RE: With and without a god.

RE: With and without a god. (Full Version)

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MHOO314 -> RE: With and without a god. (12/23/2005 9:00:09 AM)
as we would all ask why did you abandon our world: 911 Katrina Rita the tsunami Auschwitz genocide Columbine Oklahoma City you are hardly alone...

candystripper -> RE: With and without a god. (12/23/2005 9:00:59 AM)
quote: at the risk of losing a friend here (i will respect your opinion) but "God" abondonned me long ago and "if" i ever meet up with him, i will definately question so many things that he allowed to occur. if i've lost our friendship with this statement, i am truly sorry and it will add yet another void to my life. but i'm used to it. MichaelGA Of course you have not lost a friend...at least not my friendship. i can relate to the notion that some souls suffer much more than others; but God never abandoned Job, on whom all sorts of missery and loss was rained upon; He merely stayed His hand until He chose to act. Perhaps it will be the same for you; i hope so. candystripper

michaelGA -> RE: With and without a god. (12/23/2005 9:04:18 AM)
unfortunately, i'm not Job and as MHOO314 demonstrated, there's alot of qquestions that need answered. and that was just a short list.

darkinshadows -> RE: With and without a god. (12/23/2005 9:14:04 AM)
Acts of God Riddle Thread Wrath of God Thread It would be a good read if your interested and discuss those points on and stops the focus being taken off the OP Fangs set. Peace and Love

SirKenin -> RE: With and without a god. (12/23/2005 9:20:05 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: JohnWarren quote: ORIGINAL: SirKenin I would rather live as though there is a God, then live godlessly and die only to find out there was. What a hoot it would be if you picked the wrong one, bent yourself out of shape to make him happy and found that the real one had an entirely different set of hoops you were supposed to jump through. lol. [:D] Now that would positively suck.. But I am willing to take that chance.

michaelGA -> RE: With and without a god. (12/23/2005 9:20:47 AM)
i agree, let's take our respective beliefs and go home, nobody can change others so why bother. i will not convert any more than anyone else here...for or against...so it's a paradoxal discussion and should be tossed into the gabbage with the rest of the refuse.

SirKenin -> RE: With and without a god. (12/23/2005 9:22:41 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: quietkitten Sir Kenin .......... prove to me that "he is"... give me absolute proof. You can't and you know it. You are welcome to believe whatever the heck you want. I don't believe "he" exists and I never will. As far as pretending to believe in god just in case.. that is something I just can't swallow. Worship related to fear is not my idea of a good time. I would not obey a Master I feared.. and I will not worship a god out of fear. That is the cool thing about it. There is no absolute proof. You follow based on faith alone. You either believe or you do not. I do not fear God. He has done nothing to make Me afraid of Him. I have even been through extremely rough patches in My life where it seemed like He did not care. He was always there though. You either believe it or you do not. I guess we will find out one day who is right. [:)] If I was wrong, I lost nothing. If you were wrong, you lost everything.

darkinshadows -> RE: With and without a god. (12/23/2005 9:39:47 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: michaelGA i agree, let's take our respective beliefs and go home, nobody can change others so why bother. i will not convert any more than anyone else here...for or against...so it's a paradoxal discussion and should be tossed into the gabbage with the rest of the refuse. We do not agree. Again you are placing words in anothers mouth. Anybody can change anyone... but nobody can be change someone without prior consent. It is up to the individual if they wish to be changed, converted or altered. That is free will. In my opinion - it is not a paradoxical discussion, as it is a subjective one. If you wish to toss it into the garbage and not learn about others, but prefere to make assumptions based on what you think you know, instead of what people discuss with you to assist your knowledge of them - sobeit. That is free will. I much prefere to take everything and file and keep it. Knowledge is a wonderous thing. That is my free will. Peace and Rapture

SwtJadedGrl -> RE: With and without a god. (12/23/2005 9:44:33 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MHOO314 as we would all ask why did you abandon our world: 911 Katrina Rita the tsunami Auschwitz genocide Columbine Oklahoma City you are hardly alone... We chase Him out of homes, our schools and our hearts and then when something terrible happens we turn to Him and ask "why did you abandon us?"

michaelGA -> RE: With and without a god. (12/23/2005 9:47:02 AM)
this topic always makes me think of the age-old question: what happens when an immovable object is hit by an irresistable force? this would probably cause oblivion.

darkinshadows -> RE: With and without a god. (12/23/2005 10:07:30 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: michaelGA this topic always makes me think of the age-old question: what happens when an immovable object is hit by an irresistable force? this would probably cause oblivion. Well, I doubt that it would cause oblivion... because my memory lasts until I die and then... it is passed onwards. Unless you mean in an amnesty, which due to the type of conversation is irrelevant. The object would alter and change its shape, it wouldn't have to move, but face possible destruction due to it not wishing to change or grow. The irresistable force would continue onward... drawing in more knowledge and wisdom. I know which I am... for I follow in the wake of his force... without in harmony, receptive... open and with surrender. Peace and Rapture

SirKenin -> RE: With and without a god. (12/23/2005 10:32:17 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SwtJadedGrl quote: ORIGINAL: MHOO314 as we would all ask why did you abandon our world: 911 Katrina Rita the tsunami Auschwitz genocide Columbine Oklahoma City you are hardly alone... We chase Him out of homes, our schools and our hearts and then when something terrible happens we turn to Him and ask "why did you abandon us?" Exactly

JohnWarren -> RE: With and without a god. (12/23/2005 10:43:22 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: candystripper quote: What a hoot it would be if you picked the wrong one, bent yourself out of shape to make him happy and found that the real one had an entirely different set of hoops you were supposed to jump through. JohnWarren Yanno, i used to grumble about this. According to the Catholic Church, it can be traced directly to St. Peter and is the One True Church. So, i would ask, what about the MILLIONS of Buddiasts, etc, that have never even met a Catholic (as if we'd know how to convert anyway). i was a pest in Religious Instruction, he he. Nowadays i don't give it a second thought; whatever way you make contact with God, by whatever name you know Him/Her is a fine thing; good for you and surely pleasing to God. candystripper Yup, to me, the onus is on god to justify any "must do" items on the list. Unless, the list to me is rational and based on "good deeds" I hope to have the nerve to spit in the bastard's face. There is a mile-long Vikking poem that contains the line "He was my Lord and I served him; he failed me and betrayed me and I slew him." Kinda sums up the relationship quite well.

candystripper -> RE: With and without a god. (12/23/2005 3:46:14 PM)
quote: Yup, to me, the onus is on god to justify any "must do" items on the list. Unless, the list to me is rational and based on "good deeds" I hope to have the nerve to spit in the bastard's face. There is a mile-long Vikking poem that contains the line "He was my Lord and I served him; he failed me and betrayed me and I slew him." Kinda sums up the relationship quite well. JohnWarren i can't ascribe these thoughts to myself, but i've known some evil people in my life; i do not want to see them in heaven and if i do, i want a copy of the warranty deed. Not the most forgiving woman; just one of my many faults. candystripper

FangsNfeet -> RE: With and without a god. (12/23/2005 9:48:09 PM)
quote: I have it on good authority..."It's the Mormons who got it right"! Hey, I remember that episode on South Park.

FangsNfeet -> RE: With and without a god. (12/23/2005 10:10:18 PM)
quote: unfortunately, i'm not Job and as MHOO314 demonstrated, there's alot of questions that need answered. and that was just a short list. Yes there are alot of questions that may or should be answered. The only problem is that the one we are asking the questions to isn't answering them. If we feel that we have been asnwered, it's not given in a yes or no but a politician answer of our own interpretaions of events, scriptures, and feelings. Anyhow, you may not like the answers but I answered your questions. If you want to continue looking for the answers that suit you then so be it. Anyhow, I think that the only answer you want is the one you are truely directing the question to. That may take a while.

Misstoyou -> RE: With and without a god. (12/23/2005 10:10:36 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: quietkitten Sir Kenin .......... prove to me that "he is"... give me absolute proof. Faith, by definition, doesn't require proof. (Maybe conversion, in either direction, requires "proof" of a sort.) That's why we always end up with these apples and oranges discussions.

michaelGA -> RE: With and without a god. (12/23/2005 10:15:46 PM)
it's not a matter of if i like them or not...no human being...no matter how arrogant they are, can possibly them. you have never and can never answer the questions, neither can i nor anyone, just accept it as i have. there are no answers

FangsNfeet -> RE: With and without a god. (12/23/2005 11:09:00 PM)
quote: quote: You may still be alive but you would not be known as a god anymore. where did this come from, I was refering to an inventor/creator. If the inventor is alive long after his creations are long gone, then he is no longer considered an inventer/god because his inventions are not there to worship/serve him. Being imortal does not make anyone or thing a god. To be god you must simply be worshiped. "it's not a matter of if i like them or not...no human being...no matter how arrogant they are, can possibly them. you have never and can never answer the questions, neither can i nor anyone, just accept it as i have. there are no answers" So exactly what are the questions again? Every question has several answeres. I can answer 5 to any mathmatical question including what 2 plus 2 equal. I can answer DeVinci to any question that ask "Who invented _____?" In your case, everyone may have there own answer but they are answers. My guess is that you're waiting to hear the answer to your quesions form a possible creator/god rather than from any of us. Untill you get to have your meeing with such a creator, I don't mind answering your questions with what I find to be correct.

quietkitten -> RE: With and without a god. (12/23/2005 11:42:12 PM)
A reply to some posters... not you Fangs. The reason that I asked for proof he exists is not to question your faith or beliefs. It was to challenge you to change my mind. The bottom line for me is that you cannot prove "his" existence to me... therefore you cannot change my mind. As far as anyone's belief in God or Allah or any other supreme being... that is their business. But what I am hearing is not "I believe God exists" it is "God exists for everyone.. period end of story" "he" does not exist for me and never will. No matter what anyone says or does.. I have my own set of beliefs about the nature of existence. "he" is not included in them.

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