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RE: What do you most expect out of the next four years?? - 11/10/2008 7:33:07 AM   
sirsholly


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quote:

ORIGINAL: nightphoenix

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

quote:

ORIGINAL: nightphoenix

And the relevance of this is...?


Just that you said you were considering leaving the country because you were having a hissy fit over Obama's election, or something similar, perhaps?


And that is relevant to this thread how....?

relevant that for the next 4 yrs you plan to be in a different area code?


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RE: What do you most expect out of the next four years?? - 11/10/2008 7:34:18 AM   
nightphoenix


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quote:

ORIGINAL: sirsholly

quote:

ORIGINAL: nightphoenix

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

quote:

ORIGINAL: nightphoenix

And the relevance of this is...?


Just that you said you were considering leaving the country because you were having a hissy fit over Obama's election, or something similar, perhaps?


And that is relevant to this thread how....?

relevant that for the next 4 yrs you plan to be in a different area code?



And once more...how is that relevant to the thread?

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RE: What do you most expect out of the next four years?? - 11/10/2008 7:34:36 AM   
Irishknight


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The thing I most expect out of the next 4 years is to get 4 years older.

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RE: What do you most expect out of the next four years?? - 11/10/2008 7:35:38 AM   
celticlord2112


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Your quote substantiates the analogy.  Those with the larger tax bill get larger tax reductions than those with the smaller tax bill.  This is precisely what the bar analogy states.

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RE: What do you most expect out of the next four years?? - 11/10/2008 7:49:51 AM   
sirsholly


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Irishknight

The thing I most expect out of the next 4 years is to get 4 years older.

i am going to be 4 yrs younger....going backwards from now on. This aging shit is for the birds...


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RE: What do you most expect out of the next four years?? - 11/10/2008 7:59:50 AM   
hizgeorgiapeach


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~fr~
 
I'm not even gonna touch any of the various comments made so far in this thread by others, and keep myself strictly to the OP.  Some of you will no doubt find what I think about the OP offensive, some won't.  However, I'm not willing to lie in order to make sure I don't inadvertantly offend someone's sensibilities or potentially cause moral outrage.  Consider that last to be both disclaimer and warning.
 
What I expect to see out of the next four years..... hmmmmm...
 
more assassination attempts than against any prior president - some based on his race, some not, but any attempts ultimately Atributed to his skin tone by the majority of the public whether that was the motivating factor or not.  (Let's face it, folks, there are those who would pull something of that nature just cause they think it'll grab 'em their 15 minutes of fame, and who honestly wouldn't Need any further internal justification than that - the same ones who would think along those lines had it been McCain or one of the more obscure candidates who had won.) 
I expect to see a lot of chaos throughout the world on both economic and non-economic fronts. (Ya can't crowd this lil mudball with this much humanity and then expect Not to have conflict.)  
I expect to see a lot of disilliusionment when PE Obama turns out to be just another politician in a long line of politicians, and pretty much just like every other politician.
 
I expect to get older, lose my remaining and already ill parent, lose my already ill pair of grandmothers, work to much for to little while the government tries to take ever more of it in taxes, for the population to continue to grow unabated despite already being to much for the planet to easily and comfortably sustain, for polution to get worse, for apathy to increase......

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RE: What do you most expect out of the next four years?? - 11/10/2008 8:36:55 AM   
rulemylife


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quote:

ORIGINAL: nightphoenix

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylifeIt is flawed because it assumes a lower percentage reduction on the wealthy guy in the analogy when that is not what happened with the Bush tax cuts.


Or maybe it's an example with simplified math and wasn't intending on trying to mirror the Bush cuts. ;)  It still demonstrates the principle quite nicely.


It was an amusing story but what principle you were trying to demonstrate isn't clear.

If you were trying to create an analogy to defend Bush's tax cuts then the numbers aren't just simplified they're completely incorrect.

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RE: What do you most expect out of the next four years?? - 11/10/2008 8:42:21 AM   
nightphoenix


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quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: nightphoenix

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylifeIt is flawed because it assumes a lower percentage reduction on the wealthy guy in the analogy when that is not what happened with the Bush tax cuts.


Or maybe it's an example with simplified math and wasn't intending on trying to mirror the Bush cuts. ;)  It still demonstrates the principle quite nicely.


It was an amusing story but what principle you were trying to demonstrate isn't clear.

If you were trying to create an analogy to defend Bush's tax cuts then the numbers aren't just simplified they're completely incorrect.


...

It had nothing to do with defending Bush's tax cuts.  It's more a warning to those who feel we should be "sticking it to the rich!" and "making things fair!"

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RE: What do you most expect out of the next four years?? - 11/10/2008 9:02:31 AM   
rulemylife


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quote:

ORIGINAL: celticlord2112

Your quote substantiates the analogy.  Those with the larger tax bill get larger tax reductions than those with the smaller tax bill.  This is precisely what the bar analogy states.


Yes and no.  In the bar example each had their bill reduced.  Those paying less received a higher percentage reduction but less in actual dollars because they contributed less initially.  Those paying more received a lower percentage reduction but saved more in actual dollars because they contributed more initially.

The Bush tax cuts were the opposite of the bar example because those in the upper tax brackets did not save more just because their income and taxes were higher to begin with but because their tax rates were reduced 4.6% as opposed to the lower income earners in the Times analysis who received only a 2.1% reduction.


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RE: What do you most expect out of the next four years?? - 11/10/2008 10:30:54 AM   
popeye1250


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I'd like to see a return to the Rule of Law where *all* of our laws are enforced again.

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RE: What do you most expect out of the next four years?? - 11/10/2008 5:31:24 PM   
winterlight


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I remember the assassination of John F. Kennedy, Martin Luther King, Bobby Kennedy, attempted assasinations on Ford, Reagan and The Pope.

I pray that our President will not have that happen to him. I do not want to see his wife and daughters to go through what others before them have gone through.

Are there enough nuts out there to think of doing such a thing? YES!

Do I condone it. ABSOLUTELY NOT! i Hope and pray that Obama will get us back together to what/ where we need to be. We need to put aside our differences and work together to make things happen. We need to get more involved and not involved in the nit picking of each other.

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RE: What do you most expect out of the next four years?? - 11/10/2008 6:11:40 PM   
Crush


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quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

Obama will probably achieve nothing for several reasons. The problems are too great and a President's time in office too short. Half the President's time is taken up running for office for a second term and being a lame duck President in the second term.


So, by that reasoning, George Bush isn't responsible for the past eight years then.  Hmmm, bet he's glad to know that.....


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RE: What do you most expect out of the next four years?? - 11/10/2008 10:08:43 PM   
scarlettjinx


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I don't know if the KKK has made a statement, But some magizine interviewed a group of white supremicists and I believe they said four out of five were planning to vote for obama because it brought their cause to the forefront. And as much as I don't support obama the jokes that have been popping up such as "what do Abraham Lincoln, JFK, and obama have in common?  Nothing.... YET"  Disgust me.  Just my two cents

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RE: What do you most expect out of the next four years?? - 11/10/2008 11:25:10 PM   
GoddessDustyGold


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quote:

ORIGINAL: nightphoenix

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: nightphoenix

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylifeIt is flawed because it assumes a lower percentage reduction on the wealthy guy in the analogy when that is not what happened with the Bush tax cuts.


Or maybe it's an example with simplified math and wasn't intending on trying to mirror the Bush cuts. ;)  It still demonstrates the principle quite nicely.


It was an amusing story but what principle you were trying to demonstrate isn't clear.

If you were trying to create an analogy to defend Bush's tax cuts then the numbers aren't just simplified they're completely incorrect.


...

It had nothing to do with defending Bush's tax cuts.  It's more a warning to those who feel we should be "sticking it to the rich!" and "making things fair!"


nightphoenix is absolutely correct.
I wish everyone else would get off the Bush Tax Cuts kick and realize that this is just a simple mathmatical analogy to represent the basic way that a basic graduated tax code (which we have) works.  It is an attempt to assist people to see how the math works and a caution not to cut off your nose to spite your face.
I got this in My email also a couple of weeks ago (before the election) and it was written by David R. Kamerschen, Ph.D.  Professor of Economics, University of Georgia
 
The email finished with....
>
>
For those who understand, no explanation is needed.
> For those who do not understand, no explanation is possible.

 
That appears to be self evident. 

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RE: What do you most expect out of the next four years?? - 11/11/2008 2:04:45 AM   
Hippiekinkster


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quote:

ORIGINAL: nightphoenix

quote:

ORIGINAL: barelynangel

I expect to see if the Man steps up to the plate and does his best to create and obtain what he stated in his platform without negative repercussions.  I am very skeptical about his tax on businesses of $200,000.  I have a feeling it really may backfire and harm the people Obama believes it is supposed to help by not raising their taxes - the workers.


Saw a blog post that sums up quite well what to expect with Obama's tax policies -

Bar Room Economics

Suppose that every day, ten men go out for beer and the bill for all ten comes to $100. If they paid their bill the way we pay our taxes, it would go something like this:

* The first four men (the poorest) would pay nothing.
* The fifth would pay $1.
* The sixth would pay $3.
* The seventh would pay $7.
* The eighth would pay $12.
* The ninth would pay $18.
* The tenth man (the richest) would pay $59.

So, that’s what they decided to do.

The ten men drank in the bar every day and seemed quite happy with the arrangement, until one day, the owner threw them a curve. "Since you are
all such good customers," he said, "I’m going to reduce the cost of your daily beer by $20." Drinks for the ten now cost just $80.

The group still wanted to pay their bill the way we pay our taxes so the first four men were unaffected. They would still drink for free.

But what about the other six men - the paying customers? How could they divide the $20 windfall so that everyone would get his ‘fair share?’

They realized that $20 divided by six is $3.33. But if they subtracted that from everybody’s share, then the fifth man and the sixth man would each end up being paid to drink his beer. So, the bar owner suggested that it would be fair to reduce each man’s bill by roughly the same amount, and he proceeded to work out the amounts each should pay. And so:

* The fifth man, like the first four, now paid nothing (100% savings).
* The sixth now paid $2 instead of $3 (33%savings).
* The seventh now paid $5 instead of $7 (28%savings).
* The eighth now paid $9 instead of $12 (25% savings).
* The ninth now paid $14 instead of $18 (22% savings).
* The tenth now paid $49 instead of $59 (16% savings).

Each of the six was better off than before. And the first four continued to drink for free. But once outside the restaurant, the men began to compare their savings.

"I only got a dollar out of the $20," declared the sixth man. He pointed to the tenth man, "but he got $10!"

"Yeah, that’s right," exclaimed the fifth man. "I only saved a dollar, too. It’s unfair that he got ten times more than I!"

"That’s true!" shouted the seventh man. "Why should he get $10 back when I got only two? The wealthy get all the breaks!"

"Wait a minute," yelled the first four men in unison. "We didn’t get anything at all. The system exploits the poor!"

The nine men surrounded the tenth and beat him up.

The next night the tenth man didn’t show up for drinks, so the nine sat down and had beers without him. But when it came time to pay the bill, they discovered something important. They didn’t have enough money between all of them for even half of the bill!

And that, ladies and gentlemen, journalists and college professors, is how our tax system works. The people who pay the highest taxes get the most benefit from a tax reduction. Tax them too much, attack them for being wealthy, and they just may not show up anymore. In fact, they might start drinking overseas where the atmosphere is somewhat friendlier.
And that's where it belongs, in a bar with a bunch of drunks. if you can't see the fallacy, and don't understand what a weighted average is, perhaps you need some remedial math. 

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RE: What do you most expect out of the next four years?? - 11/11/2008 1:16:25 PM   
Satyr6406


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quote:

ORIGINAL: JohnSteed1967

  1. that he will get the economy back on track
  2. that he will repair our foreign relations, not only with our friends but our enemies
  3. That he will nail Osama Bin Ladin to a tree like they did in the Conan the Barbarian movie
  4. That he will be the first president to be honest with the American people about contact with ET




1) I firmly believe that this depends upon whether or not President-elect Obama has a single term or two of them. Alo contingent is if I am right about him being a socialist, you can forget about the economy getting "back on track" under his administration (unless we all decide that socialism is how we wish to live in this country and I don't see that happening any time soon).
 
2) I believe that almost ANYONE would be seen as an improvement over our current foreign policy but, sometimes world issues are a lot more complicated than they seem (I, for one, am more of an isolationist, when it comes to social issues. Sure, we have to trade with the rest of the world but, I certainly am tired of spinning our economy down to be on par with some of the third-world countries that we've be forced to "be fair with" when it comes to trade)
 
3) Bin Ladin is already dead and has been since DEC 2001
 
4) He's a politician. To expect honesty from a politician is like expecting me to give birth.

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