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RE: What do you mean with fake DOMs (I hear in many ad... - 10/20/2008 2:23:03 PM

marieToo

Posts: 3595
Joined: 5/21/2006
From: Jersey
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent

How many people from this board do you know well enough to claim they're dishonest etc?

Several. Furthermore, I wasn't just talking about the boards.

quote:

I find some statements inconsistent and ill-conceived, but that's it. Being of limited knowledge in a subject doesn't equate to being full of shit; it's possible that people are working out their thoughts on a message board and haven't arrived at an informed conclusion (thus appearing to be contradictory and, by extension, "fake"). Yes, people will present their thoughts as conclusive, but this is part of the learning process.

NG, I explained very clearly, with several examples, of what "full of shit" means to me, and none of them included, or even remotely implied "being of limited knowledge".

Hell yes people are working themselves out on a message board. Hell, I've changed over my time here. My own knowledge isn't so vast that I would judge someone with less knowledge or experience as a wannabee or a fake. Maybe that's someone ELSE'S interpretation, but it isn't mine. I explained what a fake is and isn't to me, In fact I specifically stated that I don't consider those with different ideas than mine to be fakes.

On Edit: I think we're talking past one another at this point.

< Message edited by marieToo -- 10/20/2008 2:29:51 PM >

_____________________________

marie.

I give good agita.

(in reply to NorthernGent)

Post #: 61

RE: What do you mean with fake DOMs (I hear in many ad... - 10/20/2008 2:43:05 PM

NorthernGent

Posts: 8730
Joined: 7/10/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: marieToo

Several. Furthermore, I wasn't just talking about the boards.

The OP was concerned with ads. I'd estimate the number of people with ads whom you haven't met in real life, is far more than several.

Where your statement applies only to those you've met, then I'd agree - your statement is not contradictory.

quote:

ORIGINAL: marieToo

On Edit: I think we're talking past one another at this point.

I don't think so. 'Just took a bit of time getting there.

_____________________________

I have the courage to be a coward - but not beyond my limits.

Sooner or later, the man who wins is the man who thinks he can.

(in reply to marieToo)

Post #: 62

RE: What do you mean with fake DOMs (I hear in many ad... - 10/20/2008 3:02:34 PM

marieToo

Posts: 3595
Joined: 5/21/2006
From: Jersey
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent

The OP was concerned with ads.

Well, sometimes a thought and subsequent posts will extend beyond the exact specifics of the OP.

quote:

I'd estimate the number of people with ads whom you haven't met in real life, is far more than several.

That's a given and has no relevence to my point.

quote:

Where your statement applies only to those you've met, then I'd agree - your statement is not contradictory.

It doesn't only apply to those I've met. My definition of what a liar (fake) is remains the same whether I have met a person and can judge them as such, or not. And that's what I stated originally...How I define a "fake".

Anyway, we're not going to connect on this one. Thanks for the exchange just the same.

_____________________________

marie.

I give good agita.

(in reply to NorthernGent)

Post #: 63

RE: What do you mean with fake DOMs (I hear in many ad... - 10/20/2008 3:02:44 PM

lateralist1

Posts: 886
Joined: 11/22/2006
Status: offline

Fake means to me that someone is pretending to be something that they are not.
If they are fake then they may be more likely to have a go at the people who say no fakes. There is nothing much I can do about it except wait and see how the relationship pans out. Most subs disappear very quickly when they find out I am not going to 'play' with them for months perhaps years. I'm not going to call them fakes it's just that we see things in a different way.

(in reply to NorthernGent)

Post #: 64

RE: What do you mean with fake DOMs (I hear in many ad... - 10/20/2008 6:09:45 PM

DavanKael

Posts: 3072
Joined: 10/6/2007
Status: offline

Hi, stephen1974----
I don't use the term 'fake Dom' often but I do find that I fail to take seriously those who appear to be 'putting on', creating a 'front', etc. It is more of a sense of things; an underlying insecurity in the person that they are utilizing over-compensation in an attempt to mask. I do not find that sort of presentation appealing or genuine. We are all humans, I like real people.
One of the things I really enjoyed about a person I interacted in submission to was that he was/is a real person. Generally straight-forward, willing to show humanity, to exercise thought, to show emotions, etc. Someone with whom one could have a real, broad-based relationship.
Conversely, I was texting recently with a person with whom I had a relationship several years ago where I was on the D-side of the kneel. This person asked how I was doing. I responded in a less than perky way. Next thing I know, I get a concerned phone call (Which was sweet) but part of the message was "I'm not used to you sounding like this, you're so strong". That's true, he isn't used to me sounding like that. It is also true that I am strong. Sometimes I get tired of being strong and I said so. He's seen me at my best and worst (Well, close at least) and we have known each other for about 15 years, we've been really real with one another, yet sometimes his desire to see me in a certain ways supercedes what is real. I suppose to some, that vulnerability might be less than 'real' in a D-sense. I would disagree. That was not his implication but I suppose some might see being less than D-like at all times fake or untrue to dominance.
So, I suppose I have covered a couple of points:
**If I am calling someone fake or questioning their Dominance, it's because they're putting on, putting up a front, over-compensating
**I suppose some call being a real person 'fake' because they're not living upto a fantasy. I would disagree. I like the real person part.
Davan

< Message edited by DavanKael -- 10/20/2008 6:56:45 PM >

(in reply to stephen1974)

Post #: 65

RE: What do you mean with fake DOMs (I hear in many ad... - 10/21/2008 12:48:36 PM

NorthernGent

Posts: 8730
Joined: 7/10/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: marieToo

That's a given and has no relevence to my point.

It's not a given where your post leaves your views open to interpretation. It wasn't clear in the first instance that you weren't talking of the ads mentioned in the OP.

quote:

ORIGINAL: marieToo

My definition of what a liar (fake) is remains the same whether I have met a person and can judge them as such, or not. And that's what I stated originally...How I define a "fake".

How exactly can you make an informed judgement on a poster's integrity where you haven't met him/her in person?

Well, yeah, you're entitled to define a fake as you see fit - a given, surely?

quote:

ORIGINAL: marieToo

Thanks for the exchange just the same.

Always a pleasure with you Marie; never a chore.

_____________________________

I have the courage to be a coward - but not beyond my limits.

Sooner or later, the man who wins is the man who thinks he can.

(in reply to marieToo)

Post #: 66

RE: What do you mean with fake DOMs (I hear in many ad... - 10/21/2008 2:11:53 PM

lally3

Posts: 595
Joined: 3/4/2008
Status: offline

there are those who totally rely on the s type to be submissive, a sort of instant-sub, like an instant coffee or an instant meal. no effort involved, no flair required, no skill necessary. i have come to the conclusion with some of these that there possibly is no inherent dominant leaning there, just a need for a compliant woman to do all of the things on their wish list.

these people are time wasters and tend to prey on the less experienced subs because they know they would get absolutely nowhere with anyone whose been around the track a couple of times.

when the submissive eventually tires of dominating herself and develops a mutinous attitude she is attacked with the accusation that she is not a submissive.

i hesitate to call them fake because no doubt somewhere there might well be someone who would suit them very well, but, in terms of providing consistant, intelligent, proactive, meaningful, sustained dominance these types tend to fall short.

_____________________________

even doves have pride (Prince)

(in reply to NorthernGent)

Post #: 67

RE: What do you mean with fake DOMs (I hear in many ad... - 10/21/2008 4:05:02 PM

marieToo

Posts: 3595
Joined: 5/21/2006
From: Jersey
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent

It's not a given where your post leaves your views open to interpretation. It wasn't clear in the first instance that you weren't talking of the ads mentioned in the OP.

Ok, maybe that's where the miscommunication came in. I was talking about how I would define a fake in general, not saying that it was an easy thing to do from an ad. But let me give you a quick example of someone that I would consider a fake, (or to use my word of preference) a "Fraud" (someone who lies, misleads or is intentionally deceitful). I heard from a guy on the other side not long ago. He introduced himself and said he was interested in finding a third party to join himself and his slave. I clicked onto his profile to find a complete contradiction of his email when I saw that he was a single man looking for a submissive. I wrote him back and basically told him that I don't respect liars. And he wrote me back saying that he deceived me in order to test me, to see if I would take the time to read his profile. Now how do I even know which is a lie? His original note? The profile? I wouldn't. But he's already shown himself to be fraudulent.

Ok, now who am I to say he can't dominate someone? For all I know he can, but he can't dominant me because I've now deemed him to be full of shit....a poser....a fake.....someone who intentionally portrayed something that he wasn't in order to elicit a certain response or evoke a certain test. To me, that's one type of fake, a fraud, a poser, a liar, a bullshitter. There I've done it, I've judged someone a liar and a fraud and haven't even met him. That's just one example.

quote:

How exactly can you make an informed judgement on a poster's integrity where you haven't met him/her in person?

How do you make an "informed judgement" on a US presidential candidate's integrity, sincerity, ability, when you haven't met him?

Or more to the point of the OP: How do you make an informed judgement when you read a collarme ad that's just so outlandish that you just know the person is full of it? You must have seen one or two in your time here and shrugged them off as "full of shit". No?

Surely there are posters here who you have passed certain judgements on (good or bad), in the privacy of your own mind. How did you do that without meeting them??

Ever open a Nigerian scam mail? Is that a fake? How did you know without meeting him/her? (ok maybe that example is too easy)

But come on....How do any of us make that judgement when connecting with someone online, then being in a position to decide whether or not they are worth meeting in realtime? How do we determine if they are a fake, an axe murderer, or a safe and sincere person to have coffee with?

The answer for me: Communication, a lot of listening, perception, observation, a little gut instinct, and a dash of common sense for good measure...the same way we judge anyone else in our midst as whatever, online or otherwise.

quote:

Well, yeah, you're entitled to define a fake as you see fit - a given, surely?

Yes, of course. But it was never about my entitlement. It was about me trying to explain that I was (in my previous posts) merely speaking of how I define a fake, not how I would judge someone in particular as actually being one. Which are two distinctly different things....and I think that's where our signals got crossed :

What is your definition of a fake?

vs

How do you determine if someone is a fake.

quote:

Always a pleasure with you Marie; never a chore.

Likewise. And something we'll never get caught debating about. :)

_____________________________

marie.

I give good agita.

(in reply to NorthernGent)

Post #: 68

RE: What do you mean with fake DOMs (I hear in many ad... - 10/21/2008 8:37:24 PM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline

A fake sub is one who doesn't kneel and agree to stick a pencil up their ass because they got an email demanding that.

I'm a fake sub to everyone I don't consent to submit to. I'm real to the only one who matters to me.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

(in reply to stephen1974)

Post #: 69

RE: What do you mean with fake DOMs (I hear in many ad... - 10/21/2008 11:25:25 PM

NorthernGent

Posts: 8730
Joined: 7/10/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: marieToo

But let me give you a quick example of someone that I would consider a fake, (or to use my word of preference) a "Fraud" (someone who lies, misleads or is intentionally deceitful). I heard from a guy on the other side not long ago. He introduced himself and said he was interested in finding a third party to join himself and his slave. I clicked onto his profile to find a complete contradiction of his email when I saw that he was a single man looking for a submissive. I wrote him back and basically told him that I don't respect liars. And he wrote me back saying that he deceived me in order to test me, to see if I would take the time to read his profile. Now how do I even know which is a lie? His original note? The profile? I wouldn't. But he's already shown himself to be fraudulent.

Ok, now who am I to say he can't dominate someone? For all I know he can, but he can't dominant me because I've now deemed him to be full of shit....a poser....a fake.....someone who intentionally portrayed something that he wasn't in order to elicit a certain response or evoke a certain test. To me, that's one type of fake, a fraud, a poser, a liar, a bullshitter. There I've done it, I've judged someone a liar and a fraud and haven't even met him. That's just one example.

He has lied in this instance, granted. Yet one swallow doesn't make a summer, and I personally wouldn't write him off as a consequence of this one incident; I'd say it's more a case that the risk of this person being able to follow through on his words, has increased. It could quite easily be argued that the man in question is guilty of a serious error of judgement rather than having laid bare his character.

There's only one world, the perceived difference is underpinned by our values and background. Perhaps you're more risk averse than I, perhaps your standards are higher than mine, perhaps you've been burned in the past a few more times than I have. You're catholic; I'm protestant, you're American; I'm English - perhaps I'm more tolerant than you and more inclined to give someone the benefit of the doubt until I see a pattern emerge. The example given remains open to interpretation, perhaps.

I don't have the time to respond to the rest of your post at the moment, but I'll come back to it.

_____________________________

I have the courage to be a coward - but not beyond my limits.

Sooner or later, the man who wins is the man who thinks he can.

(in reply to marieToo)

Post #: 70

RE: What do you mean with fake DOMs (I hear in many ad... - 10/22/2008 3:41:28 AM

marieToo

Posts: 3595
Joined: 5/21/2006
From: Jersey
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent

He has lied in this instance, granted. Yet one swallow doesn't make a summer, and I personally wouldn't write him off as a consequence of this one incident; I'd say it's more a case that the risk of this person being able to follow through on his words, has increased. It could quite easily be argued that the man in question is guilty of a serious error of judgement rather than having laid bare his character.

If you're saying that we each have different standards and methods of discernment, I would agree completely. One woman's poser is another woman's MasterRight. One woman's con artist is another woman's clever motherfucker. Another "given", I would think.

quote:

There's only one world, the perceived difference is underpinned by our values and background.

Agreed. But should that stop us from having our own perceptions and basing value judgements on them in order to make decisions that align with our own standards?

Or do we just fall back on the ole' "reality is perception" notion, and conclude that fakes don't really exist except in our own minds?

I'm having a difficult time trying to decipher what your point is.

quote:

I don't have the time to respond to the rest of your post at the moment, but I'll come back to it.

Good. And I hope you cover the questions presented in my previous post.

_____________________________

marie.

I give good agita.

(in reply to NorthernGent)

Post #: 71

RE: What do you mean with fake DOMs (I hear in many ad... - 10/22/2008 4:15:31 AM

ranja

Posts: 2111
Joined: 11/1/2007
Status: offline

They're a cardboard cut out, there is no substance to them and when you fart they keel over

(in reply to WestBaySlave)

Post #: 72

RE: What do you mean with fake DOMs (I hear in many ad... - 10/23/2008 4:08:45 AM

lally3

Posts: 595
Joined: 3/4/2008
Status: offline

it is both bogus and irresponsible to suggest that there are not fakes out there. there are fakes in all walks of life, busily projecting themselves as one thing to get something out of someone else. its called telling lies. projecting yourself as something youre not in order to get what they want is dressing up, pretending, make believe, fake.

people fake it because theyre:
curious and thats it
married and lying to everyone
frustrated
100 years older than they say they are
nothing like their photo
the wrong gender
on a fantasy
living out cyber driven sexual needs
in prison
under age
psychologically disturbed
inhibited in real life
impotent
a mother of 12 kids and wife to a bastard needing an escape route
a father of 12 kids and husband to a bitch needing an escape route
on a scam
looking for a meal ticket
not sure but giving it a go anyway

none of these reasons are especially offensive on their own, but when they are used to interfere with another persons life, dreams, goals, needs, desires, hopes, fantasies, path, destiny then there is something wrong with it.

not just that. it is beholden on us (subs) that when we are tied up and at the mercy of someone about to wield a flogger/cane/baseball bat, that they know what theyre doing.

it is also beholden on us to ensure that our mental health and well being is in safe hands when we place ourselves in the hands of another. that when someone says they are Dominant that they fully understand the premis of D/s when they take control of anothers life.

the 'have a go' brigade are harmless enough if theyre instincts are right and their motives are genuine. but some are not and its bats to suggest that they do not lurk, they absolutely do.

and yes, one persons nightmare is another persons dream - sure. theres someone for everyone out there. the trick is to honestly project who you are, what you want and why. those in it for purely selfish reasons are not D/s.

and yes, we're all here for our own specific selfish needs, but D/s does not and could not survive if we were all a load of selfish, self serving bastards, happy to tramp all over each others dreams. boards like these would be full of misery and disharmony all the time. instead we have real enthusiasts waxing lyrical for the majority of the time.

some years ago as a newbie on the net, though not newbie in of itself i spent an arduous year trying to work out what any of it meant, who meant what and where i hung. in that time i was barraged by idiots fishing for newbies because newbies on the whole know squat. i had enough experience and instinct to ward them off, though one or two got passed my antennae and confused the hell out of me. made me wonder if i was sub atall, if this was infact what i wanted and wondering why i kept reading about happy D/s people but couldnt find it for myself. ive 'seen' this time and again happen to newbies and it really irritates the hell out of me (on their behalf)

ive noticed over time that the idiots dont approach me anymore. clearly i give out a signal that ive been around and i know what i want and who i am here. id kick them into next week and they know it, id destroy their fantasy fuelled games and just rain on their parade far too much.

rant over.

< Message edited by lally3 -- 10/23/2008 4:18:43 AM >

_____________________________

even doves have pride (Prince)

(in reply to ranja)

Post #: 73

RE: What do you mean with fake DOMs (I hear in many ad... - 10/23/2008 9:16:41 AM

marieToo

Posts: 3595
Joined: 5/21/2006
From: Jersey
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: lally3

it is both bogus and irresponsible to suggest that there are not fakes out there. there are fakes in all walks of life, busily projecting themselves as one thing to get something out of someone else. its called telling lies. projecting yourself as something youre not in order to get what they want is dressing up, pretending, make believe, fake.

people fake it because theyre:
curious and thats it
married and lying to everyone
frustrated
100 years older than they say they are
nothing like their photo
the wrong gender
on a fantasy
living out cyber driven sexual needs
in prison
under age
psychologically disturbed
inhibited in real life
impotent
a mother of 12 kids and wife to a bastard needing an escape route
a father of 12 kids and husband to a bitch needing an escape route
on a scam
looking for a meal ticket
not sure but giving it a go anyway

none of these reasons are especially offensive on their own, but when they are used to interfere with another persons life, dreams, goals, needs, desires, hopes, fantasies, path, destiny then there is something wrong with it.

not just that. it is beholden on us (subs) that when we are tied up and at the mercy of someone about to wield a flogger/cane/baseball bat, that they know what theyre doing.

it is also beholden on us to ensure that our mental health and well being is in safe hands when we place ourselves in the hands of another. that when someone says they are Dominant that they fully understand the premis of D/s when they take control of anothers life.

the 'have a go' brigade are harmless enough if theyre instincts are right and their motives are genuine. but some are not and its bats to suggest that they do not lurk, they absolutely do.

and yes, one persons nightmare is another persons dream - sure. theres someone for everyone out there. the trick is to honestly project who you are, what you want and why. those in it for purely selfish reasons are not D/s.

and yes, we're all here for our own specific selfish needs, but D/s does not and could not survive if we were all a load of selfish, self serving bastards, happy to tramp all over each others dreams. boards like these would be full of misery and disharmony all the time. instead we have real enthusiasts waxing lyrical for the majority of the time.

some years ago as a newbie on the net, though not newbie in of itself i spent an arduous year trying to work out what any of it meant, who meant what and where i hung. in that time i was barraged by idiots fishing for newbies because newbies on the whole know squat. i had enough experience and instinct to ward them off, though one or two got passed my antennae and confused the hell out of me. made me wonder if i was sub atall, if this was infact what i wanted and wondering why i kept reading about happy D/s people but couldnt find it for myself. ive 'seen' this time and again happen to newbies and it really irritates the hell out of me (on their behalf)

ive noticed over time that the idiots dont approach me anymore. clearly i give out a signal that ive been around and i know what i want and who i am here. id kick them into next week and they know it, id destroy their fantasy fuelled games and just rain on their parade far too much.

rant over.

Awesome commentary, slight rantishness notwithstanding.

_____________________________

marie.

I give good agita.

(in reply to lally3)

Post #: 74

RE: What do you mean with fake DOMs (I hear in many ad... - 10/23/2008 9:18:42 AM

marieToo

Posts: 3595
Joined: 5/21/2006
From: Jersey
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent

I don't have the time to respond to the rest of your post at the moment, but I'll come back to it.

*bawk* *bawk* *bawk* *bawk*

::::Yellow feathers flying::::

_____________________________

marie.

I give good agita.

(in reply to NorthernGent)

Post #: 75

RE: What do you mean with fake DOMs (I hear in many ad... - 10/23/2008 11:57:43 AM

NorthernGent

Posts: 8730
Joined: 7/10/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: marieToo

quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent

I don't have the time to respond to the rest of your post at the moment, but I'll come back to it.

*bawk* *bawk* *bawk* *bawk*

::::Yellow feathers flying::::

Hmmm......it's high time I clip your wings......

US candidates? They're subject to the modern, political climate: misguided, big ideas, or full of shit? It's open to intrepretation.

People are full of surprises, which is a sentiment I'd extend to a message board. Ideas and perceptions alter; information and projections are filtered through personal experience, and so on.

I'd say lying is your best case. Yet you'd have to determine a pattern, supply accompanying evidence and convey sound judgement to convince me. Human judgement is suspect, however, considering we have a tendency to land ourselves in trouble we don't need. I suppose reason alone can't explain human behaviour.

No, we don't fall back on perception as the answer; rather, there is a heavy burden of proof required on the part of the accuser. By all means, arrive at a judgement, but it should be couched in an admission of being subject to the available information.

_____________________________

I have the courage to be a coward - but not beyond my limits.

Sooner or later, the man who wins is the man who thinks he can.

(in reply to marieToo)

Post #: 76

RE: What do you mean with fake DOMs (I hear in many ad... - 10/24/2008 12:46:55 AM

lally3

Posts: 595
Joined: 3/4/2008
Status: offline

it was a bit rantishy wasnt it - i just think its stupid to say there arent fakes out there - particularly when newbies read these boards.

NG - honesty is a biggie, playing stupid games early on is off putting and the moment someone starts to show little 'oddities' or inconsistancies they are usually fired - why - because sound integrity, sound judgement a solid personality and unwavering focus are the attributes a sub looks for, either conciously or subconciously.

first impressions count -

instinct is a subbies best friend - and,

most subbies would choose to stay on their own than land up with a dufass.

< Message edited by lally3 -- 10/24/2008 12:59:57 AM >

_____________________________

even doves have pride (Prince)

(in reply to NorthernGent)

Post #: 77

RE: What do you mean with fake DOMs (I hear in many ad... - 10/25/2008 5:16:06 AM

TEMPERANCE

Posts: 126
Joined: 8/22/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: stephen1974

And I agree, it is difficult to find out if the other is what he/she describes. Normally chat helps and if some1s ad sounds "too good to be true" (like 18 year old supermodel seeks extreme 247 right away, any age, any place ), it certainly is not real.

It can be, and often is, a lot more subtle than that...... The definition of fake means 'not real'. Unfotunately, the BDSM world attracts alot of people that profess to being something that they are not... be that either Dominant or submissive.

Those that profess to being single, yet are not. Submissive males that profess to being dominant, as its easier to get someone as a male dominant than it is being a male submissive. Dominants who are just looking for wank fodder, with no real intention of ever taking it into real life. Dominants who are just looking for a quick kinky random f@ck rather than taking the time to try to establish something more meaningful..... i could go on and on and on..... but i'll spare you the misery.....

(in reply to stephen1974)

Post #: 78

RE: What do you mean with fake DOMs (I hear in many ad... - 10/25/2008 10:50:40 AM

slaveboy291

Posts: 329
Joined: 3/5/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: faerytattoodgirl

well fake dom=man pretending to be woman.

but there are subs who do that too.

fake profiles often have model pictures taken from sites....i have seen snorg t's model girls used alot on cm.

I've seen multiple profiles all using the same pic. And some don't even match the listed stats.

(in reply to faerytattoodgirl)

Post #: 79

RE: What do you mean with fake DOMs (I hear in many ad... - 10/26/2008 3:21:48 AM

lally3

Posts: 595
Joined: 3/4/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveboy291

quote:

ORIGINAL: faerytattoodgirl

well fake dom=man pretending to be woman.

but there are subs who do that too.

fake profiles often have model pictures taken from sites....i have seen snorg t's model girls used alot on cm.

I've seen multiple profiles all using the same pic. And some don't even match the listed stats.

whats with that seriously!! - in the end you have to realise that some of these people have no intention of meeting anyone and are on a fantasy trip. but at least theyre being obvious about it.

what i dont understand is how it is there are so many really great looking genuine american D's with great personalities available - i have a friend on here (american D) who is totally georgeous and an action man, and none of the subs he approaches take him up - i just dont get it!

_____________________________

even doves have pride (Prince)

(in reply to slaveboy291)

Post #: 80

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All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Ask a Submissive >> RE: What do you mean with fake DOMs (I hear in many ads...)

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