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rulemylife -> RE: Real ID, will you carry ID??? (11/25/2008 11:32:50 AM)
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quote:
ORIGINALBlackPhx:
There is actually no right to Privacy in our Constitution or the Amendments that make up our Bill of Rights, rulemylife. That unfortunately is the crux, even our bodies are not private, just ask anyone who has had a cavity search.
Well, you've brought up a lot of different points, but there are two main issues that I always have trouble understanding people arguing against.
Really, one idea that encompasses those two issues, that the only rights we have are embodied in the Constitution and everything else is a "privilege" granted by the government.
There are many basic human rights that have been recognized long before the Constitution was thought of. In fact, the Constitution is not really even that original considering many of its ideas were borrowed from previous documents like the Magna Carta.
Regardless of that philosophical argument, there is the fact that we have a judicial branch that was established to interpret and enforce laws, including the Constitution.
And they have, in numerous decisions over the years, interpreted the Constitution as giving citizens a right to privacy and to be considered innocent until proven guilty.
The Right To Privacy
The Constitution does not specifically mention a right to privacy. However, Supreme Court decisions over the years have established that the right to privacy is a basic human right, and as such is protected by virtue of the 9th Amendment. The right to privacy has come to the public's attention via several controversial Supreme Court rulings, including several dealing with contraception (the Griswold and Eisenstadt cases), interracial marriage (the Loving case), and abortion (the well-known Roe v Wade case). In addition, it is said that a right to privacy is inherent in many of the amendments in the Bill of Rights, such as the 3rd, the 4th's search and seizure limits, and the 5th's self-incrimination limit.
(http://www.usconstitution.net/constnot.html)
quote:
Yes it is a requirement in most states that you can prove who you are and what your intent is in certain areas. We have always had that with the military, and with most businesses as well.................. We think nothing of filing our papers with our teachers with our names on them, presenting ID to get food, lodging, etc. We rent apartments and our landlords check our credit history, buy a car and fill out paperwork that carries our information where it needs to go, gert Drivers Licenses and present the information on them to rent cars, get insurance, etc. It is a world where ID is a necessity.
Again, no it is not a requirement, and the state laws that have been enacted have been struck down by the Supreme Court as unconstitutional as I documented earlier in this thread.
Yes, in practical application an ID is necessary in many cases, but not required by law.
quote:
No where in there is there a presumption of innocence
Same as with privacy:
Presumption of innocence - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Nov 10, 2008 ... The presumption of innocence – being innocent until proven guilty – is a legal
right that the accused in criminal trials has in many modern ...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Presumption_of_innocence This right is so important in modern democracies that many have explicitly included it in their legal codes and constitutions:
- In Canada, section 11(d) of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms states: "Any person charged with an offence has the right to be presumed innocent until proven guilty according to law in a fair and public hearing by an independent and impartial tribunal".
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- In France, article 9 of the Declaration of the Rights of Man and of the Citizen, of constitutional value, says "Everyone is supposed innocent until having been declared guilty." and the preliminary article of the code of criminal procedure says "any suspected or prosecuted person is presumed to be innocent until their guilt has been established". The jurors' oath reiterates this assertion.
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- Although the Constitution of the United States does not cite it explicitly, presumption of innocence is widely held to follow from the 5th, 6th and 14th amendments. See also Coffin v. United States
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- In the 1988 Brazilian constitution, article 5, section LVII states that "no one shall be considered guilty before the issuing of a final and unappealable penal sentence". The Universal Declaration of Human Rights, article 11, states: Everyone charged with a penal offence has the right to be presumed innocent until proved guilty according to law in a public trial at which they have had all the guarantees necessary for their defence.
Coffin v. U.S., 156 U.S. 432 (1895)
U.S. Supreme Court. COFFIN v. U.S., 156 U.S. 432 (1895). COFFIN et al. v. UNITED
STATES. No. 741. March 4, 1895. [156 U.S. 432, 433] By section 5209 of the ...
http://www.constitution.org/ussc/156-432.htm
The principle that there is a presumption of innocence in favor of the accused is the undoubted law, axiomatic and elementary, and its enforcement lies at the foundation of the administration of our criminal law.
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