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The Appearance of Ds - 9/29/2008 10:54:27 PM

darchChylde

Posts: 5279
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From: Warm Springs, GA but i live in San Francisco.
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First off, I'd like to state that this is not yet another thread comparing the "illusions of dominance and submission" to the actuality.

Reading a post in another, totally unrelated thread the words "I do not overtly 'Domme' him" were used; and while I am admittedly using them entirely out of context, the phrase itself took on a life of its' own.

Ok, to the point: When witnessing the interactions of people in Ds relationships, do you find the nature of the relationship to be more often expressed in the words/actions of the Dominant or the submissive? Do you find the genders involved to be a deciding factor, or is it the dominant or submissive nature of a person to be the most common factor making one more, or less, expressive of the nature of that relationship?

This is of no real importance to me, just a matter of curiosity that has tickled my brain over the past several minutes; causing me to look at my own relationship and others' in order to decide whether or not my memories or perceptions are colored by my own position in such a relationship.

I personally think that the nature of the relationship is most commonly reflected in the submissive's demeanor; but as I said, my perceptions could be tainted.

What do you think?

_____________________________

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if only to keep me to herself.

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Post #: 1

RE: The Appearance of Ds - 9/29/2008 11:20:26 PM

MasterFireMaam

Posts: 5587
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From: Charleston, WV
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I think it takes two...and I'll usually think something is off if only one is showing interest in the dynamic. Gender, race, sex or orientation have nothing to do with it.

Master Fire

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(in reply to darchChylde)

Post #: 2

RE: The Appearance of Ds - 9/29/2008 11:27:38 PM

Duckiemine

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Honestly, I agree with MasterFireMaam... It all depends on the people involved in the relationship...

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Post #: 3

RE: The Appearance of Ds - 9/30/2008 3:35:02 AM

ShiftedJewel

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I don't know really. I personally seem to notice the submissive nature first, if that makes any sense. But after noticing that I do see the dominant dynamic as well. But as far as the first impression goes? I see the submissive behavior long before I notice the dominant/submissive relationship. But maybe that's because I tend to look more for submissive type behavior in people.

Jewel

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RE: The Appearance of Ds - 9/30/2008 3:55:29 AM

TysGalilah

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do you find the nature of the relationship to be more often expressed in the words/actions of the Dominant or the submissive?

Imo it is both. Reflecting and reflective

Do you find the genders involved to be a deciding factor
No

_____________________________

galilah

.."There are two ways of spreading light: to be the candle or the mirror that reflects it. " Edith Wharton

(in reply to darchChylde)

Post #: 5

RE: The Appearance of Ds - 9/30/2008 5:33:07 AM

Dnomyar

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As far as the genders being the deciding factor. I would say mostly yes. One is there mainly to please the other.

(in reply to TysGalilah)

Post #: 6

RE: The Appearance of Ds - 9/30/2008 5:34:00 AM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
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Looking at our relationship, since we aren't involved in a nonexistant local community, I have to say it's fluid. And stress related. The one less stressed seems to be doing more. When I'm stressed, he steps up to the plate and is more overtly dominant which is very helpful for me. When he is, I submit more, more anticipatory service, etc which he finds calming.

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Post #: 7

RE: The Appearance of Ds - 9/30/2008 5:52:15 AM

LATEXBABY64

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I think people do not know how to make relationships is the biggest problem they are to busy trying to copy everyone elses

(in reply to DesFIP)

Post #: 8

RE: The Appearance of Ds - 9/30/2008 6:21:26 AM

leadership527

Posts: 5026
Joined: 6/2/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: darchChylde
Reading a post in another, totally unrelated thread the words "I do not overtly 'Domme' him" were used; and while I am admittedly using them entirely out of context, the phrase itself took on a life of its' own.

In my admittedly very limited experience, I dont' find any of those factors to be relevant. In my experience, the actual authority transfer itself is a very quiet and subdued thing. In order to see it, I'd have to be watching a couple very closely for some period of time. But people don't do simple authority transfer, they wrap some amount of fantasy around it... "kneeling, honorifics, rituals and protocols of various sorts"... none of those things are a part of the core. To the extent that a couple wraps up their D/s in a rich fantasy layer, then it's visible. If they do not, it becomes very hard to spot. Even then, you can't really know who originated the visibile fantasy layer. For instance, I just found out that my wife is actually attracted (*shudders*) to that whole black-on-black badass dom look *sighs*. So if we were out, you might key on me being "dominant" (or at least dressing that way) but it'd be her fault.

Under normal circumstances, it'd be really hard to spot the D/s dynamic between my wife and I, even in the privacy of our own living room. "Honey, would you go make me a screwdriver when you get a moment?" Is something that I might say to her. Only she and I would understand that it wasn't a question and "get a moment" implies soon without a few hours to watch closely.

(in reply to darchChylde)

Post #: 9

RE: The Appearance of Ds - 9/30/2008 6:51:48 AM

RCdc

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Neither/both.
As Master Fire has stated, it takes two.

the.dark.

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Post #: 10

RE: The Appearance of Ds - 9/30/2008 7:37:14 AM

thetammyjo

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In general what I notice in other Ds couples (or Ms for that matter) and what I am told about us is that the submissive/slave seems very attentive and focused on the dom/owner, sometimes with a sort of hyper-politeness.

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(in reply to darchChylde)

Post #: 11

RE: The Appearance of Ds - 9/30/2008 8:42:36 AM

WhiplashSmile2

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Joined: 6/11/2008
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In all honestly a D/s relationship is something that is established between two people.  Many relationships have a D/s structure, for those of us which are D/s aware it is easier for us to see and understand.

D/s does not have be overt and forced for it to naturally occur between two people.   The thing about "this lifestyle" is that we can place a knowing focus upon D/s and seek out like minded partners.

We are tuned into our relationship structure desires, along with having much clearer understanding, focus and goals in our day to day relationship with one another.

It's a combination of things that make D/s work between two people. Clearly one being Dom or submissive in nature has some influence but that's not the sole factor involved.

I tend to agree with your statement, that the nature of the relationship is reflected in the submissives Demeanor.   The same can be said about the Demeanor of the Dominant as well.

Actually the Demeanor of both parties in a DOM couple relationship even reflect the nature of thier relationship. That is if you ask me.

(in reply to darchChylde)

Post #: 12

RE: The Appearance of Ds - 9/30/2008 8:46:07 AM

SrchngCpl73112

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Joined: 9/21/2008
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I agree with what leadership had to say. You wouldnt notice our D/s relationship in public or private either unless you were watching very closely. When we are at home it is the same way with us. He may ask me "Will you get me some more DP when you get the chance?" Of course I always get up right then and get whatever he needs or wants. When we are in public he may want to run over and look at something for a minute at Walmart or wherever and he will just simply say "Stay". If anyone heard this they would think 2 different things. Wow, how can she let him talk to her that way or if they knew about our lifestyle then they would know the relationship we have. I am also very attentive to him when we go in public and he is very attentive to me. We hold hands, he opens doors for me, he always has me walk thru the door first, he doesnt like me walking behind him because he is very protective. These are things that have to do with our dynamic and how he feels he is watching over me, they arent things people will really notice but if someone does they will either understand or think we are crazy!!!! LOL

(in reply to thetammyjo)

Post #: 13

RE: The Appearance of Ds - 9/30/2008 9:47:54 AM

HopeLost

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Joined: 2/7/2007
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i think to a casual observer a submisive is more likely to be the person who is more overt. its just the nature of submission. to be focused on the Dom to show them the desire to serve or be owned or appreciated.
this is not to say that the Dom is not doing their part. in my opinion a Dominants role is just more subtle and not so easily seen.

(in reply to SrchngCpl73112)

Post #: 14

RE: The Appearance of Ds - 9/30/2008 9:50:00 AM

Lashra

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Joined: 2/9/2006
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I usually don't look at others relationships, but I do examine my own from time to time. To the outside world they would see my sub being a gentleman. What I mean by this is he opens doors for me, carries packages etc etc. Now what might strike a vanilla person as "different" is I walk on the left side, I order food for both of us in restaurants, I tell him "no" that he can't have dessert

because he needs to watch his health. He complies cheerfully. So to some we may appear strange but to others we are doing what we need for each other in our relationship.
I think its a balance with us. Although I will say I do find couples where one is a screaming harpy and then other shrinking violet to be a bit nerve rattling. I've seen some D/s couples like this, the Dom screaming at a crying sub who just doesn't want to obey and I thought they both looked pretty bad.

~Lashra

_____________________________

“We can never judge the lives of others, because each person knows only their own pain and renunciation. It's one thing to feel that you are on the right path, but it's another to think that yours is the only path.”

(in reply to darchChylde)

Post #: 15

RE: The Appearance of Ds - 9/30/2008 10:17:06 AM

CMRTyson

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Joined: 11/21/2007
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I believe that the character of the relationship is determined together by both parties. After all it is a relationship. I can see were some of the factors are determined by the submissive, since the act of submission is the voluntary act of the sub to give her/his will over to the dominant and be commanded by them. Both set the tone by action and reaction. Tysgalilah's quote at the bottom of her post: -- "There are two ways of spreading light: to be the candle or the mirror that reflects it -- speaks not only to D/s but to any successful relationship. The willingness to command and the style in which it is exercised should always be shaped by how it is received and accepted by the submissive. Frankly, I would be at a loss on how it can work otherwise.

My dear girl to open and willing for all that I have sought from her service, but some of that great eagerness is knowing I will not misuse that power. Getting us back to the trust word again. It works together, it is not about which one is one the leash to which is holding it, both rather who they are to themselves and to each other. That is true of any gender I would think.

Thanks for the question, like so many it gets you to thinking and to define so much of what you are doing and how it is done.

Tyson

(in reply to Lashra)

Post #: 16

RE: The Appearance of Ds - 9/30/2008 10:17:33 AM

lateralist1

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Depends on the people involved. The length of time they have been a couple. How much time they spend together. I don't know many BDSM couples. Well I don't think so anyway but of course one never knows who is BDSM. But I know a lot of couples who have a d/s relationship as in one of them is the boss. Funnily enough it's rarely the man. It may or may not be consensual. I'm a people watcher so I tend to notice the little things more than most. I love it when a woman has only got to raise an eyebrow to bring her man to heel. A dominant person really should never need to use CP to gain the obediance/willingness of their partner. Unfortunately finding people who want to do as they are asked/told is in my experience very difficult. But that might be a reflection on me. The dynamic of 'I'm a brat' make me has never really interested me much. Just too tiresome. I would rather be without a relationship.

(in reply to HopeLost)

Post #: 17

RE: The Appearance of Ds - 9/30/2008 11:55:30 AM

DesFIP

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From: Apple County NY
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Lateralist, what is true for me and may be what your problem is, is that in order to do as I was told meant he had to prove his decisions were always going to be well thought out. They may not always work out in reality, but he always puts thought into any decision that has the possibility of impacting me.

And I couldn't trust him on day one to be this careful all the time. It took months of me asking him for his reasons before we had a sufficient history together of him making important choices that I found myself always agreeing with before I was sure he wouldn't be careless of me.

What I do find is that most dominants aren't willing to gain trust at that slow rate. They want it before it has been earned and sadly enough without ever earning it.

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RE: The Appearance of Ds - 9/30/2008 12:33:03 PM

CreativeDominant

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

Lateralist, what is true for me and may be what your problem is, is that in order to do as I was told meant he had to prove his decisions were always going to be well thought out. They may not always work out in reality, but he always puts thought into any decision that has the possibility of impacting me.

And I couldn't trust him on day one to be this careful all the time. It took months of me asking him for his reasons before we had a sufficient history together of him making important choices that I found myself always agreeing with before I was sure he wouldn't be careless of me.

What I do find is that most dominants aren't willing to gain trust at that slow rate. They want it before it has been earned and sadly enough without ever earning it.

~segue into a side comment regarding the statement in "bold" above: Amazing what differing perceptions can be like, is it not? My observation is that many submissives want to slow things down to a point where it sometimes feels as if you...the dominant...are being made to go down a "checklist of trust". At a certain point, you either trust someone or you do not. I'll grant you that there are always new things arise in which it becomes a question again but it should not have to be with each and every new thing that comes up.

~hijack over~ In regards to the original question, I like to people watch myself and when I am around other D/s couples, I note that the submissive's actions come across first. Of course, these are settings where you might expect them to be...clubs, munches, etc.. When in public, I try to guess but I would be curious as to how often my guesses have been wrong.

(in reply to DesFIP)

Post #: 19

RE: The Appearance of Ds - 9/30/2008 12:38:31 PM

simpleplan2

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I think it depends on the two in question, CD. I agree that every new thing that comes up shouldn't call for an act of Congress but if it's someone you don't know all that well and he wants to tie you up....well, once the sub is immobilized, what can she do? I sometimes think dominants forget just how vulnerable the submissive is at times. Just because I let someone flog me and I trust him not to go too far, that doesn't mean that I am necessarily going to let him tie me up and partake in a bit of knife or fire play.

< Message edited by simpleplan2 -- 9/30/2008 12:39:12 PM >

(in reply to CreativeDominant)

Post #: 20

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