking and I asked him if he was at least wearing condoms. To which he asked me what a condom was. So, I then asked him if he was practicing safe sex. He said he was practicing what he was taught in school. Well our conversation went on and on. Essentially they taught him nothing at all. Nothing about STD's, nothing about anything that matters when it comes to sex.

In any event for states like these that have been taught nothing...yes they will pass any bill that says ban the pill because it is abortion. They just don't know any better.

(in reply to defiantbadgirl)

Post #: 6

RE: Birth control = abortion? - 7/22/2008 8:10:12 AM

Lynnxz

Posts: 4813
Joined: 10/3/2006
From: Atlanta
Status: offline

Those damn killler condoms.

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Post #: 7

RE: Birth control = abortion? - 7/22/2008 8:26:07 AM

slvemike4u

Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: hizgeorgiapeach

OY. Shit like this simply reminds me of why I'm glad I had my tubes tied years ago, and I'm getting closer and closer by the day to menopause...

Personally, I'm a strong advocate of Freedom of Choice on all fronts. My definition of when "life" begins - when the fetus has sufficient development to survive seperate from it's host, and therefore can survive as something other than a parasite on another organism. If a woman Wants to have a kid - great, more power to her. If she wants to Avoid having a kid - great, don't try to force her into doing so. As for men - until such time as they're able to concieve, gestate, and deliver a baby that has lived as a parasite in THEIR body - they get no say as far as I'm concerned. To me, they quit having a right to a voice in this particular issue 22 years ago. (And no, I won't apologize for this particular bit of gender bias - guys don't face pregnancy, women do.)

This is an already overcrowded mudball that we collectively call "home." Indiscriminate breeding does nothing to help that, and a lot to hurt it. Religious nuts who want to curtail reproductive responcibility on the part of those who choose not to burden an already overstrained system should be taken out and SHOT - multiple times - to make room for those whom they would foist off on the rest of humanity.

This is more than a "bit"of gender bias.While I fully concede a woman's choice in this matter,somewhere a man is involved....saying they have no voice in this discussion is a little rediculous!

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4

(in reply to hizgeorgiapeach)

Post #: 8

RE: Birth control = abortion? - 7/22/2008 8:27:03 AM

uninterested5

Posts: 55
Joined: 7/8/2008
Status: offline

I know abortion exists and happens and as an institution isn't going anywhere, but at the very least cut the bullshit and stop pretending it's some kind of inalienable "choice." A baby if just as dependent if not moreso after it's born. Why use the empty-headed, convoluted reasoning that it is your "right" as a woman to be a selfish whore and refuse to be answerable to nature, your higher morality, or the repercussions of your actions just because you think you can Johnnie Cochran some people on the internet into agreeing with you to spread the responsibility around? Please, by that rationale you could murder your kid at any point during like the next decade and a half for still being a "parasite."

Realistically, if you want to murder your kid before it's born because it's too inconvenient for you to raise and you want to play God and decide it's better off dead than being adopted or in foster care, I'm not going to lose sleep over it. If you murder the guy at Taco Bell because he took too long getting your food, I really don't care about that either. So murder your unborn child if you want, just never lose sight of the reason why: Because it was too inconvenient for you to endure a few months of pregnancy.

Those tools who respond and say "BUT NUITERSTED6 U IDOIT THAR R 2 MENY KIDS IN FAWSTER KARE!" If that's what you believe and how you think, try heading down to the orphanage or a shelter and explaining to all those children why their parents are insensitive for not having the foresight to preemptively decide they'd be better off dead.

I hope you think about it and relive it every night of your life.

< Message edited by uninterested5 -- 7/22/2008 8:29:25 AM >

(in reply to Lynnxz)

Post #: 9

RE: Birth control = abortion? - 7/22/2008 8:32:08 AM

Thadius

Posts: 5091
Joined: 10/11/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl

What will they think of next?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/cristina-page/hhs-moves-to-define-contr_b_112887.html

This article was nothing but grandstanding and fear mongering... Look at the source and where it is posted. Go to http://www.hhs.gov/ and check the information for yourselves. Just in case you want to navigate straight to the sections on birth control http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/birthcontrol.html#cat57 The latest news or anything about birth control from the Department of Health and Human services, is on a study of benefits of IUD extend beyond contraception. http://www.acog.org/from_home/publications/press_releases/nr05-06-08-2.cfm

Don't believe me, look for yourselves.
Thadius

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Post #: 10

RE: Birth control = abortion? - 7/22/2008 8:34:26 AM

Lynnxz

Posts: 4813
Joined: 10/3/2006
From: Atlanta
Status: offline

*Eyeroll*

So whats your view on the bc pill, Captain morality? Or condoms for that matter, jeeze. Or the Plan B pill, I've taken that before.

Personally, I don't think guys should get involved with the decision. He doesn't have to do anything... besides cum and go. ;) The woman is the one who gets to tote the thing around for 9 months.

< Message edited by Lynnxz -- 7/22/2008 8:38:54 AM >

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Post #: 11

RE: Birth control = abortion? - 7/22/2008 8:41:15 AM

slvemike4u

Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: uninterested5

I know abortion exists and happens and as an institution isn't going anywhere, but at the very least cut the bullshit and stop pretending it's some kind of inalienable "choice." A baby if just as dependent if not moreso after it's born. Why use the empty-headed, convoluted reasoning that it is your "right" as a woman to be a selfish whore and refuse to be answerable to nature, your higher morality, or the repercussions of your actions just because you think you can Johnnie Cochran some people on the internet into agreeing with you to spread the responsibility around? Please, by that rationale you could murder your kid at any point during like the next decade and a half for still being a "parasite."

Realistically, if you want to murder your kid before it's born because it's too inconvenient for you to raise and you want to play God and decide it's better off dead than being adopted or in foster care, I'm not going to lose sleep over it. If you murder the guy at Taco Bell because he took too long getting your food, I really don't care about that either. So murder your unborn child if you want, just never lose sight of the reason why: Because it was too inconvenient for you to endure a few months of pregnancy.

Those tools who respond and say "BUT NUITERSTED6 U IDOIT THAR R 2 MENY KIDS IN FAWSTER KARE!" If that's what you believe and how you think, try heading down to the orphanage or a shelter and explaining to all those children why their parents are insensitive for not having the foresight to preemptively decide they'd be better off dead.

I hope you think about it and relive it every night of your life.

Now the other ,equally rediculous ,viewpoint has been heard from....telling a woman who might have just made the most difficult decision in her life that she has committed murder is truly disgusting . Probably goes a long way torwards the first viewpoint that men have no place in the discussion...not helpful at all!

< Message edited by slvemike4u -- 7/22/2008 8:43:01 AM >

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4

(in reply to uninterested5)

Post #: 12

RE: Birth control = abortion? - 7/22/2008 8:42:31 AM

christine1

Posts: 6155
Joined: 12/15/2007
From: i'm headed to HIM...
Status: offline

i don't view birth control as abortion at all. i think it is a good thing, it shows that some thought and planning was done by the person practicing the birth control. if you don't want or can't support a child, it's a responsible thing to do.

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RE: Birth control = abortion? - 7/22/2008 8:47:20 AM

uninterested5

Posts: 55
Joined: 7/8/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

quote:

ORIGINAL: uninterested5

I know abortion exists and happens and as an institution isn't going anywhere, but at the very least cut the bullshit and stop pretending it's some kind of inalienable "choice." A baby if just as dependent if not moreso after it's born. Why use the empty-headed, convoluted reasoning that it is your "right" as a woman to be a selfish whore and refuse to be answerable to nature, your higher morality, or the repercussions of your actions just because you think you can Johnnie Cochran some people on the internet into agreeing with you to spread the responsibility around? Please, by that rationale you could murder your kid at any point during like the next decade and a half for still being a "parasite."

Realistically, if you want to murder your kid before it's born because it's too inconvenient for you to raise and you want to play God and decide it's better off dead than being adopted or in foster care, I'm not going to lose sleep over it. If you murder the guy at Taco Bell because he took too long getting your food, I really don't care about that either. So murder your unborn child if you want, just never lose sight of the reason why: Because it was too inconvenient for you to endure a few months of pregnancy.

Those tools who respond and say "BUT NUITERSTED6 U IDOIT THAR R 2 MENY KIDS IN FAWSTER KARE!" If that's what you believe and how you think, try heading down to the orphanage or a shelter and explaining to all those children why their parents are insensitive for not having the foresight to preemptively decide they'd be better off dead.

I hope you think about it and relive it every night of your life.

Now the other ,equally rediculous ,viewpoint has been heard from....telling a woman who might have just made the most difficult decision in her life that she has committed murder is truly disgusting . Probably goes a long way torwards the first viewpoint that men have no place in the discussion...not helpful at all!

Eschewing higher morality to form a bullshit support network for someone who just did something abominable is probably the biggest inherent flaw of woman. Being "supportive" doesn't mean a fucking thing when the act in question cannot in any moral sense whatsoever be "supported."

I stand behind everything I said 100%, and I hope the words burn into your neural synapses so you have to think about them every minute of your life.

(in reply to slvemike4u)

Post #: 14

RE: Birth control = abortion? - 7/22/2008 8:51:57 AM

slvemike4u

Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline

Extremely helpful and constructive thoughts on the matter ,Mr.uninterested,of course you have a right to your view and I am sure you impose that view on any poor soul in your orbit...but the law of the land disagree's with you...and thank God for that(irony intended)

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4

(in reply to uninterested5)

Post #: 15

RE: Birth control = abortion? - 7/22/2008 8:52:43 AM

Lynnxz

Posts: 4813
Joined: 10/3/2006
From: Atlanta
Status: offline

Uninterested- I'd be interested to know what your views on contraception are then. By preventing life, is it the same as ending one?

O.o

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Post #: 16

RE: Birth control = abortion? - 7/22/2008 8:54:33 AM

Thadius

Posts: 5091
Joined: 10/11/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lynnxz

Uninterested- I'd be interested to know what your views on contraception are then. By preventing life, is it the same as ending one?

O.o

I would assume that he doesn't have sex, because that would be morally repprehensible, as sex should be only for procreation.... But that would just be a guess on my part.

< Message edited by Thadius -- 7/22/2008 8:55:50 AM >

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Post #: 17

RE: Birth control = abortion? - 7/22/2008 8:56:11 AM

slvemike4u

Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lynnxz

Uninterested- I'd be interested to know what your views on contraception are then. By preventing life, is it the same as ending one?

O.o

Dear Lynnxz after the first 2 post's your actually interested? one would think you had heard enough,I know I have!!!

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4

(in reply to Lynnxz)

Post #: 18

RE: Birth control = abortion? - 7/22/2008 8:56:23 AM

PanthersMom

Posts: 2215
Joined: 11/26/2007
From: Cleveland Ohio
Status: offline

i cannot understand the mentality that it's better to allow the indiscriminate murder of unborn babies rather than force the drug companies and medical establishment to come up with reliable, inexpensive birth control for both sexes. prevent pregnancy, don't "deal with it" after it happens. personal responsibility and being responsible for whatever consequences your actions bring, that's the sign of adulthood, not that your genitals perform as intended. grow up, take responsibility and prevent pregnancy, not kill it after it's happened.

there are cases when it has to be an option; rape, incest, health of the mother, inviability of the fetus. a close friend and his wife had to abort their son at 7 months as his hydrocephalus was so severe his head would burst before delivery. he couldn't be born naturally, his head would have never survived. they decided to take the more merciful option and end his pain. maybe another couple would choose differently, but they decided this was the best option for them. i have been a pregnant teenager, the father ready to bolt. i'd decided to raise my child alone but it died before it was born. would have been 24 this month. i adopted three children of drug abusing birthmoms, so yes, i'd step up to the plate and adopt "unwanted" children. i am teaching those young men to keep it in their pants until they are capable of being resposible for what may come of their actions. abortion doesn't have to be as prevalent as it is. there are alternatives, starting with not getting pregnant to begin with!
PM

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Post #: 19

RE: Birth control = abortion? - 7/22/2008 8:59:01 AM

Lynnxz

Posts: 4813
Joined: 10/3/2006
From: Atlanta
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lynnxz

Uninterested- I'd be interested to know what your views on contraception are then. By preventing life, is it the same as ending one?

O.o

Dear Lynnxz after the first 2 post's your actually interested? one would think you had heard enough,I know I have!!!

Haha- ;)

Well said PanthersMom-

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HBIC

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Post #: 20

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