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RE: disobedience...... - 9/11/2008 4:21:22 AM

simpleplan2

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No, I don't think all owners do. Nor do all owners care to...totally depends upon the dynamic and what everyone has agreed to. Personally, I doubt that I would turn over passwords to anyone, but I'm in the privacy biz.

(in reply to MsCfromMelbourne)

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RE: disobedience...... - 9/11/2008 5:48:10 AM

smittyforyou

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Um, i guess i wasn't too clear before. my friend was the one who contacted the Domme and after many e-mails, calls, cams, etc., with her, she said she wanted a ltr with Her, she said she would give TPE, but then claimed she didn't understand what that really meant. she wants to take it slow and learn about Her vanilla side first, and over time get more into BDSM. i can understand both sides, but if she is the one who said she would give TPE and then doesn't give it what does that say about her? she said they discussed her profile and what should happen with it, but now she wants to not do what was asked. So, what would you do with a sub like that? Give her a chance to meet you or see her disobedience as a problem you don't want in the future? (i forgot to say, i told her she can always change the password if she sees the profile is being abused. right?)

< Message edited by smittyforyou -- 9/11/2008 5:50:58 AM >

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RE: disobedience...... - 9/11/2008 7:39:13 AM

Pyrrsefanie

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MsCfromMelbourne
I have access to my sub's email and MSN. Don't all owners?

Nope. Don't care, don't want it.

Could probably figure it out if I ever suspected he was cheating or what have you, but as a kink? Meh.

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RE: disobedience...... - 9/11/2008 9:18:48 AM

thetammyjo

Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: smittyforyou

A friend of mine told me a Mistress she was talking to about serving, asked for the password to her profile, and even though she wants to be with the Mistress, she doesn't want to give it. What should i tell her? i know this would cause concern to the Mistress, but what can i tell her to do?

What does this have to do with your original question? I'm very unclear on this.

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RE: disobedience...... - 9/11/2008 9:24:01 AM

thetammyjo

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quote:

ORIGINAL: smittyforyou

Um, i guess i wasn't too clear before. my friend was the one who contacted the Domme and after many e-mails, calls, cams, etc., with her, she said she wanted a ltr with Her, she said she would give TPE, but then claimed she didn't understand what that really meant. she wants to take it slow and learn about Her vanilla side first, and over time get more into BDSM. i can understand both sides, but if she is the one who said she would give TPE and then doesn't give it what does that say about her? she said they discussed her profile and what should happen with it, but now she wants to not do what was asked. So, what would you do with a sub like that? Give her a chance to meet you or see her disobedience as a problem you don't want in the future? (i forgot to say, i told her she can always change the password if she sees the profile is being abused. right?)

Reads to me like both the people involved are not very experienced otherwise they wouldn't have gotten into such a situation to begin with.

Let's see if I can remember being in a similar position... damn that's a long time ago... lol

Well, I didn't move that fast and I made sure I was seeking out mentors and groups and information so I wasn't honestly in the exact same position. However I did rush into things a bit more because of the "excitement of it all" and I learned to slow down over time from a series of heartaches resulting from said rushing.

Sometimes you do have to be hurt several times before you change course, slow down, and seek out an education on both side of the BDSM equation.

So they have two choices.

Embrace the hurt and move on.

Embrace the hurt and renegotiate with an eye toward both of them learning and exploring slowly.

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RE: disobedience...... - 9/11/2008 10:07:40 AM

LadyPact

Posts: 32566
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quote:

ORIGINAL: smittyforyou

Um, i guess i wasn't too clear before. my friend was the one who contacted the Domme and after many e-mails, calls, cams, etc., with her, she said she wanted a ltr with Her, she said she would give TPE, but then claimed she didn't understand what that really meant. she wants to take it slow and learn about Her vanilla side first, and over time get more into BDSM. i can understand both sides, but if she is the one who said she would give TPE and then doesn't give it what does that say about her? she said they discussed her profile and what should happen with it, but now she wants to not do what was asked. So, what would you do with a sub like that? Give her a chance to meet you or see her disobedience as a problem you don't want in the future? (i forgot to say, i told her she can always change the password if she sees the profile is being abused. right?)

What does it say about her? It says she used a term that she didn't quite understand and had to rethink the consequences once she knew what it was. Personally, I don't think that's such a terrible thing.

This next part might ramble on a bit. I'll apologize for that in advance. Still, it might do some folks some good.

In the beginning of any dynamic, where I think your friend is at the moment, it's important for any s-type to get to know the ways of the potential Dominant. In WIITWD, some of us tend to throw some phrases, terms, and labels around that can have different meanings to different people. If you don't believe Me, try using the search function to find out just how many times we've debated and discussed to death a few random words around here. There's no BDSM definition set in stone. It usually varies from person to person and how they interpret different things. Even a term like total power exchange, which might seem easy enough to understand can vary. Just like we've seen in this thread, to some people it means turning over that password. To others, it doesn't.

The point I'm trying to make here is that it's these kinds of things that should be discussed when someone is thinking of serving before they give control over to another person. Are they going to be able to accept the way the Dominant wants to be served or are the setting themselves up for disobedience? What areas of their life are they willing to turn over control or will it be all of them? What areas of control doesn't the Dominant want, or maybe not even care about?

There is a possibility that exists that your friend was being taught this very lesson. That it was too soon for her to offer herself to a Dominant when there were areas that she had no idea of what to expect.

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RE: disobedience...... - 9/11/2008 1:07:15 PM

chamberqueen

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It sounds like your friend has a whole lot to learn - especially if she wants to learn about their vanilla side first.

If I offered someone else TPE, they asked me to make changes from my profile, and then I backed out - I would expect that person to be confused at the very least. It sounds like the Mistress only wanted to help her, not to be nosy, and your friend pulling back the way that she did shows that she is not ready to serve. I think it would take a lot of communication and training to make the relationship last.

As a Domme, if someone did this to me I would probably think that they were a waste of my time.

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Post #: 27

RE: disobedience...... - 9/11/2008 3:32:05 PM

ElanSubdued

Posts: 1511
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Pyrrsefanie,

quote:

Throw him off of a cliff to die of exposure, and work on getting another one.

And again you demonstrate why *everyone* should read your posts. You're such a potpourri (or is that bastion) of sensible advice. :-)

Elan.

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Post #: 28

RE: disobedience...... - 9/11/2008 3:39:20 PM

ElanSubdued

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MsCfromMelbourne,

quote:

I have access to my sub's email and MSN. Don't all owners? Do I bother reading it? Hell, no. But the power to take his privacy any time I like is part of our power exchange.

I understand that this is part of your power exchange and presumably the two of you negotiated this. That said, I have to agree with pinnipedster. A Domme who wants access to my email and other private correspondance sets off a red flag for me. More often than not I've found that such a request comes from mistrust rather than a desire to share in my life.

Elan.

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RE: disobedience...... - 9/11/2008 4:27:58 PM

smittyforyou

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i want to thank all of You for Your responses (when answering my question(s)...) The answers have been very informative and i will let her know what has been offered. i don't think she understands what it means to serve, but i need to let her Domme teach her that...

Again, thank You All.

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Post #: 30

RE: disobedience...... - 9/11/2008 5:19:58 PM

ShiftedJewel

Posts: 2492
Joined: 12/2/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MsCfromMelbourne

If they had met in person and your friend really, really liked the Mistress, she would be falling over herself to give the lady her password.....and any other access she wants

I have access to my sub's email and MSN. Don't all owners? Do I bother reading it? Hell, no. But the power to take his privacy any time I like is part of our power exchange

The fact that your friend is hesitating says it all.

Umm... no. I couldn't care less. We don't hide anything from each other here, hell, if hubby or twice wanted my passwords I'd give it to them, not that big of a deal to me.

But even if that is part of the negotiation and eventual dynamic, the key word is still "eventual". I wouldn't hand over personal info to anyone until I had LOTS of trust in that person, nor would I ask for that kind of personal info until there was a fully committed relationship and there was absolute trust built up between us.

Jewel

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RE: disobedience...... - 9/11/2008 10:46:55 PM

MsCfromMelbourne

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ElanSubdued

MsCfromMelbourne,

quote:

I have access to my sub's email and MSN. Don't all owners? Do I bother reading it? Hell, no. But the power to take his privacy any time I like is part of our power exchange.

I understand that this is part of your power exchange and presumably the two of you negotiated this. That said, I have to agree with pinnipedster. A Domme who wants access to my email and other private correspondance sets off a red flag for me. More often than not I've found that such a request comes from mistrust rather than a desire to share in my life.

Elan.

Perhaps it matters that we live together 24/7.

I can open his mail and put it on his side of the desk, answer his phone and glance at his laptop any time I like and see who is writing to him.

I think even vanilla wives have access rights like that - its not *that* sinister IMO

If a sub is not trustworthy, he can simply create a new profile and use his secret new name to cruise other Mistresses etc. Taking his password is pointless if you mistrust him.

I ask you: why would a sub or slave want to keep his online communications private if he has nothing to hide from his partner??

Living 24/7, it can be difficult to find meaningful symbols of power exchange that keep the relationship feeling D/s. What valuable human rights does the "slave" really have to consensually give his Owner? Control of sexuality is one. Control of time and money are others. But handing over privacy really means something to me. The rest feels like vanilla marriage or BDSM sexplay to me.

But the OP's friend is an entirely different situation. They don't even know eachother in real life, much less live together 24/7. No wonder the lady doesn't want to hand over her password.

< Message edited by MsCfromMelbourne -- 9/11/2008 11:09:20 PM >

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RE: disobedience...... - 9/11/2008 11:24:03 PM

MsCfromMelbourne

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I should add that my partner does not have reciprocal access to my mail etc. he is forbidden to even read my posts here, in Fetlife or on BDSM Australia.

Is that because I am untrustworthy or saying evil things about him? No!

It is because he wants a genuine power differential in the relationship that goes much futher than sexy role playing games like "he must greet me on his knees naked every night". And I oblige him, but its not easy to find and maintain that power differential 24/7. It really isn't.

Which is probably a topic for another thread.

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RE: disobedience...... - 9/12/2008 5:14:08 AM

LadyHibiscus

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While I see where Ms C is coming from, I wouldn't demand my partner's passwords. Shoot, I have enough trouble wading through my own mail, let alone someone else's! I am all for transparency, but too much honesty can be a bad thing indeed.

He can't even read your POSTS, Ms C? Dang! That has to be madly frustrating for him.

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RE: disobedience...... - 9/12/2008 9:52:23 AM

MsCfromMelbourne

Posts: 777
Joined: 2/15/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

He can't even read your POSTS, Ms C? Dang! That has to be madly frustrating for him.

Funnily, it does not frustrate him at all. He has never been a member of a site like this, so he has never read any of my posts. He has no idea if my posts are interesting or not.

All he knows is that I laugh at the computer screen and I ask him bizarre questions from time to time.

I suspect he wonders why on earth I would want to spend time writing about BDSM instead of doing it - I wonder the same thing myself!!!!

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RE: disobedience...... - 9/12/2008 7:10:58 PM

PsyVamp

Posts: 1026
Joined: 10/30/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: smittyforyou

Um, i guess i wasn't too clear before. my friend was the one who contacted the Domme and after many e-mails, calls, cams, etc., with her, she said she wanted a ltr with Her, she said she would give TPE, but then claimed she didn't understand what that really meant. she wants to take it slow and learn about Her vanilla side first, and over time get more into BDSM. i can understand both sides, but if she is the one who said she would give TPE and then doesn't give it what does that say about her? she said they discussed her profile and what should happen with it, but now she wants to not do what was asked. So, what would you do with a sub like that? Give her a chance to meet you or see her disobedience as a problem you don't want in the future? (i forgot to say, i told her she can always change the password if she sees the profile is being abused. right?)

If I were the Dominant, I would walk. Then again, it is not in My nature to want profile passwords. I might ask a potential to put a blurb like "under consideration...blah blah" to test the seriousness of his/her intentions and if that were not done, I would walk.

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RE: disobedience...... - 9/12/2008 8:01:24 PM

OneMoreWaste

Posts: 910
Joined: 8/24/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: smittyforyou

Um, i guess i wasn't too clear before. my friend was the one who contacted the Domme and after many e-mails, calls, cams, etc., with her, she said she wanted a ltr with Her, she said she would give TPE, but then claimed she didn't understand what that really meant. she wants to take it slow and learn about Her vanilla side first, and over time get more into BDSM. i can understand both sides, but if she is the one who said she would give TPE and then doesn't give it what does that say about her? she said they discussed her profile and what should happen with it, but now she wants to not do what was asked. So, what would you do with a sub like that? Give her a chance to meet you or see her disobedience as a problem you don't want in the future? (i forgot to say, i told her she can always change the password if she sees the profile is being abused. right?)

Gah, the feminine pronouns are making my head spin

Agreeing to obey the conditions of a term that you don't know the meaning of is generally a bad idea. Whichever "she" did that needs to slow down and think things through more, and the other "she" needs to be a more effective communicator.

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