RE: Differences Between What He Says and What he Does

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LadyAngelika -> RE: Differences Between What He Says and What he Does (11/29/2005 1:20:03 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: windchymes Very true, Lady A....I was only directly quoting my father, who really thought he was preparing his daughters for the big bad world. He wouldn't let us drive the car until we could change a tire by ourselves, too. I can beat the AAA every time![:D] chymes I know. I wasn't criticizing your father. Though yanno, lot of good his advice would have been had you turned out a lesbian! ;-) - LA

IrishMist -> RE: Differences Between What He Says and What he Does (11/29/2005 1:20:04 PM)
quote: Yesterday was very taxing for me. Physically and elsewise, i needed to burrow down in bed and listen to drivel on tv...try to zone out and wait for a better day tomorrow. i'm sure everyone knows what i mean -- it was "one of those days". First off...(( HUGS )) Had days like that and they just plain suck. As for the rest, I agree with you on how you handled him. He said one thing, and did another. Not a very good start. But I also agree that behavior like this is not just limited to a certain group ( ie, Dominants/Masters/Dommes/Mistresses ), it can be attributed to EVERYONE. Hope your day is going much better Candy :)

MasterRobert1 -> RE: Differences Between What He Says and What he Does (11/29/2005 2:10:22 PM)
Personally, I think you did an excellent job of evaluation. You know what and who it is you want. And he didn't matych the criteria. I wish others had that level of ability.

windchymes -> RE: Differences Between What He Says and What he Does (11/29/2005 2:37:41 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika quote: ORIGINAL: windchymes Very true, Lady A....I was only directly quoting my father, who really thought he was preparing his daughters for the big bad world. He wouldn't let us drive the car until we could change a tire by ourselves, too. I can beat the AAA every time![:D] chymes I know. I wasn't criticizing your father. Though yanno, lot of good his advice would have been had you turned out a lesbian! ;-) - LA LMAO!!! With his Mennonite upbringing, he would have KILLED me! BTW....I've been with a woman....once. It just wasn't for me. Sorry dad. chymes

candystripper -> RE: Differences Between What He Says and What he Does (11/29/2005 2:56:15 PM)
quote: We could also get away from the gender stigma by saying "believe what someone does, not what someone says". I know many women that say one thing and do another. This isn't a gender issue, it's a human issue. - LA/LadyAngelika i agree with You Ma'am, as i almost always do. OOOO, leather arm binders..sigh. i NEED my One, Yanno? My poor body is in a full-out uproar. candystripper

ExistentialSteel -> RE: Differences Between What He Says and What he Does (11/29/2005 3:06:35 PM)
I was gullty of something like that once. I inserted D/s into a situation when it was entirely inappropriate. She was concerned about the death of someone and I stupidly thought that I could break her mood. All I can say is that, thankfully, the she saw enough in me to forgive the inappropriate action on my part.

candystripper -> RE: Differences Between What He Says and What he Does (11/29/2005 3:16:18 PM)
quote: I was gullty of something like that once. I inserted D/s into a situation when it was entirely inappropriate. She was concerned about the death of someone and I stupidly thought that I could break her mood. All I can say is that, thankfully, the she saw enough in me to forgive the inappropriate action on my part. ExSteel Sir, we are only human. i do not think a Man or woman can reach age 30 and not have made most all errors, sins, and faux paus known to Mankind. It doesn't define You unless You never outgrow the behavior and cause pain intentionally. i do not see You as that kind of Man. candystripper

Quivver -> RE: Differences Between What He Says and What he Does (11/29/2005 5:03:53 PM)
seems to me the Moral of the story is that old line of "action's speak louder then words" ............ that works for me, no matter what kind of equiptment you wear. Q

slavejali -> RE: Differences Between What He Says and What he Does (11/29/2005 5:40:52 PM)
quote: Original: Quiver "seems to me the Moral of the story is that old line of "action's speak louder then words" or can you walk your talk ..thats another good one

Marquisd -> RE: Differences Between What He Says and What he Does (11/29/2005 6:57:00 PM)
hmmm.................couple of things that came to my mind. Generalizations...........oh well.we all are guilty at some point. The other thing is , that if you felt that down..................and I know the feeling well after a 14 hour work day or something really exhausting.............I don't pick up the fucking phone............I collect messages.........and call them back when I feel ok and can concentrate on the conversation without being rude or inviting unwanted bahavior. Just a thought. I like your thread and agrre that no means no - even if it is a phone conversation only. Good for you to be consequent and make the best out of it. Good luck and be well Marquis_d

trj -> RE: Differences Between What He Says and What he Does (11/29/2005 7:06:20 PM)
I don't think this is a gender thing. One of my favourite poems about the politically correct womens communities (dating myself here) ends with a line about trusting action over rhetoric.--A good lesson.

OscarHargraves -> RE: Differences Between What He Says and What he Does (11/30/2005 10:19:30 PM)
Wow! Considering you said you didn't give a hoot what people thought about how you handled this, you sure got a lot of replies. Next time you want some privacy and comfort just turn on the electric blanket, the TV and then open a chocolate bar.

IronBear -> RE: Differences Between What He Says and What he Does (11/30/2005 11:16:19 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MsIncognito I think you hit the bullseye, LadyAngelika. I met a "Dominant" that I really liked. The IM and phone conversations were great. We really clicked. He knew to say all the right things at exactly the right time. He had it all down pat - in his head. When the rubber hit the road it was more like this: Him: Ready to go out to dinner? Me: You bet, I'm starved. Him: Where do you want to go? Me: Hmmm, I'm not feeling particular, just about anything will do. (Note: I am the type of person who if I am feeling particular will just say "How about Thai food?") Him: Well, give me an idea. Me: I'm easy. You pick Him: How can I pick if you won't give me an idea? Me (getting rather annoyed): Because I don't care where we go. Pick whatever you want. You get the idea. This type of thing happened all the bloody time in just about any imagineable situation. He was a classic example of saying one thing but doing something entirely different. How on earth am I supposed to submit to someone who can't even pick a restaurant? My motto is "I hear what you say, but I listen to what you do." quote: ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika Darling, we dominant women go through that all the time. They start off by saying "I want to be devoted and obedient and cater to your every wish" and then when they don't get what they want, they bail. And I'm sure this happens with all sorts of submissive/dominant combos on either side of the equation. I'm sure this happens in non-kinky relationships too. This posts interests me in as much as I know people who are usually in control of themselves and things about them and yet at times are incapable of making basic decisions. Were the situations different, yes I have no doubt that they would take charge yet at times the basics are too much to decide on. Does this devalue them as a Dominant? In the eyes of some yes and those people would in all probability request or demand their Dominant’s ID card be returned. I’ve yet to met a person who is in absolute control (as far as it is possible) of themselves or their surrounding 100% of the time or who does not have that one “weak” chink in their controlling armour. From my point of view, and yes I am one of those who on occasions am incapable of making such decisions as to what we are going to eat other than saying with all pomp and circumstance an intelligible “Food!” I’ve been pondering on this and even discussed it with various professional friends after PTSD Conferences. It seems that people who have and still suffer from stress disorders are likely to do this more frequently because parts of the mental system shuts down when it perceives an overload. Mostly it occurs in not essential situations where the full cognisant abilities are required or due to the adrenaline rush under perceived life threatening situations. It matters where the mind recognises that the subject under discussion is not vital for the survival of the person, just decides to “Leave the building” leaving behind a somewhat bewildered and confused person who consciously has no idea how to come up with answers to what is being asked (Such as “What are we having for dinner”). I have developed a defence mechanism for this, which my family know well. All I’ll do when it appears that everything has got a tad too much is to tell Neets: I don’t have a decision in my brain right now. You make the decisions and let me relax, rest or sleep.” Usually after I’ve had some RnR I’m ok for the next period of time…. Sometimes you just have to shut down or shatter. Taking the thread heading, I’m used to the situation of “Do as I say and not as I do.” Life isn’t an even playing field and just sometimes some one in a leadership position, through training or experience is able to do something different and have others doing exactly what he or she has instructed them to do even if it is the opposite of what they (the leader) does.

LadyAngelika -> RE: Differences Between What He Says and What he Does (12/1/2005 5:38:40 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: OscarHargraves Wow! Considering you said you didn't give a hoot what people thought about how you handled this, you sure got a lot of replies. You are right in that candystripper said she didn't care for opinions. I think what she meant was that she did not want to be judge for her response. And I can understand her. There are a bunch of people here who are of the opinion that s-types (gosh, I'm starting to sound like LuckyA now) need to just shut up and do what they are told. quote: Next time you want some privacy and comfort just turn on the electric blanket, the TV and then open a chocolate bar. Now between you and I, Oscar, that is horrible advice. Many women, including myself, struggle with emotional eating and suggesting that eating would solve our problems or comfort us is actually counterproductive and will only make things worse. Now suggesting that a woman empower herself by going out and doing something good for herself like taking a yoga class or something similar might be a more affective way to intervene. Oh and in the end, you can always follow the old wise saying… “if you can’t say anything constructive, then don’t say anything at all.” - LA

MsIncognito -> RE: Differences Between What He Says and What he Does (12/1/2005 6:00:06 AM)
I don't disagree with what you're saying, however, in this particular situation this was behaviour that was observed repeatedly over the course of 6+ months, repeatedly and in all kinds of different situations. The main problem, for me, was that he virtually always deferred to me and virtually always sought my approval for...well...everything. From my point of view it was a constant passive-aggressive attempt to force me into a dominant position and that's not where I wanted to be. He might be the perfect "Dominant" for someone else (I can think of a few cough subs I know personally who'd love someone that malleable) but he was definitely the wrong Dominant for me. quote: ORIGINAL: IronBear This posts interests me in as much as I know people who are usually in control of themselves and things about them and yet at times are incapable of making basic decisions. Were the situations different, yes I have no doubt that they would take charge yet at times the basics are too much to decide on. Does this devalue them as a Dominant? In the eyes of some yes and those people would in all probability request or demand their Dominant’s ID card be returned. I’ve yet to met a person who is in absolute control (as far as it is possible) of themselves or their surrounding 100% of the time or who does not have that one “weak” chink in their controlling armour. From my point of view, and yes I am one of those who on occasions am incapable of making such decisions as to what we are going to eat other than saying with all pomp and circumstance an intelligible “Food!” I’ve been pondering on this and even discussed it with various professional friends after PTSD Conferences. It seems that people who have and still suffer from stress disorders are likely to do this more frequently because parts of the mental system shuts down when it perceives an overload. Mostly it occurs in not essential situations where the full cognisant abilities are required or due to the adrenaline rush under perceived life threatening situations. It matters where the mind recognises that the subject under discussion is not vital for the survival of the person, just decides to “Leave the building” leaving behind a somewhat bewildered and confused person who consciously has no idea how to come up with answers to what is being asked (Such as “What are we having for dinner”). I have developed a defence mechanism for this, which my family know well. All I’ll do when it appears that everything has got a tad too much is to tell Neets: I don’t have a decision in my brain right now. You make the decisions and let me relax, rest or sleep.” Usually after I’ve had some RnR I’m ok for the next period of time…. Sometimes you just have to shut down or shatter. Taking the thread heading, I’m used to the situation of “Do as I say and not as I do.” Life isn’t an even playing field and just sometimes some one in a leadership position, through training or experience is able to do something different and have others doing exactly what he or she has instructed them to do even if it is the opposite of what they (the leader) does.

LadiesBladewing -> RE: Differences Between What He Says and What he Does (12/1/2005 6:15:55 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MsIncognito How on earth am I supposed to submit to someone who can't even pick a restaurant? My motto is "I hear what you say, but I listen to what you do." I have to admit that, when I really don't care where we eat, and I tell my servant to "pick a place", I'll be doggoned, I don't want the run-around -- just pick a place and let's go. I don't necessarily think that whether or not I am willing to choose a restaurant determines whether or not I am dominant. I think that whether or not my servant knows that when I say "choose", I mean for her to make a selection and she -does- marks whether or not I have made it clear that I am the dominant. Frankly, my issue with this was the debate. At the point at which he said "Well, give me an idea". I would have either expected an idea in return (a -real- one.. not just "I don't know") OR I would have phrased it as "I'm not feeling particular at the moment, either -- you choose a place, I'll approve it or not." If I tell my servant to make a choice or handle a situation or whatever, who is in charge? Is the submissive automatically in charge, just because xhe is doing what was delegated to hir? I don't think so. Lady Zephyr

MsIncognito -> RE: Differences Between What He Says and What he Does (12/1/2005 6:26:35 AM)
Which is not a problem for me unless it happens 99.9% of the time. As I stated in my response to IronBear if others enjoy that kind of "I'm going to force you into a Dominant position because I'm the Dominant" dynamic then more power to them. It's simply not the kind of dynamic I enjoy. Ultimately, it's a matter of degree. Another Dominant I was involved with sometimes asked for my preferences or opinions and I had no problem giving them and going with it if he decided he liked my preferences. I also didn't have any emotional attachment to said preference or opinions if he decided they weren't to his liking. In this case it was a matter of the "Dominant" virtually never making decisions - big or small. Again, it's simply not the kind of dynamic I'm comfortable in. If others are I'd be glad to pass along his email [:D] quote: ORIGINAL: LadiesBladewing I have to admit that, when I really don't care where we eat, and I tell my servant to "pick a place", I'll be doggoned, I don't want the run-around -- just pick a place and let's go. I don't necessarily think that whether or not I am willing to choose a restaurant determines whether or not I am dominant. I think that whether or not my servant knows that when I say "choose", I mean for her to make a selection and she -does- marks whether or not I have made it clear that I am the dominant. Frankly, my issue with this was the debate. At the point at which he said "Well, give me an idea". I would have either expected an idea in return (a -real- one.. not just "I don't know") OR I would have phrased it as "I'm not feeling particular at the moment, either -- you choose a place, I'll approve it or not." If I tell my servant to make a choice or handle a situation or whatever, who is in charge? Is the submissive automatically in charge, just because xhe is doing what was delegated to hir? I don't think so. Lady Zephyr

plantlady64 -> RE: Differences Between What He Says and What he Does (12/1/2005 6:37:12 AM)
quote: Corrupted Posts: 819 Joined: 11/1/2005 Status: offline Let me begin with some hard-won wisdom: when a Man's behavior does not match His speech, use behavior as a guide. Hello All, I'd just like to say for all men or women out there that their actions speak louder than words. I don't think one sex or another has more or less people that are out there with very good lip service and nothing to back it up. For all people in my life integrity is key to me having the ability to relax around you and trust what's coming out of your mouth. It's a shame we can't take people at face value & that people don't feel accepted enough to be forthright with their words and honorable in their actions. Funny thing is even though I'm familliar with this concept I find myself falling short of living up to it some days myself. Sincerely, sub suzanne

Sunshine119 -> RE: Differences Between What He Says and What he Does (12/1/2005 7:58:38 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: plantlady64 Hello All, I'd just like to say for all men or women out there that their actions speak louder than words. I don't think one sex or another has more or less people that are out there with very good lip service and nothing to back it up. For all people in my life integrity is key to me having the ability to relax around you and trust what's coming out of your mouth. It's a shame we can't take people at face value & that people don't feel accepted enough to be forthright with their words and honorable in their actions. Funny thing is even though I'm familliar with this concept I find myself falling short of living up to it some days myself. Sincerely, sub suzanne Suzanne, I don't think you are alone. And I agree wholeheartedly with most here that actions are what counts. Only about 20% of our communication is conveyed with words. 40% with body language and another 40% with attitude and the way things are said. Now, I hope I don't get a whole lot of flamming here, but how can someone become a slave to someone they have never met but only chatted with on-line, in writing and on the phone? I read post after post of a submissive or slave collared to a dominant without ever having met them or having met them only once or twice. [:o] It is IN PERSON where the rubber hits the road. What is a person like when you need them to make the decision about a restaurant? (I loved that one)? How does a person act day after day after day? Someone can write beautifully but be a pig in person. This goes for both sexes and both the Dominants and Submissives. Now I'm getting off topic, but how can anyone give their life to another without living with them or seeing them regularly? Is getting collared to anyone that you haven't met or who lives far, far away just another way of avoiding intimacy? The person can say "I'm in a relationship" without having to do the work or live IN the relationship. Just venting after reading a zillion posts on these discussion boards and perhaps I should have made this a new topic. But, I've already said enough.

Vendaval -> RE: Differences Between What He Says and What he Does (12/1/2005 10:19:20 PM)
Good for you candystripper! You have enough self-esteem to know what you deserve and the determination to find what you desire. There are times, such as you described, when it is best to step out of the D/s dynamic and simply be there for your partner(s) as a friend and a person.

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