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Obama: Recession could delay rescinding of tax cuts - 9/7/2008 2:34:16 PM

celticlord2112

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Obama: Recession could delay rescinding of tax cuts

quote:

WASHINGTON — Democrat Barack Obama says he would delay rescinding President Bush's tax cuts on wealthy Americans if he becomes the next president and the economy is in a recession, suggesting such an increase would further hurt the economy.

Didn't Obama say we were already in a recession and was planning to raise taxes anyway?

Don't get me wrong--I think it's great that Obama is starting to learn that raising taxes is a bad thing. I just wonder how deep the lesson goes, and will he shift gears again closer to November.

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RE: Obama: Recession could delay rescinding of tax cuts - 9/7/2008 2:39:21 PM

Thadius

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Wait a minute. I is getting confuzzled.

Wasn't Obama trying to convince all of us that raising taxes on the wealthy would be a good thing for the economy?

So now he is not only admitting that raising taxes would be bad for the economy, but the current tax cuts may have helped avoid recession?

Am I reading that correctly?

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RE: Obama: Recession could delay rescinding of tax cuts - 9/7/2008 3:06:07 PM

celticlord2112

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

Wait a minute. I is getting confuzzled.

Wasn't Obama trying to convince all of us that raising taxes on the wealthy would be a good thing for the economy?

So now he is not only admitting that raising taxes would be bad for the economy, but the current tax cuts may have helped avoid recession?

Am I reading that correctly?

Actually, what he is saying is that raising taxes on the wealthy is bad for the economy.

< Message edited by celticlord2112 -- 9/7/2008 3:07:06 PM >

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RE: Obama: Recession could delay rescinding of tax cuts - 9/7/2008 3:08:18 PM

Thadius

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So how are we gonna pay for all that new and spiffy stuff he promised us, if he gets elected?

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When the character of a man is not clear to you, look at his friends." ~ Japanese Proverb

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RE: Obama: Recession could delay rescinding of tax cuts - 9/7/2008 3:10:52 PM

NumberSix

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Same way as the war in Iraq.
Same way as the half-assed effort in Afghanistan.

Same way as the war on terror that has yet to be fought.

borrow it. We don't pay for nothin'.

6

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RE: Obama: Recession could delay rescinding of tax cuts - 9/7/2008 3:12:50 PM

celticlord2112

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

So how are we gonna pay for all that new and spiffy stuff he promised us, if he gets elected?

Well, since he won't tax the wealthy, maybe he'll just eliminate the cap on the payroll tax and apply it to all income without limitation, then dip into the Social Security "trust fund" to cook the books a bit.

He is from Chicago, ya know!

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RE: Obama: Recession could delay rescinding of tax cuts - 9/7/2008 3:13:41 PM

Thadius

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quote:

ORIGINAL: NumberSix

Same way as the war in Iraq.
Same way as the half-assed effort in Afghanistan.

Same way as the war on terror that has yet to be fought.

borrow it. We don't pay for nothin'.

6

So it's gonna be the same old same old, just with more spending? Got it.

Uhm.... then how is he going to sell the tax hikes when he finally gets around to them? He is admitting that tax increases are bad for the economy.

Edited to answer my own question... What was I thinking... once he is in office it doesn't matter if he sells them or not.

< Message edited by Thadius -- 9/7/2008 3:14:32 PM >

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When the character of a man is not clear to you, look at his friends." ~ Japanese Proverb

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RE: Obama: Recession could delay rescinding of tax cuts - 9/7/2008 3:45:46 PM

Politesub53

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McCain voted against Bush`s tax cuts, so he seems to have done a u-turn as well.

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RE: Obama: Recession could delay rescinding of tax cuts - 9/7/2008 3:50:34 PM

Thadius

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

McCain voted against Bush`s tax cuts, so he seems to have done a u-turn as well.

McCain voted against the bill because of all the spending that was included in it. Not because of the tax cuts. At least that was his statement on the floor, prior to the vote...

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RE: Obama: Recession could delay rescinding of tax cuts - 9/7/2008 4:09:57 PM

Politesub53

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

McCain voted against the bill because of all the spending that was included in it. Not because of the tax cuts. At least that was his statement on the floor, prior to the vote...

Thats not exactly true Thadius. Part of the reason he gave was the rich would get the most benefit.

quote:

1. “I don’t think the governor’s tax cut is too big—it’s just misplaced. Sixty percent of the benefits from his tax cuts go to the wealthiest 10% of Americans—and that’s not the kind of tax relief that Americans need. … Gov. Bush wants to spend the entire surplus on tax cuts. I don’t believe the wealthiest 10% of Americans should get 60% of the tax breaks. I think the lowest 10% should get the breaks. …
“I’m not giving tax cuts for the rich.”

—Discussion with media, reported in “Bush, McCain Snip Over
Tax Cut Plans,” Los Angeles Times, and “GOP Rivals Bicker on Taxes,”
Washington Post, Jan. 5, 2000.

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RE: Obama: Recession could delay rescinding of tax cuts - 9/7/2008 4:15:17 PM

Thadius

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

McCain voted against the bill because of all the spending that was included in it. Not because of the tax cuts. At least that was his statement on the floor, prior to the vote...

Thats not exactly true Thadius. Part of the reason he gave was the rich would get the most benefit.

quote:

1. “I don’t think the governor’s tax cut is too big—it’s just misplaced. Sixty percent of the benefits from his tax cuts go to the wealthiest 10% of Americans—and that’s not the kind of tax relief that Americans need. … Gov. Bush wants to spend the entire surplus on tax cuts. I don’t believe the wealthiest 10% of Americans should get 60% of the tax breaks. I think the lowest 10% should get the breaks. …
“I’m not giving tax cuts for the rich.”

—Discussion with media, reported in “Bush, McCain Snip Over
Tax Cut Plans,” Los Angeles Times, and “GOP Rivals Bicker on Taxes,”
Washington Post, Jan. 5, 2000.

I stated the reason he gave on the floor of the Senate when he was voting. You are presenting a quote from prior to Bush even winning a primary.

Just saying.

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RE: Obama: Recession could delay rescinding of tax cuts - 9/7/2008 4:15:33 PM

pahunkboy

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From: Central Pennsylvania
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close the loop holes.

Obama does want to spend alot. considering the finances I dont see how that is possible.

I can just see me budgeting like the fed does. When i go for groceries- I will give the cashier a speach like Beneraki would. It is that simple.

Same with the house patment. I will call them up and give em an Allen Greenspan assessment on irrational exhubarance.

then when I fill my gas tank, I will tell them that there is a liuidity crises and drive off.

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Post #: 12

RE: Obama: Recession could delay rescinding of tax cuts - 9/7/2008 4:21:04 PM

rulemylife

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quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112

quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

So how are we gonna pay for all that new and spiffy stuff he promised us, if he gets elected?

Well, since he won't tax the wealthy, maybe he'll just eliminate the cap on the payroll tax and apply it to all income without limitation, then dip into the Social Security "trust fund" to cook the books a bit.

He is from Chicago, ya know!

What exactly do you believe he is going to dip into? The so-called trust fund is a liabality, not an asset. There are no funds to dip into. The "fund" is a government debt because it was always included in the overall federal budget and the money for the so-called fund was spent in common with all government revenue.

(in reply to celticlord2112)

Post #: 13

RE: Obama: Recession could delay rescinding of tax cuts - 9/7/2008 4:22:58 PM

slaveboyforyou

Posts: 3607
Joined: 1/6/2005
From: Arkansas, U.S.A.
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quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112

Obama: Recession could delay rescinding of tax cuts

quote:

WASHINGTON — Democrat Barack Obama says he would delay rescinding President Bush's tax cuts on wealthy Americans if he becomes the next president and the economy is in a recession, suggesting such an increase would further hurt the economy.

Didn't Obama say we were already in a recession and was planning to raise taxes anyway?

Don't get me wrong--I think it's great that Obama is starting to learn that raising taxes is a bad thing. I just wonder how deep the lesson goes, and will he shift gears again closer to November.

See, this is the problem with Obama. He is just now learning all of this. He has been spinning fairy tales about what he will do if elected. He's finally getting some pragmatists advising him, and he's being brought down to reality. Of course, a large number of his supporters still think he's going to give them the sky. Obama's first 4 years in office will be 4 years of getting very little done.

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RE: Obama: Recession could delay rescinding of tax cuts - 9/7/2008 4:26:02 PM

rulemylife

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Joined: 8/23/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

So how are we gonna pay for all that new and spiffy stuff he promised us, if he gets elected?

Probably the same way McCain is going to pay for all those tax cuts he promised.

(in reply to Thadius)

Post #: 15

RE: Obama: Recession could delay rescinding of tax cuts - 9/7/2008 4:26:44 PM

celticlord2112

Posts: 5732
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quote:

What exactly do you believe he is going to dip into? The so-called trust fund is a liabality, not an asset. There are no funds to dip into. The "fund" is a government debt because it was always included in the overall federal budget and the money for the so-called fund was spent in common with all government revenue.

Ok, so you missed the sarcasm.

Where is he going to get the money, now that tax hikes are off the table?

As you have so eloquently demonstrated, there is no alternative pile of cash for him to dip into.

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RE: Obama: Recession could delay rescinding of tax cuts - 9/7/2008 4:30:29 PM

Thadius

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Joined: 10/11/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112

quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

So how are we gonna pay for all that new and spiffy stuff he promised us, if he gets elected?

Well, since he won't tax the wealthy, maybe he'll just eliminate the cap on the payroll tax and apply it to all income without limitation, then dip into the Social Security "trust fund" to cook the books a bit.

He is from Chicago, ya know!

What exactly do you believe he is going to dip into? The so-called trust fund is a liabality, not an asset. There are no funds to dip into. The "fund" is a government debt because it was always included in the overall federal budget and the money for the so-called fund was spent in common with all government revenue.

Actually, I think that is the point we are trying to make. He has been making all of these promises of change and basing paying for them on taxing the wealthy (typical class warfare ploy), and has now had to admit that doing so would hurt the economy. Then again, I am sure some of those folks that were arguing with me in other threads will say that taxing the wealthy and corporations is still a good idea, or try to convince me that those tax hikes are good for the economy.

Who knows, this might even be an attempt by him to try and stop the bleeding. Nah, a politician would never pander.

_____________________________

When the character of a man is not clear to you, look at his friends." ~ Japanese Proverb

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RE: Obama: Recession could delay rescinding of tax cuts - 9/7/2008 4:30:47 PM

MistressNew

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I wonder if this topic might be just an eensy bit more complicated than CL and Thadius are making it seem. Sometimes, it is a good idea to raise taxes. For instance, the largest tax increase in history was instituted by... Ronald Reagan. Perhaps republicans don't like Reagan anymore, or perhaps this is another political thread about nothing....

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RE: Obama: Recession could delay rescinding of tax cuts - 9/7/2008 4:34:04 PM

Thadius

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quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

So how are we gonna pay for all that new and spiffy stuff he promised us, if he gets elected?

Probably the same way McCain is going to pay for all those tax cuts he promised.

Explain to me why revenues went up when the taxes were cut? The answer is simple. TAX CUTS ARE GOOD FOR THE ECONOMY. Oh and cutting spending, seems to be an acceptable way to balance a budget. Therefore, a combination of increased revenues and decreased expenditures will lead to a balanced budget, oh and maybe just maybe let us pay off some of that debt.

I know it's a crazy concept, eh?

_____________________________

When the character of a man is not clear to you, look at his friends." ~ Japanese Proverb

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RE: Obama: Recession could delay rescinding of tax cuts - 9/7/2008 4:37:12 PM

rulemylife

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Joined: 8/23/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

McCain voted against the bill because of all the spending that was included in it. Not because of the tax cuts. At least that was his statement on the floor, prior to the vote...

Thats not exactly true Thadius. Part of the reason he gave was the rich would get the most benefit.

quote:

1. “I don’t think the governor’s tax cut is too big—it’s just misplaced. Sixty percent of the benefits from his tax cuts go to the wealthiest 10% of Americans—and that’s not the kind of tax relief that Americans need. … Gov. Bush wants to spend the entire surplus on tax cuts. I don’t believe the wealthiest 10% of Americans should get 60% of the tax breaks. I think the lowest 10% should get the breaks. …
“I’m not giving tax cuts for the rich.”

—Discussion with media, reported in “Bush, McCain Snip Over
Tax Cut Plans,” Los Angeles Times, and “GOP Rivals Bicker on Taxes,”
Washington Post, Jan. 5, 2000.

I stated the reason he gave on the floor of the Senate when he was voting. You are presenting a quote from prior to Bush even winning a primary.

Just saying.

Nice rationalization!

So he was against the tax cuts because they favored the wealthy. Then he was against the tax cuts because of other spending in the bill. Then he was against the second round of tax cuts. Now he he thinks Dubya just did a swell job with those tax cuts.

Keep your eye on the ball folks, ya never know where it's gonna go.

(in reply to Thadius)

Post #: 20

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