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RE: Perhaps a Magic Act? - 9/18/2008 12:26:19 PM

NuminousLeader

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Well when it is all said and done. McCain is a member of the GOP and he has cast his votes 90% for Bush.

The truth is the truth, his record supports the very crisis we are in now

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RE: Perhaps a Magic Act? - 9/18/2008 12:34:33 PM

Thadius

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quote:

ORIGINAL: NuminousLeader

Well when it is all said and done. McCain is a member of the GOP and he has cast his votes 90% for Bush.

The truth is the truth, his record supports the very crisis we are in now

Ah, a tactic I have seen around here before. The facts do not support your argument so you go for a diversion.

In that light I counter with Obama has voted with his party 95% of the time, oh and according to the tax policy center he has voted 94 times against the taxpayers of this country.

See I can do it too.

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RE: Perhaps a Magic Act? - 9/18/2008 12:42:19 PM

housesub4you

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Odd that you do not trust the House or Senate voting site. Perhaps you take his Yes votes for something else? Just check McCain voting record and his votes speak for them alone.

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RE: Perhaps a Magic Act? - 9/18/2008 12:42:42 PM

Thadius

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BOUNTYHUNTER

You know folks the sad part about our problems is that the large Percentage of our paper is in the hands of china and third world countrys banks etc, ones that we are still pumping aid into every day,Another thing if ol' Bounty's business's were failing would the goverment bail me out .you bet you ass they wouldn't...One of bounty's rules never spend more then you make....

Excellent points. I am still trying to figure out when it became a good thing to punish success and to reward failure.

A particular candidate was out stumping today claiming that it is patriotic to raise taxes and openly admitting that their ticket's plan is the "redistribution of wealth".

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RE: Perhaps a Magic Act? - 9/18/2008 12:45:31 PM

kittinSol

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

A particular candidate was out stumping today claiming that it is patriotic to raise taxes and openly admitting that their ticket's plan is the "redistribution of wealth".

True, it's much better to pretend to be all about 'what's my own stays my own, me, me, me, MINE!', and then to indebt the entire nation in order to bail out a few business failures who overestimated themselves

.

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RE: Perhaps a Magic Act? - 9/18/2008 12:46:41 PM

Thadius

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quote:

ORIGINAL: housesub4you

Odd that you do not trust the House or Senate voting site. Perhaps you take his Yes votes for something else? Just check McCain voting record and his votes speak for them alone.

You are absolutely right about voting records saying a whole lot. Remember that claim about McCain supporting corporate welfare for big oil? Guess who voted against the bill and who voted for it...

I have posted links to the library of congress many times around here, and suggested folks check out voting records and the bills they supported. Don't try pushing the claim that I choose to ignore or don't trust it. Using the Thomas search tool at the Library of Congress is one of the things I do quite regularly.

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RE: Perhaps a Magic Act? - 9/18/2008 12:49:42 PM

housesub4you

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Yea I guess your voting record is nothing but BS when you want to be President. I mean in the last week alone it's not like McCain has changed position.

Gee t, you have nothing to say about his switch from anti gov control to his current stance of more gov contol????? But wait your just argueing facts..... But Mccains words are not a fact of his position.....

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RE: Perhaps a Magic Act? - 9/18/2008 12:52:27 PM

BOUNTYHUNTER

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

quote:

ORIGINAL: BOUNTYHUNTER

You know folks the sad part about our problems is that the large Percentage of our paper is in the hands of china and third world countrys banks etc, ones that we are still pumping aid into every day,Another thing if ol' Bounty's business's were failing would the goverment bail me out .you bet you ass they wouldn't...One of bounty's rules never spend more then you make....

Excellent points. I am still trying to figure out when it became a good thing to punish success and to reward failure.

A particular candidate was out stumping today claiming that it is patriotic to raise taxes and openly admitting that their ticket's plan is the "redistribution of wealth".

"redistribution of wealth".Many times I have heard this terms and many times I have stated on the boards if you redistributed the wealth today within 6 months those that have it now would have it back again,why, because most folks just don't know how to mange money and make it grow.. Even as a boy with a paper route making 10 dollars a week my Grannie made sure I would place half of it into my saving account..My two cents..

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RE: Perhaps a Magic Act? - 9/18/2008 12:53:57 PM

Thadius

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

A particular candidate was out stumping today claiming that it is patriotic to raise taxes and openly admitting that their ticket's plan is the "redistribution of wealth".

True, it's much better to pretend to be all about 'what's my own stays my own, me, me, me, MINE!', and then to indebt the entire nation in order to bail out a few business failures who overestimated themselves .

See, perhaps this is just another cultural difference. I believe that what I earn is mine, it does not belong to the government. You should read my posts about those bailouts, if you think I am in favor of them you are mistaken. Equality in wealth seems to be the battle cry. How about approaching it from the other side of the issue. Instead of attempting to bring the wealthy down to the level of the poor, how about encouraging the poor to become wealthy? Interesting concept.

If you believe that punishing success and rewarding failure is a good idea, I can only ponder about why.

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RE: Perhaps a Magic Act? - 9/18/2008 12:57:05 PM

kittinSol

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You're probably right, it's a cultural difference. I believe that for a society to be cohesive, everybody has to participate according to their means. Obviously, a fundamentally different approach.

Although I'm getting a little irked by the amount of cash that's being spent on the behalf of the taxpayers, on the future funds that have already been indexed on behalf of future generations, and at the fact that they're getting zero return on their investment.

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RE: Perhaps a Magic Act? - 9/18/2008 1:01:10 PM

housesub4you

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And when in history have those in Power given up anything? So we learn nothing from history and fall because of greed of a few to destroy the many./

Yes yes let those with the money direct us, gee it has worked for the last 7 years. The tax cuts are great... no problems anywhere, McCain is right the dollar is sound, no worries

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RE: Perhaps a Magic Act? - 9/18/2008 1:02:57 PM

Thadius

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quote:

ORIGINAL: housesub4you

Yea I guess your voting record is nothing but BS when you want to be President. I mean in the last week alone it's not like McCain has changed position.

Gee t, you have nothing to say about his switch from anti gov control to his current stance of more gov contol????? But wait your just argueing facts..... But Mccains words are not a fact of his position.....

I pointed to at least one case where he was behind more regulation on certain industries, earlier today. Who was pushing for all of the no income, no job verification loans on homes the last few years? You know the reason that there is so much bad paper out there in the mortgage markets, that has shown to have even more influence on the other markets including the BANKS and AIG... Get back to me when you find another name to add to the list of Obama and Barney Frank.

Just to show I am not pulling shit out of thin air....

quote:

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/record.xpd?id=109-s20060525-16&bill=s109-190
Mr. President, this week Fannie Mae's regulator reported that the company's quarterly reports of profit growth over the past few years were "illusions deliberately and systematically created" by the company's senior management, which resulted in a $10.6 billion accounting scandal.

The Office of Federal Housing Enterprise Oversight's report goes on to say that Fannie Mae employees deliberately and intentionally manipulated financial reports to hit earnings targets in order to trigger bonuses for senior executives. In the case of Franklin Raines, Fannie Mae's former chief executive officer, OFHEO's report shows that over half of Mr. Raines' compensation for the 6 years through 2003 was directly tied to meeting earnings targets. The report of financial misconduct at Fannie Mae echoes the deeply troubling $5 billion profit restatement at Freddie Mac.

The OFHEO report also states that Fannie Mae used its political power to lobby Congress in an effort to interfere with the regulator's examination of the company's accounting problems. This report comes some weeks after Freddie Mac paid a record $3.8 million fine in a settlement with the Federal Election Commission and restated lobbying disclosure reports from 2004 to 2005. These are entities that have demonstrated over and over again that they are deeply in need of reform.

For years I have been concerned about the regulatory structure that governs Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac--known as Government-sponsored entities or GSEs--and the sheer magnitude of these companies and the role they play in the housing market. OFHEO's report this week does nothing to ease these concerns. In fact, the report does quite the contrary. OFHEO's report solidifies my view that the GSEs need to be reformed without delay.

I join as a cosponsor of the Federal Housing Enterprise Regulatory Reform Act of 2005, S. 190, to underscore my support for quick passage of GSE regulatory reform legislation. If Congress does not act, American taxpayers will continue to be exposed to the enormous risk that Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac pose to the housing market, the overall financial system, and the economy as a whole.
I urge my colleagues to support swift action on this GSE reform legislation.

I should point out that was stated May of 2006... before the insanity of the campaigns... Go figure.

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RE: Perhaps a Magic Act? - 9/18/2008 1:08:33 PM

Thadius

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

You're probably right, it's a cultural difference. I believe that for a society to be cohesive, everybody has to participate according to their means. Obviously, a fundamentally different approach.

Although I'm getting a little irked by the amount of cash that's being spent on the behalf of the taxpayers, on the future funds that have already been indexed on behalf of future generations, and at the fact that they're getting zero return on their investment.

As much as I am against these bailouts, claiming that there is zero return is false. There is interest associated with the loans and it is higher than the market rate.

I want everybody to be successful, I want them to realize that feeling of accomplishment. I have no problem giving somebody a hand when it is needed, helping them to learn how to become successful, however taking half of my fish to feed that man for the rest of his life doesn't seem to do either. Mmmmm..... mixed metaphors.

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RE: Perhaps a Magic Act? - 9/18/2008 1:10:15 PM

Mercnbeth

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ORIGINAL: kittinSol

You're probably right, it's a cultural difference. I believe that for a society to be cohesive, everybody has to participate according to their means. Obviously, a fundamentally different approach.

Using that concept if everyone decided not to work and had no "means" who would pay? Senator Obama says that 95% of the people will pay less under his program with all the payment coming from this mysterious and yet unidentified 5%. These people, obvious very mobile along with very wealthy, will be as Senator Biden references them "Patriots". They will not relocate or use any other method to curtail the financial responsibility Senator Obama wants to assign. I'm sure they won't cut back their business, lay off workers, or close their businesses and retire; for the opportunity to be a "Patriot". These VERY VERY special Patriots will not only have to fund the current programs and deficit but will fund the litany of Senator Obama's social engineering programs as well - because the other 95% will benefit.

Is expecting this to come to pass the product of that foreign education you received? BTW - Since you brought it up, are you still looking into how much was being spent on your education?

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RE: Perhaps a Magic Act? - 9/18/2008 1:19:48 PM

philosophy

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ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

Don't understand your point philo. Who's advocating or mandating that each and every individual, even during school age, be on the internet?

...no-one, and i'm fairly sure you know thats not what i was driving at. Several societal phenomenon have arisen since the writing of the constitution. They may or may not require new laws to be written to cover their effects.

quote:

Shouldn't your next question be; how much FURTHER will the US fall?

...i don't know......how bad are US illiteracy rates? What you said was that education ought to be a privilige, in other words non-mandatory. When that happens illiteracy rates will inevitably go up. Seriously, that's what you want?

quote:

Global warming is a fact? Really?

...yup.....there's a climate scientist on these boards, forget his name, who doesn't think that humans are responsible for it. Even he acknowledges that the earth is getting warmer at the moment. Again, are you seriously suggesting it isn't? So what is causing all those glaciers to melt?

< Message edited by philosophy -- 9/18/2008 1:20:20 PM >

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RE: Perhaps a Magic Act? - 9/18/2008 1:20:53 PM

housesub4you

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Wow couple of votes can change years of positon. McCain own record speaks for it self. You can do want you want to the facs, but the real truth is behind his votes.

So say, cry all you want the truth is out there and McCain has to answer for his voting record. Unless you think his voting record is a lie of his personal beliefs

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RE: Perhaps a Magic Act? - 9/18/2008 1:27:02 PM

Thadius

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ORIGINAL: housesub4you

Wow couple of votes can change years of positon. McCain own record speaks for it self. You can do want you want to the facs, but the real truth is behind his votes.

So say, cry all you want the truth is out there and McCain has to answer for his voting record. Unless you think his voting record is a lie of his personal beliefs

You were just saying that we should rely on information from the house and senate. I presented a direct contradiction to your point that he has just recently changed his position on the ongoing crisis. Then again, what was done in a year he wasn't campaigning, should be cast aside for the political rhetoric.

I agree voting records speak volumes. Speaking of voting records... why was Biden and Obama opposed to that legislation? It didn't have anything to do with kickbacks did it?

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RE: Perhaps a Magic Act? - 9/18/2008 1:34:03 PM

housesub4you

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Yet you deny McCain has changed according to you rules. If we follow your lead about change it seems McCains changes every day. where is that hard direct look at your person/.

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RE: Perhaps a Magic Act? - 9/18/2008 1:44:46 PM

Thadius

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McCain is not my person.

I am suggesting that he has supported more regulation in some areas, and less in others. In particular the crisis that we are now facing was brought up over 2 years ago, with proposed regulation, was blocked by the Dems, and the consequences for doing so were laid out quite well by McCain. Ah, but lets mix apples and oranges. What is Obama's plan again, and his record on this issue?

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RE: Perhaps a Magic Act? - 9/18/2008 1:47:55 PM

Mercnbeth

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Again, are you seriously suggesting it isn't? So what is causing all those glaciers to melt?

Cyclical climate change; the exact same thing that made Greenland green in the past; long before the Messiah, Al Gore, was buying carbon offsets, to rationalize his utilization of a private jet while spreading his ministry.

quote:

i don't know......how bad are US illiteracy rates? What you said was that education ought to be a privilege, in other words non-mandatory. When that happens illiteracy rates will inevitably go up. Seriously, that's what you want?

The reference to "non-mandatory" was in context to being able to remove those who failed. Many make up the 'illiterate', at least that is my claim. People who don't want to be there shouldn't have to be there. It won't effect the numbers who now get their 'everyone gets a trophy' degree. Meanwhile, the time and money resources currently behind squandered on kids who what to be 'left behind' could now be used more effectively. It is my contention that reassigning, as I mentioned with 'guild' or other options, the distracting element will improve not only the literacy rate, but the social functional rate of remaining students who graduate as well. Put simplest, my position is - let failures fail.

Concerning your question regarding literacy - defined very basically as the ability to read and write; here's what I found. The quickest and easiest source, also the least likely to be accurate, puts the US literacy rate at 99%; tied for #8. Although #1, Georgia, will most likely change after the next pole. Maybe that was the actual reason for war - to jump Russia (#6) up in the ranking.

The US is ranked similar to Austria, Australia, Canada, Germany, Japan, AND the UK.

The information comes with this disclaimer:

quote:

Many high-income countries, having attained high levels of literacy, no longer collect basic literacy statistics and thus are not included in the USI data. In calculating the HDI, a literacy rate of 99.0% is assumed for high-income countries that do not report adult literacy information.
Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_literacy_rate

I noted something interesting from the chart. It seems that countries that were or are at one time, totalitarian States, do much better with literacy. I guess without having to deal with the politically correct answer regarding the spelling, pronunciation, or meaning of a word, or even more basic "what is 2+2?"; coming into consideration, teaching a definitive 'right' answer is more affective. Maybe the US can just try doing that?

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