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RE: Creationism in public schools - 10/5/2008 7:21:50 AM

kittinSol

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Le coq: le seul oiseau qui chante les pieds dans la merde. Seul Dieu tout puissant...

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RE: Creationism in public schools - 10/5/2008 7:23:50 AM

rulemylife

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

This is not support for creationism as it applies to education...but just something to think about.

I get so tired of hearing people state that science is God because they can measure...observe...repeat..and predict ..where religion is faith and therefore not to be believed. Forget for now the documented miracles of prayer, the sightings of deities and so on... it is just faith..not real.

Yet these same very sarcastic people expect all to take on faith the instantaneous creation of the universe ..matter, energy, and time... from NOTHING...with NOTHING preceding it. How is that any less unbelievable or fantastic...or even different than Genesis...It certainly cannot be proved by observation...measure...or prediction. It is just an idea...a thought...a feeling...a FAITH.

Butch

Yes, this is an old, tired argument. There had to be a Creator because things didn't just come into being on their own.

Which begs the question of who created the Creator.

Then, the answer is he always existed, which in turn prompts the question of why couldn't the basic elements of the universe have always existed then?

< Message edited by rulemylife -- 10/5/2008 7:38:35 AM >

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RE: Creationism in public schools - 10/5/2008 7:30:00 AM

thishereboi

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

You don't have to be a creationist to be a Christian: you need to read the thread again.

No, you dont. But to say there there are absolutely no scientist that are also creationists is a bit of a stretch.

As to reading this thread again....thanks but no thanks.

For the record, I do not believe it should be taught in the public schools. They have enough trouble teaching the kids to read, write and do math. I really don't trust them to teach my child about religious ideas.

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RE: Creationism in public schools - 10/5/2008 7:31:23 AM

bipolarber

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Thishereboi,

I never said anything about their being christians, boi... I said that scientists don't believe in creationisim. There's a major difference. Seeks is trying to say that scientists somehow secretly believe in this rubbish, in a total turnaround to the basis of their professional lives. He offered no proof of this outlandish claim, so I can only assume that he wasn't telling the truth.

Now you, jumping in with both feet, have made the mistake of assuming I meant that none of them are christians. Obviously, there are very religious scientists. Einstien and Bhor, for examples. But they made the distinction between what they themselves believe, and what they can prove, via experiment and mathmatics. They understood that religion isn't something you push on kids in a science classroom.

Now, I ask again...

Who are some of these "scientists" who support this creationsim bullshit? Name them. Find links to both their credentials, and their statements that they believe that I.D. is every bit as valid as Darwin.

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RE: Creationism in public schools - 10/5/2008 7:37:15 AM

lronitulstahp

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

Le coq: le seul oiseau qui chante les pieds dans la merde. Seul Dieu tout puissant...

Maintenant, j'ai faim....pour KFC....

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RE: Creationism in public schools - 10/5/2008 7:55:36 AM

patwi

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quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

This is not support for creationism as it applies to education...but just something to think about.

I get so tired of hearing people state that science is God because they can measure...observe...repeat..and predict ..where religion is faith and therefore not to be believed. Forget for now the documented miracles of prayer, the sightings of deities and so on... it is just faith..not real.

Yet these same very sarcastic people expect all to take on faith the instantaneous creation of the universe ..matter, energy, and time... from NOTHING...with NOTHING preceding it. How is that any less unbelievable or fantastic...or even different than Genesis...It certainly cannot be proved by observation...measure...or prediction. It is just an idea...a thought...a feeling...a FAITH.

Butch

Yes, this is an old, tired argument. There had to be a Creator because things didn't just come into being on their own.

Which begs the question of who created the Creator.

Then, the answer is he always existed, which in turn prompts the question of why couldn't the basic elements of the universe have always existed then?

This is what I was wondering. If as the creationists say, like is too complex to have arisen out of nothingness, then where did that most complex of beings come from? Here is where usually you get sputtering answers like "well...that's ~faith~" which make no sense.

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RE: Creationism in public schools - 10/5/2008 8:12:10 AM

LadyEllen

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quote:

ORIGINAL: lronitulstahp

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

Le coq: le seul oiseau qui chante les pieds dans la merde. Seul Dieu tout puissant...

Maintenant, j'ai faim....pour KFC....

KFC - le coq, ses pieds et sa merde ensemble. Seul Dieu sait pourquoi.....

E

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RE: Creationism in public schools - 10/5/2008 8:14:38 AM

NumberSix

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coq au vin?

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RE: Creationism in public schools - 10/5/2008 8:18:12 AM

celticlord2112

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quote:

ORIGINAL: bluepanda
The fact that they're incorrect doesn't have any importance to you, then?

Since they are not, the question is irrelevant.

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RE: Creationism in public schools - 10/5/2008 8:31:26 AM

Raechard

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You can always test your theory that gravity isn't fact by jumping off a building and seeing if you float. You are being pedantic because there are few facts in science doesn’t mean some shouldn't be assumed as facts for our purposes. Using your approach we can't call the sky blue or the grass green. In fact you don't really exist either because I can't prove you exist therefore you don't.

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RE: Creationism in public schools - 10/5/2008 8:34:39 AM

NumberSix

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Raechard

You can always test your theory that gravity isn't fact by jumping off a building and seeing if you float.

Theoretically, you would be squashed so flat you would only have one side.

Perhaps theory and fact would hold no commerce should that occur.

6

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RE: Creationism in public schools - 10/5/2008 8:36:57 AM

bluepanda

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quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112

quote:

ORIGINAL: bluepanda
The fact that they're incorrect doesn't have any importance to you, then?

Since they are not, the question is irrelevant.

I've seen it demonstrated to you several times just in this particular thread that your statements regarding evolution and the nature of scientific theories are completely incorrect. At best, you're just making up new definitions for words that already have perfectly functional and widely understood definitions, for no apparent logical reason; and at worst, you're just being blatantly dishonest. I don't know you well enough yet to figure out which is which, but either way, yes - these statements that you're so staunchly defending and of which you seem so proud are incorrect. For someone relatively new to the forums, it makes it very difficult for me to ever take anything else you say seriously going forward.

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RE: Creationism in public schools - 10/5/2008 8:36:58 AM

kdsub

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quote:

ORIGINAL: patwi

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

This is not support for creationism as it applies to education...but just something to think about.

I get so tired of hearing people state that science is God because they can measure...observe...repeat..and predict ..where religion is faith and therefore not to be believed. Forget for now the documented miracles of prayer, the sightings of deities and so on... it is just faith..not real.

Yet these same very sarcastic people expect all to take on faith the instantaneous creation of the universe ..matter, energy, and time... from NOTHING...with NOTHING preceding it. How is that any less unbelievable or fantastic...or even different than Genesis...It certainly cannot be proved by observation...measure...or prediction. It is just an idea...a thought...a feeling...a FAITH.

Butch

Yes, this is an old, tired argument. There had to be a Creator because things didn't just come into being on their own.

Which begs the question of who created the Creator.

Then, the answer is he always existed, which in turn prompts the question of why couldn't the basic elements of the universe have always existed then?

This is what I was wondering. If as the creationists say, like is too complex to have arisen out of nothingness, then where did that most complex of beings come from? Here is where usually you get sputtering answers like "well...that's ~faith~" which make no sense.

To me there is no sense to be made of it...If there is a God what was before...if there is no God what was before... What was before the beginning...will there ever be a final ending...if so what happens after that. No matter what you believe these questions are unanswerable... So believe what you want but it will always be just a guess a feeling... There will never be science or religion that will totally explain it.

We just have to understand we are now and will always be limited in our ability to understand the ultimate questions.

Butch

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RE: Creationism in public schools - 10/5/2008 8:37:08 AM

celticlord2112

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Raechard

You can always test your theory that gravity isn't fact by jumping off a building and seeing if you float. You are being pedantic because there are few facts in science doesn’t mean some shouldn't be assumed as facts for our purposes. Using your approach we can't call the sky blue or the grass green. In fact you don't really exist either because I can't prove you exist therefore you don't.

Jumping off a building (which is quite fun, btw--BASE jumping is a hobby everyone should try just once) would not prove gravity is a fact. It would prove there is a phenomenon by which objects (including my parachute and I) are drawn to earth.

As for proof of my existence, the only proof I can offer up is the extermely obvious and pedestrian "Coito ergo sum".

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RE: Creationism in public schools - 10/5/2008 8:40:06 AM

Raechard

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A sphere has one side.

I would be a quantum singularity of a person sucking in the outside world due to my densely compacted form with one side.

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RE: Creationism in public schools - 10/5/2008 8:41:08 AM

NumberSix

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Coitus, ergo sum. (for you, perhaps)
Cogito, ergo sum. (for others)

I take issue with your use of object. Object is not provable.

Ponderously,
Edwin Garvey

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RE: Creationism in public schools - 10/5/2008 8:43:24 AM

Raechard

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quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112
Jumping off a building (which is quite fun, btw--BASE jumping is a hobby everyone should try just once) would not prove gravity is a fact. It would prove there is a phenomenon by which objects (including my parachute and I) are drawn to earth.

As for proof of my existence, the only proof I can offer up is the extermely obvious and pedestrian "Coito ergo sum".

Yeah and you go to McDonalds and ask for a the Phenomena known as Big Mac which has the as yet unproven qualities of taste and energy?

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RE: Creationism in public schools - 10/5/2008 8:44:58 AM

kdsub

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My own humble theory that has no basis in fact..Is that our very thoughts create reality. There is a branching with each thought, and a new reality a new universe is made from each thought.

This to me means there are an infinite number of realities and universes...AND as many possibilities as thoughts. So in one universe there is not a God... but in another there is. In one universe we can walk through solid walls but in another we can't. In one universe there is life after death...but in another there is not... All the possibilities depend on our thoughts.

As good as any guess I think... By the way in my universe there is a God... But in others there is only oblivion.... I feel sorry for them.

Butch

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RE: Creationism in public schools - 10/5/2008 8:45:27 AM

celticlord2112

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Raechard
Yeah and you go to McDonalds and ask for a the Phenomena known as Big Mac which has the as yet unproven qualities of taste and energy?

No, I go to Whataburger.

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RE: Creationism in public schools - 10/5/2008 8:45:47 AM

MasterG2kTR

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Didn't any of you ever watch the Matrix??

(just thought this thread needed a little humor)

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