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RE: Obeying your Owner? - 7/30/2008 8:58:39 PM   
LadyPact


Posts: 32566
Status: offline 		My sub has a first rule.  That is to protect My property.

I'm not saying I've never given him a good beating after having a glass of wine or two, but I know when My aim isn't accurate.


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The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

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(in reply to Aileen1968)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: Obeying your Owner? - 7/30/2008 9:06:53 PM   
chiaThePet


Posts: 2694
Joined: 2/4/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Aileen1968

I like to play buzzed.  Believe it or not, people don't always get so completely wacked that they can't control themselves.  Sometimes a nice mellow buzz heightens everything just perfectly.  Some people will feel comfortable playing like this.  Some won't. 


 Ninety nine bottles of beer on the wall

               Ninety nine bottles of beer

               You take one down and pass it around

               Hey who the fuck stole one of my beers?

               Aileeeeeeeeeeen! You got some splainin to do.

chia* <they call me mellow yellow, that's right> (the pet)

_____________________________

Love is a many splendid sting.

You can stick me in the corner, but I'll probably just end up coloring on the walls.

(in reply to Aileen1968)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Obeying your Owner? - 7/30/2008 9:11:36 PM   
Aileen1968


Posts: 6062
Joined: 12/12/2007
From: I miss Shore, New Jersey
Status: offline 		Some people get off on that rush of playing a little less cautiously. 

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Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Obeying your Owner? - 7/30/2008 9:14:40 PM   
DarkVictory


Posts: 247
Joined: 8/7/2004
Status: offline 		I've played in a wide variety of mental and physical states.  I've played safely and not so safely.  How I play is my business and that of my partner.  As long as she/they know what they're getting into, and are aware of the risks, laissez les bons temps rouler as they say in the french quarter.

(in reply to Aileen1968)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: Obeying your Owner? - 7/30/2008 9:36:56 PM   
Owner4SexSlave


Posts: 1311
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline 		When it comes down to drinking and play and doing things.  Some people are really wacked and loose judgement and control, some people are still within reasonable control and judgement. 

It all depends upon your partner and knowing them.

Now, if both the Dom and sub are both wasted off their asses... Lord knows what kind of crazy shit can happen. 

It all depends upon the people in any given relationship.  If they are Happy Drunks, Mean Drunks, or Crazy Drunks.   All depends... then not to mention the amount of Drinking involved, what kind of drinks...  moods and you name it.

There are some people, I can't stand be around at all when they are drinking.  There are other people I'm totally comfortable around.   All depends upon the person.

Mind you more people do stupid and crazy shit when they have been drinking.

If it's a just a couple of drinks generally no big deal.   If somebody is totally wasted off their Ass....

It all depends upon what NOT so Bright Stupid Idea or Fantasy they having going on in their mind.   Judgement and Common sense for what it can be applied at the time, is best to follow at times.

(in reply to berdachegirl)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Obeying your Owner? - 7/31/2008 12:29:39 AM   
Prinsexx


Posts: 4584
Joined: 8/27/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: berdachegirl

When your Master or Mistress orders you to do something dangerous, or something with lasting effect, but also something you feel they normally wouldn't ask you to do, do you obey them? If they are drunk, inebriated or otherwise in an altered state, at what point do you say "Mistress wouldn't normally wish this of me, it must be the booze talking" ?

curious,
~cheryl~


Drunk?
no way......i wouldn't have that in my life...
Altered state? My Master abseills professionally an so being in an altered state physically would cost Him and those He trains/works with well it would cost them lives.But altered states mentally? Well He's also a Reiki healer and i am an empaath and an extreme sensitive and do psychic readings of different sorts so altered states/guides/insight is 'normal' but does take rigorous self-discipline. Altered states as in drugs i am notagainst but again with aa guide and in a cotroled environment for the hallucinogenic stuff. Recreational drugs...again i don't preach but i don't practice tahiong them anynore and wouldn't want to be with anyone who had. To me consent means informed consent as far a is possible which means knowing about what altered states are going on.
When i am into a scene i get all the altered state i need.
Edited to add: so as not to sound overtly pompous about altered states...i have played in the past in incredidible substance induced states BUT it's not so much the fear of being out of control (afterall i am an s-type) it's the question of come-down or withdrawal. The 'drop' from a scene is enough to handle for me as it is and always was and always will be.


< Message edited by Prinsexx -- 7/31/2008 12:52:44 AM >

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To my stalker:
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(in reply to berdachegirl)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Obeying your Owner? - 7/31/2008 2:12:17 AM   
berdachegirl


Posts: 10
Joined: 6/22/2008
Status: offline 		I don't mean a situation that always involves play, it can be simple obedience, but as to a induced state some people can operate and some lose control. My question was more about if a submissive or slave who is bound to obey should ever supplant their owner's judgment with their own, given such a situation. While being a submissive or slave does not give one leave to abandon common sense and reality, it does mean you are placing a degree or even absolute trust in the judgment of another above your own. Can you really supplant this whenever you make the call to and still be trusting in them? They may violate it and that is something else to deal with altogether, but it is their trust to violate.

Now subby ain't gonna go jump off a bridge, but tis a slippery slope to cross. If I can deny my Owner when they tell me to do XYZ, what if they weren't really thinking clearly when they said no ice cream? Does Master really care about me getting the laundry done tonight? Maybe I can have that sugar cookie after all~

(in reply to Prinsexx)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Obeying your Owner? - 7/31/2008 3:06:13 AM   
silkncarol


Posts: 318
Status: offline 		I don't believe you should play drunk...i'm not talking about a glass of wine with dinner here....but seriously inebriated.   I want to have all my senses about me.....to not have my senses dulled even a little bit...experience everything i'm feeling in any given moment....and if i'm putting myself into my partners hands, i expect them to have their wits about them too.......cause we all know chit happens...if it does,  i want a sober, sane, responsible person dealing with it.   To each their own though.....i'm not the moral police for anyone.....but if you follow the SSC or RACK....altering your mental state certainly takes out....safe, consentual, risk aware.......just sayin.

Also......If i'm participating in any activity.....it's because i WANT to be there.....and i'm responsible for me own actions.............. i wont be blaming them on anything else later.

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We attract hearts by the qualities we display. We retain them by the qualities we possess.

Shoes can change your life................. Cinderella

(in reply to berdachegirl)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Obeying your Owner? - 7/31/2008 3:11:41 AM   
RCdc


Posts: 8674
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: berdachegirl

When your Master or Mistress orders you to do something dangerous, or something with lasting effect, but also something you feel they normally wouldn't ask you to do, do you obey them? If they are drunk, inebriated or otherwise in an altered state, at what point do you say "Mistress wouldn't normally wish this of me, it must be the booze talking" ?

curious,
~cheryl~



I do not have an issue playing whilst inebriated or using medication or drugs.  It depends on the context and scenario.
You use your common sense.  If a person is acting out of charachter, then you take that into consideration.
But if you are asking this question, my suggestion is you shouldn't be in a relationship or playing at all.
 
the.dark.

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RC&dc


love isnt gazing into each others eyes - it's looking forward in the same direction

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Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Obeying your Owner? - 7/31/2008 3:36:49 AM   
Owner4SexSlave


Posts: 1311
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: silkncarol

I don't believe you should play drunk...i'm not talking about a glass of wine with dinner here....but seriously inebriated.   I want to have all my senses about me.....to not have my senses dulled even a little bit...experience everything i'm feeling in any given moment....and if i'm putting myself into my partners hands, i expect them to have their wits about them too.......cause we all know chit happens...if it does,  i want a sober, sane, responsible person dealing with it.   To each their own though.....i'm not the moral police for anyone.....but if you follow the SSC or RACK....altering your mental state certainly takes out....safe, consentual, risk aware.......just sayin.

Also......If i'm participating in any activity.....it's because i WANT to be there.....and i'm responsible for me own actions.............. i wont be blaming them on anything else later.


Lord if it's over sugar cookies and ice cream, that's one thing.  If you owner passes your a 45 caliber hand gun and tells you to shoot the neighbors dog in the head, that's a different story.  If it's over laundry that's petty simple and basic.  If it's about getting a tattoo in the middle of your forehead and you have a professional career where your physical appearence is important, that's something somebody should be thinking about with some common sense.

(in reply to silkncarol)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Obeying your Owner? - 7/31/2008 4:20:54 AM   
Asmodeus


Posts: 81
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		Fast Reply -

Wiitwd can have some inherent risks of physical damage. Regardless of how comfortable someone is when they've been drinking, smoking, or imbibing in whatever mode and reality altering chemical they choose their judgement is impaired.

Allowing someone who is judgment impaired to put you in a potentially dangerous situation seems like a bad idea.

< Message edited by Asmodeus -- 7/31/2008 4:23:26 AM >

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Deus Ex Machina

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Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Obeying your Owner? - 7/31/2008 4:27:56 AM   
softness


Posts: 2918
Joined: 8/1/2006
From: Leeds, UK
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: berdachegirl

When your Master or Mistress orders you to do something dangerous, or something with lasting effect, but also something you feel they normally wouldn't ask you to do, do you obey them? If they are drunk, inebriated or otherwise in an altered state, at what point do you say "Mistress wouldn't normally wish this of me, it must be the booze talking" ?

curious,
~cheryl~



I would refuse with no qualms whatsoever.
If DV made a request of me that would have a lasting negative consequence, I would want some discussion about it, if that was not forthcoming I would refuse, no question no hesitation. I have an obligation to please and obey Him for as long as He is a responsible Owner to me, and not a moment longer.
If DV got drunk and made a request that put me in danger, likewise I would refuse. His judgement is impaired and I have a duty to protect His property. If later I was punished for disobeying an order, that that is an acceptable consequence.

I'm in service to Him as an intelligent, forward thinking woman ... not a moron

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proudly wearing the blue collar of consideration to DK Leather, Leatherdykeuk, and LeatherEagle of the UK KRueL Leather Family

veritas, respectus honorque in corio





(in reply to berdachegirl)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: Obeying your Owner? - 7/31/2008 5:14:12 AM   
Owner4SexSlave


Posts: 1311
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: berdachegirl
When your Master or Mistress orders you to do something dangerous, or something with lasting effect, but also something you feel they normally wouldn't ask you to do, do you obey them? If they are drunk, inebriated or otherwise in an altered state, at what point do you say "Mistress wouldn't normally wish this of me, it must be the booze talking" ?

curious,
~cheryl~


I would say at any point you realize this!  Because 

First you realized and know it's something dangerous or has lasting effects. 

Second, because it's not something they would have you do when they were sober.

Yes, it's really the booze talking!

Otherwise If it's NOT dangerous and has NO long lasting effects, do it.      


(in reply to berdachegirl)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Obeying your Owner? - 7/31/2008 5:20:14 AM   
SweetNika


Posts: 955
Joined: 4/19/2008
From: Forest Hills, Maryland
Status: offline 		For me it's simple I have a responsibility to protect myself, so if they were ordering me to do something that was dangerous or harmful to me in ANY way damn skippy I am disobeying because at that moment they have forfieted their right to own me because they have failed to protect their property.

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Blessed be,
Nika


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Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Obeying your Owner? - 7/31/2008 5:23:00 AM   
katie978


Posts: 352
Joined: 7/21/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Surrenderwithin

On a personal level, I do not know that I could/ would serve anyone who getting " crazed or drugged up" was a pertinent out for me in service to them!


Didn't mean to imply he spends any amount of time with me totally trashed... This comes up more in conversation, "And you always have to do what I say...unless I'm crazy or drugged up or something". The only time I can really see it happening is if his blood sugar was low or he was on perscription drugs recovering from a surgury or some such.


As far as berdachegirl's extended question, yes there are times when my judgement might overcome my Dom's. However, the amount of trust I have for him is immense-I can't imagine him knowingly asking me to do something that would cause me lasting physical harm. In a situations where I was concerned, I would likely ask him to clarify his orders and express my concern over them. If he persisted, then it would depend completely on the situation.

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"That's the plan. Rule the world. You and me. Anyday ::wink::"



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Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Obeying your Owner? - 7/31/2008 7:29:30 AM   
DarkSteven


Posts: 28072
Joined: 5/2/2008
Status: offline 		Acknowledge his commands with full intent to obey them.  Then wait.

When he's himself again, remind him of his directives and request that he confirm them.


_____________________________

"You women....

The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

Quit fretting. We men love you."

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Profile   Post #: 36
RE: Obeying your Owner? - 7/31/2008 7:32:35 AM   
Leatherist


Posts: 5149
Joined: 12/11/2007
Status: offline 		I don't do any drugs beyond caffienne. I'd be wondering why anyone who would play under the influence could even keep anyone.

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My shop is currently segueing into production mode.

I'm not taking custom orders.

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Profile   Post #: 37
RE: Obeying your Owner? - 7/31/2008 7:40:24 AM   
favesclava


Posts: 1608
Joined: 2/15/2007
Status: offline 		as an intelligent human i'm expected to know when an order cannot be obeyed. it will either harm me or Him. i'm His cherished possession. and got more going for me than my boobs
edited to add : i skipped the last page to put my 2cents in. i missed softness post that expresses my feelings so well.

< Message edited by favesclava -- 7/31/2008 7:43:41 AM >

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Resident jingly dancing girl
The Pookie Of Darkness
Okay? Ready? Fine .Here's my hand. We are going now. I know the way. All you have to do is hold on tight ... and believe.SK

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Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Obeying your Owner? - 7/31/2008 7:44:00 AM   
OnlyHisLovebug


Posts: 56
Joined: 7/14/2008
Status: offline 		I agree with DarkSteven on this one...I try never to say "no" to my Master.  Given the circumstances the OP stated, I think that getting verification from Him when He is more Himself, before carrying out the request, would be acceptable and prudent.  

I understand that the OP was afraid that this would equate to undermining His authority- and felt that it could open the door to future leeway in interpreting His rules.  I think that would only be the case if she allowed it to happen. 

I know my Master, and I know that if He has all His faculties about Him, I'm not going to question that what He dictates is in our best interest.  But, if He were somehow compromised to the point where I'd not feel He was capable of making sound decisions even for Himself, I know beyond any doubt He'd not want me to blindly accept a decision that could be detrimental to me, either.       

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If you press me to say why I loved him, I can say no more than because he was he, and I was I. ~Michel de Montaigne

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Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Obeying your Owner? - 7/31/2008 7:45:28 AM   
RedMagic1


Posts: 6470
Joined: 5/10/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: berdachegirl
Now subby ain't gonna go jump off a bridge, but tis a slippery slope to cross. If I can deny my Owner when they tell me to do XYZ, what if they weren't really thinking clearly when they said no ice cream? Does Master really care about me getting the laundry done tonight? Maybe I can have that sugar cookie after all~

Unfortunately, I think you are not kidding.  Listen -- it is NOT a slippery slope.  Unless you choose to see it that way to construct some rationalization.  Are you really dating someone whose sober, sane persona is indistinguishable from his falling-down-drunk persona?  If the answer is "no," then stop playing philosophy-games.  And if the answer is "yes," then WTF???

Feel free to do dumb shit, but don't turn around and say it was ok to do because it was "power exchange."  I'm inclined to agree with the dark here.


_____________________________

Not with envy, not with a twisted heart, shall you feel superior, or go about boasting. Rather in goodness by action make true your song and your word. Thus you shall be highly regarded, and able to live in peace with all others.
- 15th century Aztec

(in reply to berdachegirl)
Profile   Post #: 40
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