RE: Obama has officially been elected President of the United States (Full Version)

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Musicmystery -> RE: Obama has officially been elected President of the United States (11/5/2008 11:23:03 AM)

And winning four elections.



tazzygirl -> RE: Obama has officially been elected President of the United States (11/5/2008 11:41:43 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: subeos

quote:

what happened to the native people of america was pretty heinous. i'm part cherokee and while they may not want me in the tribe, native issues are EXTREMELY important to me, too. but there's a difference between that and being considered non-human and bought and sold as property. being a slave is a kink to people now, but in our history it means something else altogether.


The Native Americans need to get over what happen to them. They get checks, free homes and much other free things. The Blacks do not get those things. This is not going to go over well. But I hope that policy will change. But prolly not, because they have been already to spoiled by it. Their issues are extremely important because they can not just move on. But they have their casinos. Time for equality.
And  nope I am not racist!
~sub_eos~

~To Thine Own Self Be True~



i am half souix.  my father full blooded.  we dont GET checks, free housing, or anything else.  everything i have, i worked hard for.  as did my father,, and his father, and his father.  as far as the casinos, most tribes dont see much if anything from them.

so many races, colors, tribes, ect, have been used, manipulated, even enslaved, some for a set amount of time, some for all their lives. 

so much hatred.. so much blame.  what happened, happened.  we cant change that, nothing can rewrite history.  im sorry the slaves from africa were sold by their own tries or warring tribes.  im sorry american's bought them as cheap slave labor.  im sorry some were beaten and killed without any more thought that one might have given a horse at that time.

but a WHOLE country went to war over that issue, among others.  they gained their freedom, such as it was.  and it wasnt much.  native americans too had to fight for what was rightfully theirs.  its never easy to let go of a bad past, whether its a personal or race.

i grew up in the military, where you dont see race, you see ranks.  in the 70's while some places were still segregated (yes, many places still were) our neighbors wore a rainbow of colors... we didnt see them as a black man, or am italian, or japanese.  they were MP's, Commanding Officers, Navy Seals.  Men of honor, pride and dignity... and thats all we saw.. all we knew growing up.

it wasnt till my father  retired and we moved south that the full racism issue slapped me in the face.  i was 14, and absolutely amazed at the amount of hatred i saw from one race towards another.  and i feel like im still seeing that to this day, thankfully, not as much.

i currently live in ohio, and not saying this is an ohio trait, but, the amount of obvious racism i see where i live is worse than i encountered in the south.

people... isnt it time to let it go and become a country of americans instead of  always leading our nationality by our race? isnt it TIME we let go of all that?  i dont march to my government and complain that my ancestors were forced from their lands,  bullied onto reservations and had to give up their way of life because another race decided we were inferior.  and, yes, some people still look at us as if we are.  when we stop looking at the color of our skin, and start focusing on the philosophies of each person individually, then maybe we can surpass this insane racism issue and pull together to become what we are supposed to be,... united
tazzy



BlackPhx -> RE: Obama has officially been elected President of the United States (11/5/2008 11:46:39 AM)

Native American women also got undesired, unrequested, unneeded and uninformed hysterectomies as late as 1975. http://www.whale.to/b/heavner.html , by the government. They have been moved off of reservations when oil, gold, or other precious materials have been found and relocated to land that barely sustains life. Native Americans have been raped, held as slaves (yes some sold other NA's as slaves or kept them themselves, some tribes would lay down and die rather than submit), infected with influenza and small pox to kill them off and starved.

The free homes you speak of are far from free, most are the equivalent of FEMA trailers and low cost housing, and this is how they live until a Tribe does make enough money to actually build  homes like many of us take for granted. Native Americans must leave reservations if they desire a good education, and many of the religions (there were many) have vanished under decades of Missionary indoctrination, the few that still remain, are Tourist attractions for the most part. Most can barely speak their native tongue and there are few remaining elsewhere in a "home country" that can teach them. Few tribes exist where hundreds once did, they have been assimilated into several major tribes.

The Percentage of the Total Population Who Are American Indian and Alaska Native Alone: 2006 can be found here : http://factfinder.census.gov/servlet/GRTTable?_bm=y&-geo_id=01000US&-_box_head_nbr=R0203&-ds_name=ACS_2007_1YR_G00_&-redoLog=false&-format=US-30&-mt_name=ACS_2006_EST_G00_R0203_US30 . The Highest is Alaska at 13.5% or in numbers out of 683,478 living in Alaska in 2007, 88, 852 of them were of the race that originally settled that land. Georgia a smaller state has a higher percentage of African Americans at 29.8% out of a 9 million person census in 2007. Given far too short a time, the Original Population of this country will be completely assimilated and an entire way of life will exist only as artifacts in a museum.

Their grave mounds have been ransacked for artifacts, sacred lands developed and sold and many of the "Native Art" pieces that are available are made in china ( always check the tag on your Navaho rug) and jewelry in Mexico (Mexican Silver and Turqouise must be marked as such).

Being 1/3 of each of 3 races (Irish, Apach and Black) I have had a strong interest in my genetic past (you would be surprised at how it can affect your health). Being stolen or sold by your country, is not greater or less in it's impact than having that country stolen from you. Either is a tragedy and leaves a long and bitter memory.

But, we are a country of many people, many ethnicities, cultures and unity is possible here. We saw that happen last night. I hope to see it continue for many years to come.

poenkitten



variation30 -> RE: Obama has officially been elected President of the United States (11/5/2008 11:54:03 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster

Try Article III, Section 2:

quote:

In all Cases affecting Ambassadors, other public Ministers and Consuls, and those in which a State shall be Party, the supreme Court shall have original Jurisdiction. In all the other Cases before mentioned, the supreme Court shall have appellate Jurisdiction, both as to Law and Fact, with such Exceptions, and under such Regulations as the Congress shall make.


Oh and check out the Federalist #78 while you're at it.

Thanks for playing, see Chip for your parting gift!



um...judicial review isn't in 3.2. I'm reading and rereading 3.2 and I"ve yet to see where it says the supreme court can determine constitutionality.

and by it being mentioned in the federalist papers, you are proving my point. the federalist papers are listing what they (hamiolton and madison) *want* to see happen...because it's not in the constitution. I will repeat that. they are arguing for it in the federlaist papers precisely because it is not in the constitution.



variation30 -> RE: Obama has officially been elected President of the United States (11/5/2008 11:58:41 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

NG, one, we're not the Japanese and two I'm in favor of them if we need them.
They say that there's something like 600-800 bridges in the country that should be replaced.
It's not "spending our way out of recession" it's spending money on things that need it.
It's spending money on things that have been neglected for far too long.


I hate to be the one to break this to you, but economic laws hold true despite the time and place.



Musicmystery -> RE: Obama has officially been elected President of the United States (11/5/2008 11:59:41 AM)

*looks at the posts, looks at the thread title*

Must be some glich--I keep getting a different thread.



variation30 -> RE: Obama has officially been elected President of the United States (11/5/2008 11:59:42 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: HunterS

quote:

ORIGINAL: variation30

or to bring this back home...it didn't help us to try and spend our way out of a depression under fdr. it made things much worse.



Perhaps you might explane just how?
 
H.


look at the consequences of his policies of plowing under crops in order to keep food prices high...



variation30 -> RE: Obama has officially been elected President of the United States (11/5/2008 12:00:58 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: amelliagrace

I wonder if Obama has the balls to push to have that atrocity put to death?  I didn't vote for either Obama or McCain, though I considered each of them long and hard.  The repeal of the Patriot Act would probably get him my vote, four years from now, provided he manages anything even close to a tolerable administration.
 
Grace


um...seeing as how obama voted for the patriot act, I don't see why he would do away with it...



BKSir -> RE: Obama has officially been elected President of the United States (11/5/2008 12:01:24 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

*looks at the posts, looks at the thread title*

Must be some glich--I keep getting a different thread.


Nah, this thing just hopped rails about 74 times... and that was only by page 8. ;)



variation30 -> RE: Obama has officially been elected President of the United States (11/5/2008 12:04:05 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: HunterS

First this is the "opinion" of two men,hardly a consensus.
next this discusses the NIRA which was a relatively small aspect of the NRA.  The question I posed was in response to the assertion that "spending" ones way out of a depression did not work.
Agreed, many of FDR's programs were struck down by the supreme court.  That he was successful is hardly debatable...from a distance of nearly 80 years we have a much different perspective of how things "couda,woulda,shoulda" been done.  At the time the poor were getting poorer and the rich were getting richer...hmmm...not unlike today.
 
H.


there's more than two men who believe this.

and also, a consenus means nothing. truth is not determined by a popular vote.



variation30 -> RE: Obama has officially been elected President of the United States (11/5/2008 12:07:08 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

If the 2nd ammendment is an unlimited absolute right to own and carry firearms then we can't prevent mentally unstable people from owning firearms. Similarly for convicted criminals.


convicted criminals give up their rights when they violate the rights of others.

as far as the mentally unstable, as a psychology major, I am curious...is there an objective test for mental instability? If no, then how are we to decide whose rights to strip? should we just let whim decide? should we allow mentally unstable people from being searched at random by the government? should we prevent mentally unstable people from speaking freely?

edit: and gun regulation wasn't done for the community good, as many of you believe. it comes from the jim crow south, where people were trying to keep firearms away from blacks so they could not defend themselves or their rights...

which I think is an excellent demonstration of what stripping individuals of their rights really is.



variation30 -> RE: Obama has officially been elected President of the United States (11/5/2008 12:10:38 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BitaTruble

quote:

ORIGINAL: variation30



I'm pretty sure the majority of slaves were initially captured by africans and then sold to europeans.


That we raided and kidnapped, stole humans from their own land is historical fact. What you are 'pretty sure' of doesn't change history.




I would suggest you read more about the slave trade. you'll see that most of the 'stealing' was done by africans. and again 'we' didn't do any thing.

or at least I haven't. have you gone to africa and stolen people?



variation30 -> RE: Obama has officially been elected President of the United States (11/5/2008 12:12:52 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: subeos

The Native Americans need to get over what happen to them. They get checks, free homes and much other free things. The Blacks do not get those things. This is not going to go over well. But I hope that policy will change. But prolly not, because they have been already to spoiled by it. Their issues are extremely important because they can not just move on. But they have their casinos. Time for equality.
And  nope I am not racist!
~sub_eos~

~To Thine Own Self Be True~



...wow.

I don't know where to start.



amelliagrace -> RE: Obama has officially been elected President of the United States (11/5/2008 12:29:39 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: variation30

quote:

ORIGINAL: amelliagrace

I wonder if Obama has the balls to push to have that atrocity put to death?  I didn't vote for either Obama or McCain, though I considered each of them long and hard.  The repeal of the Patriot Act would probably get him my vote, four years from now, provided he manages anything even close to a tolerable administration.
 
Grace


um...seeing as how obama voted for the patriot act, I don't see why he would do away with it...



It takes major balls to own your part in such collossal fuck-up.  Does he have them, in this case?  Remains to be seen.  Does he have the same warped  view as Bush when it comes to the PA?  Remains to be seen.
 
Grace



slvemike4u -> RE: Obama has officially been elected President of the United States (11/5/2008 12:35:21 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: variation30

quote:

ORIGINAL: HunterS

First this is the "opinion" of two men,hardly a consensus.
next this discusses the NIRA which was a relatively small aspect of the NRA.  The question I posed was in response to the assertion that "spending" ones way out of a depression did not work.
Agreed, many of FDR's programs were struck down by the supreme court.  That he was successful is hardly debatable...from a distance of nearly 80 years we have a much different perspective of how things "couda,woulda,shoulda" been done.  At the time the poor were getting poorer and the rich were getting richer...hmmm...not unlike today.
 
H.


there's more than two men who believe this.

and also, a consenus means nothing. truth is not determined by a popular vote.

Well just whose truth are we discussng here....your's,there appears to be more than a lottle "opinion"coloring your truths.



HunterS -> RE: Obama has officially been elected President of the United States (11/5/2008 1:02:12 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: variation30

convicted criminals give up their rights when they violate the rights of others.





A convicted pot smoker  has violated the rights of whom?
There are any number of convicted felons who have not violated anyones rights.
There are any number of convicted felons who have violated the rights of others but had nothing to do with a firearm.
Your logic is less than logical.

H.



popeye1250 -> RE: Obama has officially been elected President of the United States (11/5/2008 1:06:20 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: variation30

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

NG, one, we're not the Japanese and two I'm in favor of them if we need them.
They say that there's something like 600-800 bridges in the country that should be replaced.
It's not "spending our way out of recession" it's spending money on things that need it.
It's spending money on things that have been neglected for far too long.


I hate to be the one to break this to you, but economic laws hold true despite the time and place.



Well, it's not going to help the economy if more bridges or levees collapse is it perfessor?
"Psychology" eh?
So when you get your "degree" we'll be seeing you at Starbucks?
Why not Electrical Engineering?
Then you could help build "The New America."



slvemike4u -> RE: Obama has officially been elected President of the United States (11/5/2008 1:10:52 PM)

LOL...popeye ,you are too much.



HunterS -> RE: Obama has officially been elected President of the United States (11/5/2008 1:15:46 PM)

quote:

I would suggest you read more about the slave trade. you'll see that most of the 'stealing' was done by africans. and again 'we' didn't do any thing.

or at least I haven't. have you gone to africa and stolen people?


Receipt of stolen property is the same as stealing that property.
While you are suggesting that people read up on the subject of the slavery you might avail yourself of the same advice.  From the inception of our country until the Civil War the country supported itself on excise taxes and export duties.  These are primarily taxes on the product of slave labor.  The infrastructure which you and I enjoy today was paid for by slave labor.  So the fact is, that while you clearly did not own slaves, you certainly have benefited from their labor which you neither earned nor bought.
 
H.



daddysub4realdom -> RE: Obama has officially been elected President of the United States (11/5/2008 3:56:21 PM)

ahh here is where you are wrong i orginally had a profile that explained everything i did and didnt want and i still got the  same crap it just taught me that no one bothers to read on this site when looking for people, hence why i deleted all of it, so please dont say things like that until you have the facts



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