Over 100 US College Presidents Open Debate on Lowering Drinking Age to 18

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Over 100 US College Presidents Open Debate on Lowering ... - 8/19/2008 6:36:19 PM

FatDomDaddy

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I think its an excellent idea.

If 18 is a legal age to smoke cigarettes, enlist into the military and enter into binding contracts, then is a beer or two at the end of the day too much to ask for?

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/health/bal-te.md.drink19aug19,0,7994349.story

http://www.amethystinitiative.org/

< Message edited by FatDomDaddy -- 8/19/2008 7:15:01 PM >

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RE: Over 100 US College Presidents Open Debate on Lower... - 8/19/2008 7:50:49 PM

slvemike4u

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Hom many ums do you have FDD,any parent's worst nightmare begins and ends at the intersection of drinking and driving.Society has no justifiable reason to move those two actions closer for the young.Certainly not,if anything move it back a year or two,there is somthing to be said for living to see your 25th birthday

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RE: Over 100 US College Presidents Open Debate on Lower... - 8/19/2008 7:55:29 PM

faerytattoodgirl

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its 19 here in canada...so whats the difference if its 18,19 or 21...
most kids start at around 15 or less anyway.

so lowering it wont change anything...the same as making it higher wouldnt change anything.

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RE: Over 100 US College Presidents Open Debate on Lower... - 8/19/2008 8:04:46 PM

slvemike4u

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Society has no imperitive to make it legal .This would be tantamount to condoning what right now is illegal,and highway deaths under the age of 25 would increase.

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If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4

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RE: Over 100 US College Presidents Open Debate on Lower... - 8/19/2008 8:13:18 PM

hopelessfool

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Mike it totally diagree, Europe has very low drinking ages, like 15 16, and you know what they have the lowest drunk driving accidents. Why? Its not a forbidden fruit, there for its not a "I Need to get trashed this weekend" type of deal. I was raised seeing my mom drink wine, Ill admit Ive had tastes before I am of legal age, but my mom never made it a ' Drinking is bad dont do it.' And because it wasnt forbidden I have no drive to go and get drunk. If they lower it, I think drunk driving accidents will go down, because more people will try it, see its stupid and not really want to drink, the " oh its bad" will be lessoned.

Kids want to do what they are not allowed. You tell them dont play in the creek they are going to play in the creek, you tell them dont touch that dead bird, the second you turn your back they are going to touch that dead bird, Why is alcholoh Any different? Dont drink, Drinkings bad, Dont do it.... And what are they going to do?...you saying no just made doing it go up to a 8 on the cool scale.

< Message edited by hopelessfool -- 8/19/2008 8:17:13 PM >

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RE: Over 100 US College Presidents Open Debate on Lower... - 8/19/2008 8:13:20 PM

kdsub

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nope kids are stupid...you were and so was I.... Yes they are old enough to put their lives at risk in the military for the rest of us and yes they should be allowed to drink BUT only on base if allowed. Keeping the age at 21 will save many lives.

Butch

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RE: Over 100 US College Presidents Open Debate on Lower... - 8/19/2008 8:16:57 PM

Sunnyfey

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personally I think at the age of 18 I was quiet a bit less mature then I am now. Add drinking to that mix, I would have made a lot more mistakes then I did. And my little sister drinking legally?! fuck no, shes an idiot like I was!

Now as for the 18 year olds in the military? I think an exception should be made for them. They tend to be a bit more resposible from the training the endure. Not all of them mind you, btu alot of them anyway. Hell if you signed up to give your life for your country? You deserve a beer.

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RE: Over 100 US College Presidents Open Debate on Lower... - 8/19/2008 8:18:59 PM

Vendaval

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You also need to factor in the ease and availability of public transportation and the distance from the pubs and liquor stores to residential areas.

On another note, many of the worst DUI offenses and drunk driving wrecks occurr when two areas having differing age limits are side by side. Youngsters on the side with the higher age requirement will drive to the area with the lower age requirement, get drunk and attempt to drive home again.

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RE: Over 100 US College Presidents Open Debate on Lower... - 8/19/2008 8:31:27 PM

slvemike4u

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This really isn't a complicated issue,despite European experiences with low drinking age,statistics from American experiences are what matter.And too many teenagers die as a result of auto-related causes,with alcohol a contributing factor in too many of those accidents.Any legislation that would facilitate that would be a mistake

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If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4

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RE: Over 100 US College Presidents Open Debate on Lower... - 8/19/2008 8:40:40 PM

Alumbrado

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quote:

statistics from American experiences are what matter.

The argument the university presidents seem to be making is that the US statistics for teenage binge drinking on campus have risen since the age was raised, and that the kids who learn to abuse alcohol in college are still dying in car wrecks which are spread out over more years. The 21 drinking age is a bandaid that serves to mask a greater problem.

http://www.amethystinitiative.org/filemanager/filedownload/phpfDRawu/FAQ%20Response.pdf
http://www.amethystinitiative.org/filemanager/download/10873/

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RE: Over 100 US College Presidents Open Debate on Lower... - 8/19/2008 8:41:55 PM

celticlord2112

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quote:

Now as for the 18 year olds in the military? I think an exception should be made for them. They tend to be a bit more resposible from the training the endure.

Hogwash.

18 year olds in the military are not responsible. That's why God created that ghastly, horrific, terrifying breed known as the Sergeant.

18 is 18 is young, dumb, and full of cum--in or out of the military.

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RE: Over 100 US College Presidents Open Debate on Lower... - 8/19/2008 8:42:15 PM

NeedingMore220

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I have 3 kids, one of whom is 15. I can kind of see the logic behind lowering the drinking age. It just might make parents actually deal with their kids drinking - rather than doing the old 'not my kid' thing. Lots of kids, if not most, drink in high school. Most will be put into a situation where they have had a few beers and need to get home when they are legal to drive.

Rather than parents saying 'don't drink and drive' perhaps the fact that they know their kid can legally crack open a beer they will then be more open to the options available - as in, having a safe driver.

How nice would it be for your 18yo kid who's a senior in high school to be able to go out with his buddies, and the parents can say 'who's the designated driver tonight?' - rather than pretending nothing is going to happen. I know I will be saying that, even if my kids aren't legal to drink, once they graduate high school.

Or even the parents can take turns being the driver for the evening out. It would mean dealing with a possibly shit-faced 18yo, but at least they'd be home alive and the kid wouldn't have to drive, have to pretend that he wasn't drinking, wouldn't be risking someone else's life on the road.

There's just something about pretending it's not happening that doesn't sit well with me. It's like being allowed to bury your head in the sand because it's against the law and just telling your kid not to do it should be enough. It's just not realistic.

Also, if you give the kid the situation to handle at a younger age, perhaps when they go away to college they won't go nuts drinking just because it's suddenly available. Perhaps binge drinking would decrease. And perhaps the rate of college kids who turn into alcoholics would decrease.

And yes, if an 18yo is serving his/her country, give 'em a friggin' drink already, with a pat on the back and a thank you.

< Message edited by NeedingMore220 -- 8/19/2008 8:47:25 PM >

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RE: Over 100 US College Presidents Open Debate on Lower... - 8/19/2008 8:43:57 PM

celticlord2112

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quote:

This really isn't a complicated issue,despite European experiences with low drinking age,statistics from American experiences are what matter.And too many teenagers die as a result of auto-related causes,with alcohol a contributing factor in too many of those accidents.Any legislation that would facilitate that would be a mistake

True, it's not a complicated issue.

If someone is old enough to buy cancer sticks, vote for Democrats, and march off to war, he or she should be able to wash all that maturity down with a decent beer at the very least.

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RE: Over 100 US College Presidents Open Debate on Lower... - 8/19/2008 8:51:19 PM

Alumbrado

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quote:

...Also, if you give the kid the situation to handle at a younger age, perhaps when they go away to college they won't go nuts drinking just because it's suddenly available. Perhaps binge drinking would decrease. And perhaps the rate of college kids who turn into alcoholics would decrease.

When the age was 18, kids were sneaking booze at 16...behind barns, under bleachers, and so forth. And many of them were drinking and driving, a problem that shouldn't be ignored.

But the bandaid solution of legislating morality that our politicians came up with, has gotten kids away from a pint under the seat in high school, to hundreds of dollars worth of booze every night at the frat house.

So 23 year olds are showing up with cirrhosis of the liver, or dying in car wrecks at 26 or 29...when they have a mini-van full of family, and soccer moms are spiking their Starbucks frozen lattes with a shot of blue top before picking up your kids at Cub Scouts.

< Message edited by Alumbrado -- 8/19/2008 8:52:25 PM >

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RE: Over 100 US College Presidents Open Debate on Lower... - 8/19/2008 9:01:29 PM

slvemike4u

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So society at large has a problem with drinking,all well and good.So the 21 y/o minimum is a band-aid for the larger societal problem,all well and good.Society should not be in the business of condoning it.Maybe those College Professors should spend more time trying to figure out how to do something about frat-party related deaths as a result of bninge drinking, than advocating giving it a legal thumbs up...

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Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4

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RE: Over 100 US College Presidents Open Debate on Lower... - 8/19/2008 9:08:34 PM

Alumbrado

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quote:

So society at large has a problem with drinking,all well and good.So the 21 y/o minimum is a band-aid for the larger societal problem,all well and good.Society should not be in the business of condoning it.Maybe those College Professors should spend more time trying to figure out how to do something about frat-party related deaths as a result of bninge drinking, than advocating giving it a legal thumbs up...

Errrmmm... I'm pretty sure you are mixing up college professors with university administrators, but if you know how they can go onto private property owned by adults who are paying customers of their schools, and fix the problem as easily as you say, I'm sure they would be all ears.

And society would still be condoning it if they raised the legal age to 45...I think we would all agree that Prohibition was a flop.

I'm with you on wanting to stop teenage drinking and driving deaths, but some bells can't be unrung.

< Message edited by Alumbrado -- 8/19/2008 9:15:08 PM >

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RE: Over 100 US College Presidents Open Debate on Lower... - 8/19/2008 9:34:33 PM

slvemike4u

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They do have options Alumbrado,there seems to be a certain wink and a nod policy taking place concerning underage drinking at our university's...and a good amount of it is done on university property(dorms and student housing).And I am well aware this stuff is best dealt with by engaged and informed parents but it is still my opinion it need not be made harder..or in this case easier...

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4

(in reply to Alumbrado)

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RE: Over 100 US College Presidents Open Debate on Lower... - 8/20/2008 4:36:03 AM

hopelessfool

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My mom "in essence let me drink at a young age" she left a bottle out knowing me at 15 was going to giggle and take the bottle and get drunk... And ya know what I did, and you know what happened the next morning? She banged pots and pans, made really NASTY smelling food, and made it Totally and completely miserable for me. And Ive never gotten drunk again. Why? Because I never want a head ache from that again she got my mind to associate drinking to much with that PAIN.... Now was my mom good or bad yell about that all you want she was a great mother and helped me make Responsible decisions.

YOU want drinking and driving to go down with your kids, take them to see a brain smattered car of an idiot who drank and drived (which actually most fatal drinking accidents accour with men ages 35 to 50 who have one to many beers and think they are okay). Take away the " Oh my god drinking is bad drinking is this drinking is that."

Know the main difference between europe on drinking and amercia on it. America villianizes it, making it something "dangerous" and "evil" which makes kids want it more. Europe teaches moderation and responsiblity with it. They see their parent every night with ONE glass of wine at dinner, and they see their parents heathly and nothing wrong, but they also see their parents being responsable with that one drink and one drink only.

Like someone above me said sticking your head in the sand doesnt work, whining about it doesnt work. If you were younger youd care about the drinking age and wouldnt be saying dont lower it dont lower it. Why because Its not going to affect you like it will someone in their eariler years.

Im sure if they raised the drinking age to 50 youd be pitching a fit and bitching its too high. I think its too high, Not because of my age, but I as someone whos younger KNOW how people my age think generall think

Im not supposed to do it Im going to do it because its "cool' its "dangerous" my parents told me not to.

Instead of the very short very lack luster program in high school they show one day that isnt even mandatory. Make EVERY TEEN take classes on substance and alcohol abuse. Have the teacher Show a cirrosed liver or at least a lot of photos of it. Make them see the honest bad in what happens when you drink... and show someone who died who moderately drank and show him being okay. Why, what you need to teach is MODERATION. Not a drinking age, Not a dont do it. Everything in life is good in Moderation....

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RE: Over 100 US College Presidents Open Debate on Lower... - 8/20/2008 5:42:59 AM

DesFIP

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I've always said that if in active service, or a vet, you should be able to drink at under 21. Of course the alternative could be to raise voting, military to age 21 also? But in the colleges behalf, they are seeing binge drinking increase, and that's a dangerous pastime.

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RE: Over 100 US College Presidents Open Debate on Lower... - 8/20/2008 5:45:38 AM

NeedToUseYou

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If one thinks that a person is not mature enough to drink at 18, then they obviously aren't mature enough to enter contracts, or join the military. In the military they will be put in charge of potentially life and death decisions. Therefore, it would reason a person unable to make a decision about drinking should not be allowed in the military either. Same with contracts, entering a bad contract can be as destructive as binge drinking.

So, if one is arguing 18 years aren't mature enough to drink essentially you are arguing that they should not be allowed in the military nor enter contracts. It's the only way that makes sense. Now if one believes 18 year old should be allowed into the military and enter into legally binding contracts, then they should be able to drink.

This whole argument is really silly, Oh johnny can't drink he's not mature enough, but he can sign up for credit cards and destroy his credit for years, and join the military and potentially get blown up, or kill people.

I guess. It's one or the other with me. All at 18 or all at 21, it makes little sense to do otherwise.

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