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ORIGINAL: lronitulstahp

You seem to assume that people of faith aren't capable of grasping scientific fact.  Be sure to tell that to Newton and Galileo.

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  You do realize that both Galileo and Newton faced religious persecution because of their scientific findings?
They both were men of faith yet their science found them in conflict with their respective churches.
We don't doubt their findings today, yet the same types are people that believed the Sun revolved around the Earth have their descendants in today's Creationists. 

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ORIGINAL: cyberdude611

A LOT of people believe in creationism though.

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 And to their credit, science has not disproved it.

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Science does not know how life began.

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And Palin never said only creationism should be taught. She said it should be taught along with evolution. What is interesting is if you go to the university level you will find on-campus religious services. You will find on-campus religious organizations. And you will find on-campus classes involving christianity, islam, and many other religions. But you go down to the public high schools and such stuff is banned.

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Now has having those religious organizations on those college campuses interfered with science and learning? Not at all. In fact going back, the Big Bang theory was first proposed by a Catholic preist in Belgium who had a facination with astronomy. Charles Darwin wrote about his belief in god until the day he died. These people who thought up these theories of evolution and big bang were not atheists.

Albert Einstein had a good quote for this....
"Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."
"All religions, arts and sciences, are branches of the same tree."

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ORIGINAL: lronitulstahp

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  You do realize that both Galileo and Newton faced religious persecution because of their scientific findings?
They both were men of faith yet their science found them in conflict with their respective churches.
We don't doubt their findings today, yet the same types are people that believed the Sun revolved around the Earth have their descendants in today's Creationists. 

  Once again, for the people in the cheap seats....You seem to assume that people of faith aren't capable of grasping scientific fact.  Be sure to tell that to Newton and Galileo. 
i am not being facetious rml when i say i think it's pretty clear why i chose these two particular individuals to prove a point.  i pretty much assume most of us know the historical meaning behind it.
 

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We don't doubt their findings today, yet the same types are people that believed the Sun revolved around the Earth have their descendants in today's Creationists. 

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ORIGINAL: Sanity

It is my opinion that someone would have to be extremely insecure for them to maintain that there is any subject which could not be discussed, in regards to science.

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ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou

Yes and Darwinism led to social Darwinism which incorrectly applied "survival of the fittest" to every aspect of humanity.  The Nazis used Darwinism as "proof" that certain groups of people were "subhuman" and polluting the gene pool, and thus needed to be eliminated like a virus. 

You also have other examples in history where secularism has went to the extremes and resulted in evil acts.  Stalinist purges, the French Revolution, Chinese Cultural Revolution, the Khmer Rouge, etc, etc.  Science doesn't have all the answers to life, and it's the fool that believes so. 

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ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou
Science doesn't have all the answers to life, and it's the fool that believes so. 

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ORIGINAL: Jack45

It is still the theory of evolution after all. What the gods in the 'White Coats' can't take a little competition?

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ORIGINAL: ThatDaveGuy69

But let's play a little mental game.  Let's pretend that creationism worms its way into the PUBLIC curriculum.  You've suddenly created a religious institution out of a state-funded school.  Lot's of constitutional problems there, but that's another thread.  Now let's pretend that I have a religion that I practice (uhg!) and teach to my children.  My religion says a great turtle shit out the universe after an all-nighter of margaritas and grilled shrimp.  Now we all have to accept that MY religion is JUST AS VALID as any other.  So when does the great turtle myth of creation get taught?  And what do I tell my kids when they are mocked for not beleiving that "god" did it all?  How many versions of creation are you willing to have taught?  How many are you willing to fund?  It spirals out of control pretty damn fast, doesn't it...

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For me the highlight of the evening was when I polled the audience as to how
many agreed with Gish that the creation story should be taught in public
schools. A veritable phalanx of hands shot up. I then went through a series
of slides of different creation stories from around the world, asking for a
show of hands as to how many think that this creation story or that creation
story should be taught in public schools. Of course, no one raised their
hands because they think all these other creation stories are silly myths.
These are from the chapter in my book Why People Believe Weird Things on how
to debate a creationist:

--No Creation Story from India, where "The world has always existed as it is
now, unchanging from eternity."

--The Slain Monster Creation Story from Sumeria-Babylonia, where "The world
was created from the parts of a slain monster."

--The Primordial Parents Creation Stories from the Zuni Indians, Cook
Islanders, and Egyptians, where "The world was created by the interaction
of primordial parents."

--The Cosmic Egg Creation Stories from Japan, Samoa, Persia, and China, where
"The world was generated from an egg."

--The Sea Creation Stories from the Burmese, Choctaw Indians, and Icelanders,
where "The world was created from out of the sea."

--The Spoken Edict Creation Stories from the Mayans, the Egyptians, and the
Hebrews, where "The world sprang into being at the command of a god."

When I got to this last slide no one raised their hand, so I left if up and
said, "Uh, are you SURE you don't want this last one taught, because THIS
creation story is YOURS." Slowly it dawned on them what I was doing. Some
hands started to go up, but the rest didn't want to be trapped any further. I
then drove home the point that to insist that the government force public
school children to learn one religious creation story to the exclusion of all
others is not only in violation of the First Amendment's establishment
clause, it is religious bigotry. Since they didn't seem to be getting my
point, I went over the top and yelled out "Shame on you. SHAME ON YOU. This
is bigotry. It is racism. And it is wrong."

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ORIGINAL: Thadius

Now that would be one hell of a question to ask during the debates...

"As a Christian, do you believe the description of creation in Genesis to be true, if not what other portions of the Bible do you believe to be false?"

Anybody seen a place to submit questions for any of the debates?   I got's me a few that I would love to ask of both candidates.

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ORIGINAL: lronitulstahp

my point was that as a religious person, i am still able to have my beliefs and a knowledge of and appreciation for Science...but i can only speak for myself.  Hmm, sort of like Newton and Galileo. (the people of their time weren't the examples i chose to use, but them)  Not all faithful people are fundies. Not all Christians align themselves with the religious right.  i mean, i'm a slut for goodness sake!!!

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ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou


Yes and Darwinism led to social Darwinism which incorrectly applied "survival of the fittest" to every aspect of humanity.  The Nazis used Darwinism as "proof" that certain groups of people were "subhuman" and polluting the gene pool, and thus needed to be eliminated like a virus. 

You also have other examples in history where secularism has went to the extremes and resulted in evil acts.  Stalinist purges, the French Revolution, Chinese Cultural Revolution, the Khmer Rouge, etc, etc.  Science doesn't have all the answers to life, and it's the fool that believes so. 

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What i cant understand, is the need to be so condescending towards people with religious beliefs.