RE: feminization (Full Version)

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hardbodysub -> RE: feminization (2/5/2009 11:06:15 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: UPSG

Yeah, I saw that movie. Good movie too. The guy that played the post-op transsexual is supposedly - or one would assume so from public photos - an effeminate homosexual in real life.


Try pre-op. That was what created the big surprise in the movie, remember?

And how can you assume someone's sexual orientation from PR photos?



bootiegrl -> RE: feminization (2/5/2009 11:16:59 AM)

Even TS women are turned off by feminization. It takes a really special woman to want a sissy guy. To be honest, most feminization is just this thing created by the adult industry (that I am part of) to sell web site memberships. The girls I know who do it, only do it because the guys are paying them to do it. I haven't really met women TS or genetic who would be into it for real.

You know, being transgender isn't a sexual thing. It is a real thing. And guys, when you dress up and then send me notes saying "I don't look quite as good as you yet, but I will soon when I learn makeup better" - are retarded. You know when you have had as much estrogen in your body as a small mule for 10 years, have dumped $50k-$75k into plastic surgery peeling your face off to grind your skull and breaking the bones in your jaw to reset them... Then you can start telling me how you will look as good as me someday. And I don't care how they make you feel, wigs, panties, and cakey makeup make you look ridiculous.

In truth, I can coach men on how to transition asthetically but that coaching costs a lot of money - just like any type of consulting. Nothing I could do could change the mind.



unownedsissy -> RE: feminization (2/5/2009 3:08:57 PM)

i would only add my 2 pence by saying that for many sub males, being feminised adds to the humiliation and the desire to submit and so on..the sub space intensifies ( for me at least) as doe the levels of subjugation and boundaries.
i totally empathise with dommes who do not enjoy feminising their submissive however , its so indelibly ingrained onto some sub cross dressers minds that it merges into a nevesseity inorder to correctly submit.
that my 2 pence spent



UPSG -> RE: feminization (2/5/2009 6:22:53 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: hardbodysub


quote:

ORIGINAL: UPSG

Yeah, I saw that movie. Good movie too. The guy that played the post-op transsexual is supposedly - or one would assume so from public photos - an effeminate homosexual in real life.


Try pre-op. That was what created the big surprise in the movie, remember?

And how can you assume someone's sexual orientation from PR photos?


Thanks for the correction, HB! :) My bad. Yeah, I should have said pre-op.

[sm=lol.gif] Well, ok... I can't be 100% certain that dude is homosexual from his photos. But when a guy dresses like a "bitch" (flaming style) and works in the fashion industry I can take a pretty good guess can't I! Lol.



UPSG -> RE: feminization (2/5/2009 6:28:16 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: bootiegrl

Even TS women are turned off by feminization. It takes a really special woman to want a sissy guy. To be honest, most feminization is just this thing created by the adult industry (that I am part of) to sell web site memberships. The girls I know who do it, only do it because the guys are paying them to do it. I haven't really met women TS or genetic who would be into it for real.

You know, being transgender isn't a sexual thing. It is a real thing. And guys, when you dress up and then send me notes saying "I don't look quite as good as you yet, but I will soon when I learn makeup better" - are retarded. You know when you have had as much estrogen in your body as a small mule for 10 years, have dumped $50k-$75k into plastic surgery peeling your face off to grind your skull and breaking the bones in your jaw to reset them... Then you can start telling me how you will look as good as me someday. And I don't care how they make you feel, wigs, panties, and cakey makeup make you look ridiculous.

In truth, I can coach men on how to transition asthetically but that coaching costs a lot of money - just like any type of consulting. Nothing I could do could change the mind.


[sm=lol.gif] Very good point, BG.

I have seen some stunning T-girls online too. Granted porn sites but some of them appear to have been pumping estrogen since their early teens or something, for I swear to God some of them would inspire you to loss your life for them in edged weapon combat.




P.S. I could see myself one day, if I ever make a lot of money, building a small secondary house on an estate of mine, housing an attractive pre-op transsexual down in Latin America, assuming we got along well and appreciated each others company and friendship. She could never dominate me though, and the relationship might be completely platonic (or possibly sexual). Eye candy, good friendship, and the opportunity to be in some small way helpful to an attractive transsexual in the heart of machismo land (where many T-girls are confined at times to abject poverty) would give me a great satisfaction.



energeticservant -> RE: feminization (2/5/2009 8:42:07 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: bootiegrl
You know, being transgender isn't a sexual thing. It is a real thing. And guys, when you dress up and then send me notes saying "I don't look quite as good as you yet, but I will soon when I learn makeup better" - are retarded.


Well, at least you're not judging anyone that's alternative to you.. Who are you to say what is or isn't real? Just because you are transgender doesn't give you the right to go on the offensive against guys who wear panties and look bad. It just makes you look like an ass.



bootiegrl -> RE: feminization (2/6/2009 12:42:45 PM)

Yes, it really does give me that right.



hardbodysub -> RE: feminization (2/6/2009 1:01:56 PM)

quote:

You know, being transgender isn't a sexual thing. It is a real thing.


Well, I think I understand where you're coming from. I also kind of gag when I see guys trying to dress up like women and looking really bad. I don't deny them the right to do it, and I don't contact them and tell them I don't like it; it's their thing, so I leave them to it. If they contacted me like they did you, I'd feel justified in responding.

On the other hand, the statement above seems to imply that anything sexual isn't real, which doesn't make much sense. I think you're trying to say that being transgender isn't a sexual fantasy, as crossdressing often is. Nobody who knows anything about it would disagree with you on that. Is that what you're saying?



UPSG -> RE: feminization (2/6/2009 5:44:08 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: hardbodysub

quote:

You know, being transgender isn't a sexual thing. It is a real thing.


Well, I think I understand where you're coming from. I also kind of gag when I see guys trying to dress up like women and looking really bad. I don't deny them the right to do it, and I don't contact them and tell them I don't like it; it's their thing, so I leave them to it. If they contacted me like they did you, I'd feel justified in responding.

On the other hand, the statement above seems to imply that anything sexual isn't real, which doesn't make much sense. I think you're trying to say that being transgender isn't a sexual fantasy, as crossdressing often is. Nobody who knows anything about it would disagree with you on that. Is that what you're saying?


I think most transsexuals want to be fucked like women. So, to that extent I do believe it is sexual. A woman trapped in a man's body? I don't know. I do accept people are effeminate and girly driven though. Maybe that is genetic maybe it isn't.

But if a person was to say they believe they were a dog or a horse trapped in a man's body people would think they're crazy.



HeavansKeeper -> RE: feminization (2/7/2009 3:44:41 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: MistresseLotus

[:D]  A  fine Lady you have there!

I wonder how many Doms (male) enjoy masculinizing their female slaves for kicks?
Probably as many female Dommes that enjoy feminizing male slaves.


I doubt it. The male form is an ugly thing. We're demon's to the female's angelic qualities.



SolangeRichards -> RE: feminization (2/7/2009 3:53:51 AM)

I would like to discuss a couple of points I have encountered a few times in many chatrooms and forums. One is some silliness I like to call the TGirl Hierarchy, the other is the "I'm more trans than you" nonsense. The hierarchy concept is like that of a pyramid. At the bottom would be men who might play a little, like maybe try on the wife's panties once in awhile. At the top is the transitioning preop. I say pre because I have never heard this malarkey from a postop. The basic idea is that the preop is somehow 'above' the rest of the group. Someone may have an opinion, but it's not really valid, because hey, what are they doing next to what I live with? This of course is not common to all preops, but I've sure as heck heard it from more than a few preops.. My feeling is this, what if that sometime pantyboy was a psychiatrist specializing in gender, or a biologist specializing in the study of hormones, or a judge with deep knowledge of the legal system as it relates to gender?  It certainly seems a fact that valuable information, input and unique points of view can come from many sources.  Just because somebody is transitioning doesn't make them a more valuable resource than those who choose a different path.  It makes them an expert on their experiance, which may or may not have value to another.   The bottom line is this, if you want credibility and respect in life, you go earn it. It's never about what you are, it's about what you have done with it.
Now, as to the second point, I want to point out that the trans used here on the site is short for transgender. I think that someone who tries on his wife's pantyhose when he gets the chance has a gender issue of some kind or another. I think a preop transsexual does as well. Is one more trans than the other?  Would that not be in a similar vein to being a little bit pregnant? A woman who conceived last night is pregnant, a women carrying a child for eight and a half months is pregnant. Do they fight with each other over who is more pregnant? I very much doubt they do. They understand that one is FURTHER ALONG than the other. Personally, I think if someone is sincere, and they choose to use the trans identifier, that's it. Nobody in a chatroom or forum has any business questioning their right to use it, or making any decisions on whether they should. It in fact is none of anyone's damn business. It's a complicated thing to be transgender, there are so many things to consider and to work through. Thinking that anyone should stand before insecure strangers and justify the path taken seems ludicrous to me. I think there is more than enough room for the once a year panty wearer and the postop TS in the transgender world.  It would be a real special event if everyone would act like it.....



Reigna -> RE: feminization (2/7/2009 12:38:44 PM)

Solange, once again I find myself in agreement with you. In fact, I was going to post something along this line myself, but it's nice to have it come from a trans person.

I find extremely toxic the idea that there's a qualitative difference between "a man trapped in a woman's body" and a "mere" fetishist. This idea seems to have leaked out of transgender treatment clinics, where often medical and surgical treatments are denied to trans people who acknowledge that there ever was any sexual component whatsoever to their transness. In effect, doctors in these clinics force the vast majority of their patients to lie. So what if he was jacking off into women's panties when he was 15? So what if he still does? Does that mean he shouldn't be offered the best treatment available? And how can he possibly get the best treatment available if he doesn't dare say what's really going on?

Part of this condemnatory attitude toward transness as a component of sexuality comes from the notion that there's something wrong with sexual behavior in general. You simply cannot have people enjoying themselves, especially if that enjoyment comes from a (usually) implied devaluing of masculinity. Part of it comes from simple us/them dynamics, which people seem able to create out of even the flimsiest materials. And part of it comes from good old fashioned misogyny. Because if "he" really is a woman, "his" behavior can't be helped. But if he's really a man--well, he's just gotten way to close to those icky, polluting woman-things; he's got cooties.

So, yeah, I agree completely that there is a spectrum of transness. But a qualitative difference? Despite the arguments and the testimonials, I just don't see it. In fact, I find the notion that there is a difference to be both absurd and sad.



LadyConstanze -> RE: feminization (2/7/2009 12:45:53 PM)

It depends pretty much with who am I doing it, with some people I have thoroughly enjoyed it because the chemistry was right, with others it would just bore me.



Reigna -> RE: feminization (2/7/2009 12:54:52 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: hardbodysub

... I think you're trying to say that being transgender isn't a sexual fantasy, as crossdressing often is. Nobody who knows anything about it would disagree with you on that.


With respect, I think it's fair to say that the matter is somewhat less than settled. It happens that I do know a little about it, and I respectfully disagree with you.



stef -> RE: feminization (2/7/2009 1:56:32 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: SolangeRichards

I think there is more than enough room for the once a year panty wearer and the postop TS in the transgender world.  It would be a real special event if everyone would act like it.....

Oddly enough, many transsexuals don't share this opinion and cringe at the thought of the term "transgender" being used like this, or at all.  It has nothing whatsoever to do with any supposed hierarchy, implied value or being "further along", but with reality.  Comparing transsexuals to transvestites makes as much sense as comparing apples to pears.  One is no better than the other, they're just entirely different things.

~stef



Reigna -> RE: feminization (2/7/2009 2:14:46 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: stef

Oddly enough, many transsexuals ... cringe at the thought of the term "transgender" being used like this, or at all.  It has nothing whatsoever to do with any supposed hierarchy, implied value or being "further along", but with reality.  Comparing transsexuals to transvestites makes as much sense as comparing apples to pears.  One is no better than the other, they're just entirely different things.


I don't find it odd at all. Who wants to be lumped in with a bunch of degenerates?



stef -> RE: feminization (2/7/2009 2:47:03 PM)

Who are the degenerates again?  I seem to have misplaced my program.

~stef



SolangeRichards -> RE: feminization (2/8/2009 4:23:00 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: stef

quote:

ORIGINAL: SolangeRichards

I think there is more than enough room for the once a year panty wearer and the postop TS in the transgender world.  It would be a real special event if everyone would act like it.....

Oddly enough, many transsexuals don't share this opinion and cringe at the thought of the term "transgender" being used like this, or at all.  It has nothing whatsoever to do with any supposed hierarchy, implied value or being "further along", but with reality.  Comparing transsexuals to transvestites makes as much sense as comparing apples to pears.  One is no better than the other, they're just entirely different things.

~stef


I will agree with you that there are a number of transsexuals who have issues with the term transgender and I'm aware of their feelings on the subject.

I was trying to be somewhat site specific in it's usage, rather than focus on the political aspects of a term that to date has been rather fluid in it's definition.

All that said however, as time passes the term is being applied more and more across the spectrum as an umbrella term.  Even to the point that many bookstores group works involving separate issues like TS and crossdressing into a single section of the bookstore.  There may be transsexuals who dislike the term, but I don't think the word will be going away...

Pears and apples by the way, are in fact related.  They share a common family.



energeticservant -> RE: feminization (2/8/2009 10:33:40 AM)

This is no less a true sexual schema then Straight Het Male Dom, Switch TS, Bisexual Sub Fem, etc. It is silly for a TS to say they are more real than a crossdresser.

Feminization is such a vague term, covering many possible situations. If you say "I enjoy feminization" it's probably a good idea to qualify it, because it's going to go ten different directions with ten different people.

quote:

ORIGINAL: unownedsissy
i would only add my 2 pence by saying that for many sub males, being feminised adds to the humiliation and the desire to submit and so on..the sub space intensifies ( for me at least) as doe the levels of subjugation and boundaries.
i totally empathise with dommes who do not enjoy feminising their submissive however , its so indelibly ingrained onto some sub cross dressers minds that it merges into a nevesseity inorder to correctly submit.
that my 2 pence spent



TexasMaam -> RE: feminization (2/8/2009 10:49:39 AM)

I enjoy feminizing a sub when it's MY idea or whim to do so.

I do NOT enjoy a whiney sissy who wants to greet me in girly clothes and expect My motor to get revved up seeing him in pinks, pastels and frills.

The only thrill I get by feminization is when a man really has NO desire to engage in that activity and I force it on him for giggles, laughter and the glee it affords me.

A recent episode of SuperNanny where a pig male was forced to wear heels while he did all of his wife's housework that he always took for granted is a perfect example of the kind of feminization antics I love to enforce.

Teaching a man how akward it is to wear heels, and how time consuming it is to shave, primp and make up is a hoot. 

A steady diet of it is nauseating.

TexasMaam



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