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emotional safewording - 11/22/2005 8:04:55 AM   
misskittyslave


Posts: 42
Joined: 5/15/2005
Status: offline 		Most of U/us play or have safe words for during a scene, when the physical pain is going to cause damage when it gets too much and becomes dangerous.

i wonder how many live with an emotional safe word, when things are getting so far out of control for the submissive emotionally he/she can safe word and stop what is going on breath and talk about what is troubling them without fear of repercussion?

i wonder do M/s couples who normally have good communication skills and a decent relationship for the most part ever think that sometimes there might be something happening that a submissive is dealing with internally that is damaging them emotionally but they are with holding it in because they do not know that emotions are just as great of a risk to damaging them and causing harm as the physical aspects of a bdsm relationship?

for instance verbal humiliation what if it goes so far that a sub is starting to believe that what the dominant says is not just for in scene but how they really feel about them, or if a dominant withholds affection from a submissive because they are not complying to an order because they have a mental roadblock they are trying to work through or an insecurity.

emotinos are sometimes stronger and more painful than any physical aspect of bdsm i feel that sometimes a submissive might need to call their safe word to stop and have the ability to talk about it without fear of repercussion and i feel that no matter how bothersome it is to the dominant it is Their responsability to actually listen and help get to the root of the emotinoal difficulty enabling the submissive to continue serving Them in a healthy manner.

any thoughts on this?


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RE: emotional safewording - 11/22/2005 8:10:59 AM   
siamsa24


Posts: 2426
Joined: 2/2/2004
Status: offline 		I have been to the point that during verbal humiliation I really began to believe it, but I couldn't say anything ("if he really thinks that I am all of that, then why would he care how I feel?"), but there must have been a change in my facial expression because he stopped at once.
He never withholds affection because he is so affectoinate himself, but I can see where that would do as much damage.

I think the the possible emotional and mental damage is often overlooked because many assume the the other person knows that it "isn't really real"

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RE: emotional safewording - 11/22/2005 8:23:43 AM   
Rover


Posts: 2634
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline 		A safeword is nothing more than a communication tool. Some relationships have partners that communicate better than others.

In many (most?) power exchange relationships, a Dominant would want to know that something is bothering their submissive/slave. And many (most?) times, it's plainly evident (though we may not know precisely what the issue is without asking).

John

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RE: emotional safewording - 11/22/2005 8:30:36 AM   
jamesthehumanrug


Posts: 668
Joined: 10/21/2005
Status: offline 		greetingsmskittys'slave
i have saved your message ,for later, to re read ,so i can, not reply, to all your questions ,on the topic,however,
that is ,so gracious, and, poised ,to have a safeword, for emotional humiliation ,esp., for ,"in public", when you can't say stop ,without ruining your image, or someone-elses.
,but, i like her ,to be herself ,as tops go ,and, not censor her anything coming down ,on me ,as her slave...i wonder ,if you know;what's the emotional reaction ,of the top, to the actual use,of a " safe word" ,by the bottom ....usually....?

< Message edited by jamesthehumanrug -- 11/22/2005 8:36:22 AM >

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RE: emotional safewording - 11/22/2005 8:42:48 AM   
MistressFire70


Posts: 378
Joined: 7/25/2004
From: North Carolina
Status: offline 		I feel that one should use a safeword whenever harm is being done. Note that hurt and harm are two different things to me! I want to HURT, but I don't want to HARM. Harm can come in many different forms, not just physical. We also sometimes don't know what landmines are in our heads, meaning that we may fantasize about something only to have a deeply negative reaction when we finally get it.

Also, a topic that isn't spoken about much: Dominant safe words. There are times when I know that I would have to safeword for my own safety/sanity. More so sanity than safety.

Fire


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RE: emotional safewording - 11/22/2005 8:51:36 AM   
thetammyjo


Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline 		Personally I think that emotional and pyschological safewords are more important than physical ones. I can see if someone is bleeding, I can't see if they are having a flashback.

Problem is that if something triggers an emotional limit, I'm not sure how well that trigger person would be at using a safeword. They could be emotionally too far out of it to do so.

I think that watching for changes in response and attitude and checking in can do wonders.

But then I've owned this same slave boy for 6 years now and while we have safewords, I can't remember the last time either of us used one. Mostly we just talk and watch/listen to each other.


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RE: emotional safewording - 11/22/2005 9:09:41 AM   
softpjOS


Posts: 398
Joined: 6/7/2005
Status: offline 		I personally haven't encountered a "scene" where I experienced emotional "challenges" however life being life and people (even slaves/subs/bottoms/pick your "title/label") need a way to communicate emotional difficulties without fear of being seen as demanding/needy or self centered.

If it is indeed a scene situation then I would venture to say that your safe word would apply in any given situation where you felt the need to stop the activity and honestly discuss what was giving you difficulty. Any Master/Mistress/(insert title of choice) that would disregard emotional pain or see it as less important then physical pain should be shown the door. Period.

If it is something non scene related, daily living so to speak then a signal between the parties that would let the other know that a serious frank discussion is necessary.

In my own relationship we have come up with such a signal. When I kneel at Her feet and place my head in Her lap She knows I am requesting Her undivided attention to discuss something that is bothering me. This position is reserved for times when I am deeply troubled and She knows that what I have to say may be upsetting. If She feels unable to listen at that moment then I am directed to my safe spot so She may take a little time to take a few deep breaths before we begin or if necessary threaten the kids if they dare interupt..take the phone off the hook.. what ever preparations She feels necessary to ensure the time we need will be without interuptions. I am to remain in that position during the entire discussion, I am free to speak however my tone must remain respectful. Anything thing said during this time (as long as it was stated respectfully) will not bring punishment or any other repercussion.

Now just because She is my Mistress does not mean that She does not need a signal to tell me that She needs to stop a discussion that may be unsettling Her. If I hear "girl we will continue this discussion later" I know I need to stop and allow Her time to consider what I have said. If I continue after that statement then it is likely that punishment will be forth coming.

The number of "heated discussions" between us has decreased signifigantly since we put these signals into use. I feel better knowing that I can come to Her and openly discuss things that I would normally just bottle up and hold inside until the cork blows. She also enjoys the knowledge that a single sentence will shut this opinionated yap. I can see the eyes of those that know me rolling now. ~laughs~

pj

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RE: emotional safewording - 11/22/2005 9:38:14 AM   
JohnWarren


Posts: 3807
Joined: 3/18/2005
From: Delray Beach, FL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thetammyjo

Personally I think that emotional and pyschological safewords are more important than physical ones. I can see if someone is bleeding, I can't see if they are having a flashback.

Problem is that if something triggers an emotional limit, I'm not sure how well that trigger person would be at using a safeword. They could be emotionally too far out of it to do so.


Libby and I have observed that psychological crises come on more quickly than physical ones. It's almost as if the buildup is logarithmic rather than arithmetical. For that reason, we tell our play partners who might be effected by phychological issues to call safeword early and not try to "tough" it out

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RE: emotional safewording - 11/22/2005 9:40:02 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline 		I think safewords are good to be used in situations where it's not clear that "No means no" and that something needs to change immediately.

Otherwise, just say stop, or say what's wrong.

However, lots of subs do NOT feel they can just open up. They feel guilty about it, they feel ashamed, they worry about their dom being insecure and feeling that the sub somehow mistrusts them (the danger in making the safeword a symbol for trust rather than just a tool to use). Having a "safeword" handy can help them get the ball rolling without having to screw up the courage to bring up the issue all at once.

No matter what type of scene it is, no matter what type of emergency issue you are having, it's an important responsiblity of the bottom/sub to SPEAK UP and communicate the issue.

If you're not in a scene at all, then just say what's wrong and start a dialogue.

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RE: emotional safewording - 11/22/2005 11:54:20 AM   
anopheles


Posts: 241
Joined: 6/23/2005
Status: offline 		I think this is closely related to the whole doormat issue. Everyone, whether they are sub, slave, dog, cat or wildebeest has the right to not be emotionally damaged by whatever experience. If someone chooses to disregard their emotional suffering for the sake of someone elses pleasure of satisfaction, then they've turned themselves into a doormat. Likewise, recognizing (whether it be by a special word, or just by knowing that person well enough to see when they are hurting) and acknowledging that something you did or are doing is really causing emotional pain in someone, and stopping it, I think should be non-negotiable in any relationship.


--Anopheles

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RE: emotional safewording - 11/22/2005 12:27:21 PM   
Rover


Posts: 2634
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline
quote:

I think this is closely related to the whole doormat issue. Everyone, whether they are sub, slave, dog, cat or wildebeest has the right to not be emotionally damaged by whatever experience.


It has been asserted in other threads that slaves have no rights. Does that make dogs, cats and wildebeasts higher on the foodchain than consensual lifestyle slaves?

Inquiring minds want to know.

John

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RE: emotional safewording - 11/22/2005 12:28:12 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Rover
It has been asserted in other threads that slaves have no rights. Does that make dogs, cats and wildebeasts higher on the foodchain than consensual lifestyle slaves?

Inquiring minds want to know.


In my previous relationships, absolutely.

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RE: emotional safewording - 11/22/2005 12:30:58 PM   
Rover


Posts: 2634
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline 		So then, as is asserted in the quotation above, consensual lifestyle slaves have no right to their emotional (and I will add physical, for sake of argument) health?

John

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RE: emotional safewording - 11/22/2005 12:54:05 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Rover
So then, as is asserted in the quotation above, consensual lifestyle slaves have no right to their emotional (and I will add physical, for sake of argument) health?

Not having priority over animals does not mean that they are given no deference at all.

I would say no, it's not a right for an owned slave.

However, I do think it would be an unhealthy relationship if the slave were not kept in reasonable good functioning condition.

(in reply to Rover)
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RE: emotional safewording - 11/22/2005 12:54:37 PM   
slavejali


Posts: 2918
Status: offline 		the only time i have safeworded to Master was over an emotional issue. It wasnt play-time. i was having a fear of separation anxiety attack. Long story, but short and curlies of it was, i had lost a husband to death previous to my coming together with Master, one of the side dishes it left me with was a fear of loss, when this fear would come on me, i had no control over it. I cant remmeber what was happening that day i safeworded, but basically Master was going to go for a walk cuz i was acting stupid over some issue, just as he was about to leave, the panic set in, total irrational fear, i can describe it like a phobia that people have, there is no logical reason for the fear, it just arises and thats that.
Anyways, i safeworded, this was interesting. It made us look at our relationship, safewording over an emotional thing had never even been discussed. It deepened our relationship in a way, cuz it took Masters authority to a new level, it showed how i viewed his ownership of me, not just in physical ways but on emotional and mental levels too. Dont know if im describing this well...i expressed by safewording that He had power over my emotional and mental state if that makese sense. I dont know if Master would agree with what im saying..but its the best way i can describe it.

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RE: emotional safewording - 11/22/2005 1:03:15 PM   
Rover


Posts: 2634
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline 		What issue is "healthy" or "unhealthy" for possessions like slaves that have no rights or limits? How does "healthy" enter into the discussion at all?

And what does "reasonably good functioning condition" have to do with anything? Sometimes it's fun just to break something. Everyone has done so many times in their lives.

John

< Message edited by Rover -- 11/22/2005 1:04:42 PM >

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RE: emotional safewording - 11/22/2005 1:43:02 PM   
ICGsteve


Posts: 202
Joined: 2/2/2005
Status: offline 		John; To want to break another, or want to be broken, for the sake of the breakage is to desire an abuse dynamic. To break or be broken in order to attempt to grow, that is another thing altogether. The motivation for the breakage makes all of the difference. In the first case their is no human bond, in the other there is a strong bond, probably love.

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RE: emotional safewording - 11/22/2005 1:50:39 PM   
Rover


Posts: 2634
Joined: 6/28/2004
Status: offline 		Steve, what does "love" have to do with a possession (please be advised that most of these folks have already disavowed any association of love in a Master/slave relationship)?

People enjoy breaking their possessions all the time. That's why things like demolition derby's are so popular. Get a few miles on the ole slave... errr... car, and you don't take quite the same care of it. In fact, you might look for opportunities to "abuse" it (can you really "abuse" something that has no rights or limits?).

We're talking about possessions without rights or limits. We're talking about objects that exist exclusively for our pleasure and at our whim. Why not do it just to see if it can be done? Sure, it's extreme. But that's the fun, don't you see... to see just HOW extreme it can be!!

What, you think a Sadistic Master to a lowly slave is going to give a rat's patoot what the consequences are? If this one breaks and is of no further use to me, there's always another one just around the corner seeking to become a REAL slave without rights or limits. They're a dime a dozen.

John

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RE: emotional safewording - 11/22/2005 1:52:39 PM   
veronicaofML


Posts: 1317
Joined: 11/19/2005
From: from iowa..now in wisconsin
Status: offline 		emotional?????????

inter es tink

i can but talk from MY experiences in life.
are ya ready? can ya handle it?

k..........here goes.

as to abuse? my elders told me for 20 years i was a no good sonofabitch and a poor excuse for a kid and wish to hell they didnt have me.
i had 3 wives tell me i am a no good bastard ....
soooooooooooooo
for 52 yrs i have heard the same song and dance. so IF anyone DID say something in-a-scene(though i am not s/m) i would look at em and ask.."yea? what's yer point asshole?"

so i wonder myself if the 2 people are going to be emotionally healthy enough to take it or take it to heart "in-a-weak-moment".

your concerns are valid. but it's JUST a guess........usually? normally?
these kind of things SHOULD BE discussed BEFORE any "scene" is done.
take care


< Message edited by veronicaofML -- 11/22/2005 1:58:22 PM >

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RE: emotional safewording - 11/22/2005 2:02:05 PM   
veronicaofML


Posts: 1317
Joined: 11/19/2005
From: from iowa..now in wisconsin
Status: offline 		yep. according to what MY elders said...........but then the city has some laws on it.


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drugs sex and rock n roll,...drugs are good and so is the rock n roll, sex is over rated"
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