|
BitaTruble -> RE: Combat Brigade ready on US soil.. WTF?? (10/24/2008 8:37:45 PM)
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf
No that was not a generic you, it was specific. The words you used seemed very specific to you. I would like to not which of the rights you have tried to use have been absolutely denied.
You haven't earned the right to know. Some stranger on the forums? Please. It's a pointless exercise which serves no purpose other than to satisfy your own curiosity. I could write a long list here and get back nothing but a 'prove it', so you'll just have to remain ignorant.
quote:
As far as defending it, I am not and I do not like the Patriot Act either, but I use a much different tact when I wish to show that it is a bad thing. I also hold not just the adminitsration responsible for it, as it took all those overlooked members of Congress to allow it to pass.
Um, no, it actually didn't. The Presidential signatories precluded that particular requirement of law. Congress passed a bill, yes .. then Bush added the exclusions in his signatories which changed the legislation and signed that which is why it's illegal. The executive branch is not the branch which creates law. The current Patriot Act, as it stands today (and, in fact the first one) were NOT signed off on by Congress. I'll ask you the same thing I asked the other guy .. have you actually read the Patriot Act? If not, why don't you like it? If so, why don't you know that it wasn't passed, as it stands, by Congress?
quote:
Yeah scare tactics, because that is what they are. You admit you are scared, since you choose your words carefully, and you seem determined to spread the fear. Your leaps in logic are astounding, but then again I do not see logic in your posts, I see only emotion. You say Kudos to me for being trusting, which shows either a debate tactic, or that you did not actually read what I wrote. Suppose it is just those emotions of fear unchecked.
Your ignorance is equally astounding. My fear is based on my reason that as soon as it's okay for the executive branch to create law, then our executive branch has two of the three branches of government in the hands of a single person. In fact, it goes beyond that because those signatories also precluded the Supreme Court from being able to act against the interest of the executive branch. That doesn't scare you? Are you okay with all the power being in the hands of one person?
Guardsman are only supposed to be used on foreign soil in the event there are no other resources. Paraphrased, but this is the part of the Posse Comitatus which you left out of another post. You'll find it in some of the links you provided. Sort of an important part to leave out since it's the piece that makes the currect action unlawful. There are other resources. They are called the National Guard and they are currently serving in Iraq.
quote:
They are not assisting in law enforcement, but DISASTER RELIEF. Try reading it a bit more clearly next time, then again your fear could be blinding you. National Guardsmen do not usually stay as such, less likely to make it a career, not to mention as regular Army they can be on standby 24/7. Do you not see some of the LOGICAL reasons yet?
My fear does not blind me. It was with clarity and consideration that I came to my conclusions. The fear came after I realized what they portend and how much power now lies in the hands of a single man. Now we have the illegal Patriot Act and I see a violation of the Posse Comitatus. I've drawn my conclusions from logic and reason. You keep drinking that kool-aid though and source out wiki. Try not to get sand in your ears.
Do I see any logic to violating the Posse Comitatus? No, I don't.
quote:
Really? That was pretty plain in your posts and I missed that. Do you see why it might be better to have a full time unit doing such work?
I clearly stated that it was the job of the National Guard.
Well, your argument is a strawman, but as far as whether or not it would be better to have a full-time unit doing the work, it may very well be, but that's not the issue. I prefer our government to follow the law which they legislated then enacted and that is the issue.
quote:
Well your logic does not seem to pan out. You fear these units may be used on domestic soil, against US citizens? What about all the military sitting on based already? Sorry it looks more like irrational reaction.
I don't think your logic can understand my logic because my understanding comes from actually having read the legislation to which I am refering. Perhaps you see my reaction as irrational, but I see yours as ignorant. As far as the military bases, another strawman. The one has nothing to do with the other. I'll take my paranoia over your ignorance 7 days a week.
quote:
Never going to happen in the current two party system, where the politicians practice shell games, and no one is willing to hold them accountable because it is all of the other politicians doing bad things, not the one's you (general) support.
This is the first thing you've said with which I agree. If Feingold had run for President, the fact that he is the only Senator who stood up and said.. WTF to the Patriot Act would have put him so far above anyone else running that I would have given serious consideration to casting a vote in his favor.
quote:
You (specific) used the words "no one". I am waiting for you to back up that "No one" showed up somewhere during a disaster. Otherwise it is an exaggeration, used because of your paranoia and fear.
First call for a state of emergency, August 27. First National Guard personnel didn't arrive until August 31. I ammend my statement to 'no one for 4 days.'
quote:
No I actually read that article and then did some more research on their role. Did you actually read the entire article, or just the conspiracy theory/paranoi/I am afraid parts?
I read the entire article, related bills and used that in combination with my knowledge of the Patriot to reach my conclusions.
quote:
Fear is a tactic that was used to get is to where we are, and those methods being used for what you see as "good" is just as deplorable. You can deny all you wish, but truth remains and only lies are invented.
.. and ignorance is bliss. I suggest you actually read the books instead of try to argue from your Wiki sources.
|
|
|
|
