Submissive and slave improvement

Submissive and slave improvement (Full Version)

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troilus -> Submissive and slave improvement (11/30/2005 3:49:02 PM)
Is not a main benefit of being submissive to allow your dom or master to make improvements to your self that you would not make on your own? To that, I am curious if slaves and submissives would welcome a master who would insist that they lose (or sometimes gain) weight, exercise, learn manners, etc. How many would go farther, and accept gifts of surgery? I'm not interested in that, but I imagine some would like to nip and tuck their slaves...

BeingChewsie -> RE: Submissive and slave improvement (11/30/2005 3:54:19 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: troilus Is not a main benefit of being submissive to allow your dom or master to make improvements to your self that you would not make on your own? To that, I am curious if slaves and submissives would welcome a master who would insist that they lose (or sometimes gain) weight, exercise, learn manners, etc. Not for me. The main benefit is getting to live authentically. My owner insists I maintain things to his preferences. I'm sure most do. quote: How many would go farther, and accept gifts of surgery? I'm not interested in that, but I imagine some would like to nip and tuck their slaves... Ohhhhhhhh.. I would turn this body plastic in a NY minute!..A little nip, a little tuck, a little lift..::sigh::

LilWhiteWolf -> RE: Submissive and slave improvement (11/30/2005 4:02:28 PM)
while i agree that helping Your sub or slave to achieve something that they truly want is admirable, i, for one, would want that choice. unless this is discussed before a commitment is established, i don't think it is "fair" ( i know, there is no such thing as fairness in alot of D/s relationships...smiling) to want to change your sub or slave if she is happy with the way he or she is. You knew what what her faults or drawbacks were before you collared her or him. as far as plastic surgery, well i think i would take it as an insult if my Master wanted me to have it done. as always this is just the opinion of the rebel sub ..grinning

sweetpettjenny -> RE: Submissive and slave improvement (11/30/2005 4:06:40 PM)
i would hope he would encourage me and train me to be perfect for him. Yes i would have surgery

jamesthehumanrug -> RE: Submissive and slave improvement (11/30/2005 4:17:43 PM)
greetings,troil us, i dont know ,but ,i hope a top is proud of what they do ,for their pets, just like some animal lover taking their pet to the vets,for a special operation,i assume it is ,about the same level, esp,if they take them, out ,or use them ,and claim the new addition was totally their idea... i don't think, that even if it is the slaves' money;it ain't comin', in plastic- surgery ,unless the top says ,so....unless it's done ,in secret ,and,totally done ,for the top ,AND PROCLAIMED BY THE BOTTOM ALOUD...ie: see what i did again,to be the best slave possible... and, the other .... loose, or gain weight?i don't want to hear the complaint,from a "real top" ,if you dont like it ;CHANGE ME! (,OR WHAT'S YOUR PROBLEM?GO FIND SOMEONE ELSE ,AND CONTROL THEM BETTER,DON'T KNOW HOW ,NOW?????)....I, JUST DON'T WANNA' HEAR IT; IT'S REDICULOUS,A SLAVE ,BELONGS ,TO THE TOP,AND THEY CAN'T DO ANYTHING?....BUT, that's a benefit you don't expect,but, that, too won't happen ,unless you're ,'in the know' ,or going ,with a top usually as far as i'm concerned... i should dress,for vanilla down the street, and, if me,or her (the dom) dress, in sexy uniform ,or english tite-fit leather ; any other way but ,"frump;" we'd be acosted.... several times....UNLESS YOURE IN THE RIGHT NEIGHBORHOOD AND WITH MONEY SO NO CITY WORKERS AND THEIR, OFFSPRING RELATIONS AND ,TOO DISTANT-RETARDS CAN TOUCH YOU , then there's always, that THOUGHT:of -don't you ,just love those sexy little presents, and, being treated ,so precious, and oh so "special" , just ,before they kill you ?! IT IS ALL A TOPS FAULT AND PROBLEM AND ITS ,NOT A "SLAVE" ,IF YOU HAVE RESISTANCE...

AbstractSavant -> RE: Submissive and slave improvement (11/30/2005 4:25:11 PM)
It's part of my hard limits that no permanent changes will be made to me without my own express desire and consent. My Master supports me in changing myself every day for the better, in weight loss, fitness training and emotional growth.

girl4you2 -> RE: Submissive and slave improvement (11/30/2005 4:28:13 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: troilus Is not a main benefit of being submissive to allow your dom or master to make improvements to your self that you would not make on your own? To that, I am curious if slaves and submissives would welcome a master who would insist that they lose (or sometimes gain) weight, exercise, learn manners, etc. i'm a bit curious as to why a submissive or slave might not make improvements to their selves on their own, or that you might think that they'd only do it on the wishes and under the tutelage of a dom or master. quote: How many would go farther, and accept gifts of surgery? I'm not interested in that, but I imagine some would like to nip and tuck their slaves... i'd ask here, how far would one go? i happen to have some connections to the guy who did michael jackson's work, if anyone wants to push it to the extreme. plastic surgery isn't a simple thing as i've heard they present on tv. complications do arise, up to and including death. i'd surely hope that this would be discussed to some extent. while a collared slave may not have voting rights as to his or her own body, i'd hope that all the risks and benefits and possible side effects would be known by all and duly considered. i wonder what would happen were the slaves and submissives given the same opportunities to do likewise for their doms and/or masters? just curious, as i know things ain't democratic.

troilus -> RE: Submissive and slave improvement (11/30/2005 4:37:58 PM)
Submissives, I think, could express their wishes and earn their satisfaction. Slaves, well, you are out of luck. Find a hot master. I agree with your assessment of plastic surgery. I frown upon it. As for the subs making improvements on their own, I did not say it was impossible. I think they have failed to do so in the past. It may be psychologically easier for them to stop eating so much if their masters told them when to eat. And it might be just easy enough for a master to say, "exercise 2 hours daily" and for the sub to do it. But perhaps the master will have to watch the sub exercise for 2 hours. I would enjoy watching a sub run on my treadmill for an hour.

sub4hire -> RE: Submissive and slave improvement (11/30/2005 5:04:02 PM)
quote: Is not a main benefit of being submissive to allow your dom or master to make improvements to your self that you would not make on your own? To that, I am curious if slaves and submissives would welcome a master who would insist that they lose (or sometimes gain) weight, exercise, learn manners, etc. How many would go farther, and accept gifts of surgery? I'm not interested in that, but I imagine some would like to nip and tuck their slaves... Would you not ask yourself the question "why didn't they want me for me to begin with?" If a person wants you to change to suit them, would your heart truly be in it? Probably not, which is why most people whose dominants put them on diets fail miserably. I can see it if the submissive wants to lose weight. Needs some help and the dominant pushes them in the right direction. However just to be selfish because they did not choose the right partner in the first place is wrong. As far as the nip and tuck goes, at what point does it stop? What if you nip and tuck yourself forever and it still isn't good enough? Does said dominant then leave you for someone more suitable?

girl4you2 -> RE: Submissive and slave improvement (11/30/2005 5:14:47 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: sub4hire Would you not ask yourself the question "why didn't they want me for me to begin with?" If a person wants you to change to suit them, would your heart truly be in it? Probably not, which is why most people whose dominants put them on diets fail miserably. I can see it if the submissive wants to lose weight. Needs some help and the dominant pushes them in the right direction. However just to be selfish because they did not choose the right partner in the first place is wrong. As far as the nip and tuck goes, at what point does it stop? What if you nip and tuck yourself forever and it still isn't good enough? Does said dominant then leave you for someone more suitable? exactly, and worded better than i did. also, what happens if one of the nip and tuck surgeries fails or has to be redone due to some unplanned complication and/or it comes out horribly? what if the person is left worse off than they began? what if they get that michael jackson/barbie phenom and don't want to quit (dom or sub)? how drastic is drastic? and what if, after all that improvement, they find that they look around and decide to wander off to "firmer" pastures? health issues aside, what if people just decided to accept people as they are and/or were when they were met?

noirgirl -> RE: Submissive and slave improvement (11/30/2005 7:21:26 PM)
I would refuse "help" with losing weight. I am not interested in losing weight, or in a dominant who thinks I need to do so. My mistress and I go for long walks together at times, and that is fine but it is for enjoyment not exercise. I don't think physical changes to my body are something that is relevant to D/s. My mistress is more concerned with controlling my mind, than altering my body

LuckyAlbatross -> RE: Submissive and slave improvement (11/30/2005 8:12:47 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: troilus Is not a main benefit of being submissive to allow your dom or master to make improvements to your self that you would not make on your own? Not for me. For me the main benefit is being in a relationship that fulfills me and the people I am with. quote: To that, I am curious if slaves and submissives would welcome a master who would insist that they lose (or sometimes gain) weight, exercise, learn manners, etc. Yes, in fact each of my part relationships as an owned slave did all of that. quote: How many would go farther, and accept gifts of surgery? I'm not interested in that, but I imagine some would like to nip and tuck their slaves... Absolutely. There are some surgeries I'd beg for. Cosmetic Surgery

realophelia -> RE: Submissive and slave improvement (11/30/2005 8:25:16 PM)
quote: How many would go farther, and accept gifts of surgery? I'm not interested in that, but I imagine some would like to nip and tuck their slaves... I would accept it in a minute. Though I would have want the surgery being offered. Ophelia

LuckyAlbatross -> RE: Submissive and slave improvement (11/30/2005 9:01:47 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: girl4you2 also, what happens if one of the nip and tuck surgeries fails or has to be redone due to some unplanned complication and/or it comes out horribly? what if the person is left worse off than they began? what if they get that michael jackson/barbie phenom and don't want to quit (dom or sub)? how drastic is drastic? Those are all excellent questions that should be weighed and understood before undergoing such relationships and decisions. That doesn't make the decisions out of bounds. quote: and what if, after all that improvement, they find that they look around and decide to wander off to "firmer" pastures? Then they do. I'd prefer someone go where they want and be honest about it. quote: health issues aside, what if people just decided to accept people as they are and/or were when they were met? Then they do. However, in a relationship as an owned slave, I would understand that being accepted as who I am does not mean I can expect to stay that way. Property gets changed all the time.

FelinePersuasion -> RE: Submissive and slave improvement (11/30/2005 9:38:14 PM)
As for the subs making improvements on their own, I did not say it was impossible. I think they have failed to do so in the past. It may be psychologically easier for them to stop eating so much if their masters told them when to eat. Umm you do know that not every over weight woman is over weight because they eat all the time or to much. There's a lot of reasons why someone can be over weight with out eating to much

subbella -> RE: Submissive and slave improvement (11/30/2005 9:56:29 PM)
My Master always encouraged me to take better care of myself health wise. One thing he hoped I would accomplish was to stop smoking. FINALLY I took the leap and smoked my last cigarette two days ago. (of course this is after about 3 bouts of bronchitis in less than 2 years and two doctors telling me to quit). I quit cold turkey, no patch, no gum, no crutch. I am hacking my head off, and have no voice to speak of, so these two ailments help keep me from going for a cigarette in a pinch. I just hope once I"m healthy, then the desire to smoke will be gone. I'm hoping that Master will recognize my will power and offer me a reward of some sort, especially since he's been wanting me to quit for over a year! Any other changes to my body that would require surgery would cause me to look twice at what my Master sees in me. I'm not perfect, nor do I want to be. I know I can make some improvements, but proper diet and exercise and change of bad habit into good are enough for natural change. A nip and tuck is a temporary fix, and before too long, requiring another nip and tuck down the road. A vicious cycle.

girl4you2 -> RE: Submissive and slave improvement (11/30/2005 10:18:40 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: subbella My Master always encouraged me to take better care of myself health wise. One thing he hoped I would accomplish was to stop smoking. FINALLY I took the leap and smoked my last cigarette two days ago. (of course this is after about 3 bouts of bronchitis in less than 2 years and two doctors telling me to quit). I quit cold turkey, no patch, no gum, no crutch. I am hacking my head off, and have no voice to speak of, so these two ailments help keep me from going for a cigarette in a pinch. I just hope once I"m healthy, then the desire to smoke will be gone. congratulations and i wish you well. keep going and don't look back, one day at a time and you will make it. how wonderful! you will certainly be rewarded with immediate better health (your lungs will clear out) as well as longer term (far less lung infections such as bronchitis). hurrah! just keep those in mind in case of cravings and remember you can DO IT! quote: I'm hoping that Master will recognize my will power and offer me a reward of some sort, especially since he's been wanting me to quit for over a year! Any other changes to my body that would require surgery would cause me to look twice at what my Master sees in me. I'm not perfect, nor do I want to be. I know I can make some improvements, but proper diet and exercise and change of bad habit into good are enough for natural change. A nip and tuck is a temporary fix, and before too long, requiring another nip and tuck down the road. A vicious cycle. a very vicious cycle it can be, as you see. sounds like you are pretty good as you are!

veronicaofML -> RE: Submissive and slave improvement (11/30/2005 10:36:53 PM)
i have given this some thought. i am trying to be nice. making improvements? unless i was around someone in 100% perfect health and was a covergirl model.....i have YET to meet 1 single woman walking this earth, that "I" was ever involved with personally, that had room to talk about body size...SOOOOO in MY eyes? NO domme should start telling ME what i should/ should not do/ health wise. my 2 cents best wishes take care

NakedOnMyChain -> RE: Submissive and slave improvement (11/30/2005 10:55:25 PM)
quote: Is not a main benefit of being submissive to allow your dom or master to make improvements to your self that you would not make on your own? To that, I am curious if slaves and submissives would welcome a master who would insist that they lose (or sometimes gain) weight, exercise, learn manners, etc. It's not a main benefit in my case. The main benefit of my submissiveness is that I love my dom and I truly enjoy serving him. I've never needed anyone to tell me I'm not physically or aesthetically up to par. If I don't feel good, or feel that I look good, I'll do something about it on my own. Sure, it's wonderful if master helps motivate me. But if he looked at me and said, "Go run. You look like hell, you cow," I'd probably smack him and be on my way. Seriously, why would anyone choose someone that they feel they have to mold? If you don't like them, don't be with them. (I'm talking about major things here, not how you eat your Fruit Loops.) quote: How many would go farther, and accept gifts of surgery? I'm not interested in that, but I imagine some would like to nip and tuck their slaves... Not a chance. There will be no nipping and tucking on this girl. My body is a temple. (I think I'm having a domme moment.) I love myself just the way I am. Sure, I'm open to some fine-tuning, such as exercise and a healthy diet, but cosmetic surgery is something I never intend to try. I don't relish the idea of changing drastically to please other people. It's one thing to serve and to love. It's completely another to change the core of who you are for someone else. It reminds me of a past relationship I had. I had all this beautiful long dark hair that I loved. (Yes, it was longer than I have now). He had a thing for girls that had short blonde hair. He wanted me to chop mine off and dye it. So, being stupid and eighteen, I did. I cried for weeks after the cut. It was horrible, and it looked heinous on me. That was when I realized that no matter how much someone's opinion matters to me, I have to live for myself first and foremost. If I'm not a valuable person to myself, I never will be for anyone else. And hey, the guy ended up cheating on me with a blonde, short-haired fifteen year old anyway, so fuck him. [;)]

subbella -> RE: Submissive and slave improvement (11/30/2005 11:17:09 PM)
Thanks for your encouraging words! Yes, I know in time my lungs will clear and I'll feel so much better. My teeth will be brighter and my energy level will increase. Right now, I just want the cough to go away and my voice to come back. It's a shame it took me so long to see the "light".

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