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RE: When Does It End? - 11/3/2008 11:56:54 AM   
bestbabync


Posts: 1061
Joined: 7/25/2007
Status: offline 		i was referring to both races which some refer to as sides.  sorry i did not make myself clear....ooops!

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RE: When Does It End? - 11/3/2008 12:16:39 PM   
barelynangel


Posts: 6233
Status: offline 		chuckles, actually i am not wrong.   And if you really want to be technical, both of our opinions are right and wrong depending which group you believe as there is a debate on whether or not race is biological or social.  They are currently fighting this out in the genetic field if i am not mistaken.  But as you said, this really is a tangent of the original post and in all actuality is very insignificant in the message of my post.

angel

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RE: When Does It End? - 11/3/2008 1:22:24 PM   
jlf1961


Posts: 14840
Joined: 6/10/2008
From: Somewhere Texas
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quote:

ORIGINAL: barelynangel

Kittinsol,

If you want to be technical, actually biologically there ARE differences in race, that is why when you have bones many times the med. examiner can decipher the possible race of person with just looking at the bones -- but you knew that already i am sure. 

angel



Actually, Angel, it is not only skeletal differences, but there are differences in blood, muscle tissue, even ear wax.

However, what I find as funny is the fact that racist forget one very important fact..... With the exception of the Romans, there was few other fair skinned people in Judea at the time of Christ.

Even more basic is the simple fact that the species homo sapiens, of which we are of the sub species, homo sapiens sapiens.

Now, with that in mind, every supspecies of that homo s. sapiens share 99.5% genetic material, the rest being adaptive mutation, so in being racist, we are in fact being racist against our selves.



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RE: When Does It End? - 11/3/2008 1:24:11 PM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline 		No, there is no 'fight in the genetic field' over this subject. It is ignorance and preconceived ideas that leads people (like you) to perpetuate the false idea that there are different races within humanity that can be recognised through obscure differences in skeletal structure or other nonsensical 'scientific' methods. There is one human race, and many different mandellian traits. But there aren't different 'human races'. And that, my dear, is the end of that.

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RE: When Does It End? - 11/3/2008 1:26:03 PM   
kittinSol


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quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

Actually, Angel, it is not only skeletal differences, but there are differences in blood, muscle tissue, even ear wax.




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RE: When Does It End? - 11/3/2008 1:48:06 PM   
barelynangel


Posts: 6233
Status: offline 		Kittinsol, i am curious where you get your beliefs from to the point you actually are calling concepts ignorant of what i speak, my beliefs have partially been from pre-med and genetic classes i have taken, as well as simply watching the field.  There is a debate going on in the genetic field because while the difference is low i think under 10% there still are genetic differences coming up based on specifics of race.  The issue they are coming up against is more of genetic mutations based on specific markers from specific races.   Please since you seem to know it all about the genetic field and the biological fields of these types of studies and this issue, show me the absolute proof you have.    What i have stated i have read in medical journals, medical research reports, i have heard it debated in pre-med as well as genetic classes i have taken.  While i won't say i am absolutely right, i won't say i am absolutely wrong and i sure am not ignorant of the debate being had in the genetic field over this issue.  So please show me your research you have done as well as all the information within which you base your presumption. 

I am actually facinated by genetics among other things within the biological fields as well as forensic sciences, so i am sure your information will be interesting to look over.

angel



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RE: When Does It End? - 11/3/2008 1:57:49 PM   
JustDarkness


Posts: 1461
Joined: 7/25/2008
Status: offline 		I hope it ends tomorrow.
MEaning...all this crap around the elections. Just let the one with most voters win....and let him lead the country.
Then we can forget about all the  other stuff.

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RE: When Does It End? - 11/3/2008 3:06:09 PM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline 		When people start thinking that one can have 'scientific beliefs' they can say goodbye to science. Science isn't about beliefs, but about empirical facts. The research, and those pesky facts, are out there for you to feast your eyes upon, unless you don't want them to get in the way of your beliefs, that is. In the meantime, if you're going to make erroneous assertions, people like me will correct them and tell you that you are wrong. Have a good day.

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RE: When Does It End? - 11/3/2008 3:30:34 PM   
barelynangel


Posts: 6233
Status: offline 		As i said kittinsol, all i see is you making assertions i am wrong.  I have seen no proof on your end and while you may think highly of yourself lol, i tend to put my thoughts with people actually working on this information and the studies they have performed and analyzed as well as drawn conclusions based upon their findings.  So well, in order to disprove me you would need your own empirical facts, which you have yet to offer.  Sorry, you can jump up and down and yell you are wrong, but that in all actuality doesn't make me wrong or you right.  grins, i think people tend to try that and well, it doesn't work all that well lol.

I suggest you do your research and get back to me.  Anyway, i think you and i both established this tangent is redundant. 

angel

< Message edited by barelynangel -- 11/3/2008 3:32:51 PM >

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RE: When Does It End? - 11/3/2008 3:42:51 PM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline 		The confusion about human races.

What we know and what we don't know: human genetic variations and the social construction of race.

Is "race" real?

Have fun doing your homework.

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RE: When Does It End? - 11/3/2008 3:58:39 PM   
slvemike4u


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Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

Since you don't know about my side, and what I have experienced, you're banging your head against the wall for nothing.
Leave her be Kittin,she gets into less trouble this way.

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RE: When Does It End? - 11/3/2008 5:33:07 PM   
barelynangel


Posts: 6233
Status: offline 		Mike, was that really necessary?  Are you really that eager for attention from me or is it kittin you are desperate for attention?  I don't know you, i have had one other encounter with you on these boards and it is not one i remember or care too.  So please do not presume you know me and post silly stuff like this just to try and get attention.  Thanks. 

That being said,

Kittinsol,   thank you for the links to the one website.  I have no problem doing my homework nor do i mind learning new things, i know and even acknowledged previously there are articles that contradict what i believe just as there are articles that contradict what you state.  But i asked for absolute proof, and you really haven't offered any.  Unfortunately, 3 different articles don't prove absolute proof lol to state the other side does not exist which is what you have stated - i was absolutely wrong -- , as i am sure you know.  However, I will read these articles and the site itself with interest.  You imply you have some type of knowledge of all of this, care to share your qualifications? Your sarcasm has been duly noted though i have yet to figure out the reason for it. 

angel

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RE: When Does It End? - 11/3/2008 5:35:13 PM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline 		If you think that my offerings to you constitute sarcasm, you haven't earned it yet, baby.

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RE: When Does It End? - 11/3/2008 5:43:23 PM   
thornhappy


Posts: 8596
Joined: 12/16/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: barelynangel

Kittinsol,

If you want to be technical, actually biologically there ARE differences in race they may not be huge or significant all the time but that is why when you have bones at times the med. examiner can decipher the possible race of person with just looking at the bones structure especially at times with skulls and facial structure -- but you knew that already i am sure. 

angel

There is more genetic diversity within a "race" than there are between them.  For the scientific data backing it up, see the book "Mutant."  I've mentioned it before in this forum, and don't want to transcribe whole paragraphs again (fingers tired!)

thornhappy

< Message edited by thornhappy -- 11/3/2008 5:46:13 PM >

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RE: When Does It End? - 11/3/2008 5:46:31 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

No, there is no 'fight in the genetic field' over this subject. It is ignorance and preconceived ideas that leads people (like you) to perpetuate the false idea that there are different races within humanity that can be recognised through obscure differences in skeletal structure or other nonsensical 'scientific' methods. There is one human race, and many different mandellian traits. But there aren't different 'human races'. And that, my dear, is the end of that.


Kittin, if what you're saying is true then that means that all those Affirmative Action Race-Based programs are and have been based on false pretenses!


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RE: When Does It End? - 11/3/2008 5:50:14 PM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline 		No, that is not what this means:  a biological fallacy doesn't negate the human experience, and from a social and cultural point of view, race and ethnicity very much exist. Homework time for you too, pop.

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RE: When Does It End? - 11/3/2008 6:50:00 PM   
Lordandmaster


Posts: 10943
Joined: 6/22/2004
Status: offline 		I never understand why people in Collarme threads seem to think that anyone who disagrees with them is obliged to "prove" his or her case.  Geneticists no longer use "race" as a scientific term in conjunction with human beings, and that's really all there is to it.  The American Anthropological Association put it best:

http://www.aaanet.org/stmts/racepp.htm

quote:

There is greater variation within "racial" groups than between them.


I doubt 1% of Americans realize that white Americans are genetically closer to black Americans than most Africans are to each other!

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RE: When Does It End? - 11/3/2008 6:58:21 PM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: JustDarkness

I hope it ends tomorrow.
MEaning...all this crap around the elections. Just let the one with most voters win....and let him lead the country.
Then we can forget about all the  other stuff.


I'm with you on that!

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Profile   Post #: 58
RE: When Does It End? - 11/4/2008 5:16:13 AM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster
I doubt 1% of Americans realize that white Americans are genetically closer to black Americans than most Africans are to each other!


Oh, oh! Sacrilege!

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