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Resumes and interviews - 11/16/2008 8:30:41 PM

LadyHibiscus

Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
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There are some other threads on how there is plenty of work to be had if we only LOOK for it. Okey dokey. I am a middle aged lady who has been with the same company for seventeen years. Did other stuff on the side, but I have the most longevity here. I *could* just hang where I am at forever, but there are big changes coming down and it is just plain time to leave.

The man at the unemployment office said that I shouldn't say how many years of experience I have with Activity X, because it showed my age. Well, aren't we supposed to be specific? How about when they ask why I am leaving my job of long standing? I can't honestly say that I do not like the direction the company is headed, and I no longer feel I can ethically continue---that is wrong on so many levels!

So, job seekers! Help me, and others out. What are the buzzwords, the techniques, the loopholes for getting noticed these days?

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RE: Resumes and interviews - 11/16/2008 8:39:49 PM

MadAxeman

Posts: 4171
Joined: 8/28/2008
From: UK
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Provide a reference in a sealed envelope.
All it needs to say is 'this chick gives the best head on the planet'

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Post #: 2

RE: Resumes and interviews - 11/16/2008 9:28:43 PM

BbwCanaDomme

Posts: 330
Joined: 5/22/2008
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I don't have any dates on my resumes so people don't know how old I am. But I'm 21 so it's kind of the reverse of what you're going for...

You could wear something low cut? Or try to find incriminating evidence of sketchiness on a prospective employer? haha

(in reply to MadAxeman)

Post #: 3

RE: Resumes and interviews - 11/16/2008 10:09:54 PM

Termyn8or

Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
Status: offline

Lady, don't mind Madax. He's a joker and probably a smoker and a midnight toker.

It is all in the presentment. First of all (this advice is old but I don't think things have changed that much) try to schedule the interview right when you put in the application. I mean call and say "I don't have all day, so could you get me an appointment when I fill out the app ?" . That shows that you are non nonsense.

Unless the app specically requires it, and even if it does, only put years down in the work history part. If it has spaces for dates just write over it and put "early", "mid" or "late". If they question that ask them "What do you want to know what time as well ?".

When you are aging, as we all are it is most important to show your spunk. Walk in there like you are a twenty year old with thirty years of experience. That is also part of the reason you want to get the interview scheduled for the day you go fill out the app.

There are other reasons. It also shows that you are someone who "doesn't want to waste their time" which should translate into you won't waste company time either. About ten or so years ago I no longer carried a cellphone, just got rid of the thing. When you go, leave the phone in the car or take the battery clean out of it. Any response is bad, even refusing to answer it. This is not a social get-together.

If the interviewer's phone rings, you shutup, and when the call is finished say something like "I bet you want to shoot that thing". However if someone walks in don't use that of course LOL.

Keep your cover letter and resume' to one page each, at least ten point font. No italics, no underlining, nothing of the sort if you can avoid it.

Use makeup only to make yourself look younger, no other reason. Other than that just smell and look good of course, but do not enhance. The idea here is to look younger, not made up. Set them a picture of youth. The picture of youth unmadeup will infer self confidence.

Also most businesses have websites, make sure you have explored their's and know EXACLY what the company does. If they are not on the web find someone with a Thomas Register to find out. Know how long they have been in business. Know the founder's name. Something like "I see you do this now, but you started out ........", such things go a long way.

And last but definitely not least, once you know exaclty what they do, figure out things you could do for them before the interview. If you have an idea or something pipe right up with it. And shoot for the stars.

Yes it doesn't feel good when your hopes are blasted into the ground, but you need to be really optimistic. That is the gamble you take. Ups and downs.

Also "position desired" is very important. This depends on the company. If they have a human resources dept., you are being interviewed by someone who is a professional interviewer. So don't put that. Do put down even a job for which you are not qualified, but then use the word "or" and then the position which you actually seek.Like "Department manager or [position in that department, or actually anywhere you think I could be of use]" something like that.

I have never failed to get a job if I could get an interview. However this is old and might have changed. At one job I beat out 154 other applicants. For ONE job. Things may have changed over the years though, just realize that. You might have to adjust a few things.

For the past almost twenty year my my job interviews have strarted with "Hey, can I smoke here ?". But that is me.

I hope I never have to deal with that situation again, but if I do I hope I can take my own advice, and especially hope that advice is good and valid.

That's the best I can do right now. Good luck to you.

T

(in reply to MadAxeman)

Post #: 4

RE: Resumes and interviews - 11/16/2008 11:13:40 PM

DomKen

Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline

I've been reading resumes a lot recently, see the other thread, and can say a few things. First if you've been somewhere for a while that is a plus so make a point of it. If the company discriminates based on age would you really get the job anyway?

Second I passed over a lot of short "one page" resumes. If you're applying for a skilled experienced position then make sure your resume includes not just teh specifics being sought but related experience and skills.

As to explaining why you're changing jobs, you've been with the same company 17 years. If you have no prospect for further advancement or you don't like the direction is going then tell that to the interviewer. 17 years at the same company proves you don't change jobs lightly.

Good luck

(in reply to Termyn8or)

Post #: 5

RE: Resumes and interviews - 11/17/2008 2:51:01 AM

Termyn8or

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Joined: 11/12/2005
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DK, as much as you might find this hard to believe, I can put quite a bit on one page. I know you are ROFL right now because I use more bandwidth than ten people here with the long posts. But actually I do not disagree.

It really does depend on the kind of position for which one is applying. For example someone who wants to be director of marketing research and liason with the engineering team better have more than one page. However I think with most jobs now one page should do it, and I don't mean a double spaced page of 18 point bold. I mean some substance.

I don't know what other thread you referenced, but if it was mine, I may have written a very effective anti-resume. Remind me never to tell people what to do, they might just do it.

BTW what kind of jobs do you have ? I can do just about anything except roofing and welding. I mean really, if my job is gone I will be looking, and at that point relocation really doesn't matter, I can just rent the place out. Like I said I hope I don't have to take my own advice, but if that's how it boils down so be it.

Another thing I would mention, don't use a resume prep program. Open Word or something and format it yourself. Make it easy to read and full of pertinent information only. They don't want to know what you eat, religion should not matter unless you want a job at a church.

Remember this is all about money. Why else would someone work ? I cetainly don't want to, but I know if I don't the money will run out. So attitude is important as well. And as I said I am not normal, not even close. My recent folly, well I am expecting a status, and I had that. When I said make a bench within a week there was lumber on the truck. Shops have built me custom benches, and I have not been fired in a long time. We'll see what happens next week though. But regular people have a whole different set of problems than me. Most don't happen to have near unlimited credit and need to get the bills paid. Many will take any job, so maybe my advice is not the best. However I do think it's mostly good.

T

(in reply to DomKen)

Post #: 6

RE: Resumes and interviews - 11/17/2008 3:23:29 AM

thishereboi

Posts: 14463
Joined: 6/19/2008
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I wish I had some really good answers, but I am still unemployed, so it doesn't look good. I wouldn't worry to much about them thinking your old due to your experience. You don't look that old and I have found most companies want someone with experience. I wouldn't quit the other job until I had found something else, but after so many months looking, I can tell you there is not a lot out there.

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(in reply to LadyHibiscus)

Post #: 7

RE: Resumes and interviews - 11/17/2008 3:30:54 AM

MontrealPhoenix

Posts: 1526
Joined: 2/27/2008
Status: offline

Hi Lady H

Here are some tips I learned at Secretarial School from a teacher who is also a career councellor:

1. Keep your resume to one page. DO show all dates, the fact you've been at your present job so long will be a plus. Companies like people who show they don't move from job to job.

2. Learn all you can about the prospective company

3. DON'T provide references, give them only if they express an interest after the interview. Write "References upon request" on the resume.

4. in the interview tell them how you will be a plus to your company.

Good luck Lady H

phoenix

_____________________________

"Only in a collar can a woman be truly free"
~Tribesmen of Gor ..pg 75

"He who ties a woman owns her"
~Guardsman Of Gor pg 267

(in reply to LadyHibiscus)

Post #: 8

RE: Resumes and interviews - 11/17/2008 3:42:51 AM

BbwCanaDomme

Posts: 330
Joined: 5/22/2008
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As retarded as this sounds; just make sure you're better than the other people applying, and if you aren't, apply the saying my producing teacher taught us on the first day "fake it until you make it." Just make sure you know your shit, and can answer any questions they can possibly come up with. And don't bad mouth your current company when you're in the interviews, just say that you've advanced as far as you feel you could within the company. If you go in talking about ethics, etc, you're going to either look petty, or come across as someone who will leave your job if you disagree with managment. But again, you don't have to be great, you just need to be better than everyone else trying to get the same job.

(in reply to MontrealPhoenix)

Post #: 9

RE: Resumes and interviews - 11/17/2008 4:14:12 AM

Aneirin

Posts: 6121
Joined: 3/18/2006
From: Tamaris
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When I created my resume, I wrote what was my true and honest experience, but I then gave it to a friend who was a personnel manager for a blue chip company. That friend took what I had written and rewritten it in the way a personnel manager wanted to see it. No lies, but embellishments created by using 'power words'. In short, the resume was hard hitting, to the point and interesting, written in a way, it grabs the attention, much like successful advertising.

What I was told was a personnel manager probably sees lots of resumes in a day, and is frankly bored of reading them, you have to create something that stands out, but is at the same time conservative. So that would be a one page resume, containing the major facts, if they want the details, they are obviously interested, the resume has done it's job. It is also good to provide a short profile using power words.

So, your name, age, location followed by profile, then eduction then places worked and their position, all this on one page.

_____________________________

Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

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(in reply to BbwCanaDomme)

Post #: 10

RE: Resumes and interviews - 11/17/2008 5:39:09 AM

cloudboy

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Richard Bolles (What Color is Your Parachute) classifies a resume as a "rejection tool." He recommends networking and F2F meetings as the better method of job searching.

(in reply to LadyHibiscus)

Post #: 11

RE: Resumes and interviews - 11/17/2008 6:05:06 AM

LadyEllen

Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
Status: offline

All I am interested in as an employer;
- can you do the job plus anything else that might come up; the more extras you can do the better your chances
- what tasks can you do better than I can do them myself
- how much money you will make me/ save me; the more in either direction, the better
- from that, do you have any commercial sense
- will you fit in with the people I have now
- can you speak and write with reasonable grammatical accuracy and pronounce tolerably
- are you reliable
- do you have a sense of humour
- do I like you as a person

I am specifically not interested in any way whatever what degrees you might have. I am not interested in past achievements unless they can be shown to be repeatable in my employ. I am wholly disinterested what you do in your own time. I am unimpressed by designer suits you might wear to an interview or what car you drive or your postcode at home. None of these add to my bottom line.

I dont employ people for any other reason than to improve the bottom line. If I have no need to employ, I dont - unless someone can prove to me that I should, for my benefit.

Overall I would suggest a resume be one part of a presentation which should be more akin to a business plan; showing me why its a good idea to invest in you.

E

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In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to cloudboy)

Post #: 12

RE: Resumes and interviews - 11/17/2008 6:07:55 AM

barelynangel

Posts: 6233
Status: offline

Hi, as someone who went through many resume's to hire people, i can give some advice:

1. If you are going to have a one page resume make sure its not crammed, we don't want to read a book on one page. I would rather have 2 page resume than get a headache trying to decipher a resume crammed with stuff that is hard to read and no less than 11 to 12 point font and no larger than 11-12 pnt font lol. What you also may want to consider since you have been with one company so long is doing a skills resume. Put a very rough job history -- 17 years at one place isn't going t give you a lot of job history, but then be very specific with regard to what you did at that company for 17 years.

2. As someone else stated, know the job you are applying for and the company and REWRITE your resume for each position and company using the power words that will catch their eye immediately. (Put that at the top so it is clear) ALSO PUT A COVER LETTER stating the position, your interest in an interview and a little about yourself outside of the job.    I would recommend hiding any and all possible internet references with your name that are not positive -- even a myspace page may cause raised eyebrows. DOUBLE CHECK FOR GRAMMER AND SPELLING lol. You would not believe how many people provide resumes and cover letters with mistake in them.

3. PUT YEARS on your resume.   One thing we hated was when people simply put the job but didn't put dates, we tossed those figuring they were trying to hide something.    If you are concerned about what you say in why you are leaving, since you have been there 17 years -- do not say no room for advancement, one would think you would have figured that out a lot earlier and it shows you don't know your company all that well or are willing to be a drone.   DO explain the real reason you are leaving, the company is changing directions and you felt that since the company is changing, it would do you good to change also. If they want you to expound on that make sure you know your stuff and have a good discussion outline in your head about it. After 17 years, it would take a lot for a person to leave and new employers would figure that but make sure you can articulate that.

4. I would offer references at the end of the interview, many times in our interviews we forgot to ask for them at the end. And then we had to decide if we wanted to waste time calling the person to get them or just look at someone else who came in. I know its old fashion but getting a few written references along with a couple (NOT A WHOLE PAGE lol) of references to call. What you want to do is make it as easy as possible and giving prospective employers 10 references to choose from to call, is a lot-- we know you are only providing references of people you know will give you a good one. I would also suggest not only higher ups in your company but include at least one co-worker.

5. I LOVED THANK YOU NOTES!!!!! I liked the prospective employee sending an email saying thanks, i loved getting the little hand written notes etc.

All in all, show the company you are interested in them but also you are interested in you. Be relaxed and gauge the personality of the interviewer. Be sure to converse with them don't be robotic as if its a questiion answer, remember you are getting to know then as they are trying to get to know you. These will be people you are working with, so express interest as a person by being conversational in your interview. If that makes sense. Ask questions about the company in a conversatoinal way, but have a balance.

Good luck.

angel

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What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.
R.W. Emerson

(in reply to cloudboy)

Post #: 13

RE: Resumes and interviews - 11/17/2008 6:41:36 AM

LadyHibiscus

Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline

Thanks, everyone! I can see that some things really have stayed the same. I remember well hashing over seriously crappy resumes (and still do, for clients with staffing issues) and at least I can SPELLCHECK.

I have to admit that I don't remember the last time I took a job that required me to fill out an *application*. I hope that I am still past that point... I have some old resumes in the computer, tailored a little differently for whatever, and I think they are about a page. It gets tough to keep it brief AND hit all the highlights when you have been in the workforce for decades. There are some nice resources through the unemployment office that I am going to use---I keep hearing about all these "accomplishment" oriented resumes, and I would give you the deer in the headlights look if you asked me what I had "accomplished" all this time other than doing my job better than most!

Thishereboi, what can we do? It is SAID that sales is the way to go, but if it were my way, I would have done it when I was young.

And regarding the sassmonkey comments (thx for the giggle!) I have actually LOST jobs based on my looks. Me, ordinary, minimal makeup me, has been considered TOO pretty. And now I have ginormous breasts. Night watchman! There's a job I could get!

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RE: Resumes and interviews - 11/17/2008 6:42:00 AM

meatcleaver

Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

Richard Bolles (What Color is Your Parachute) classifies a resume as a "rejection tool." He recommends networking and F2F meetings as the better method of job searching.

I'm not sure how many employers take resumes serious, everyone knows people embelish the truth if they don't downright lie and if they aren't lying, why aren't they showing initiative. If most companies told the truth about their products they wouldn't sell anything so why would they want honest employees in the first place?

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There are fascists who consider themselves humanitarians, like cannibals on a health kick, eating only vegetarians.

(in reply to cloudboy)

Post #: 15

RE: Resumes and interviews - 11/17/2008 6:42:12 AM

Mercnbeth

Posts: 11766
Status: offline

You want the best path to generate a job from a resume - tailor the resume to the job. In an age of word processing, its easy to make minor adjustments every time you give out a resume. It's also good to include a personalized, targeted cover letter. Personalized to the department head and the person who will be your supervisor. You find that out by taking a proactive approach to the process.

Finding a job IS a job. Call the company and do your homework about it. What are there assets? How to they stand up to the competition? What are the specific job accountabilities and responsibilities? Once you find these out - tailor your resume and the cover letter, to highlight how YOU meet or exceed the hiring objectives. Now here's the harder part - justify the salary you desire by documenting how your productivity, or if you are looking for a position as a support staff, how your efficiency will produce a positive bottom line after you are brought on-board. Salary is difficult, because there is always a range involved; a number you have in mind and a number the employer has in mind. They won't tell you the 'magic number', but they should always tell you the range.

Don'ts are easier. Don't lie with anything that can be verified, especially education. Even if you get the job, falsifying information can be grounds for termination down the road. Don't be desperate, even if you are. Don't answer questions telling in detail what you can't do; use what you can, and did do, as a qualification for applying your skill set to the problem; better yet use specific examples. Like, I never was involved with selling 'widgets' however, selling 'sprockets' has similar issues and I was wonderful doing this to achieve this result for the 'sprocket' company.

Even if you do all that remember - the best way to get a good job is to know somebody. Seriously, networking is very important. It gets you the information you need like, who is really hiring, and how much they are really paying. It also, depending on the credibility of your friends, gives you credibility with the employee. A firm handshake is good. A firm handshake accompanied by something like; "Our good friend 'Bob' says you're the person to talk to about getting a job here."; is even better.

A 'thank-you' follow up helps too. Most jobs involve some responsibility and showing you can follow up gives a sense of your accountability.

At the end of reading your resume and concluding the interview, they need to think they can't do without you, and can't afford NOT to hire you. One last thing to consider - the only time you are getting pay equal to your worth is when you are working for yourself.

Good Luck!

(in reply to barelynangel)

Post #: 16

RE: Resumes and interviews - 11/17/2008 7:51:43 AM

beargonewild

Posts: 22716
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline

All the best in landing your dream job Lady H! The main advice that had been drilled into me when I was creating a dreaded resume is to be concise when listing education, past experience, etc. Many employers I know state that they do want to see the length of time a person spent at past jobs as that is a clear indication if the person just bounces from job to job or is stable enough to hold and keep a job. I was always told the secret to a resume is to sell yourself and your abilities that will cause the employer to call you in for the interview. Plus I was always told to keep one's resume to 2 pages with a separate page of references. It's my experience that when a potential employer receives a one page resume, it's tossed in the garbage without a second glance.

_____________________________

Do Not Rile da Chosen Bear

Promiscuous boy you already know
That I’m all yours what you waiting for?

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(in reply to LadyHibiscus)

Post #: 17

RE: Resumes and interviews - 11/17/2008 9:12:46 AM

pahunkboy

Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline

hello.

One thing employers look for is resume embellishment.   many resumes are overly .. overstates experience.etc- you could consider it misleading or lieing.

ageism is real.   it is a barrier.

tho- on any civil service job I applied for- they ask dates and number of hours a week worked.

some job ads are run specifically to "prove" there is no available American for that job-so the company can hire h1visas.

word of mouth is key.   often the motion happen all the while the interveiw plans to hire Jane the cousins neighbor at church, and goes thru the interviewing so it appears to be "open"

the most embarrassing mistake I made at an interview is when I was asked where I wanted to be in 5 years. I went into personal goals... not professional. yikes.

on jobs- there is ALWAYS work to do.   the world need work completion.

I understand tho that money is tight. Maybe you can get a job tallying the bail out books....

(in reply to beargonewild)

Post #: 18

RE: Resumes and interviews - 11/17/2008 9:16:23 AM

Dnomyar

Posts: 7933
Joined: 6/27/2005
Status: offline

Hard fact. Your over qualified. Translation. I can find someone who will work cheaper than you will.

Persistance(pest-sistance) is your best ally. If there is a job you really want call and call and call again about it.

Phony job post. You find a lot of employers do that for one reason or another.

(in reply to beargonewild)

Post #: 19

RE: Resumes and interviews - 11/17/2008 10:00:46 AM

beargonewild

Posts: 22716
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline

You are absolutely right on that Ray. At least that I have come across up here and especially in the industry I used to be employed in. I had spent 20 years as a front end cook and a few years ago, I was looking for part time work to supplement my income as a self employed business owner, which I ran my business from home. As a highly experienced cook, I am not able to work at a restaurant earning a wage to reflect my experience because those employers know they can hire a person with little or no experience, can't cook worth a damn for minimum wage. I'd be happy to earn $12/hr which is still less then industry standards here. Thus I stopped looking for pt time work, run my business part time and supplement my income in other ways.

< Message edited by beargonewild -- 11/17/2008 10:02:29 AM >

_____________________________

Do Not Rile da Chosen Bear

Promiscuous boy you already know
That I’m all yours what you waiting for?

Resident MANWHORE ~1000 Bear pts~

10 NZ points
Whips~n~Cuffs

(in reply to Dnomyar)

Post #: 20

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